HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > Hockey Talk by Country > Finland

Team Finland @ 2011 U20WJC's

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
07-22-2010, 08:01 AM
  #26
Needles
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Country: Finland
Posts: 854
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jussi View Post
I think Markus Granlund will be concentrating on the U-18 team this season.
OT: Are there any potential 1st/2nd round draftees in the U18 besides Mi. Granlund? Mika Partanen and/or Sami Salminen perhaps?

Needles is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-22-2010, 04:09 PM
  #27
Tormentor
Registered User
 
Tormentor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Too Far
Country: Finland
Posts: 1,731
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Needles View Post
OT: Are there any potential 1st/2nd round draftees in the U18 besides Mi. Granlund? Mika Partanen and/or Sami Salminen perhaps?
Partanen is no longer eligible to the U18 national team since he's a 92-born, it's 93-born or younger this upcoming season. There's pretty good depth in 2011 draft class for Finland, but IMO there are no sure-fire 1st/2nd rounder’s at the moment. Joel Armia might have the best chance of going fairly high in the draft, if he shows development in his game, especially in his skating.

Some sort of an early ranking/players worth watching for in 2011 NHL draft:
1. - F - Joel Armia (-93)
2. - F - Jesper Kokkonen (-93)
3. - F - Miikka Salomäki (-93)
4. - F - Mika Partanen (-92)
5. - F - Markus Granlund (-93)
6. - GK - Christopher Gibson (-92)
7. - F - Sami Salminen (-93)
8. - GK - Richard Ullberg (-93)
9. - F - Miro Aaltonen (-93)
10. - D - Samuli Piipponen (-93)
11. - F - Robert Leino (-93)
12. - D - Patrik Parkkonen (-93)
13. - GK - Kimmo Meriläinen (-93)
14. - D - Miihkali Teppo (-92)
15. - F - Jesse Huhtala (-93)
16. - D - Joonas Valkonen (-93)
17. - D - Roni Rukajärvi (-93)
18. - D - Santeri Arousva (-93)
19. - D - Julius Nyqvist (-92)
20. - F - Tomi Wilenius (-93)
21. - D - Niklas Nevalainen (-93)
22. - F - Heikki Liedes (-93)
23. - D - Roni Viirlas (-93)
24. - F - Aleksi Niemitalo (-93)
25. - GK - Samu Perhonen (-93)
26. - F - Jesse Lindsten (-93)
27. - D - Markus Västilä (-92)
28. - F - Arttu Heikkinen (-93)
29. - GK - Ville Runola (-93)
30. - F - Ville Järveläinen (-93)

Tormentor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-22-2010, 07:06 PM
  #28
Doothpick
RIP Ruslan Salei
 
Doothpick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 765
vCash: 500
Thanks for the list, Tormentor.

Doothpick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-23-2010, 01:07 AM
  #29
Needles
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Country: Finland
Posts: 854
vCash: 500
Thanks Tormentor! Nice to see so many big sized forwards in the top10.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tormentor View Post
9. - F - Miro Aaltonen (-93)
The last time I heard about Miro Aaltonen, he was supposed to be the next big thing after Mikael Granlund and Teemu Pulkkinen. Hopefully he does better in the Jr. A next year.

Needles is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-23-2010, 09:57 AM
  #30
wings5
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,271
vCash: 500
I would think Salomaki would be first on the list based on his experiance and performance in Jr.A.Why is Armia and Kokkonen ahead of him even though they didn't spend a full season at that level and didn't perform quite as well as Salomaki? Speaking more about Kokkonen.

wings5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-23-2010, 04:37 PM
  #31
Tormentor
Registered User
 
Tormentor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Too Far
Country: Finland
Posts: 1,731
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Needles View Post
The last time I heard about Miro Aaltonen, he was supposed to be the next big thing after Mikael Granlund and Teemu Pulkkinen. Hopefully he does better in the Jr. A next year.
Aaltonen had a big role in his team last season in Jr.A, but had some problems when the game got faster and more physical. Aaltonen is still growing and developing physically, so with more experience, strength and speed he should do well in Jr.A this upcoming season, his skill level and hockey sense are already on a good level.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wings5 View Post
I would think Salomaki would be first on the list based on his experiance and performance in Jr.A.Why is Armia and Kokkonen ahead of him even though they didn't spend a full season at that level and didn't perform quite as well as Salomaki? Speaking more about Kokkonen.
I feel that the difference in overall talent level between the top-7 forwards; Armia, Kokkonen, Salomäki, Partanen, Granlund, Salminen and Aaltonen is far from astronomical, so the upcoming season will play a major role in determining who the top draft prospect of the group is. Therefore it’s probably best not to put too much value in the order that I’ve ranked them in. I’m probably going to change my mind many times as the season goes on and the draft gets closer.

