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Old
06-07-2010, 07:37 PM
  #176
Led Zappa
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Originally Posted by SJeasy View Post
Until the final round.
And Marleau gets points in a series until the series he disappears in and in the past that's when the Sharks bow out. He hasn't really takin' them anywhere. It goes both ways. Marleau's PO history is not great. He blazes for a series or 2 and then flames out. Except this year where his flame was out for the first 2 rounds until he blazed through the 3rd, which we lost anyways.

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06-07-2010, 07:39 PM
  #177
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Originally Posted by Barrie22 View Post
heatley 1 goal, 0 assists in 5 games.
spezza 0 goals, 2 assists in 5 games.
alfredsson 3 goals, 2 assists in 5 games.

this is the funny thing about sports, it was alright for spezza to be useless that round, but heatley it wasn't. heatley gets all the blame for the loss, while spezza goes scotch free.

and i still won't get on heatley's case, for his entire playoff career he is still a point per game player. but i know, putting up point per game numbers is just lucky, and he really did nothing to garner those types of numbers.
From my recollection, both of them got heat for being useless in that series. The venom came out recently to Heatley due to the trade request. If it was Spezza asking for the trade, he'd get flamed for this very thing too. However, anybody who thinks Heatley was equal or better than Spezza during the run just didn't watch those playoffs and doesn't get them as players. Spezza's a puck-controller like Thornton and that has a dramatic impact on the game regardless of if it's turned into a scoring chance. Heatley wasn't doing that but he was doing things the way he does to put points on the board. A lot of the times he'll make a pass one won't expect out of him or he'll put a shot to the net that another player can bang home on the rebound. Heatley can be just as productive as any other player at any other time but because he's more of an off-puck player and spends less time controlling the puck, he's never going to have the same level of impact as one who does.

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06-07-2010, 07:41 PM
  #178
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Originally Posted by Led Zappa View Post
And Marleau gets points in a series until the series he disappears and in the past that's when the Sharks bow out. He hasn't really takin' them anywhere. It goes both ways. Marleau's PO history is not great. He blazes for a series or 2 and then flames out. Except this year where his flame was out for the first 2 rounds and we and he blazed out in the 3rd.
Look at your own statements. Either he is great for a round or two in the POs and doesn't dominate one team, which is not enough - or he dominates for every single round without any slump for 2 straight months and then you might be happy? As easy pointed out, no skater has ever carried a team on his back through every single series, adjust your expectations. Marleau has carried us in some series, and others need to step up at other times. Pavs accomplished this against the Avalanche this year, nobody did against the Ducks last year.

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06-07-2010, 07:48 PM
  #179
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Originally Posted by Lars Bjorn View Post
Look at your own statements. Either he is great for a round or two in the POs and doesn't dominate one team, which is not enough - or he dominates for every single round without any slump for 2 straight months and then you might be happy? As easy pointed out, no skater has ever carried a team on his back through every single series, adjust your expectations. Marleau has carried us in some series, and others need to step up at other times. Pavs accomplished this against the Avalanche this year, nobody did against the Ducks last year.
I am pointing out the hypocrisy as I see it. Heatley is being held to a higher standard here or that's how I perceive it at least. Patty's some outstanding PO performer and Heatley's a passenger.

Ya know Marleau's gotten a ton of his goals by simply being in the right place at the right time. It's part of being a great player.

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06-07-2010, 07:51 PM
  #180
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Originally Posted by Led Zappa View Post
I am pointing out the hypocrisy as I see it. Heatley is being held to a higher standard here or that's how I perceive it at least. Patty's some outstanding PO performer and Heatley's a passenger.
It's all because of the goals scored. Marleau's like .45 and Heater's .28 in playoff goals per game avg (post lockout or not).

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Originally Posted by Led Zappa View Post
Ya know Marleau's gotten a ton of his goals by simply being in the right place at the right time. It's part of being a great player.
Exactly. Heatley wasn't... even in his Ottawa run, while Alfie was. Patty has been better than Heater in that regard. This team needs goals in the playoffs, not assists. Heatley was not a successful acquisition in that regard.


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06-07-2010, 08:06 PM
  #181
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Originally Posted by Davidhye View Post
This team needs goals in the playoffs, not assists. Heatley was not a successful acquisition in that regard.
Assists mean there were goals

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06-07-2010, 08:13 PM
  #182
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Originally Posted by MadmanSJ View Post
Assists mean there were goals
Which he wasn't scoring.

I don't hate Heater or anything. I like the guy. But Doug Wilson thought he is the cure of our scoring drought in the playoffs and I knew it was BS because he is not that kind of player.

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06-07-2010, 08:14 PM
  #183
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Originally Posted by Led Zappa View Post
I am pointing out the hypocrisy as I see it. Heatley is being held to a higher standard here or that's how I perceive it at least. Patty's some outstanding PO performer and Heatley's a passenger.

Ya know Marleau's gotten a ton of his goals by simply being in the right place at the right time. It's part of being a great player.
I haven't ever said he was a passenger. I have said that he is overpaid for his role. I have not questioned his effort. I have pointed out that his playoff record is that of getting assists rather than goals.

