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MLD 2010 DRAFT Part I

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Old
06-15-2010, 08:41 PM
  #51
TheDevilMadeMe
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VanIslander View Post
Zabrodsky is an interesting pick. If it wasn't for the question mark posed by him not playing against the best of his era he'd be a ATD regular for sure!


Indeed. That's one reason why Bobrov should be seen as a marginal ATD regular, clear ATD extra pick. He may or may not be able to handle the workload against the best of his era. Same goes for Malecek.
Agreed. I think that all three are best used as top line talent in the MLD. Bobrov, as a LW (instead of center like the Czechs) is probably talented enough to be useful in the ATD in theory. But he's the type of player who needs to have his line built around him, and he's probably not good for that on the ATD level.

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06-15-2010, 08:42 PM
  #52
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By 1972 the Soviets had clearly reached the level of the best of their era. Mid-1960s? One can assume they were at least 80% there. Late 1950s? Half there? 1940s and 1930s European hockey? *shrug* Seems like a AAA-level starter, MLD depth pick, not the sort of guy you put heavy faith in on a top line unless one pines for letting it ride in Vegas.

Quote:
Agreed. I think that all three are best used as top line talent in the MLD. Bobrov, as a LW (instead of center like the Czechs) is probably talented enough to be useful in the ATD in theory. But he's the type of player who needs to have his line built around him, and he's probably not good for that on the ATD level.
Maybe you're right. If they are worthy of being extra skater depth picks in the ATD then going early in the MLD may be apt. Hobey Baker and Moose Goheen used to be early picks and top starters in the MLD and now they are seen as and drafted as legitimate extra skaters in the main ATD, drafted as depth options worth taking a flyer on despite not competing against the best of their era. But let's not draft the best Italian or Swiss league player quite yet, k?


Last edited by VanIslander: 06-15-2010 at 08:54 PM.
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Old
06-15-2010, 08:45 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by VanIslander View Post
By 1972 the Soviets had clearly reached the level of the best of their era. Mid-1960s? One can assume they were at least 80% there. Late 1950s? Half there? 1940s and 1930s European hockey? *shrug* Seems like a AAA-level starter, MLD depth pick, not the sort of guy you put heavy faith in on a top line unless one pines for letting it ride in Vegas.
Zabrodsky isn't just 1940s "European hockey," though. He's 1940s Czech hockey, which was well ahead of the Soviets at the time. I'd say it's pretty comparable to the competition that ATD mainstays Bobrov and Solugubov faced.

And he dominated his competition, much like Bobrov did. Of course, the criticism of Bobrov is apt with Zabrodsky too - he has to be the centerpiece of his line to be effective. We'll see what we can do.

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06-15-2010, 08:54 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by VanIslander View Post
Savard is playoff-limited without individual or team accomplishments in any league or international setting. History won't totally forget him but close to it, with him being no more than a bit stat: his three top-3 assist seasons - he sure as hell has a weaker resume in so many ways than several undrafted players. It must be a homer pick.
Thanks for thinking much of me.

Savard is playoff-limited, but then I wouldn't call is resume bad with 22 points in 25 games and the 13 point in 11 game run.

3 top-3's, 4 top 10's in assists are a "bit" stat? How many players do you expect to find with that kind of resume from here on out? I highly doubt we'll come across one with a playmaking resume that is better than Savard's, at least clearly.

He lacks individual accomplishments, but playing at centre certainly hurts him there- and he hasn't exactly played for perrenial contenders either for team accomplishments. And though he lacks these kind of accomplishments, it does not make him necessarily worse than those that were awarded weaker individual or team accomplishments outside of best on best situations, which I don't usually put much stock in (depending on the kind of accomplishment and level of competition)

Savard doesn't play for the team I like, never has, I am not a fan of his. I selected him because his playmaking and offensive resume was too good to ignore. I don't make homer picks.

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06-15-2010, 08:58 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by Leafs Forever View Post
Thanks for thinking much of me.

Savard is playoff-limited, but then I wouldn't call is resume bad with 22 points in 25 games and the 13 point in 11 game run.

3 top-3's, 4 top 10's in assists are a "bit" stat? How many players do you expect to find with that kind of resume from here on out? I highly doubt we'll come across one with a playmaking resume that is better than Savard's, at least clearly.

