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I have proposed these trades to the Isle's fans

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Old
05-19-2004, 02:53 PM
  #1
guitaraholic*
 
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I have proposed these trades to the Isle's fans

on their board:

http://www.hfboards.com/showthread.p...10#post1393310

Basically they're:

1. Demitra and Mayers for Isle's first in 2004 and Jason Blake

2. Demitra for Hamrlik

3. Sejna, Salvador, 3rd in '04 for Isle's first in '04

thoughts?

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05-19-2004, 03:09 PM
  #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guitaraholic
on their board:

http://www.hfboards.com/showthread.p...10#post1393310

Basically they're:

1. Demitra and Mayers for Isle's first in 2004 and Jason Blake

2. Demitra for Hamrlik

3. Sejna, Salvador, 3rd in '04 for Isle's first in '04

thoughts?
Isles simply can't afford Demetra.
He made about what $6m,while Hamrlik made $3.6m?I think there's a good chance that Hamrlik signs an extension at a price the isles can fit into their budget,before the current cba expires

Isles will want to give their own small,skilled wing prospects Weinhandl+Paps a chance,so I don't see them in the mix for 24 yr old Sejna.They could use a kid like Salvador,but not as the key to a deal that costs a 1st rounder,especially when their prospect pools so depleted.

We're reading rumors that they'll look to move 2-3 vets and that's where I expect they'll get a physical d-man or at least clear enough salary space to sign one off the ufa market.

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05-19-2004, 03:14 PM
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It's a mistake to trade Sejna...

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05-19-2004, 06:49 PM
  #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 210
It's a mistake to trade Sejna...
Do you think he's going to materialize into a viable NHL player, 210? I have come to respect your opinions on Blues prospects so if you say he's a keeper... I'll defer to your opinion. What do you feel his upside is? Can you compare him to any current NHLers in playing style/production?

thanks. I saw only the 20some games he played for the Blues during the reg. season and while he had flashes he was clearly overmatched.

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05-19-2004, 09:19 PM
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He should never have started the season in StL, and if the Blues had followed their "normal" course and sent him to Worcester everyone would be awaiting his arrival in StL and not thinking he's a bust.

I'm not a huge fan of calling prospects "the next so-and-so", but offensively he reminds me a lot of Samsonov. Sejna's defensive play is a lot better then his however...

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05-19-2004, 09:40 PM
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From a Blues perspective, I'd do 1, but not 2 or 3. The Blues need more scoring depth, not defenseman. Also, I wouldn't give up on Sejna yet much less package him with Salvador and a 3rd for a late 1st.

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05-20-2004, 10:41 AM
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guitaraholic
on their board:

http://www.hfboards.com/showthread.p...10#post1393310

Basically they're:

1. Demitra and Mayers for Isle's first in 2004 and Jason Blake

2. Demitra for Hamrlik

3. Sejna, Salvador, 3rd in '04 for Isle's first in '04

thoughts?
Actually I don't see Isles acquire Demitra. They are trying to reduce payroll and recent rumpurs are that they are going to unload some of their big guns before trade deadline.
Personally, I've been dreaming of acquiring Parrish and maybe Scatchard. If I were GM I'd go with Weight as our N 1 pivotmman, Cajanek as 2nd, signed Sillinger to play 3/4 line pivot. Having McClement on horizon I would not hurry to get Scatchard (who could also play RW).
As of Parrish - he is relatively young gritty scoring RW making only 2.3 mil a year. Seems to me that he could be obtained for 2nd rounder and Bogy. Sejna-Weight-Parrish line seems to be very potent...

Concerning Demitra trade proposals. I understand that Pavol is very talanted but I doubt that he can bring something more to the Blues table. I've seen him playing at WHC and something was really wrong with him (maybe he lost confidence or so but that does not matter).
How about Demitra (6.5 mil) to Sabres for Drury (3.5 mil) +... .I would not even mind eating some of Demitra's salary.
In my opinion this trade is in favour of both sides:
1. Blues trim payroll and get a decent top-line player.
2. Sabres get a point per game producer who can really help them in regular season to get to playoffs they desperately want to reach in exchange for 45-60 point producer.
3. Besides, Satan and Demitra could benefit from plaiyng together.
If Blues could manage a Jagr-type deal in Tkachuk trade (getting some picks and prospects) then some of them could be used to get Parrish-type players to complement top lines. Freed money could be used for Rucinsky-type free agents.
Imagine the core of Sejna, Parrish, Weight, Drury, Rucinsky, Drake etc.
If that scenario can be performed Blues could rebuild and still be in contention for playoffs. But only reality can show us the real value of players.

