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***Official Off-Season Trade Proposals/Rumours Thread*** Part 2

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05-29-2010, 08:37 AM
  #1
RedWhiteBlackGold
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***Official Off-Season Trade Proposals/Rumours Thread*** Part 2

Carry on from this thread:

http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=769401

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Old
05-29-2010, 01:02 PM
  #2
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Would yo do this Trade w/ Canucks?

Canuck fan here, Congrats to a respectable year. Just wanting to propose a trade to see how realistic it could be. thanks for your input.

To Vancouver
Brian Lee
2nd rnd pick

To Ottawa
Kevin Bieksa
J Hansen
4th rnd pick

Reason:

For Ottawa: The Sens have alot of young Dmen that will be difference makers in their system, the problem is with Alffy getting older and Spezza, Phillips, Fisher, Kuba, Kovalev, Neil all being mid aged- the window of opportunity for winning is now.

Those young studs on the back-end (Karlsson, Weiroch, Cowen, Lee) maybe a couple years away from being really effective. Karlsson might be the exception.

Ottawa adds Bieksa who at 3.7 mil for one more year adds grit, offensive talent, and leadership. Bieksa is the type of player that is built for the playoffs. As a Canuck fanatic I dont really want to get rid of him but I think his D-style isnt what we need to go up against teams like SJ and Chi.

Hansen is a player that is very under-used in Vancouver. He shows flashes of offensive brilliant from time to time but has trouble keeping it consistent. His speed is top knotch, I believe he got a breakaway against the Hawks in the 2nd round in 3 games in a row. He is also a tenacious fore-checker and penalty killer. He is an RFA and will proabbly earn 800k this year which is an absoloute bargain.


For Vancouver- Brian Lee isnt really the type of D-man we are looking for, he is big but from all counts he seems to shy from the physical game and doesnt use his big fram to his advantage at times. However his first pass is excellent and the ability to runt he point on the PP will be welcomed.

The biggest reason Van does this is for salary dumpo. The canucks currently have around 12 million dollar in free cap space and with this trade they will have around 15 mill to spend which will allow us to sign 2 of the following D-men that we need, Hamhuis, Martin, Kubina, Michalek etc...

I know there isnt much trade history between out 2 teams , I think Salo for Schaffer was the last one, but maybe this one is worth kicking the tires over.

Thoughts?

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05-29-2010, 01:06 PM
  #3
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I probably would. I think I'd rather just try to sign Michalek though...

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05-29-2010, 01:12 PM
  #4
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jokes on you, we don't have a 2nd!

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05-29-2010, 01:12 PM
  #5
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Maybe it's the 2011 2nd rounder.

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05-29-2010, 01:14 PM
  #6
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A few things to comment on...

Quote:
Originally Posted by carlweezer View Post
For Ottawa: The Sens have alot of young Dmen that will be difference makers in their system, the problem is with Alffy getting older and Spezza, Phillips, Fisher, Kuba, Kovalev, Neil all being mid aged- the window of opportunity for winning is now.
That argument is valid for Phillips, Fisher, and Alfredsson. But many Sens fans want Kovalev and Kuba gone; Neil is not a core player; and Spezza isn't even 30 yet. The Sens' legitimate shot at a Cup will be years from now when (hopefully) there is a solid core - Lehner, Karlsson, Cowen, and Wiercioch look like they might form a promising back end of the ice. For now, we have a bunch of "mediocre" players, and a mediocre team does not win a Cup.


Quote:
Originally Posted by carlweezer View Post
Ottawa adds Bieksa who at 3.7 mil for one more year adds grit, offensive talent, and leadership. Bieksa is the type of player that is built for the playoffs. As a Canuck fanatic I dont really want to get rid of him but I think his D-style isnt what we need to go up against teams like SJ and Chi.
The Sharks and Blackhawks are playoff teams, and you don't think Bieksa will help you against them. Yet you say he's built for the playoffs. Pretty sure that's contradictory.


Quote:
Originally Posted by carlweezer View Post
For Vancouver- Brian Lee isnt really the type of D-man we are looking for, he is big but from all counts he seems to shy from the physical game and doesnt use his big fram to his advantage at times. However his first pass is excellent and the ability to runt he point on the PP will be welcomed.
His first pass is good, his skating is very good, and his positioning is OK. But he really doesn't get involved much and he has a weak shot. At best, I think he'll be a #4 defenseman who basically only plays even-strength minutes and gets 15-20 points.


Quote:
Originally Posted by carlweezer View Post
The biggest reason Van does this is for salary dumpo. The canucks currently have around 12 million dollar in free cap space and with this trade they will have around 15 mill to spend which will allow us to sign 2 of the following D-men that we need, Hamhuis, Martin, Kubina, Michalek etc...
The Canucks have more cap space than the Sens. This doesn't make sense for the Sens for that reason. You want two of Hamhuis, Martin, etc., and yet we're in the same boat (except we only want one). By all accounts, Bieksa really struggled this year, and is terribly inconsistent. He's damn expensive at $3.75M, and so I don't think this makes sense for Ottawa - we would have literally no cap space after that.

