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Horton's Agent Believes He Will Be Traded By The Draft

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Old
06-18-2010, 02:31 PM
  #76
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Originally Posted by Ghoste View Post
This goes along the lines of the 'no heart' comment out of Boston. See ya Nate!

-ghoste
My question is with the no heart comment out of Boston comment why do we keep hearing Boston may be interested. Is it just fans drumming it up or what?

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06-18-2010, 02:43 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by PBPantherfan View Post
My question is with the no heart comment out of Boston comment why do we keep hearing Boston may be interested. Is it just fans drumming it up or what?
Boston needs offense , Horton helps them there and they have plenty of picks to make a deal possible

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06-18-2010, 02:54 PM
  #78
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I like Weiss, but I think he is inconsistent. I don't think he is untouchable.

The only roster players that I would not put a "For Sale" sign on are Frolik, Matthias & Kulikov.
He's not inconsistent, he's just not a superstar. He's a solid 2-way center who certainly looked stronger last season AND with healed wrists and without playing with his two linemates for much of the year set a career high in goals and fell just a couple points short of his career marker set last season. He's steadily progressed each season of his career and I think it's a big mistake to deal him.

His production is dependent upon having talented linemates because he's not a premier talent. But he IS a solid talent who can be a key player on the team in a #2 center role. Hell, he'd even serve as a #1 center if he was paired with a couple of premier wingers (see Steve Rucchin for the Ducks in the Kariya-Selanne years).

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06-18-2010, 03:04 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by Acadmus View Post
He's not inconsistent, he's just not a superstar. He's a solid 2-way center who certainly looked stronger last season AND with healed wrists and without playing with his two linemates for much of the year set a career high in goals and fell just a couple points short of his career marker set last season. He's steadily progressed each season of his career and I think it's a big mistake to deal him.

His production is dependent upon having talented linemates because he's not a premier talent. But he IS a solid talent who can be a key player on the team in a #2 center role. Hell, he'd even serve as a #1 center if he was paired with a couple of premier wingers (see Steve Rucchin for the Ducks in the Kariya-Selanne years).
I like Weiss and I'm in no rush to see him dealt, but there are games where Weiss just seems a bit lost. It has nothing to do with scoring or lack thereof. I don't get that impression from watching him on TV, so I understand where you are coming from.

Weiss is what he is - a very good 2nd line center. He has value. He's just not an untouchable piece. Just my opinion.


Last edited by angry_treefrog: 06-18-2010 at 03:12 PM.
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06-18-2010, 03:21 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by angry_treefrog View Post
I like Weiss and I'm in no rush to see him dealt, but there are games where Weiss just seems a bit lost. It has nothing to do with scoring or lack thereof. I don't get that impression from watching him on TV, so I understand where you are coming from.

Weiss is what he is - a very good 2nd line center. He has value. He's just not an untouchable piece. Just my opinion.
I think like many other players on the Panther's roster he has been put in a position that is too much for his abilities. That inconsistent play is probably a result of seeing the other team's top d-pairing every night. If he could be given more breathing room I would expect to see an increase in production and a more consistent performance.

I agree that he isn't untouchable but I would want a hefty return for a guy who is signed to his contract with his production level.

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06-18-2010, 03:23 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by RainingRats View Post
I think like many other players on the Panther's roster he has been put in a position that is too much for his abilities. That inconsistent play is probably a result of seeing the other team's top d-pairing every night. If he could be given more breathing room I would expect to see an increase in production and a more consistent performance.

I agree that he isn't untouchable but I would want a hefty return for a guy who is signed to his contract with his production level.
I have no argument with any of the above.

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06-18-2010, 06:35 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by angry_treefrog View Post
I like Weiss and I'm in no rush to see him dealt, but there are games where Weiss just seems a bit lost. It has nothing to do with scoring or lack thereof. I don't get that impression from watching him on TV, so I understand where you are coming from.

Weiss is what he is - a very good 2nd line center. He has value. He's just not an untouchable piece. Just my opinion.
The thing is, the only reason a player is "touchable" is if you think he can bring in multiple upgrades at other positions, you think you need a different piece in his own position, a different piece in a different position, or you simply have a glut in one position and a player is therefore expendable.

