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Kovalchuk, how much is too much?

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Old
05-17-2010, 10:32 PM
  #151
etherialone
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I agree that it could go that way with JJ but if it does we lose him for nothing when he UFA bails. I don't see him resigning with us if we make him go to arbitration of course, DL would likely deal him and a first round pick to move up in the draft the year that it happens (or so).

HAH? Ya like it? Pretty good huh?

I thought you'd like that one.

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05-17-2010, 10:38 PM
  #152
Sydor25
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The Kings are a better team right now without Cammy. I'm sure they can be better without Johnson. Who knows, Muzzin, Hickey or Voynov could end up better than Johnson.


You forget that I don't miss Cammy. . I won't miss Johnson if he wants to go for the money too. Especially if I get to watch Kopitar, Doughty and Kovalchuk for 7+ years.

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05-17-2010, 10:44 PM
  #153
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Oh, and if we shave down DD and JJ's salary by a total of $3.5m (which I can't see but its all just guessing) we are still over the cap and playing allot of kids or cheap ufa grunts in important positions.
It is allot closer than I thought we would be at the end of the exercise though.

I see Kovy getting, as I have been saying, closer to a 10 year $82m contract (front loaded) but I tend to be a bit over on these things. (I saw Hossa getting a 10 year 64m deal instead he got a 12 year 64m deal which sounds like i was close but not when you look at the cap hit).

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05-17-2010, 10:47 PM
  #154
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$80 million/12 years



I knew we would get you on the Kovalchuk bandwagon.


Last edited by Sydor25: 05-17-2010 at 10:52 PM.
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05-17-2010, 10:56 PM
  #155
etherialone
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Could be, I like it. I would write more but the Human Dog HYBRID is freaking me out so bad I think that I might just not sleep tonight.

Looks too much like my ex......scary!

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05-17-2010, 11:02 PM
  #156
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Originally Posted by RH63 View Post
I think the caps overpaid. I could understand 6.7 if it was for 5 or 7 yrs but for 10 yrs, it really should be 6 mil at most imo.
???? Are you serious you must be the one person on earth that thinks that's overpayment....in a couple years people are gonna talk about that contract like they talk about Parise's now.

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05-17-2010, 11:15 PM
  #157
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Looking at what #2 dmen such as Brent Seabrook, Ryan Suter, Brent Burns and are earning, I would guess that Johnson's worth, once he reaches his potential, should be $3.5M.

As for #1 defensemen, Boyle earns $6.6M, Markov $5.75M, Green $5.25M.
Keith got 13 years with an average hit of $5.5M. He's locked up until he's 39. I'd expect Doughty to get a similar deal. He's 20 now. Even if he got a 15 year deal, we all know he'll still be playing hockey at 35. If he signs for a cap hit between what Keith and Boyle are earning, then the Kings will be in a good position in terms of salary commitments.

Filling the #1 defense position is one of the toughest, that's why you want to commit long term and I anticipate that happening with Doughty. Johnson still has room to develop, but I don't think the Kings will commit over $4M to their #2 dman.

We have to be careful not to get committed to the idea of signing Kovalchuk, otherwise, we are setting ourselves up for disappointment. I want him in a Kings uniform, but it is possible that Kovalchuk and his family have other interests. Be hopeful, but don't feel entitled.

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05-17-2010, 11:19 PM
  #158
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust View Post
Looking at what #2 dmen such as Brent Seabrook, Ryan Suter, Brent Burns and are earning, I would guess that Johnson's worth, once he reaches his potential, should be $3.5M.

As for #1 defensemen, Boyle earns $6.6M, Markov $5.75M, Green $5.25M.
Keith got 13 years with an average hit of $5.5M. He's locked up until he's 39. I'd expect Doughty to get a similar deal. He's 20 now. Even if he got a 15 year deal, we all know he'll still be playing hockey at 35. If he signs for a cap hit between what Keith and Boyle are earning, then the Kings will be in a good position in terms of salary commitments.

Filling the #1 defense position is one of the toughest, that's why you want to commit long term and I anticipate that happening with Doughty. Johnson still has room to develop, but I don't think the Kings will commit over $4M to their #2 dman.

We have to be careful not to get committed to the idea of signing Kovalchuk, otherwise, we are setting ourselves up for disappointment. I want him in a Kings uniform, but it is possible that Kovalchuk and his family have other interests. Be hopeful, but don't feel entitled.

This. On all accounts.

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Old
05-18-2010, 01:29 AM
  #159
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Player/Current Cap Hit/Future Cap Hit

Doughty - 3.475 + 2.525 = 6M

Johnson - 1.425 + 2.575 = 4M

Simmonds - .821,667 + 2.2 = 3M

Bernier - 843,333 + 1.2 = 2M

Moller - .875,000 + 0.6 = 1.5M


The list above has the 5 RFA's many people on these boards are afraid we won't be able to re-sign.

Total Raise = 9.1M
Contracts coming off the books: 4.0 (Zeus), 3.5 (JW), 0.6 (McCauley) = 8.1

Bonus Cushion+CAP going up should cover the 1.0M and/or the RFA's will only be signed to a 1 year deal and wait an extra year for a long contract (Smyth's 6.25 contract will be up the next year).

Then we have Lewis, Lokitonov, Clifford, King, Hickey, Voynov, Trebuert coming up to play with our CORE:

Like somebody mentioned earlier = Kovalchuk, Kopitar, Brown, Simmonds, Schenn, Doughty, Johnson, Bernier/Quick.