He lacks individual accomplishments, but playing at centre certainly hurts him there- and he hasn't exactly played for perrenial contenders either for team accomplishments. And though he lacks these kind of accomplishments, it does not make him necessarily worse than those that were awarded weaker individual or team accomplishments outside of best on best situations, which I don't usually put much stock in (depending on the kind of accomplishment and level of competition)

Savard doesn't play for the team I like, never has, I am not a fan of his. I selected him because his playmaking and offensive resume was too good to ignore. I don't make homer picks.
Savard might be the best point-producer in the MLD too. He has 3 Top 10s in points - granted they are mostly assist driven, but they show that he isn't totally devoid of goalscoring.

The criticisms of course are that he only has a single good playoff run, and he spent most of his career as poor defensively and a liability to take lazy (but not tough) penalties.

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06-15-2010, 09:02 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by Leafs Forever View Post
I wouldn't call is resume bad with 22 points in 25 games and the 13 point in 11 game run.
That is historically insignificant. PLENTY of players have done that and many undrafted have done better.

Quote:
3 top-3's, 4 top 10's in assists are a "bit" stat? How many players do you expect to find with that kind of resume from here on out? I highly doubt we'll come across one with a playmaking resume that is better than Savard's, at least clearly.
So everything rides on that accomplishment. He should be remembered fifty years from now because he was a decent playmaker of his era, okay I get that reasoning, it makes him a AAA-level starter. But do you honestly think there are no undrafted players "with that kind of resume" of having four top-10 assist seasons?

I guess we draft guys from way back based largely on a similar stat, so it's fair enough. And in this 16-team draft, it's hard to imagine he wouldn't stand up as at least average on a scoring line as a passer.

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06-15-2010, 09:10 PM
  #57
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That is historically insignificant. PLENTY of players have done that and many undrafted have done better.
Plenty have done worse as well. Not trying to herlad his playoff resume as particularly good or anything, just not bad.

Quote:
So everything rides on that accomplishment. He should be remembered fifty years from now because he was a decent playmaker of his era, okay I get that reasoning, it makes him a AAA-level starter. But do you honestly think there are no undrafted players "with that kind of resume" of having four top-10 assist seasons?

I guess we draft guys from way back based largely on a similar stat, so it's fair enough. And in this 16-team draft, it's hard to imagine he wouldn't stand up as at least average on a scoring line as a passer.
"Decent" playmakers, in my book, don't come top-3 in assists three times in a fairy short time span.

Do I think there are undrafted players with 3 top 3's or 5's, 4 top 6's in assists? I rather doubt that. Four top-10 assist seasons, maybe, though likely only a few, and not as impressive as Savard'ds resume.

I think he is going to prove to be more than average as a passer, when all is said in done. Perhaps folks don't think much of him yet because he is such an under-the radar guy in the NHL today, but I will do a direct first line C comparison when the draft has progessed enough to get the guy the respect he deserves, if I must.

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06-15-2010, 09:11 PM
  #58
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I sure as heck hope that someone int he next ATD doesn't look at the first round of the MLD and think, hey I'll get Savard. There are bottom-6 forwards way more deserving of main ATD selection than him! (But the fact that we are building teams does justify taking a passer regardless of his historical significance, given the role of a top line center on a team's success.)

Quote:
I think he is going to prove to be more than average as a passer, when all is said in done.
Totally irrelevant to this board. No projections whatsoever. (Sounding more like a homer pick.) No future kuddos for picking a guy who does more later. Assume he gets a career ending injury tomorrow, for the purposes of this history draft.


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Old
06-15-2010, 09:17 PM
  #59
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I think that Savard will end up having a case for the best regular season offensive player in the MLD. He also provides nothing other than offense and is actually probably a negative in intangibles over the course of his career. But you still need to score to win.

Savard isn't close to ATD level because he is a "scoring line or bust player," but I can see him as good enough for first line duty in the MLD. He wouldn't have been my pick, but I don't think it's a bad one.

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06-15-2010, 09:42 PM
  #60
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I sure as heck hope that someone int he next ATD doesn't look at the first round of the MLD and think, hey I'll get Savard. There are bottom-6 forwards way more deserving of main ATD selection than him! (But the fact that we are building teams does justify taking a passer regardless of his historical significance, given the role of a top line center on a team's success.)
I can agree with that- he certainly doesn't belong in a bottom-6 in most situations. He is indeed in that "scoring line or bust" group that TDMM metioned.