At the moment I feel that Joel Armia has the highest NHL potential of the group. He’s 6’3 tall and tough to play against. He has flair, good set of hands and a great wrist shot. His skating is holding him back both offensively and defensively, so hopefully we see some improvement in this area.

Jesper Kokkonen was a bit inconsistent in Jr.A this past season and didn’t always get quality ice time, but that’s not unusual for a 16 year old player who’s playing against mostly 18 and 19 year old players. He’s a good hockey player for his age and the combination of size, agility and the fact that he skates really well, ensure the interest of NHL scouts. I admit that he still has quite a lot to prove, but I feel that he has good potential.

Salomäki is overall the most complete player of the group and might actually get a good chance to play SM-liiga hockey this upcoming season. In this sense it wouldn’t be wrong to rank him 1st. I feel that some scouting organizations might be a bit unaware of his talent, because he was slightly injured while attending the World U-17 Hockey Challenge (broken toe) and the WU18C’s (sprained ankle). Salomäki is a 5’11 tall “power forward” and he isn’t the fastest/(most agile) player on the ice, so at the moment that’s the biggest question mark as far as his NHL potential is concerned.

Tormentor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-03-2010, 03:04 AM
  #32
Tormentor
Registered User
 
Tormentor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Too Far
Country: Finland
Posts: 1,731
vCash: 500
U20 Camp at Lake Placid

Finland - Sweden (3 - 5)
1-1 Mika Partanen
2-2 Iiro Pakarinen (Erik Haula)
3-3 Joonas Mäkinen

Christopher Gibson was the netminder for Team Finland, 18 saves. Sweden scored 4 goals on the powerplay. Sweden had Pääjärvi-Svensson, Ekman-Larsson and Josefson in the roster, so the result ain't that bad considering that we were missing Granlund, Vatanen, Pulkkinen and our top goalies (Ortio and Aittokallio).

You can follow the schedule and results from here

Tormentor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-05-2010, 12:10 AM
  #33
Tormentor
Registered User
 
Tormentor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Too Far
Country: Finland
Posts: 1,731
vCash: 500
USA - Finland (6 - 3)
4-1 Junttila (Haula)
5-2 Rissanen (Hakanpää, Donskoi) PP
6-3 Partanen (Rajala, Nättinen) PP

According to nhl.com Finland's lineup was as following:
Quote:
Toni Rajala-Joonas Nattinen-Iiro Pakarinen
Joonas Donskoi-Erik Haula-Julius Junttila
Teemu Rautiainen-Mikael Salmivirta-Mika Partanen
Valtteri Virkkunen-Joonas Makinen-Topi Taavitsainen
Teemu Tallberg

Nico Manelius-Jyrki Jokipakka
Rasmus Rissanen-Jani Hakanpaa
Tommi Kivisto-Jesse Virtanen
Mikael Aaltonen-Miihkali Teppo

Jonathan Iilahti will start in goal, with Christopher Gibson backing him up.

Tormentor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-05-2010, 07:09 AM
  #34
Needles
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Country: Finland
Posts: 854
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tormentor View Post
At the moment I feel that Joel Armia has the highest NHL potential of the group. He’s 6’3 tall and tough to play against. He has flair, good set of hands and a great wrist shot. His skating is holding him back both offensively and defensively, so hopefully we see some improvement in this area.
Armia will play tomorrow in Pitsiturnaus as a part of the Ässät lineup: http://www.raumanlukko.fi/index_2.ph...set&u=1220&b=u

Needles is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-06-2010, 01:33 AM
  #35
Tormentor
Registered User
 
Tormentor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Too Far
Country: Finland
Posts: 1,731
vCash: 500
Sweden - Finland (6 - 2)
4-1 Donskoi (Junttila)
4-2 Pakarinen (Rissanen, Partanen) PP

Jonathan Iilahti was the netminder, 30 saves.

Tormentor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-06-2010, 08:28 PM
  #36
SChan*
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,502
vCash: 500
how is finlands youth program progressing? I remember when finland was a bit better than swedens juniors but it seems that the finnish U20 team hasnt beated the swedes in forever. What gives.