Just an example:

Kovalchuk – Kopitar – Brown
Richardson – Schenn – Simmonds
Clifford – Lewis – Lokitonov
King – Moller - Westgarth


Doughty – Scuderi
Johnson – Hickey
Greene – Voynov
Drewiske/Muzzin

Bernier
Quick/Zatkoff

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05-18-2010, 04:36 AM
  #160
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Loktionov and Moller in the bottom Six ???

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05-18-2010, 02:35 PM
  #161
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SkoalMan11 View Post
Loktionov and Moller in the bottom Six ???
Move Brownie and Richardson down if you like...that was not the point. lol

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05-18-2010, 03:10 PM
  #162
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We assembled some members of the media that covers the Kings and talked about the merits of signing Kovalchuk in our roundtable. Here's the Kovie segment.

Link

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05-18-2010, 03:13 PM
  #163
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Originally Posted by SkoalMan11 View Post
Loktionov and Moller in the bottom Six ???
why not?

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05-18-2010, 03:13 PM
  #164
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingsCast View Post
We assembled some members of the media that covers the Kings and talked about the merits of signing Kovalchuk in our roundtable. Here's the Kovie segment.

Link
I notice a distinct lack of involvement in this roundtable from lakingsnews.com, so therefore, I must render the verdict 'incomplete'.

Invitation got lost in the mail huh?

Also, who is the guy with the ponytail? He is ruining the image of long-hairs for the rest of us!

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05-18-2010, 03:41 PM
  #165
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingsCast View Post
We assembled some members of the media that covers the Kings and talked about the merits of signing Kovalchuk in our roundtable. Here's the Kovie segment.

Link
I love the guy with the glasses The debate just seemed dumb. I dunno if Kovalchuk is going to ask for a NMC, but if he isn't a fit in two years, trade him and get assets for nothing. Either way, he is worth the paycheck and we are the best fit. Get it done. Also, Dean has made the big deal before. He brought Selanne to the Sharks.

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05-18-2010, 03:45 PM
  #166
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I also COMPLETELY disagree with Matsuda that term is the key issue. Its all about the cap hit.

If you aren't worried about Kovy screwing up the core for the first 4 or 5 years, you can't be worried about him screwing it up beyond that.

I think Dean will absolutely be prepared to offer the years, and it will come down to the cash and how willing Kovy is to structure his contract to keep the cap hit reasonable.

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05-18-2010, 04:09 PM
  #167
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingsCast View Post
We assembled some members of the media that covers the Kings and talked about the merits of signing Kovalchuk in our roundtable. Here's the Kovie segment.

Link
That's an interesting panel. You guys need to do a better job promoting yourselves on message boards

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05-18-2010, 04:27 PM
  #168
The Black1963
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???? Are you serious you must be the one person on earth that thinks that's overpayment....in a couple years people are gonna talk about that contract like they talk about Parise's now.
Well, I'm comparing Keith's contract to that of Backstrom's.

Keith makes 5.5 for 13 years and Backstrom makes 6.7 for 10 yrs. I would prefer Keith and his contract over Backstrom's.

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05-18-2010, 04:29 PM
  #169
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Well, I'm comparing Keith's contract to that of Backstrom's.

Keith makes 5.5 for 13 years and Backstrom makes 6.7 for 10 yrs. I would prefer Keith and his contract over Backstrom's.
What? Those two players have absolutely nothing to do with each other.

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05-18-2010, 04:30 PM
  #170
The Black1963
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I also COMPLETELY disagree with Matsuda that term is the key issue. Its all about the cap hit.

If you aren't worried about Kovy screwing up the core for the first 4 or 5 years, you can't be worried about him screwing it up beyond that.

I think Dean will absolutely be prepared to offer the years, and it will come down to the cash and how willing Kovy is to structure his contract to keep the cap hit reasonable.
Well said, P.O.T.Y. Nominee.

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05-18-2010, 04:31 PM
  #171
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What? Those two players have absolutely nothing to do with each other.
Why did I think he was a dman?

My bad.

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05-18-2010, 04:35 PM
  #172
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Why did I think he was a dman?

My bad.
Lol... I had a feeling you thought Backstrom was a dman. Maybe you thought of the goalie Backstrom without knowing it and somehow married those two into the fictitious defenseman Backstrom.

I think you can compare Keith and Green's contract. Or Keith and Weber.

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05-18-2010, 04:37 PM
  #173
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I'll gladly take Kopi and his 7 yrs at 6.8 over Backstrom's 10 yrs at 6.7.

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05-18-2010, 04:46 PM
  #174
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JDM View Post
I notice a distinct lack of involvement in this roundtable from lakingsnews.com, so therefore, I must render the verdict 'incomplete'.

Invitation got lost in the mail huh?

Also, who is the guy with the ponytail? He is ruining the image of long-hairs for the rest of us!
We'll get you guys in the next one. PM me your email so I have it on file.

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05-18-2010, 05:20 PM
  #175
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Originally Posted by RH63 View Post
I'll gladly take Kopi and his 7 yrs at 6.8 over Backstrom's 10 yrs at 6.7.


There is nothing wrong with that contract. You're talking about a 21 year old kid that is coming off a 100pt season. You must still not have the correct Backstrom

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