Quote:
Totally irrelevant to this board. No projections whatsoever. (Sounding more like a homer pick.) No future kuddos for picking a guy who does more later. Assume he gets a career ending injury tomorrow, for the purposes of this history draft.
Not what I meant, and I am well aware of this fact (can you stop assuming the worst?) Though I can understand why one could be confused by what I said, I was trying to convey that when all is said and done regarding first line centre's/first lines (all of them are drafted), Savard will prove stand amongst them as more than an average first line passer (something that may be hard to visualize and determine until more players are drafted)

Quote:
I think that Savard will end up having a case for the best regular season offensive player in the MLD. He also provides nothing other than offense and is actually probably a negative in intangibles over the course of his career. But you still need to score to win.

Savard isn't close to ATD level because he is a "scoring line or bust player," but I can see him as good enough for first line duty in the MLD. He wouldn't have been my pick, but I don't think it's a bad one.
I can mostly agree with that, though Savard has become more well-rounded in recent times, and wasn'[t really bad (to my knowledge- dunno much on his career in Atlanta intangible wise).


Last edited by Leafs Forever: 06-15-2010 at 09:58 PM.
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06-15-2010, 10:39 PM
  #61
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I'm going to look at Zabrodsky on SIHR and see exactly how he did.. and there really isn't much, except that he led his league in goals 6 times out of 7 that I have stats for.

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Old
06-15-2010, 11:02 PM
  #62
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Sorry for the delay folks but I was waiting for madarcand but it's late at night where he's to.

In any event with our 1st pick the Carolina Hurricanes are proud to select Geoff Courtnall, a left winger out of British Columbia



Never a flashy player, Courtnall still had a solid career which included:

367 career goals, 6 seasons of 30 or more goals, 799 career points over a solid 17-year career.

VanIslander has been messaged.

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06-15-2010, 11:36 PM
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leafs Forever View Post

I can mostly agree with that, though Savard has become more well-rounded in recent times, and wasn'[t really bad (to my knowledge- dunno much on his career in Atlanta intangible wise).
He's definitely become more well rounded in recent years. In Boston, he basically "grew up" - stopped taking so many bad penalties and became adequate defensively. Still, over the whole of his career, I think he averages out to negative in the intangibles dept. But then, it's not like guys like Nilsson are without their negatives.


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06-15-2010, 11:59 PM
  #64
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Texas selects right winger Mike Keane, an all-time great (wrongfully overlooked for the first time in the ATDs): an integral part of Stanley Cup championships with three different franchises, not only as a leader in Montreal with a team-high 13 assists in their 1993 Cup-winning postseason and as an important impact third liner in the Avs-Wings rivalry and Colorado '96 cup, but he also logged 18:02 minutes per game average as a 31 year old in the Dallas' cup-winning run, one of the leaders for the Stars in so many ways. He has no top-10 finishes in the regular season and it's the only knock against the speedy ball of intangibles who only has 470 points in 1161 NHL games yet has stepped up offensively and in every other way in the playoffs. He ought to be on the Bottom-6 as a starter in any 30-team all-time context and he will certainly be one of the captains of the Brahmas.



Full bio to come.

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06-16-2010, 12:05 AM
  #65
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You're criticizing other picks and you pick Mike Keane? Huh..

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06-16-2010, 01:04 AM
  #66
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Charlotte Clippers select RW Viktor Shalimov

IIHF Top Forward: 1982
IIHF Top Scorer: 1975 (points and goals), 1982 (goals)
USSR Top Scorer: 1976 (goals)
USSR All Star: 1976, 1982
USSR Best Line: 1976, 1980

USSR International Games: 126GP, 66G
USSR League Games: 572GP, 293G

Tied for leading scorer at 1976 Olympics with 10pts (5G, 5A) in 5 games


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06-16-2010, 01:13 AM
  #67
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With our first selection, the 10th overall in this year Minor League Draft, Les As de Québec are please to select Monsieur David Alexander Balon



Height: 5'10''
Weight: 180 lbs
Position: Left Wing
Shoots: Left
Date of Birth: August 02, 1938
Place of Birth: Wakaw , Saskatchewan, Canada
Date of Death: May 29, 2007 (Age: 68)

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06-16-2010, 01:15 AM
  #68
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Originally Posted by EagleBelfour View Post
With our first selection, the 10th overall in this year Minor League Draft, Les As de Québec are please to select Monsieur David Alexander Balon
He's already been selected.

