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Rutherford: Whitney unlikely to sign with Canes

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Old
06-11-2010, 03:59 PM
  #201
UnderratedBrooks44
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Yeah the only way Armstrong is coming back is if everyone realizes he makes enough already and he actually takes a paycut. $2 million is the most he's worth and I don't even know if he's worth $1.75 to the Penguins.

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06-11-2010, 04:46 PM
  #202
Hans Rutherford
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Originally Posted by UnderratedBrooks44 View Post
Yeah the only way Armstrong is coming back is if everyone realizes he makes enough already and he actually takes a paycut. $2 million is the most he's worth and I don't even know if he's worth $1.75 to the Penguins.
I'd take Colby $2million over two years (wouldn't go much over that either), than trade assets for Stafford. I don't think either of them would out-do one another by much. Say what you will about Staffords "offensive" upside, it's just never arrived in the NHL, and who knows if it ever will. A change of scenery could help him here, but that's never a guarantee.


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06-11-2010, 08:36 PM
  #203
Jag68Sid87
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Stafford would be nice, but Zack Kassian is the guy I want from Buffalo. Make the call, Ray. Make the call.

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06-11-2010, 08:38 PM
  #204
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Zack Kassian is more untouchable than Tangradi. Much more.

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06-11-2010, 09:02 PM
  #205
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Stafford would be nice, but Zack Kassian is the guy I want from Buffalo. Make the call, Ray. Make the call.
And Ray could talk until he was blue in the face...

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06-11-2010, 09:07 PM
  #206
Darth Vitale
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Not sold on Stafford but he'd be a modest improvement over Guerin or Feds.

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06-11-2010, 09:14 PM
  #207
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You don't think? I do. First off the draft is a crapshoot and second I'd be pleased if we drafted a 20 goal scorer with a little room to still grow with the 20th pick. Plus he helps us NOW.
Yep. We'd be lucky if our 20th pick this year turned into a clone of Kris Versteeg 4-5 seasons from now.

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06-11-2010, 09:23 PM
  #208
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Yep. We'd be lucky if our 20th pick this year turned into a clone of Kris Versteeg 4-5 seasons from now.
Right? I don't understand the argument against Versteeg at 20. Who needs prospects when you can get 24 year old future 25-30 goal scorer.

What are the chances our 20th pick will ever score 25 goals in the NHL? Not good.

The only downside is that we don't get him on his ELC. But we're going to spend at least 3M on a winger anyway, right?

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06-11-2010, 09:49 PM
  #209
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Right? I don't understand the argument against Versteeg at 20. Who needs prospects when you can get 24 year old future 25-30 goal scorer.

What are the chances our 20th pick will ever score 25 goals in the NHL? Not good.

The only downside is that we don't get him on his ELC. But we're going to spend at least 3M on a winger anyway, right?
Not an ELC, but you also aren't waiting for a guy to develop and Versteeg is an RFA after his current deal is up.

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06-11-2010, 09:52 PM
  #210
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Not an ELC, but you also aren't waiting for a guy to develop and Versteeg is an RFA after his current deal is up.
Exactly right. I was saving that for someone who disagreed with me

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06-11-2010, 09:57 PM
  #211
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Exactly right. I was saving that for someone who disagreed with me
Sorry to steal your ammo

I will say that, Versteeg's play in the SCF was a little discouraging. He played well in game 1, but after that...not so much.

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06-11-2010, 10:01 PM
  #212
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Originally Posted by UnderratedBrooks44 View Post
Versteeg, without going into how likely he is to get, is a perrrrrfect fit. Yes he has flaws to his game, that's why he's making $3 million not $6 million. We don't need a winger that's going to hit everything in sight we need a winger that can shoot the damn puck and create space for our centers. Oh, and being able to skate from here to there before the sun goes down helps a lot too. I think it was game 3 or 4 he zoomed into the slot and fired a wrist shot that went in. That exemplifies what we need. Someone who can actually do something on their own.
Well said, i'm in complete agreement.

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06-11-2010, 10:05 PM
  #213
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Originally Posted by JTG32005 View Post
Sorry to steal your ammo

I will say that, Versteeg's play in the SCF was a little discouraging. He played well in game 1, but after that...not so much.
Discouraging, yes, but still worth the deal if we could get him for the 20th straight up. You'd like to see him go all out a bit more in the Finals of all series, but he still made more happen offensively than any winger on this year's roster would've been likely to, had the Pens made it to the Finals instead.

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06-11-2010, 10:06 PM
  #214
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Sorry to steal your ammo

I will say that, Versteeg's play in the SCF was a little discouraging. He played well in game 1, but after that...not so much.
No problem.

He's the kind of guy that just can't get to his game as much when he's playing on the 3rd line, IMO.

I think UB44 nailed it in his post earlier. He can come out of nowhere and snipe one and he also has the ability to carry the puck and make plays with it. His lack of physicality (which isn't Kyle Wellwood-esque) won't be as visible in the top-6, especially if he's playing on a line with Crosby and Kunitz.

I realize we're getting well ahead of ourselves here, but it's fun to think about.

Also- maybe Bowman's asking price came down since he didn't have a great SCF?

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06-11-2010, 10:16 PM
  #215
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No problem.

He's the kind of guy that just can't get to his game as much when he's playing on the 3rd line, IMO.

I think UB44 nailed it in his post earlier. He can come out of nowhere and snipe one and he also has the ability to carry the puck and make plays with it. His lack of physicality (which isn't Kyle Wellwood-esque) won't be as visible in the top-6, especially if he's playing on a line with Crosby and Kunitz.

I realize we're getting well ahead of ourselves here, but it's fun to think about.