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05-20-2004, 04:13 PM
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Felix
I've seen him playing at WHC and something was really wrong with him (maybe he lost confidence or so but that does not matter).
Demitra was tied for 4th in total points for the tournament, with 4 goals and 4 assists and a +/- of + 5.


Yeah he has lost confidence. :lol

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05-20-2004, 06:25 PM
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Personally I find his failure to once again pay the price to succeed in the playoffs followed in rapid succession by his excellent play in the WC's to be more problematic than had is 'slump' continued through the WC's. It pretty much proves he's simply not willing or capable of playing in the playoffs, IMO.

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05-20-2004, 06:31 PM
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guitaraholic
Personally I find his failure to once again pay the price to succeed in the playoffs followed in rapid succession by his excellent play in the WC's to be more problematic than had is 'slump' continued through the WC's. It pretty much proves he's simply not willing or capable of playing in the playoffs, IMO.
Demitra outplayed Weight in the playoffs and I dont see you calling Weight out.

Weight has had 7 games in a Bluenote where he was worth his pay.

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05-20-2004, 08:23 PM
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Felix

As of Parrish - he is relatively young gritty scoring RW making only 2.3 mil a year. Seems to me that he could be obtained for 2nd rounder and Bogy. Sejna-Weight-Parrish line seems to be very potent...

.

and the isles are trading 27 yr old Parrish, who's scored 23-30 goals a season in 5 of his first 6 nhl seasons, for 3rd liner Eric Boguniecki and a 2nd in a crappy draft because????

Scatchard,Asham,Bates,Mapletoft,Bergenheim aren't enough 3rd liners?

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05-20-2004, 08:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CREW99AW
and the isles are trading 27 yr old Parrish, who's scored 23-30 goals a season in 5 of his first 6 nhl seasons, for 3rd liner Eric Boguniecki and a 2nd in a crappy draft because????
I see your point about trading Parrish, but I think you underrate Boguniecki, and wonder why you think this is such a "crappy" draft?

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05-20-2004, 09:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PrussianBlue
I see your point about trading Parrish, but I think you underrate Boguniecki, and wonder why you think this is such a "crappy" draft?

PrussianBlue

It's not underrating Boguniecki when I say the isles already have several quality 3rd liners and 3-4 prospects who'll be fighting for limited icetime on the lower lines,so the isles wouldn't be in the mix for Boguniecki.

Isles need another consistent scorer for the top two lines.Exchanging Parrish for Boguniecki makes no sense.I'm not saying Parrish won't be moved,just that this deal doesn't fill nyi roster needs.At least the Huselius rumors made sense.

and I think it's a crappy draft because I've read there's a considerable dropoff in talent after the first 15-20 picks.

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05-20-2004, 09:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CREW99AW
It's not underrating Boguniecki when I say the isles already have several quality 3rd liners and 3-4 prospects who'll be fighting for limited icetime on the lower lines,so the isles wouldn't be in the mix for Boguniecki.
Maybe not, but it is underrating Boguniecki to dismiss him as just another third-liner, and the equal of the Islanders' third-liners. Scatchard is the only one of the Islanders' "bottom six" guys who's ever scored as many as 20 goals in an NHL season, which Boguniecki has also done.

If Boguniecki became an Islander tomorrow, he'd be no worse than the seventh-best forward on the team, and at this point, I'd take him ahead of Scatchard or Czerkawski.

Yashin, Peca, Hunter, Kvasha, Parrish... name me another Islander forward who is better than Boguniecki right now, at this stage of his career.

Believe it or not, I've always been an Islander fan as well as a Blues fan, ever since the Trottier-Smith-Gillies dynasty days. But those days are twenty-five years in the past, man, and they're not coming back any time soon, as much as you (and I) might wish otherwise.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CREW99AW
and I think it's a crappy draft because I've read there's a considerable dropoff in talent after the first 15-20 picks.
I tend to take that kind of stuff with a grain of salt, as the scouts say that every year, and three-four years later, a bunch of guys emerge from the late first round and beyond to become NHL players.

