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A trade in the works?

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Old
05-24-2004, 11:48 AM
  #151
KallioWeHardlyKnewYe
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluenote13
Umberger. If the Rangers sign RJ, they could then package him to Columbus, who are not all too unfamiliar to RJ, he did play for Ohio State.
I wouldn't rule out CBJ's interest in Umberger. But, I can't see him being signed just to be traded. If CBJ want him, I'd think they'd just roll the dice that the Rangers don't sign him.

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05-24-2004, 11:57 AM
  #152
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KallioWeHardlyKnewYe
I wouldn't rule out CBJ's interest in Umberger. But, I can't see him being signed just to be traded. If CBJ want him, I'd think they'd just roll the dice that the Rangers don't sign him.

Yes and no. If they want him, trade for him and avoid a bidding war.

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05-24-2004, 01:17 PM
  #153
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway
Yes and no. If they want him, trade for him and avoid a bidding war.
I'd rather risk a biding war than give up an asset to get Umberger, who, at this point I would imagine would want to be in the middle of a bidding war.

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05-24-2004, 01:58 PM
  #154
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Do you really think another team is going to jump in and trade us more then a 2nd for Umberger? The guy didn't impress here, and is starting to really be looked at like a head case. I'm sure he'll be signed by someone (possibly us), but don't expect him to be flipped for something great otherwise Burke would have moved him a lot earlier.

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05-24-2004, 02:28 PM
  #155
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Originally Posted by True Blue
There's a little more to it than just logic and what Sather would or would not do.

"Trade Poti to Carolina for #38 pick"

Where is the logic here? Why on Earth would Carolina make this trade? People have got to stop including Poti in every possible trade. I understand that people want him gone, but wanting and reality are 2 different things. NO team is going to surrender a 1st or 2nd round pick for him. Given his atrocious play and salary, Poti is close to untradeable.

"Maybe even trade Rachunek, Josh Green, Lacouture, Purinton, Labarbera, or Dunham if anybody is interested and would give fair value in return."

Sather just traded for Rachunek. Does anyone out there really think that he is going to turn around and ship him right out? Dunham is pretty much untradeable right now. And players like Josh Green, Lacouture, Purinton, Labarbera have as much trade value as a waiver pick. What is a fair return for any one of them? A new hockey stick? A puck?

"Then use the 2 late 2nd rounders to get another late 1st rounder;"

With the well-documented drop-off in talent (or polish or whatever you want to call it), why would a team trade away it's first rounder in return for 2 LATE 2nd rounders? Just does not make sense.

"and use Toronto's pick and another late 2nd rounder to move up into mid teens."

Again, the 25th pick and another late 2nd rounder is not going to get you to move up 10 spots (15th is mid-teens).

Not only do these trades have to make sense for the Rangers, they have to make sense for other teams as well.
I will not go into specifics of every trade, but obviously we would have to include some decent players like Josh Green or Lacouture to move up.

As for Rachunek--maybe Sather like most of us wasn't thrilled with his play in the end of the season.

And as for Poti, 2 teams that badly need a guy like poti are Carolina and Atlanta. They need him for PP, as well as for offense. Carolina is really thin on defense and besides Hill, almost nobody can score. Besides their coaches could even make Poti play physical.

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05-24-2004, 02:32 PM
  #156
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KallioWeHardlyKnewYe
I wouldn't rule out CBJ's interest in Umberger. But, I can't see him being signed just to be traded. If CBJ want him, I'd think they'd just roll the dice that the Rangers don't sign him.

Why would Columbus want Umberger? But if they really do I would trade his rights for their 2nd round pick.

Also I think teams like Columbus, Chicago, Carolina and Buffalo are all going for defensemen.

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05-24-2004, 02:42 PM
  #157
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prucha73
Why would Columbus want Umberger? But if they really do I would trade his rights for their 2nd round pick.

Also I think teams like Columbus, Chicago, Carolina and Buffalo are all going for defensemen.
Maybe but I don't think Barker and Thelen will go in the top 5... I think Chi could take Barker.. which would probably mean Columbus takes Ladd... we get Olesz or Thelen

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05-24-2004, 02:52 PM
  #158
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Originally Posted by Barnaby
Maybe but I don't think Barker and Thelen will go in the top 5... I think Chi could take Barker.. which would probably mean Columbus takes Ladd... we get Olesz or Thelen
I think Ducks might trade up to pick Ladd to reunite him with Getzlaf.