And right place/right time is part of being a great player. Also not missing those chances (a la Selanne) is another part. You don't get Patty's numbers by missing too often.

I am making the point about playoff roles. JT is a reg. season superstar. He is not a playoff superstar. Patty is reg. season elite and PO elite (not superstar). To attain playoff superstar status, the player has to match or beat reg. season production. That is the benchmark. Patty has done that. He is streaky in both seasons, but doesn't measurably drop off over the long haul. Heatley is close but needs to up his goal totals in the post-season. JT has to up his game period (and he was more reasonable this year than years past). When you get all on board matching regular season production is when you get playoff success.

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06-07-2010, 08:26 PM
  #184
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Originally Posted by SJeasy View Post
I haven't ever said he was a passenger. I have said that he is overpaid for his role. I have not questioned his effort. I have pointed out that his playoff record is that of getting assists rather than goals.

And right place/right time is part of being a great player. Also not missing those chances (a la Selanne) is another part. You don't get Patty's numbers by missing too often.

I am making the point about playoff roles. JT is a reg. season superstar. He is not a playoff superstar. Patty is reg. season elite and PO elite (not superstar). To attain playoff superstar status, the player has to match or beat reg. season production. That is the benchmark. Patty has done that. He is streaky in both seasons, but doesn't measurably drop off over the long haul. Heatley is close but needs to up his goal totals in the post-season. JT has to up his game period (and he was more reasonable this year than years past). When you get all on board matching regular season production is when you get playoff success.
Yours was just the last post in a trail that led up to that reponse. Didn't mean to put words in your mouth.

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06-07-2010, 10:06 PM
  #185
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Originally Posted by Led Zappa View Post
I am pointing out the hypocrisy as I see it. Heatley is being held to a higher standard here or that's how I perceive it at least. Patty's some outstanding PO performer and Heatley's a passenger.

Ya know Marleau's gotten a ton of his goals by simply being in the right place at the right time. It's part of being a great player.
The reality is that the roles are different for these two players. Up until the last two seasons, Marleau was relied upon to carry his line. Heatley has never been in that situation nor should he be because he's not that kind of player. To me, that changes the view on certain things especially when how the team does is being brought up. As in, implying that because Heatley's been to the Stanley Cup Finals, that that somehow means something about his abilities when it doesn't given the context of that team. Marleau and Heatley should be held to different standards because they're not the same players and they've never played the same roles on their respective teams.

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Old
06-07-2010, 10:18 PM
  #186
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Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd View Post
The reality is that the roles are different for these two players. Up until the last two seasons, Marleau was relied upon to carry his line. Heatley has never been in that situation nor should he be because he's not that kind of player. To me, that changes the view on certain things especially when how the team does is being brought up. As in, implying that because Heatley's been to the Stanley Cup Finals, that that somehow means something about his abilities when it doesn't given the context of that team. Marleau and Heatley should be held to different standards because they're not the same players and they've never played the same roles on their respective teams.
Couldn't agree more. If Patty's to be compared to anybody on the Sharks it's JT. Heatley was brought here last year and is not getting dealt NMC or not. I'm fine with that. If Marleau is a casualty of getting Heatley it wasn't because Heatley was expected to take Patty's role. it's more likely that DW has made his choice in Thornton or believe(s/ed) he could get a reasonable deal with Marleau.

Maybe I change my mind after one more season, but Heatley fulfilled my expectations until the PO's and I'll give him a pass on that one for now.

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06-07-2010, 10:53 PM
  #187
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i wouldn't give the address out here of course but a cursory search of what i think was the area on trulia reveals that a place very similar to what i remember this house being has been on the market for over 2 months.
update on that whole thing:
public county records show a deed of transfer may 18th, 2010. if i'm reading the site correctly, the marleau family trust/their bank(s) became the owners of the property in question a few weeks ago - after conferring with my friend, my fateful visit to that office was most likely in early february. AFAIK this timeframe is consistent with purchasing property through a trust, esp. if it happened to have been a short sale (not sure if it was) - though my personal experience is more to do with properties in other states/countries.

though, this doesn't conclusively say anything technically... i seem to recall another former shark lamenting that just as one house closed he was traded (was it rivet?)

EDIT:
trulia listing was updated june 5th, 2010. status: for sale.
was posted on a different real estate site as for sale may 23rd, 2010

i think this is happening, guys & gals


Last edited by baydrake: 06-07-2010 at 11:26 PM.
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06-07-2010, 11:25 PM
  #188
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Originally Posted by baydrake View Post
update on that whole thing:
public county records show a deed of transfer may 18th, 2010 (the website may just not have been updated till recently) though, this doesn't conclusively say anything technically... i seem to recall another former shark lamenting that just as one house closed he was traded (was it rivet?)

EDIT:
trulia listing was updated june 5th, 2010. status: for sale.
was posted on a different real estate site as for sale may 23rd, 2010

i think this is happening, guys & gals
While I appreciate the extra effort (and I do, I don't want to marginalize this for you) you're putting in, it happens when it happens and not before. And then, because we have no control over it, we accept it and move on.

