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Carter For a LA Goalie

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Old
06-14-2010, 03:42 PM
  #101
dookie88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cruel11 View Post
Carter is the partying type and he had problems in the lockeroom (heard it from Flyers fans). Doesn't sound like Dean's type of guy.
And that Flyers fan was in the locker room on a regular basis or what?

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06-14-2010, 03:44 PM
  #102
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Originally Posted by mja View Post
There's going to have to be loads more coming from Florida.

I don't trade my 25 year old 40 goal scorer for a 35 year old goaltender with a less than impressive post-season resume and who also happens to be an impending UFA next season.
Vokoun and Horton for Carter and Nodl/Parent?

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06-14-2010, 03:44 PM
  #103
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Originally Posted by nikolai19 View Post
It makes no sense whatsover to get rid of Bernier. He hasn't fully had a chance in the NHL and next year is a year that he will split time with Quick. LA wasn't confident enough in Ersberg to give him time but that will be different with Bernier. Quick played 72 games and that was too much, even admitted by Terry Murray. Next year expect that Bernier will get 25 starts (roughly) and Quick will still be the #1 goalie.

While LA has an immediate concern to fill a couple of holes, they can get that done through free agency or via trading picks/prospects. Lombardi has been in this boat before with having several talented goalies in his organization (Nabakov and Kipper in SJ), so he knows the drill.
I would tend to agree, but Carter is the kind of guy you make concessions for.

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06-14-2010, 03:47 PM
  #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by idoentknow View Post
That's very unrealistic.

Carter is a natural Center, I doubt he would accept playing on the wing.

Many other teams need a number one elite center in Carter, before LA needs Carter as a winger or a number two center, hence the other teams will offer more than what LA will want to offer.

Philadelphia isn't going to trade Carter, unless they get a great return.

Quick +, is not a great return. Nothing against Quick, but one year is not enough to prove that Quick will be great goaltender in the future. Philadelphia would probably give Emery another shot, before trading Carter for Quick +. Emery had some great years in Ottawa, also brought them to the Cup final in 07'.
Considering Ray Emery is likely never going to play in the NHL again and will be happy if he can live a normal life, this is not true.

I don't know how many times we have to go over this, LA is not trading Quick or Bernier until they battle it out and Lombardi decides who he wants to go with going forward. That entire article is speculation. Nothing in there is legitimate and there is no evidence that suggests that the two teams have talked about a deal for Quick/Bernier for Carter. As much as HF doesn't want to admit it, there is a very small chance Jeff Carter is moved. When was the last time a 25 year old big, two-way sniper C who is good for at least 35 goals/year was traded for a guy with 3 NHL games under his belt? Okay, Bernier has all of this potential, but tell me why we should trade Carter for Bernier where we can probably get Cory Schneider for Parent and a pick?

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06-14-2010, 03:48 PM
  #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kingsfan View Post
As much as I'd love Carter, I don't see it working. Why would Dean trade Quick to get carter, thus building up for a better post-season but expecting a rookie like Bernier to carry the load. Vice versa, I can't see Philly wanting Bernier as I'm sure they'd rather have a veteran presence for a better post-season, and from LA Quick is the closest to that.
Actually the Flyers prefer Bernier. A couple writers have commented in the past that Price and Bernier were at the top of their wish lish.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LeftCoast View Post
Mason Raymond + Cory Schneider for Carter?
Not even close

Quote:
Originally Posted by Analyzer View Post
T
Halak, 1st 2010, Weber (or Carle) + something else small (Maxwell ?) -> Carter + Parent + Cote

Halak 1st 2010 and 2011 -> Carter +Nodl+5th.

Halak + 1st2010+ Pacioretty/Aaron Palushaj -> Carter + Nodl


Halak +2011 first + Palushaj -> Carter

Halak + 2nd + Ryder -> Carter
.
Flyers like Price, but aren't high on Halak according to Tim Panaccio. So any deal for Carter would likely involve Price.