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05-24-2004, 03:12 PM
  #159
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Originally Posted by Prucha73
I will not go into specifics of every trade, but obviously we would have to include some decent players like Josh Green or Lacouture to move up.
That's rather the point. If you want to move up, you would have to include someone who is significantly better than Green or Lacouture. No team is trading for players like that, as there are always similar players available on the waiver wire. There is just not much of a market for waiver-wire players.

"As for Rachunek--maybe Sather like most of us wasn't thrilled with his play in the end of the season."

There were quite a few that were perfectly content with him. Sather did not trade for him, just to move him on draft day.

"And as for Poti, 2 teams that badly need a guy like poti are Carolina and Atlanta. They need him for PP, as well as for offense. Carolina is really thin on defense and besides Hill, almost nobody can score. Besides their coaches could even make Poti play physical."

I have no idea where the idea that Atlanta is dying for a Poti. They are not. He is not a Hartley-type player. Kevin Lowe could not get him to play defense. Neither could MacT. Neither could Ron Low. Neither could Trottier. Neither could Sather nor Renney. I doubt that the 'Canes coach could and Hartley would not even give him the time of day. People have to give up the fantasy that Poti is somehow going to be moved for a) a first-rounder or b) a second rounder and subsequently this 2nd rounder would be packaged with either another 2nd rounder or the Toronto pick to move up. Not happening. Poti is not getting moved for a pick. Not given his level of play, not given his salary, and not given the upcoming CBA armageddon.
If Carolina is as thin on defense as you claim they are, why would they even consider Poti?
People have to stop having the fantasy that somehow Poti is going to get moved for a pick. This is reality and not EA sports.

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05-24-2004, 04:03 PM
  #160
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prucha73
I think Ducks might trade up to pick Ladd to reunite him with Getzlaf.
Possibly... If Chi takes Barker then Columbus takes Ladd, and I doubt the Ducks trade into the top 3 to get ahead of the Jackets. If Ladd drops to 5 then the Ducks could trade up to the Phoenix pick.. that could be an interesting scenario. Purely hypothetical, but interesting.

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05-24-2004, 05:41 PM
  #161
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Quote:
Originally Posted by True Blue
There's a little more to it than just logic and what Sather would or would not do.

"Trade Poti to Carolina for #38 pick"

Where is the logic here? Why on Earth would Carolina make this trade? People have got to stop including Poti in every possible trade. I understand that people want him gone, but wanting and reality are 2 different things. NO team is going to surrender a 1st or 2nd round pick for him. Given his atrocious play and salary, Poti is close to untradeable.

"Maybe even trade Rachunek, Josh Green, Lacouture, Purinton, Labarbera, or Dunham if anybody is interested and would give fair value in return."

Sather just traded for Rachunek. Does anyone out there really think that he is going to turn around and ship him right out? Dunham is pretty much untradeable right now. And players like Josh Green, Lacouture, Purinton, Labarbera have as much trade value as a waiver pick. What is a fair return for any one of them? A new hockey stick? A puck?

"Then use the 2 late 2nd rounders to get another late 1st rounder;"

With the well-documented drop-off in talent (or polish or whatever you want to call it), why would a team trade away it's first rounder in return for 2 LATE 2nd rounders? Just does not make sense.

"and use Toronto's pick and another late 2nd rounder to move up into mid teens."

Again, the 25th pick and another late 2nd rounder is not going to get you to move up 10 spots (15th is mid-teens).

Not only do these trades have to make sense for the Rangers, they have to make sense for other teams as well.
IF a team came up to him and asked if they would make these trades, then it would be logic for someone to say yes, but Sather doesn't use logic when making decisions.

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Old
05-24-2004, 05:45 PM
  #162
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prucha73
Why would Columbus want Umberger? But if they really do I would trade his rights for their 2nd round pick.

Also I think teams like Columbus, Chicago, Carolina and Buffalo are all going for defensemen.
They don't have a second round pick!

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05-24-2004, 05:46 PM
  #163
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Broadway Crosby
IF a team came up to him and asked if they would make these trades, then it would be logic for someone to say yes, but Sather doesn't use logic when making decisions.
sather doesn't really get ripped off in trades. sather has drafted very well since he became gm. sather at the deadline got some really good young players. his logic in hiring coaches is pretty bad but..................... the talent that is coming in this year and in the future is pretty exciting.

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05-24-2004, 05:48 PM
  #164
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Originally Posted by Son of Steinbrenner
sather doesn't really get ripped off in trades. sather has drafted very well since he became gm. sather at the deadline got some really good young players. his logic in hiring coaches is pretty bad but..................... the talent that is coming in this year and in the future is pretty exciting.
Not LATELY, but he has got ripped off in trades. You also can't judge his drafting as of late, because none have played in the NHL, or had an impact.