The Panthers do not have any players that have enough value to acquire multiple replacements that are upgrades anywhere of merit, they need to fill the positions where the players they'd ostensibly be trading occupy, and they do not have enough depth at any position right now for anyone to be expendable. The only tradeable parts on the Panthers right now are therefore players whose performance is simply subpar, and the most you'll get for those are prospects or picks. Weiss is a very good 2nd line center - you can't trade him and expect to get a 1st line center or a 1st pair defenseman. And if you package him with other players, you strengthen one position at the expense of the overall strength of the team.

The fact is, right now the Panthers need to focus on having excellent drafts and making key free agent acquisitions, then turn any highly prized prospect into the aforementioned multiple player replacements deal if and when they've met their other positional requirements. Therefore I'd call Booth, Weiss, Frolik, Horton, Kulikov and perhaps Markstrom untouchable pieces as of now. Probably their 1st rounder as well unless some team is so stacked or so desperate to clear cap space they'd allow themselves to be gouged for the pick. What the Panthers need to do is make up for mostly bad drafting over the last 15 years and stock the cabinets with assets that they can then trade as needed to fill the perceived holes in their roster. They've been doing that for several years now, so if they keep on this path they'll soon have a glut somewhere other than in goal (where goalies seem to have minimal trade value these days).

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06-18-2010, 06:39 PM
  #83
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Here's some of the Horton rumors.

http://thehockeywriters.com/nathan-h...rumours-begin/

With a hockey writer on the Bruins board saying that a deal with Boston is very close to reality.

http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=788004&page=2

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06-18-2010, 06:39 PM
  #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RainingRats View Post
I think like many other players on the Panther's roster he has been put in a position that is too much for his abilities. That inconsistent play is probably a result of seeing the other team's top d-pairing every night. If he could be given more breathing room I would expect to see an increase in production and a more consistent performance.

I agree that he isn't untouchable but I would want a hefty return for a guy who is signed to his contract with his production level.
I've been saying this for a long time now. Just about everyone here needs to be "shifted" to their natural position because everyone is playing out of place. We don't have a #1 defenseman, nor a #1 center. We might have one #1 winger, but that's debatable at times depending on their play.

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06-18-2010, 07:59 PM
  #85
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Nesn.com is getting ready to post a story of Horton to be a Bruin. So Horton to the Bruins has some legs.

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06-18-2010, 08:22 PM
  #86
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Originally Posted by StanJonathan View Post
Here's some of the Horton rumors.

http://thehockeywriters.com/nathan-h...rumours-begin/

With a hockey writer on the Bruins board saying that a deal with Boston is very close to reality.

http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=788004&page=2
that article sucks. 1994?

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06-18-2010, 08:41 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by Acadmus View Post
The thing is, the only reason a player is "touchable" is if you think he can bring in multiple upgrades at other positions, you think you need a different piece in his own position, a different piece in a different position, or you simply have a glut in one position and a player is therefore expendable.

That is your definition of touchable. Mine is different.

The Panthers do not have any players that have enough value to acquire multiple replacements that are upgrades anywhere of merit, they need to fill the positions where the players they'd ostensibly be trading occupy, and they do not have enough depth at any position right now for anyone to be expendable. The only tradeable parts on the Panthers right now are therefore players whose performance is simply subpar, and the most you'll get for those are prospects or picks. Weiss is a very good 2nd line center - you can't trade him and expect to get a 1st line center or a 1st pair defenseman. And if you package him with other players, you strengthen one position at the expense of the overall strength of the team.

This is true if you are trying to make the team better for this coming season. I think Tallon may have a longer view.

The fact is, right now the Panthers need to focus on having excellent drafts and making key free agent acquisitions, then turn any highly prized prospect into the aforementioned multiple player replacements deal if and when they've met their other positional requirements. I agree. Therefore I'd call Booth, Weiss, Frolik, Horton, Kulikov and perhaps Markstrom untouchable pieces as of now. Looks like Tallon may disagree with you about Horton. I'll agree that those players have the most value. Probably their 1st rounder as well unless some team is so stacked or so desperate to clear cap space they'd allow themselves to be gouged for the pick. What the Panthers need to do is make up for mostly bad drafting over the last 15 years and stock the cabinets with assets that they can then trade as needed to fill the perceived holes in their roster. They've been doing that for several years now, so if they keep on this path they'll soon have a glut somewhere other than in goal (where goalies seem to have minimal trade value these days). No argument there.
I think it comes down to what your goals are. I think Tallon sees this team as fundamentally broken. He's probably right. You pretty much have to strip it down to the frame & foundation and start over. Weiss is a good player. He may be part of the solution here. He may not be. He certainly isn't irreplaceable.