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06-14-2010, 03:51 PM
  #106
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I dont think Philly would want Quick. I mean it seem like he started to crack under the pressure of the playoff race post olympic break. And the talent overall in the Atlantic is high of that of the pacific division. In the atlantic you got Zach Parasie, Sidney Crosby, Evgeni Malkin, Jon Tavares, Kyle Okposo, Mark Streit, Sergei Gonchar(maybe), Martin Brouder, Marc Andre Fleury, Henrik Lundquvist ect.. While in the pacific you got Joe Thorton, Dany Heatley, Patrick Marleau(maybe), Ilya Brzygolov, Corey Perry, Ryan Getzlaf, and Bobby Ryan

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06-14-2010, 03:57 PM
  #107
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*I preface this by saying neither Quick nor Bernier is coming to Philadelphia, at least for a year or so.*

The reason Quick broke down was because he was playing way more games at a more competitive level than he was used to, and the LA defense in front of him was struggling. In Philadelphia, this wouldn't be the case. The Philadelphia defense would help him out greatly compared to LA, having Pronger, Timonen, and Coburn in front of you compared to Doughty, JJ, and Greene would help him greatly. Quick is being looked at as a flash in the pan, who can't start in this league, which is a joke. People are scared that the same thing will happen to him that happened to Mason, which is ridiculous. Mark my words, Mason will look more like the Mason of 08-09 than the Mason of 09-10 next year. The team in front of him struggled mightily, and so did he. Quick and Mason are not related at all.

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06-14-2010, 04:01 PM
  #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BiLLY_ShOE1721 View Post
*I preface this by saying neither Quick nor Bernier is coming to Philadelphia, at least for a year or so.*

The reason Quick broke down was because he was playing way more games at a more competitive level than he was used to, and the LA defense in front of him was struggling. In Philadelphia, this wouldn't be the case. The Philadelphia defense would help him out greatly compared to LA, having Pronger, Timonen, and Coburn in front of you compared to Doughty, JJ, and Greene would help him greatly. Quick is being looked at as a flash in the pan, who can't start in this league, which is a joke. People are scared that the same thing will happen to him that happened to Mason, which is ridiculous. Mark my words, Mason will look more like the Mason of 08-09 than the Mason of 09-10 next year. The team in front of him struggled mightily, and so did he. Quick and Mason are not related at all.
I agree with you that he broke down because of the amount of games he played, but I still think he is an overrated goalie. His .907 save percentage is not impressive in the least. His win totals were impressive, but wins are a team stat and are the worst way to judge a goalie. I would never deal Carter for him.

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06-14-2010, 04:01 PM
  #109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BiLLY_ShOE1721 View Post
*I preface this by saying neither Quick nor Bernier is coming to Philadelphia, at least for a year or so.*

The reason Quick broke down was because he was playing way more games at a more competitive level than he was used to, and the LA defense in front of him was struggling. In Philadelphia, this wouldn't be the case. The Philadelphia defense would help him out greatly compared to LA, having Pronger, Timonen, and Coburn in front of you compared to Doughty, JJ, and Greene would help him greatly. Quick is being looked at as a flash in the pan, who can't start in this league, which is a joke. People are scared that the same thing will happen to him that happened to Mason, which is ridiculous. Mark my words, Mason will look more like the Mason of 08-09 than the Mason of 09-10 next year. The team in front of him struggled mightily, and so did he. Quick and Mason are not related at all.
Bold is because teams make the goaltender, the goaltender does not make the team.