SChan* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-07-2010, 02:57 AM
  #37
Tormentor
Registered User
 
Tormentor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Too Far
Country: Finland
Posts: 1,731
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by VonKaggas View Post
how is finlands youth program progressing? I remember when finland was a bit better than swedens juniors but it seems that the finnish U20 team hasnt beated the swedes in forever. What gives.
I think that overall the Swedish hockey has a lot more depth than the Finnish hockey. Sweden has a lot of clubs doing quality work with junior development, a lot of enthusiastic people working in hockey, better competition on higher levels of hockey (Elitserien/Allsvenskan/J20 SuperElit vs. SM-liiga/Mestis/Jr.A), and a better team sport culture. Whereas Finland might produce a few good prospects per age group, Sweden is at the moment producing close to a dozen.

Finnish hockey federation is trying to improve the situation in Finland, but their work is pretty meaningless as long as there's no real change in mentality at the club level. Some bigger clubs aren't putting the best possible effort to junior development, most smaller clubs are putting their recourses on "hobby hockey". The atmosphere of ambition and hard work is missing from many organizations.

Tormentor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-07-2010, 03:06 AM
  #38
Latex*
DM is good
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Helsinki,Helsingfors
Posts: 5,551
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tormentor;
I think that overall the Swedish hockey has a lot more depth than the Finnish hockey. Sweden has a lot of clubs doing quality work with junior development, a lot of enthusiastic people working in hockey, better competition on higher levels of hockey (Elitserien/Allsvenskan/J20 SuperElit vs. SM-liiga/Mestis/Jr.A), and a better team sport culture. Whereas Finland might produce a few good prospects per age group, Sweden is at the moment producing close to a dozen.

Finnish hockey federation is trying to improve the situation in Finland, but their work is pretty meaningless as long as there's no real change in mentality at the club level. Some bigger clubs aren't putting the best possible effort to junior development, most smaller clubs are putting their recourses on "hobby hockey". The atmosphere of ambition and hard work is missing from many organizations.
Which of the big clubs are you referring when you say "aren't putting the best possible effort to junior development"?

Latex* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-08-2010, 12:52 AM
  #39
Tormentor
Registered User
 
Tormentor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Too Far
Country: Finland
Posts: 1,731
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Latexi84 View Post
Which of the big clubs are you referring when you say "aren't putting the best possible effort to junior development"?
Perhaps I should have phrased it differently; all SM-liiga teams have room for improvement, some more than others. I think that clubs like Ässät and KalPa are doing fairly well considering their recourses (population of the town, available indoor ice, money…) and have lately brought up quite a few kids to their first team that have been with the organization from start to finish (from skating school to Jr.A). If Elitserien clubs like Brynäs (from Gävle, population 70000) and Skellefteå (population 32000) are able to produce multiple NHL prospects in a short time, every SM-liiga team should check their procedures/practices. Most Mestis teams can’t compete with Allsveskan clubs simply because of recourses, but I think that SM-liiga teams could do better.

-------------------------

Finland – USA (3 – 8)
1-0 Junttila (Hakanpää, Rissanen)
2-0 Donskoi (Junttila)
3-1 Pakarinen (Donskoi)

The first game was lost by 2 goals, the second by 3 goals, the third by 4 goals, and the final game by 5 goals. One could say that it went from bad to worse, and that the inexperienced coaching staff has some learning to do.

Tormentor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-08-2010, 09:26 AM
  #40
SChan*
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,502
vCash: 500
finland was up 3-1 against the US and yielded 7 goals in 1.5 periods

what a meltdown

SChan* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-09-2010, 01:13 AM
  #41
Jussi
I am siege face
 
Jussi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Country: Finland
Posts: 42,605
vCash: 612
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tormentor View Post
Most Mestis teams can’t compete with Allsveskan clubs simply because of recourses, but I think that SM-liiga teams could do better.
OT: I believe the word you're looking for is resources?

Jussi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-09-2010, 06:12 AM
  #42
Tormentor
Registered User
 
Tormentor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Too Far
Country: Finland
Posts: 1,731
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jussi View Post
OT: I believe the word you're looking for is resources?
Oui, ärmlich inglés.