On the balance, I'd like to see him stay. I agree that (based on past history) the Panthers are unlikely to see equal value in that trade.

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06-18-2010, 08:50 PM
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I would absolutely love to see Krejci on the panthers but we'd need to toughen up if we acquire him. He is an absolute stud and is very exciting to watch. I think he'll be a star in the NHL for a while but idk about Horton for Krejci straight up.

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06-18-2010, 08:53 PM
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And to add, the Horton+Vokoun for Carter and Coburn would be one of those deals, IMO, that would go down as a win-win for both teams.

I just don't want to see us get cents on the dollar by trading a star player for several good players. The teams trading the stars almost always end up losing those type of deals. Coburn is impressive and Carter fits what we need most up front.

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06-18-2010, 08:54 PM
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Would anyone do Krejci for Horton straight up?

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06-18-2010, 08:59 PM
  #91
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Would anyone do Krejci for Horton straight up?
Bruins fans wouldn't. Our GM is another story though.

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06-18-2010, 09:06 PM
  #92
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Hope it comes true

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06-18-2010, 09:16 PM
  #93
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Here's the story for NESN

http://www.nesn.com/2010/06/bruins-c...an-horton.html

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06-18-2010, 09:21 PM
  #94
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Wouldnt mind a deal with Boston so long as a center is coming back and they dont deal the #3 overall. I personally would love to get Bergeron cause he's that "character" type of player that Tallon wants plus he has decent size.

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06-18-2010, 09:24 PM
  #95
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Horton with Bergeron or Savard will get him 90+ points IMO. He always lights up against Boston too, so they've seen him at his best and hopefully will pay for what he's capable of.

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06-18-2010, 09:28 PM
  #96
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"According to this source, who stressed the Panthers were talking to numerous teams about Horton and could still accept another offer, "the parameters" of the possible trade were still being worked out as of late Friday afternoon, but "Horton believed he could be very close to being a Bruin." "

I'm hoping this means Ottawa is involved and Spezza is coming back our way. Not much of a surprise there is a lot of interest. Hopefully we win a trade for once.

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06-18-2010, 09:44 PM
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Was Horton on the home page of the panther's website yesterday or this morning? I thought that I had seen him on the left side with the Miami scene in the background. Now it's just Weiss and Booth. Am I just not seeing it right?

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06-18-2010, 09:45 PM
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Was Horton on the home page of the panther's website yesterday or this morning? I thought that I had seen him on the left side with the Miami scene in the background. Now it's just Weiss and Booth. Am I just not seeing it right?
i think its been booth and weiss all along.

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06-18-2010, 09:53 PM
  #99
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Was Horton on the home page of the panther's website yesterday or this morning? I thought that I had seen him on the left side with the Miami scene in the background. Now it's just Weiss and Booth. Am I just not seeing it right?
Right before they updated the website, it was Horton and Booth. Then once it was updated, Horton was switched with Weiss. I think that got some people thinking. Maybe something is up.

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06-18-2010, 10:20 PM
  #100
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And to add, the Horton+Vokoun for Carter and Coburn would be one of those deals, IMO, that would go down as a win-win for both teams.

I just don't want to see us get cents on the dollar by trading a star player for several good players. The teams trading the stars almost always end up losing those type of deals. Coburn is impressive and Carter fits what we need most up front.
I agree. Flyers fans want the world for Carter, and he's a very talented player, but that deal quite possibly makes the Cup favorites next year and Tallon would be an idiot not to take it. It would allow Voukoun and Horton to really shine on a bigger stage with more talent around them and would give the Panthers a couple of great building blocks in Carter and Coburn. And I think in 5 years you'd say the Flyers even got the better end of the deal, but that it was still a win-win for both.

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