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Old
06-14-2010, 04:01 PM
  #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmichael7753 View Post
I dont think Philly would want Quick. I mean it seem like he started to crack under the pressure of the playoff race post olympic break. And the talent overall in the Atlantic is high of that of the pacific division. In the atlantic you got Zach Parasie, Sidney Crosby, Evgeni Malkin, Jon Tavares, Kyle Okposo, Mark Streit, Sergei Gonchar(maybe), Martin Brouder, Marc Andre Fleury, Henrik Lundquvist ect.. While in the pacific you got Joe Thorton, Dany Heatley, Patrick Marleau(maybe), Ilya Brzygolov, Corey Perry, Ryan Getzlaf, and Bobby Ryan
He played his first playoff race and was absolutely overplayed before Olympic brak.

For the rest of you post..... it's not even worth an answer.

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06-14-2010, 04:04 PM
  #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Libertine View Post
I agree with you that he broke down because of the amount of games he played, but I still think he is an overrated goalie. His .907 save percentage is not impressive in the least. His win totals were impressive, but wins are a team stat and are the worst way to judge a goalie. I would never deal Carter for him.
Sure.......... if you are the goalie with the fewest shots against.......
But he one with the most shots against... just saying.

I'm pretty sure your cup winning squad is way better than our squad so we don't have to trade again.
Honestly i doubt the Kings will part with one of Bernier or Quick in near future.

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06-14-2010, 04:16 PM
  #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Libertine View Post
I agree with you that he broke down because of the amount of games he played, but I still think he is an overrated goalie. His .907 save percentage is not impressive in the least. His win totals were impressive, but wins are a team stat and are the worst way to judge a goalie. I would never deal Carter for him.
The guy's only 24 years old. Give him some time, goalies take a long time to hit their strides, and while I don't see Quick as an elite top 5 starter, I think he could be near the bottom of the top 10 and certainly in the top 15, which is all we need.

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06-14-2010, 04:38 PM
  #113
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kurrilino View Post
Sure.......... if you are the goalie with the fewest shots against.......
But he one with the most shots against... just saying.

I'm pretty sure your cup winning squad is way better than our squad so we don't have to trade again.
Honestly i doubt the Kings will part with one of Bernier or Quick in near future.
What are you talking about? The Kings had the third best shots against per game average in the league. He was one with the fewest.

I agree I don't see the Kings trading either guy.



Quote:
Originally Posted by BiLLY_ShOE1721 View Post
The guy's only 24 years old. Give him some time, goalies take a long time to hit their strides, and while I don't see Quick as an elite top 5 starter, I think he could be near the bottom of the top 10 and certainly in the top 15, which is all we need.
I agree he could be a good goalie and would be interested in him in the right deal, but I have no interest in him being the main piece of a Carter deal. He's not that good.

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Old
06-14-2010, 04:40 PM
  #114
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I like Quick, and would take him here, but there has to be something significant coming back for Carter. That's not even close to fair value.

But trading Carter is not the answer, at all.

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06-14-2010, 05:51 PM
  #115
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LA-Carter
PHI-Quick, Hickey/Teubert

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06-14-2010, 05:53 PM
  #116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonas1235 View Post
LA-Carter
PHI-Quick, Hickey/Teubert
LA won't trade Quick, and that package is too shallow for Philly. Quick is nothing special. He's another above-average starter; dime-a-dozen. Hickey/Teubert is incredible, but as the meat of this proposal, they don't hold water against Carter right now.

That's not only insulting to Philly, but it's impossible for LA to do.

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06-14-2010, 06:03 PM
  #117
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Probably not very likely to happen, but would the flyers be interested in Backstrom from the wild?

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06-14-2010, 06:05 PM
  #118
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post

Halak + 1st 2010 + Weber + Pacioretty -> Carter + Parent + Carcillo

How about that?

We get a good D prospect, Pacioretty, a first, and our goalie (finally).

You get a big top line center (finally), a shut-down defenseman with solid upside, and some physicality (finally).