Tormentor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-10-2010, 09:46 AM
  #43
Tony Piscotta
Hockey's Future Staff
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Hamilton Square
Country: United States
Posts: 763
vCash: 500
Is this really a question of coaching or more due to the depth of the other teams - particularly the USA's ability to have two teams at the tournament? I'd imagine the scores and results were secondary concern as compared to getting as many players as possible experience in as many different situations as necessary. That has usually worked well for Finland both in the European Hockey Tournament and in World Championship competition.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tormentor View Post

The first game was lost by 2 goals, the second by 3 goals, the third by 4 goals, and the final game by 5 goals. One could say that it went from bad to worse, and that the inexperienced coaching staff has some learning to do.

Tony Piscotta is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-10-2010, 03:20 PM
  #44
Tormentor
Registered User
 
Tormentor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Too Far
Country: Finland
Posts: 1,731
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony Piscotta View Post
Is this really a question of coaching or more due to the depth of the other teams - particularly the USA's ability to have two teams at the tournament?
USA's original 42-player Evaluation Camp roster was cut to 28-players for these games against Sweden and Finland. USA had a roster of 3 goalies, 9 defensemen, and 16 forwards. Finland had a roster of 2 goalies, 8 defensemen, and 14 forwards, not much difference there. Ortio, Aittokallio, Vatanen, Kärmeniemi, Granlund and Pulkkinen were the only players that would’ve improved the team.

I admit that it's unfair to question the coaching staff without seeing the games, but their inexperience is a concern. None of the three coaches have head coach experience from SM-liiga. Short international tournaments require quick decision making and adjusting, experience helps. There’s not much time to prepare and some of the opponents are fairly unknown, recognizing their weaknesses and using them to your advantage can be a key to victory.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony Piscotta View Post
I'd imagine the scores and results were secondary concern as compared to getting as many players as possible experience in as many different situations as necessary.
Scores and results are a secondary concern in these kind of tournaments, that’s true. On the other hand, if the team doesn’t win any games, it doesn’t learn what winning requires at this level.

I don’t think that giving experience to certain players was the main objective in this tournament, games against Mestis teams are better suited for that. I believe that the main objective was to gather information. How different players performed against this level of competition in a North American rink and how well did they fulfil their role. Also it’s important to see how the dense tournament schedule affects the performance level of different players.

Tormentor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-25-2010, 04:19 AM
  #45
Tormentor
Registered User
 
Tormentor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Too Far
Country: Finland
Posts: 1,731
vCash: 500
4 Nations Tournament Nyköping, SWE

Schedule:  
3-SEP-2010
4-SEP-2010
5-SEP-2010

Team:     
AITTOKALLIO Sami 1992 186 78 L Ilves Tampere
ORTIO Joni 1991 186 83 L TPS Turku
      
JOKIPAKKA Jyrki 1991 189 86 L Ilves Tampere
KIVISTÖ Tommi 1991 186 89 L Jokerit Helsinki
MANELIUS Nico 1991 182 87 L Jokerit Helsinki
AALTONEN Mikael 1991 178 85 L TPS Turku
HAKANPÄÄ Jani 1992 195 97 R Blues Espoo
VIRTANEN Jesse 1991 181 84 L Lukko Rauma
KÄRMENIEMI Lauri 1991 179 75 R HPK Hämeenlinna
      
RAJALA Toni 1991 178 75 L Ilves Tampere
JUNTTILA Julius 1991 178 78 L Kärpät Oulu
TUOMINEN Henri 1991 191 86 L Ilves Tampere
PAKARINEN Iiro 1991 185 88 R KalPa Kuopio
PULKKINEN Teemu 1992 180 83 R Jokerit Helsinki
KUMPULAINEN Janne 1991 175 75 L JYP Jyväskylä
TALLBERG Teemu 1991 186 86 L HIFK Helsinki
DONSKOI Joonas 1992 183 83 R Kärpät Oulu
NÄTTINEN Joonas 1991 189 85 R Blues Espoo
PIITULAINEN Jesper 1991 172 76 R SapKo Savonlinna
MÄKINEN Joonas 1991 185 95 L HPK Hämeenlinna
VIRKKUNEN Valtteri 1991 177 79 L Blues Espoo
GRANLUND Markus 1993 178 74 L HIFK Helsinki
SALOMÄKI Miikka 1993 180 88 L Kärpät Oulu

Apparently Rasmus Rissanen (Hurricanes prospect camp?), Erik Haula and Mika Partanen will already be in North America, so they aren't available. Also Mikael Granlund and Sami Vatanen are still absent from the roster.