I can guarantee that there will be at least one legitimate star player who emerges from a pick below #20 in this draft, and that there will be several players picked below #20 who have longer and more productive careers than at least two or three of the guys picked at #20 or above. It happens every year.

PrussianBlue


Last edited by Prussian_Blue: 05-20-2004 at 09:38 PM.
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05-20-2004, 10:24 PM
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PrussianBlue
Maybe not, but it is underrating Boguniecki to dismiss him as just another third-liner, and the equal of the Islanders' third-liners. Scatchard is the only one of the Islanders' "bottom six" guys who's ever scored as many as 20 goals in an NHL season, which Boguniecki has also done.

If Boguniecki became an Islander tomorrow, he'd be no worse than the seventh-best forward on the team, and at this point, I'd take him ahead of Scatchard or Czerkawski.

Yashin, Peca, Hunter, Kvasha, Parrish... name me another Islander forward who is better than Boguniecki right now, at this stage of his career.


PrussianBlue
You'd take Boguniecki over the nyi 3rd liners.That's fine.I wouldn't and doubt the nyi would be interested in him when their biggest needs are a physical top 4 d-man and another consistent top 6 scorer.

Isles don't play Czerkawski on the 3rd line.He's the first line and pp because of his skill.

Scatchard who does play on the 3rd line,has had 27 and 20 goal seasons.He's 6'3 220 lbs,adds badly needed size and toughness.Blake played well enough to make the WC team this yr and Asham's a hardworking,gritty kid the coaches like.

There are young players on the 4th line who'll be fighting increased icetime.
Saying 26 yr old Boguniecki's currently a better nhler then 19 yr old Bergenheim(18 nhl games) and 23 yr old Mapletoft(27 nhl games),doesn't really mean much.Let's check back in a few yrs.

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05-20-2004, 10:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guitaraholic
Personally I find his failure to once again pay the price to succeed in the playoffs followed in rapid succession by his excellent play in the WC's to be more problematic than had is 'slump' continued through the WC's. It pretty much proves he's simply not willing or capable of playing in the playoffs, IMO.

Really?

66 playoff games, 18 goals, 25 assists, 43 points, +4. I'll admit he didn't show up in game 1. But he outplayed Weight by far in the series. Dougie can hit the road to the Eastern Conf. Pretty simple to me, Pavol back at or near 4-5 million or Weight who is older for 9 ish? No brainer imo.

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05-21-2004, 04:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Demitra #38
Demitra was tied for 4th in total points for the tournament, with 4 goals and 4 assists and a +/- of + 5.


Yeah he has lost confidence. :lol
Oh! Points! If talking of them - then say how many points did he score in the last two most important games for Slovaks - against Canada and USA? And not against significantly weaker teams?
He played on the line with Bartecko and Hossa and that was clearly evident that it was Hossa who carried this line.

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05-21-2004, 04:42 AM
  #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CREW99AW
You'd take Boguniecki over the nyi 3rd liners.That's fine.I wouldn't and doubt the nyi would be interested in him when their biggest needs are a physical top 4 d-man and another consistent top 6 scorer.

Isles don't play Czerkawski on the 3rd line.He's the first line and pp because of his skill.

Scatchard who does play on the 3rd line,has had 27 and 20 goal seasons.He's 6'3 220 lbs,adds badly needed size and toughness.Blake played well enough to make the WC team this yr and Asham's a hardworking,gritty kid the coaches like.

There are young players on the 4th line who'll be fighting increased icetime.
Saying 26 yr old Boguniecki's currently a better nhler then 19 yr old Bergenheim(18 nhl games) and 23 yr old Mapletoft(27 nhl games),doesn't really mean much.Let's check back in a few yrs.

I've based my tarde proposals on the rumours that Isles want to dump some salary. BTW, Parrish rumour emerged long before trade deadline and I beleive he was not traded only because of the injury he sustained some time before deadline.
Bogy and 2nd for Parrish is very fair deal in terms of what team get in result. And remember, 2nd round pick (Kiprusoff) got Flames to SC Finals... So that's very good price for Parrish.

If Isles need a D, then how about Salvador and 3rd for Parrish?

And mid, noone is going to give you young top-6 forward makig around 1 mil. for RFA Parrish making 2.3 mil and due to raise.