Also- maybe Bowman's asking price came down since he didn't have a great SCF?
That's what i'm hoping for, it would be fantastic if that were the case.

I'm really having trouble not getting my hopes up about this. Right now, Kris Versteeg is doing double duty as the type of player the Pens are in most need of, and the type of player the Hawks can most easily let go without it hurting them too badly.

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06-11-2010, 10:48 PM
  #216
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Well, you guys have convinced me. Attempting to get Versteeg seems a no-brainer to me at this point.

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06-11-2010, 10:51 PM
  #217
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Certainly is now with Hawks losing another $1M+ in bonus money to Tazer. They're really up against it.

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06-12-2010, 08:00 AM
  #218
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ZOMG HIGHLIGHTS TIME!!!!



He did an even better job on Eaves than Satan did.






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06-12-2010, 08:22 AM
  #219
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Well, I guess I am still the lone ranger when it comes to dealing No. 20 for Versteeg. Sorry, but I am a believer in upside. Everybody always looks at the negative side of the coin here, instead of the positive. Everybody says, "we'd be lucky if so and so scores 25 goals". I view it as a rare opportunity for our club to land something better at No. 20 in a deep draft than what we're used to. We got a pretty good, perhaps even great, prospect at No. 30 last year. 10 spots higher in a deeper draft (my opinion) could lead to something even better. I'd rather have Dylan McIlrath, Jeff Skinner, Austin Watson, Evgeny Kuznetsov, etc. than Kris Versteeg. I'd rather have two or three assets (if we trade down) than just Versteeg. Or, I'd rather move up in the draft and secure a Skinner, Watson or maybe even a Niederreiter or Granlund. All you're doing by trading 20 for Versteeg is you're limiting the upside potential of your first-round pick. I don't like that. I know people love the sure thing here, but I don't believe in the sure thing. Ever. I believe in erring on the side of talent and upside.

Besides, I saw Versteeg's little rap yesterday at the parade. Ouch. That was cringe-worthy.

As for Kassian, I believe we need to get into Marlon Brando mode here and make Buffalo an offer they can't refuse. Kunitz, Gonchar's rights and a pick or prospect (Letestu?) for Kassian...something like that.

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06-12-2010, 08:26 AM
  #220
wej20
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Originally Posted by Jag68Sid87 View Post
Well, I guess I am still the lone ranger when it comes to dealing No. 20 for Versteeg. Sorry, but I am a believer in upside. Everybody always looks at the negative side of the coin here, instead of the positive. Everybody says, "we'd be lucky if so and so scores 25 goals". I view it as a rare opportunity for our club to land something better at No. 20 in a deep draft than what we're used to. We got a pretty good, perhaps even great, prospect at No. 30 last year. 10 spots higher in a deeper draft (my opinion) could lead to something even better. I'd rather have Dylan McIlrath, Jeff Skinner, Austin Watson, Evgeny Kuznetsov, etc. than Kris Versteeg. I'd rather have two or three assets (if we trade down) than just Versteeg. Or, I'd rather move up in the draft and secure a Skinner, Watson or maybe even a Niederreiter or Granlund. All you're doing by trading 20 for Versteeg is you're limiting the upside potential of your first-round pick. I don't like that. I know people love the sure thing here, but I don't believe in the sure thing. Ever. I believe in erring on the side of talent and upside.

Besides, I saw Versteeg's little rap yesterday at the parade. Ouch. That was cringe-worthy.

As for Kassian, I believe we need to get into Marlon Brando mode here and make Buffalo an offer they can't refuse. Kunitz, Gonchar's rights and a pick or prospect (Letestu?) for Kassian...something like that.
We may be limiting the upside by trading the 20th overall for Versteeg but we're drastically limiting our downside to.

I don't see the point of overpaying for Kassian who wont contribute until the 11-12 season and I don't see him as putting up many more points than Kunitz does now.

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06-12-2010, 08:27 AM
  #221
Jag68Sid87
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Well, I believe Kassian will become better than Dustin Byfuglien (as a power forward), so yeah I'd overpay for sure.

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06-12-2010, 09:18 AM
  #222
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As for Kassian, I believe we need to get into Marlon Brando mode here and make Buffalo an offer they can't refuse. Kunitz, Gonchar's rights and a pick or prospect (Letestu?) for Kassian...something like that.
I can't even imagine that would get Buffalo to listen. They'd want Letang+ or Staal. I'm telling you, he's unattainable.

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06-12-2010, 09:20 AM
  #223
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I can't even imagine that would get Buffalo to listen. They'd want Letang+ or Staal. I'm telling you, he's unattainable.
Letang + is something we should explore for a lot of players, but that's been my mantra since he signed his new deal so whatever. Just my opinion. There's a chance Letang lives up to that contract a couple years from now and beyond but with that package we could get someone that would help us now and in the future.

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06-12-2010, 09:50 AM
  #224
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We may be limiting the upside by trading the 20th overall for Versteeg but we're drastically limiting our downside to.

I don't see the point of overpaying for Kassian who wont contribute until the 11-12 season and I don't see him as putting up many more points than Kunitz does now.
You would be taking away pretty much all downside, really. The only what if involved with Versteeg is who will he fit with, and what happens if he doesn't fit in like Poni didn't? Other than that, it's a win all the way around.

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06-12-2010, 09:56 AM
  #225
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Letang + is something we should explore for a lot of players, but that's been my mantra since he signed his new deal so whatever. Just my opinion. There's a chance Letang lives up to that contract a couple years from now and beyond but with that package we could get someone that would help us now and in the future.
If I'm giving up Letang+, I'm going for an actual NHL player that can help us right now and has proven something. But yeah, I agree that moving him would be an option for certain guys.

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