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05-29-2010, 01:14 PM
  #7
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sure 2nd 2011 then..thoughts?

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05-29-2010, 01:17 PM
  #8
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Brian lee is definately not a pp qb. His shot is terrible, and while a good passer and skater, he has little offensive creativity. His strengths are his passing, skating, positioning, and long reach. Being 6'3, agile and a good passer could make him a real good defensive defenseman one day, but he will never be an offensive defenseman. I can't see him ever putting up more then 30 points (mostly assists).

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05-29-2010, 01:19 PM
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiasco View Post
A few things to comment on...



That argument is valid for Phillips, Fisher, and Alfredsson. But many Sens fans want Kovalev and Kuba gone; Neil is not a core player; and Spezza isn't even 30 yet. The Sens' legitimate shot at a Cup will be years from now when (hopefully) there is a solid core - Lehner, Karlsson, Cowen, and Wiercioch look like they might form a promising back end of the ice. For now, we have a bunch of "mediocre" players, and a mediocre team does not win a Cup.




The Sharks and Blackhawks are playoff teams, and you don't think Bieksa will help you against them. Yet you say he's built for the playoffs. Pretty sure that's contradictory.




His first pass is good, his skating is very good, and his positioning is OK. But he really doesn't get involved much and he has a weak shot. At best, I think he'll be a #4 defenseman who basically only plays even-strength minutes and gets 15-20 points.




The Canucks have more cap space than the Sens. This doesn't make sense for the Sens for that reason. You want two of Hamhuis, Martin, etc., and yet we're in the same boat (except we only want one). By all accounts, Bieksa really struggled this year, and is terribly inconsistent. He's damn expensive at $3.75M, and so I don't think this makes sense for Ottawa - we would have literally no cap space after that.

Bieksa being a playoff performer isnt a contradictory, he is very useful however we have players that can produce offensively like he does, like Ehrhoff, Edler, Salo..we need a Dman that will battle in front of the net and shut "big players" down. like what Mitchell use to do for us.

Also his inconsistency can be traced to his 2 freak injuries with a skate cutting a tendon on leg 2 years in a row.

and I can see why you would turn this down but maybe if you cant sign a UFA dman because other teams can offer more money then you will re-consider trading for one such as Bieksa

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05-29-2010, 01:28 PM
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carlweezer View Post
and I can see why you would turn this down but maybe if you cant sign a UFA dman because other teams can offer more money then you will re-consider trading for one such as Bieksa
Yep, Murray probably would re-consider it. But I think he will first try the FA route because there are many, many options out there for defensemen who have two-way games.

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05-29-2010, 05:19 PM
  #11
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With the extra 2m of cap space this would be a tough line-up to play against next year.
out
Kelly

In
Cogliano RFA(not sure about cap hit?) Love to see his speed with Kovalev and Foligno

Regin/Spezza/Michalek interested in seeing if Regin can handle playing on top line
Fisher/Cullen/Alfie great line in the playoffs
Foligno/Cogliano/Kovalev Speed size skill not in that order
Ruutu/Winchester/Neil hate to lose Kelly but I think winchester can keep up

Phillips/Kuba
Karlsson/Michalek
Campolie/Carkner
Lee

Elliott
Leclaire

We would be close to the cap, but its a better team than last year

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05-29-2010, 05:36 PM
  #12
Karl Cowensson
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wilfred View Post
With the extra 2m of cap space this would be a tough line-up to play against next year.
out
Kelly

In
Cogliano RFA(not sure about cap hit?) Love to see his speed with Kovalev and Foligno

Regin/Spezza/Michalek interested in seeing if Regin can handle playing on top line
Fisher/Cullen/Alfie great line in the playoffs
Foligno/Cogliano/Kovalev Speed size skill not in that order
Ruutu/Winchester/Neil hate to lose Kelly but I think winchester can keep up

Phillips/Kuba
Karlsson/Michalek
Campolie/Carkner
Lee

Elliott
Leclaire

We would be close to the cap, but its a better team than last year
I like but I get the feeling that would put the team dangerously close to the cap, need cap space for injury call ups too.

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05-29-2010, 08:05 PM
  #13
Cherith Cutestory
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Any chance Murray trades down in order to get a 2nd round pick? Would any of the teams picking 17-30 go for it do you think?

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05-29-2010, 08:08 PM
  #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wilfred View Post
With the extra 2m of cap space this would be a tough line-up to play against next year.
out
Kelly

In
Cogliano RFA(not sure about cap hit?) Love to see his speed with Kovalev and Foligno

Regin/Spezza/Michalek interested in seeing if Regin can handle playing on top line
Fisher/Cullen/Alfie great line in the playoffs
Foligno/Cogliano/Kovalev Speed size skill not in that order
Ruutu/Winchester/Neil hate to lose Kelly but I think winchester can keep up

Phillips/Kuba
Karlsson/Michalek
Campolie/Carkner
Lee

Elliott
Leclaire

We would be close to the cap, but its a better team than last year
I wouldn't mind flipping Winnie for a pick at the draft and having Smith take his place.