Whitney
Falloon
Irbe

and so many more wore teal, broke in with teal, excited fans over the years and left.

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There's a little boy and on his 14th birthday he gets a horse... and everybody in the village says, "how wonderful. The boy got a horse" And the Zen master says, "we'll see." Two years later, the boy falls off the horse, breaks his leg, and everyone in the village says, "How terrible." And the Zen master says, "We'll see." Then, a war breaks out and all the young men have to go off and fight... except the boy can't cause his legs all messed up. and everybody in the village says, "How wonderful."

"We'll see."

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06-07-2010, 11:32 PM
  #189
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Originally Posted by Mr.Bridge View Post
While I appreciate the extra effort (and I do, I don't want to marginalize this for you) you're putting in, it happens when it happens and not before. And then, because we have no control over it, we accept it and move on.

Whitney
Falloon
Irbe

and so many more wore teal, broke in with teal, excited fans over the years and left.
thankfully it's not much effort. i stumbled across it to begin with and it was a matter of a phone call and two online searches. 5 mins or so?

my breath is as bated as anyone else's to see what happens. after all, there are any number of explanations for the observations, but i certainly know which outcome i'm expecting a bit more than the others now...

EDIT: that friend: "Maybe it means he's taking a pay cut and he can't afford that huge house anymore."


Last edited by baydrake: 06-07-2010 at 11:40 PM.
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06-07-2010, 11:41 PM
  #190
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Originally Posted by baydrake View Post
thankfully it's not much effort. i stumbled across it to begin with and it was a matter of a phone call and two online searches. 5 mins or so?

my breath is as bated as anyone else's to see what happens. after all, there are any number of explanations for the observations, but i certainly know which outcome i'm expecting a bit more than the others now...
It's quite common for free agents to go through this process simply to be prepared to move if it is necessary. It's not really a telling sign of movement. There's still three weeks for something to change on either side.

Admittedly, Marleau is my favorite player and letting him go will be a proverbial punch to the gut from my perspective. I have no desire to peruse through a Sharks team without Marleau to find a new favorite. I'd probably lean towards Jamie McGinn or Joe Pavelski. Hopefully, I don't have to make that decision. lol

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06-07-2010, 11:43 PM
  #191
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Originally Posted by baydrake View Post
update on that whole thing:
public county records show a deed of transfer may 18th, 2010. if i'm reading the site correctly, the marleau family trust/their bank(s) became the owners of the property in question a few weeks ago - after conferring with my friend, my fateful visit to that office was most likely in early february. AFAIK this timeframe is consistent with purchasing property through a trust, esp. if it happened to have been a short sale (not sure if it was) - though my personal experience is more to do with properties in other states/countries.

though, this doesn't conclusively say anything technically... i seem to recall another former shark lamenting that just as one house closed he was traded (was it rivet?)

EDIT:
trulia listing was updated june 5th, 2010. status: for sale.
was posted on a different real estate site as for sale may 23rd, 2010

i think this is happening, guys & gals
Is it the $7.8 million dollar house in LG on Trulia?

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06-07-2010, 11:47 PM
  #192
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Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd View Post
It's quite common for free agents to go through this process simply to be prepared to move if it is necessary. It's not really a telling sign of movement. There's still three weeks for something to change on either side.

Admittedly, Marleau is my favorite player and letting him go will be a proverbial punch to the gut from my perspective. I have no desire to peruse through a Sharks team without Marleau to find a new favorite. I'd probably lean towards Jamie McGinn or Joe Pavelski. Hopefully, I don't have to make that decision. lol
Joe Thornton should be your new favorite player.

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06-07-2010, 11:49 PM
  #193
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Originally Posted by baydrake View Post
thankfully it's not much effort. i stumbled across it to begin with and it was a matter of a phone call and two online searches. 5 mins or so?
5 minutes you could have spent sleeping/showering/eating/not being on the computer.

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06-07-2010, 11:53 PM
  #194
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Joe Thornton should be your new favorite player.
I despise your very being, sir.

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06-08-2010, 12:02 AM
  #195
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I despise your very being, sir.
I demand some sort of contradicting smiley or my feelings would be seriously hurt (even though I am perfectly aware you love me as much as Marleau).

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06-08-2010, 12:06 AM
  #196
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I demand some sort of contradicting smiley or my feelings would be seriously hurt (even though I am perfectly aware you love me as much as Marleau).
You know what really grinds my gears? You, David. **** you! Diane...

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06-08-2010, 12:07 AM
  #197
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You know what really grinds my gears? You, David. **** you! Diane...
At least you didn't call me Dave.

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06-08-2010, 12:08 AM
  #198
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At least you didn't call me Dave.
I'll make sure to start doing that going forward.

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06-08-2010, 12:10 AM
  #199
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This has seriously dampened my night.

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06-08-2010, 01:08 AM
  #200
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This has seriously dampened my night.
It's all TracksuitDave's fault.

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