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05-21-2004, 10:18 AM
  #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Felix
I've based my tarde proposals on the rumours that Isles want to dump some salary. BTW, Parrish rumour emerged long before trade deadline and I beleive he was not traded only because of the injury he sustained some time before deadline.
Bogy and 2nd for Parrish is very fair deal in terms of what team get in result. And remember, 2nd round pick (Kiprusoff) got Flames to SC Finals... So that's very good price for Parrish.

If Isles need a D, then how about Salvador and 3rd for Parrish?

And mid, noone is going to give you young top-6 forward makig around 1 mil. for RFA Parrish making 2.3 mil and due to raise.
The rumors were Parrish being traded to Fla for Huselius. So no thanks for your offer---that one is much better

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05-21-2004, 10:24 AM
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Take Huselius over Salvador and you'll get a soft, vastly overrated, one dimensional Euro floater instead of a gritty, solid dman who is vastly underrated. Personally, I think you've chosen poorly.

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05-21-2004, 10:59 AM
  #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Felix
I've based my tarde proposals on the rumours that Isles want to dump some salary. BTW, Parrish rumour emerged long before trade deadline and I beleive he was not traded only because of the injury he sustained some time before deadline.
Bogy and 2nd for Parrish is very fair deal in terms of what team get in result. And remember, 2nd round pick (Kiprusoff) got Flames to SC Finals... So that's very good price for Parrish.

If Isles need a D, then how about Salvador and 3rd for Parrish?

And mid, noone is going to give you young top-6 forward makig around 1 mil. for RFA Parrish making 2.3 mil and due to raise.

Parrish trade rumors came out first in the summer,then in the winter when the owner was trying to move $5-$7m in nyi salary.He was bidding to buy the NJ Nets.The Net deal dragged on and in late Dec, Wang dropped his Nets bid,saying the isles wouldn't have to move salary.

FL press reported that the Panthers and Isles have a New Years deal that would have sent Parrish to FL,but the isles backed out at the last min.The links to the article were posted here and discussed by NYI and Panther fans.

Parrish got hurt 3-4 days AFTER the press reported the failed deal.So his injury didn't stop the deal,the isles front office changing their minds did.

Panthers have tried trading for Parrish before,while MM tried to trade for Huselius before.Panther beatwriters are saying the team will have up to $10m to spend this offseason,that they want to bring in 2 d-men and a physical forward.I think Parrish for Huselius is a good possibilty.Or maybe Parrish to Detroit, where the Detroit press says the Wings blame a lack of grit on their early playoff exit.


and Salavador's not a top 4 defenseman,so no thanks on the Parrish for Salvador+pick offer.

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05-21-2004, 11:03 AM
  #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guitaraholic
Take Huselius over Salvador and you'll get a soft, vastly overrated, one dimensional Euro floater instead of a gritty, solid dman who is vastly underrated. Personally, I think you've chosen poorly.

Or you get a very talented,but underachieving young player who needs a change of scenery,that you could be put on a 2nd line with grittier forwards Peca and Hunter.

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05-21-2004, 11:04 AM
  #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guitaraholic
Take Huselius over Salvador and you'll get a soft, vastly overrated, one dimensional Euro floater instead of a gritty, solid dman who is vastly underrated. Personally, I think you've chosen poorly.
To each his own---I'll take a young 25yr old 20 goal winger over a 28 yr old 5th or 6th depth dman.

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05-21-2004, 11:18 AM
  #24
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I think you haven't seen enough of Salvador if you think he's merely a 5th or 6th depth dman. Guess we just disagree. Huselius will never win you anything whereas guys like Salvador, guys that will fight in the trenches, clear the front of the next, skates well, makes the smart, safe play, win you games.

Take your euro-soft headcase, please. You can pair him with Yashin. Couple of real winners you'd have there....

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05-21-2004, 11:31 AM
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guitaraholic
I think you haven't seen enough of Salvador if you think he's merely a 5th or 6th depth dman. Guess we just disagree. Huselius will never win you anything whereas guys like Salvador, guys that will fight in the trenches, clear the front of the next, skates well, makes the smart, safe play, win you games.

Take your euro-soft headcase, please. You can pair him with Yashin. Couple of real winners you'd have there....
I'am not saying I would trade Parrish for Huselius but those were the rumours. Parrish is a top 6 forward scoring anywhere between 23-30 goals a season so we would want back either a top 6 forward (Huselius or someone else) or a top 4 dman which Salvador is not

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