Don't know if I'd pull the trigger without thinking twice about it, but I'd definitely think long and hard.
I'd be happy with this if some of the extra fat was removed. Take out one of Weber/Pacioretty and one of Parent/Carcillo:

To Philly:
Halak, Weber/Pacioretty, 2010 1st

To Montreal:
Carter, Parent/Carcillo

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06-14-2010, 06:05 PM
  #119
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If LA is ready to take a gamble on Bernier taking the load (not too much of a gamble imo) I think the following deal might be worth a look.

Carter
2nd round pick

for

Quick
Simmonds

Philly gets scoring and grit and an average to above average starter (which would seem to them like the leagues number one goalie considering there recent luck in goal)

while LA get's a proven 40 goal center to anchor the second line and a second to continue to build from within. Strength down the middle has worked quite well for recent cup winners. This move might keep Schenn from being rushed in to take big minutes right off the bat as well.

Kings do take on salary but for a player like Carter would open up the offense a ton, would be worth it.

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06-14-2010, 06:08 PM
  #120
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Originally Posted by grN1g View Post
Probably not very likely to happen, but would the flyers be interested in Backstrom from the wild?
At $6 million, I hope not.

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06-14-2010, 06:08 PM
  #121
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smoked View Post
If LA is ready to take a gamble on Bernier taking the load (not too much of a gamble imo) I think the following deal might be worth a look.

Carter
2nd round pick

for

Quick
Simmonds

Philly gets an scoring and grit and an average to above average starter (which would seem to them like the leagues number one goalie considering there recent luck in goal)

while LA get's a proven 40 goal center to anchor the second like and a second to continue to build from within. Strength down the middle has worked quite well for recent cup winners.

Kings do take on salary but for a player like Carter would open up the offense a ton, would be worth it.

Flyers don't have a 2nd in 2010, and I don't know why they'd be adding, anyway. Simmonds is great and Quick could be good for us, but it's not worth it for a player who is already a top talent. No way they add a pick on top of that. Simmonds is worth more to L.A. than he would be in a trade.

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06-14-2010, 06:11 PM
  #122
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jakomyte View Post
I'd be happy with this if some of the extra fat was removed. Take out one of Weber/Pacioretty and one of Parent/Carcillo:

To Philly:
Halak, Weber/Pacioretty, 2010 1st

To Montreal:
Carter, Parent/Carcillo
not enough

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06-14-2010, 06:36 PM
  #123
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Originally Posted by mercury View Post
Flyers don't have a 2nd in 2010, and I don't know why they'd be adding, anyway. Simmonds is great and Quick could be good for us, but it's not worth it for a player who is already a top talent. No way they add a pick on top of that. Simmonds is worth more to L.A. than he would be in a trade.
Fair point, I was thinking along the lines of a third then realized that LA would be taking on considerable salary. I figured Simmonds would fit the Philly mold well, but I guess if you guys hang onto Hartnell he would be a bit redundant.

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06-14-2010, 06:38 PM
  #124
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Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post
Bold is because teams make the goaltender, the goaltender does not make the team.

depends what team you talking about. not true for every team except in your world.

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06-14-2010, 06:42 PM
  #125
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I don't think Lombardi will deal a goalie this offseason, but just for the sake of argument, if Carter's traded, a 1st will likely be involved. If it's to LA, Stoll likely needs to be involved. I think Carter is being severely underrated by many here and Quick is being underrated as well.

I would look at something like:

Quick
Stoll
#19
Hickey/Voynov

for

Carter
Parent
4th round pick

Honestly, that could still be well off value wise. It's a lot of assets for the Kings to give up, but a guy who can pot 40+ is going to cost a good amount, and Stoll really has no spot on the team in the future anyway. The Kings can slot Carter in the 1b Center role this year and on Kopitar's wing next year if Schenn is ready. Flyer fans, you can tell me if you think you're overpaying here. But if both sides feel they're overpaying, it's probably relatively even.

Again, I sincerely doubt Lombardi trades either goalie this year anyway.


Last edited by LAPenguin: 06-14-2010 at 07:08 PM.
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