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Old
05-29-2010, 09:06 PM
  #15
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Quote:

The biggest reason Van does this is for salary dumpo. The canucks currently have around 12 million dollar in free cap space and with this trade they will have around 15 mill to spend which will allow us to sign 2 of the following D-men that we need, Hamhuis, Martin, Kubina, Michalek etc..
We could just as easily sign one of these guys ourselves and keep our assets. If Bieksa was on a good contract it would be different.

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05-30-2010, 08:08 AM
  #16
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Peter Regin ($1.2m) / Jason Spezza ($7.0m) / Milan Michalek ($4.3m)
Matt Cullen ($2.9m) / Mike Fisher ($4.2m) / Daniel Alfredsson ($4.9m)
Nick Foligno ($1.0m) / Chris Kelly ($2.1m) / Alexei Kovalev ($5.0m)
Jarkko Ruutu ($1.3m) / Jesse Winchester ($0.8m) / Chris Neil ($2.0m)
Ryan Shannon ($0.6m)

Chris Phillips ($3.5m) / Z. Michalek ($3.8m)
Filip Kuba ($3.7m) / Erik Karlsson ($1.3m)
Chris Campoli ($0.8m) / Matt Carkner ($0.7m)
Brian Lee ($0.9m)

Pascal Leclaire ($3.8m) / Brian Elliott ($0.8m)

ROSTER SIZE: 22; PAYROLL: $57.921m; CAP ROOM: $1.304m

If the cap does go up about 2M this would be one hell of a lineup.

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Old
05-30-2010, 08:51 AM
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I think Regin is going to get a 1.5M deal.

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05-30-2010, 09:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Afro Thunder View Post
I think Regin is going to get a 1.5M deal.
I agree and Foligno is probably going to get more than 1M. But Murray is quite the stickler for RFA contracts, so hopefully that continues. The cheaper the RFAs are signed the better.

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05-30-2010, 09:35 AM
  #19
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I wish he would start resigning the RFA's already so us mini GMs could see what we are working with.

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05-30-2010, 10:55 AM
  #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Karl Cowensson View Post
I agree and Foligno is probably going to get more than 1M. But Murray is quite the stickler for RFA contracts, so hopefully that continues. The cheaper the RFAs are signed the better.
9 goals gets you over 1mil as an RFA now? He's a small-ish borderline 4th line player who doesn't fight... he's not worth 1mil. I think he gets ~0.75-0.9mil or gets traded.

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05-30-2010, 11:04 AM
  #21
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Quote:
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9 goals gets you over 1mil as an RFA now? He's a small-ish borderline 4th line player who doesn't fight... he's not worth 1mil. I think he gets ~0.75-0.9mil or gets traded.
Yeah Murray is gonna give up on him over a 200k spread...

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05-30-2010, 11:06 AM
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Trade Foligno to Sabres for a 2nd, then he can play with his bro in a couple of years.

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05-30-2010, 11:12 AM
  #23
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Trade Foligno to Sabres for a 2nd, then he can play with his bro in a couple of years.
This is just brutal. Carolina should trade us their Ruutu for Chris Kelly, then he can play with his bro for a year.

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05-30-2010, 12:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Twelvie View Post
9 goals gets you over 1mil as an RFA now? He's a small-ish borderline 4th line player who doesn't fight... he's not worth 1mil. I think he gets ~0.75-0.9mil or gets traded.
08-09: 81GP 17G (32Pts) 91Hits 33TKaways (25GVaways)
09-10: 61GP 9G (26Pts) 78Hits 36TKaways (12GVaways)

He's only 22Yrs old... for comparison sake Fisher at 22 had a career high 18G and 38Pts

Foligno is worth 1.0 - 1.5 for 2-4 years... he's shown that he does have hands to score 20, he does throw hits and is developing into a strong take away player without giving the puck up a bunch

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05-30-2010, 12:16 PM
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Fuhr View Post
08-09: 81GP 17G (32Pts) 91Hits 33TKaways (25GVaways)
09-10: 61GP 9G (26Pts) 78Hits 36TKaways (12GVaways)

He's only 22Yrs old... for comparison sake Fisher at 22 had a career high 18G and 38Pts

Foligno is worth 1.0 - 1.5 for 2-4 years... he's shown that he does have hands to score 20, he does throw hits and is developing into a strong take away player without giving the puck up a bunch
I agree and his cap hit is probably on the low end of that, coming in around $1M. He may make .9, .95, 1, 1.1 for a total of $3.95M over 4 years.

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