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05-24-2004, 05:57 PM
  #165
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Originally Posted by Broadway Crosby
Not LATELY, but he has got ripped off in trades. You also can't judge his drafting as of late, because none have played in the NHL, or had an impact.
I can judge his draft record. So can everyone else. that is why we had that poll of top 20 prospects to judge players. Do u think prospects fall from the sky?

every GM has made bad choices but sather has not been ripped off in a deal yet. his masterful trades at the deadline have accelerated the rebuilding process

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05-24-2004, 06:02 PM
  #166
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Originally Posted by Barnaby
Possibly... If Chi takes Barker then Columbus takes Ladd, and I doubt the Ducks trade into the top 3 to get ahead of the Jackets. If Ladd drops to 5 then the Ducks could trade up to the Phoenix pick.. that could be an interesting scenario. Purely hypothetical, but interesting.
I doubt Columbus takes Ladd at #4, they might take Thelen

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05-24-2004, 06:04 PM
  #167
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prucha73
I doubt Columbus takes Ladd at #4, they might take Thelen
There is a heck of a lot better chance they take Ladd at 4 then Thelan. If they wanted Thelan they could possibly trade down a slot or two. Ladd won't last past 6 if everything went right he could last until 7, but I doubt it.

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05-24-2004, 06:07 PM
  #168
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Originally Posted by Barnaby
There is a heck of a lot better chance they take Ladd at 4 then Thelan. If they wanted Thelan they could possibly trade down a slot or two. Ladd won't last past 6 if everything went right he could last until 7, but I doubt it.
I doubt they would take Ladd over Olesz

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05-24-2004, 06:11 PM
  #169
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prucha73
I doubt they would take Ladd over Olesz
I don't, they are higher on Ladd.

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Old
05-24-2004, 06:13 PM
  #170
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Originally Posted by Broadway Crosby
I don't, they are higher on Ladd.
how do you know this?

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05-24-2004, 06:15 PM
  #171
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prucha73
I doubt they would take Ladd over Olesz
I'm not saying they will, but it definately wouldn't surprise me. Word is Columbus loves Barker and Ladd. If one isn't there, then they'll probably take the other. Thats what I've been hearing the last few weeks anyway. I would be fine with Ladd at 6. Pho apparently really likes Tukonen. I'm not sure if they'd take him over Ladd or Olesz, but that makes draft day fun

In a perfect world.. (and assuming no trades)

1. WSH - Ovechkin
2. Pitt - Malkin
3. Chi - Barker
4. CBS - Ladd
5. PHO - Tukonen
6 NYR - OLESZ - YIPPE

Of course Radulov could jump in, a trade could be made - anything could happen. Something like that could happen altho I doubt Olesz lasts even if his stock has dropped a bit.

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05-24-2004, 06:16 PM
  #172
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Broadway Crosby
I don't, they are higher on Ladd.
They are supposedly high on Ladd, but that doesn't necessarily mean they like him more then Olesz.

Maybe they trade down to six with us. We grab Olesz - they grab Ladd at 6. Of course they'd have to be darn sure Pho doesn't want him.

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05-24-2004, 06:18 PM
  #173
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Originally Posted by Son of Steinbrenner
how do you know this?
It's been known for a while, their have been newspaper articles on CBJ draft board, and it's consensus that they are higher on Ladd than Olesz.

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05-24-2004, 06:20 PM
  #174
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Barnaby
I'm not saying they will, but it definately wouldn't surprise me. Word is Columbus loves Barker and Ladd. If one isn't there, then they'll probably take the other. Thats what I've been hearing the last few weeks anyway. I would be fine with Ladd at 6. Pho apparently really likes Tukonen. I'm not sure if they'd take him over Ladd or Olesz, but that makes draft day fun

In a perfect world.. (and assuming no trades)

1. WSH - Ovechkin
2. Pitt - Malkin
3. Chi - Barker
4. CBS - Ladd
5. PHO - Tukonen
6 NYR - OLESZ - YIPPE

Of course Radulov could jump in, a trade could be made - anything could happen. Something like that could happen altho I doubt Olesz lasts even if his stock has dropped a bit.
WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOO!

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05-24-2004, 06:20 PM
  #175
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Broadway Crosby
It's been known for a while, their have been newspaper articles on CBJ draft board, and it's consensus that they are higher on Ladd than Olesz.
A consensus on a board or in a paper doesn't mean FACT.

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