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06-16-2010, 01:17 AM
  #69
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He's already been selected.
... Search engine fails me again!

Gimme a minute then!

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06-16-2010, 01:27 AM
  #70
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Monsieur Hamilton Livingstone Gilmour



Position: Right Wing / Left Wing
Height: About 5'3''
Weight: Unknown
Shoots: Right
Date of Birth: March 21, 1885
Place of Birth: Ottawa , Ontario, Canada
Date of Death: March 13, 1959 (Age: 73)

Stanley Cup Champion (1903, 1904, 1905, 1909)
MCHL First All-Star Team (1907)
ECAHA/ECHA 1st All-Star Team (1908, 1909)
Inducted into the Hockey Hall of Fame (1962)


Canadian Amateur Hockey League [1902-1903]
Top-10 Scoring (9th)
Top-10 Goalscoring (6th)
Top-10 Playoff Goalscoring (3rd)
Eastern Canada Amateur Hockey Association / Eastern Canada Hockey League [1905-1909]
Top-10 Assist (5th)
Top-10 Penalty Minutes (1st, 6th)

- In the ''Honor Roll'' of the All-New Hockey's 100 by Stan Fischler (Top-204 Hockey Player)
- Two of his brothers, Suddy and Dave, also played with Ottawa
- After retiring from profesional hockey 7 years before, Gilmour played two games in the National Hockey Association with the Ottawa Senators
- Billy Gilmour served in World War I
- He resided in Paris, France, prior to the outbreak of World War II before retiring to Mount Royal, Quebec

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Originally Posted by HHOF
Along with his scoring prowess, Gilmour was regarded as one of the greatest stickhandlers of all time.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trail of the Stanley Cup, vol.1
1903 Playoffs: The Gilmour boys and Frank McGee were going great guns. The clean-playing Bowie got into a jangle with Billy Gilmour
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultimate Hockey
1905 Ottawa Silver Seven

PlayerPosOOVODVOLVOV
Alf SmithRW9.08.5 9.08.83
Harvey PulfordP7.09.59.58.67
Frank McGeeC 9.58.58.08.67
Harry WestwickR8.58.58.58.5
Billy GilmourLW7.07.57.57.33

OOV = Overall Offensive Value
ODV = Overall Defensive Value
OLV = Overall Leadership Value
OV = Overall Value

links:
http://www.legendsofhockey.net/Legen...t=ByName#photo
http://www.sihrhockey.org/member_pla...TOKEN=32966801
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Billy_Gilmour


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06-16-2010, 01:46 AM
  #71
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Now we're rolling, guys. Keep it up!

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06-16-2010, 08:18 AM
  #72
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Mark and I both just got to our respective offices, we will pick shortly.

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06-16-2010, 09:00 AM
  #73
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The Huskies are pleased to select RW, BIll Goldsworthy.



I thought about making a bio, but couldn't really put it together any better than this seventies one I came accross, would have just been typing out the exact same stuff:

http://hfboards.com/showpost.php?p=2...&postcount=719

Hopefully there is more to find.

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06-16-2010, 09:51 AM
  #74
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The Huskies are pleased to select RW, BIll Goldsworthy.



I thought about making a bio, but couldn't really put it together any better than this seventies one I came accross, would have just been typing out the exact same stuff:

http://hfboards.com/showpost.php?p=2...&postcount=719

Hopefully there is more to find.
Now there's a good pick, I heavily considered taking him in the ATD, but went with Vyacheslav Bykov instead.

Kudos, Stalberg!

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06-16-2010, 10:04 AM
  #75
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the cornwall royals are pleased to select...

vasili pervukhin (d)

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Red Machine
...coming along to supplement and then supplant Davidov and Vasiliev on the nationals were two other Dyanamo defensive stars - the crafty Vasily Pervukhin and the tough Zinetula Bilyaletdinov
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kings of the Ice
Vasili Pervukhin stands out as the one player least likely to make a mistake on the ice. His flawless play was really quite remarkable, whether in closing a breach on the defensive line or winning a tussle with an opponent.

Pervukhin maneuvered himself as lightly as a butterfly to match the pace and rhythm of the attacker.

For Pervukhin there were no slumps, nor opponents that he couldn't handle.

The powerplay built around Pervukhin became a Soviet classic in those years.

...Pervuhkin's initiating pass made mounting an attack relatively smooth


Last edited by papershoes: 06-16-2010 at 06:33 PM.
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