Tormentor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-27-2010, 03:42 PM
  #46
Korkki
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Pori, Finland
Country: Finland
Posts: 1,076
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tormentor View Post
Partanen is no longer eligible to the U18 national team since he's a 92-born, it's 93-born or younger this upcoming season. There's pretty good depth in 2011 draft class for Finland, but IMO there are no sure-fire 1st/2nd rounder’s at the moment. Joel Armia might have the best chance of going fairly high in the draft, if he shows development in his game, especially in his skating.
Armia scored once and had some nice moves in a game against lukko today. Seems like his skating has improved a bit and as I have said earlier he has the scorer's sense. But of course he will need more muscles before he is capable to fully play in mens level.

Korkki is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
08-28-2010, 09:03 AM
  #47
Juzmo
rip
 
Juzmo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Country: Finland
Posts: 37,168
vCash: 6969
Quote:
Originally Posted by Korkki View Post
Armia scored once and had some nice moves in a game against lukko today. Seems like his skating has improved a bit and as I have said earlier he has the scorer's sense. But of course he will need more muscles before he is capable to fully play in mens level.
I have a feeling he will probably see some games in SM-liiga if a guy gets hurt in the top three lines.

Juzmo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-05-2010, 08:57 AM
  #48
The Saw Is the Law
Registered User
 
The Saw Is the Law's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Country: Finland
Posts: 1,836
vCash: 500
U20 4-Nations tournament

2 loses regular, one shootout loss.

Finland-Russia 1-2 (SO)

1-0 PP Nico Manelius, assists Markus Granlund, Jani Hakanpää

Sweden-Finland 4-1

1-1 Mikael Salmivirta, assist Teemu Tallberg

Czech Republic-Finland 3-2

0-1 Jani Hakanpää
1-3 Jesse Virtanen, assists Lauri Kärmenimi, Markus Granlund

Scoring leaders:
Hakanpää 1+1
Markus Granlund 0+2


Last edited by The Saw Is the Law: 09-05-2010 at 09:11 AM.
The Saw Is the Law is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-05-2010, 10:26 AM
  #49
FrankTheTank
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Country: Finland
Posts: 89
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Saw Is the Law View Post
2 loses regular, one shootout loss.

Finland-Russia 1-2 (SO)

1-0 PP Nico Manelius, assists Markus Granlund, Jani Hakanpää

Sweden-Finland 4-1

1-1 Mikael Salmivirta, assist Teemu Tallberg

Czech Republic-Finland 3-2

0-1 Jani Hakanpää
1-3 Jesse Virtanen, assists Lauri Kärmenimi, Markus Granlund

Scoring leaders:
Hakanpää 1+1
Markus Granlund 0+2
Four goal on three game! That's sad. Only one forward made a goal. That's super sad.

Toni Rajala made 0+0 and if I remember correct he made in Lake placid only 0+1 on four game! He will be better when he get play with Granlund and Pulkkinen but still...

We have to also remember that there was lot of players who wasnt there because of European trophy, injuries and some players have already travelled to the states. Granlund, Pulkkinen, Vatanen, Pakarinen, Haula, Rissanen, Partanen, Donskoi and Junttila. Am I still missing some one?

But glad to see that Markus Granlund made points.

FrankTheTank is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
09-05-2010, 11:19 AM
  #50
Tormentor
Registered User
 
Tormentor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Too Far
Country: Finland
Posts: 1,731
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by FrankTheTank View Post
Toni Rajala made 0+0 and if I remember correct he made in Lake placid only 0+1 on four game! He will be better when he get play with Granlund and Pulkkinen but still...
If he gets to play with Granlund and Pulkkinen that is... There's a pretty good competition for top-6 spots with Mi. Granlund, Pakarinen, Pulkkinen, Donskoi, Nättinen, Junttila, Haula and Rajala. Partanen, Ma. Granlund and Salomäki might also be options if someone gets injured. If Rajala doesn’t start scoring goals soon, he might not have a suitable role in the team. Anyways three 5’10'' tall forwards on the same line might not be ideal in a tournament that’s played in North America, especially when Pulkkinen and Rajala aren’t that strong defensively.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FrankTheTank View Post
We have to also remember that there was lot of players who wasnt there because of European trophy, injuries and some players have already travelled to the states. Granlund, Pulkkinen, Vatanen, Pakarinen, Haula, Rissanen, Partanen, Donskoi and Junttila. Am I still missing some one?
Nättinen injured his Achilles tendon in the first game, so 8 top forwards and two important defensemen were out. Canada, Sweden and USA will have great teams, but Finland might have the 4th best team at the WJC's, if all players are healthy and available.

Tormentor is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:27 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.