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2010-11 Salary Cap/Lineup Discussion (contract chart post #1)

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Old
07-01-2010, 02:23 PM
  #101
Fogel
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I think we overpaid for both D slightly, but I guess that helps reinforce the need for good talent from the farm. The top 6 D are signed for the next 2 years then Gogo will still be a RFA. I guess that leaves a lot of time in the minors for Despres and the rest of the blue line prospects. It will be interesting to see if the D prospects develop as expected in that time frame.

Next year will be a bit rough. Talbot, Dupuis, Godard, Rupp, Adams, kennedy come off, but only at $5.3M. The bottom guys might be able to be replaced at <1M, but we count Talbot and/or Dupuis as a top 6 so it will be a big year for forward prospects to fill in important roles.

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07-01-2010, 02:46 PM
  #102
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I think the Pens are done shopping for now. By my estimation they only have 1.2mil left to spend. If they want to augment the roster it will be through trades. And when you look at that the Pens have their top 4 D signed for the next 4 years.......Gogo could be gonzo.

2010-11 PITTSBURGH PENGUINS
CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR
FORWARDS
Chris Kunitz ($3.725m) / Sidney Crosby ($8.700m) / Pascal Dupuis ($1.400m)
Eric Tangradi ($0.846m) / Evgeni Malkin ($8.700m) / Maxime Talbot ($1.050m)
Matt Cooke ($1.800m) / Jordan Staal ($4.000m) / Tyler Kennedy ($0.725m)
Craig Adams ($0.550m) / Michael Rupp ($0.825m) / Nick Johnson ($0.500m)
Eric Godard ($0.750m)
DEFENSEMEN
Paul Martin ($5.000m) / Zbynek Michalek ($4.000m)
Brooks Orpik ($3.750m) / Kristopher Letang ($3.500m)
Alex Goligoski ($1.833m) / Ben Lovejoy ($0.525m)
Deryk Engelland ($0.500m)
GOALTENDERS
Marc-Andre Fleury ($5.000m) / Brent Johnson ($0.600m)
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS
(these totals are compiled using the bonus cushion)
ROSTER: 22; CAP:$59.4m; PAYROLL: $58.279m; CAP ROOM: $1.258m BONUSES: $0.138m

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Old
07-01-2010, 02:57 PM
  #103
regard
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I did the same thing only with Letestu centering the 4th line and no Johnson.

I REALLY hope Tangradi is ready now so our PP can be:
[net]
Tangradi
---------Crosby
Letang GoGo Malkin

I agree with the GOGO comment, Id be talking to Dallas right now.



Also this gives us a logjam on D in the next few years. Which is good.
We can eventually trade guys like Bortozzo or Strait for forwards who are similirly ready, or Despres might make GoGo or Letang redundant in a few years.


Also-For people who think Godard should be waived for Cap Space look at what NYR and PHilly did. Were going to need him and hes going to earn his paycheck whether you like that part of hockey or not.

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Old
07-01-2010, 03:28 PM
  #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Goalie_Bob View Post
I think the Pens are done shopping for now. By my estimation they only have 1.2mil left to spend. If they want to augment the roster it will be through trades. And when you look at that the Pens have their top 4 D signed for the next 4 years.......Gogo could be gonzo.

2010-11 PITTSBURGH PENGUINS
CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR
FORWARDS
Chris Kunitz ($3.725m) / Sidney Crosby ($8.700m) / Pascal Dupuis ($1.400m)
Eric Tangradi ($0.846m) / Evgeni Malkin ($8.700m) / Maxime Talbot ($1.050m)
Matt Cooke ($1.800m) / Jordan Staal ($4.000m) / Tyler Kennedy ($0.725m)
Craig Adams ($0.550m) / Michael Rupp ($0.825m) / Nick Johnson ($0.500m)
Eric Godard ($0.750m)
DEFENSEMEN
Paul Martin ($5.000m) / Zbynek Michalek ($4.000m)
Brooks Orpik ($3.750m) / Kristopher Letang ($3.500m)
Alex Goligoski ($1.833m) / Ben Lovejoy ($0.525m)
Deryk Engelland ($0.500m)
GOALTENDERS
Marc-Andre Fleury ($5.000m) / Brent Johnson ($0.600m)
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS
(these totals are compiled using the bonus cushion)
ROSTER: 22; CAP:$59.4m; PAYROLL: $58.279m; CAP ROOM: $1.258m BONUSES: $0.138m
This is what we'll likely see IMO, Staal could see time in the top 6 and Letestu probably has the inside track for one of the roster spots with Johnson/Tangradi/Jeffrey/Cheap FA competing for the other spot.

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Old
07-01-2010, 03:54 PM
  #105
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A lot of people around the board are talking about how much we are screwed on our PP now. We have rid ourselves of Mike Yeo, and I am not one of these people that thinks Yeo sat at the edge of a bench with a dry erase board with and evil laugh stroking a cat "This plan will destroy my enemies or destroy us all!"

It overall is a coaching thing, but he is the head of the power play, who ever gets put in charge of it and what ever form it takes, maybe not better than our PP when it was at its maximum effectiveness with Gonchar... But I would slap a 20 on the table right now on a bet that it will be more consistent now. Where ever it ends up. We will probably have a middle tier PP, but after the wrinkles get ironed out at the start of the season I would be it will be consistent.

Another thing to look at last season was not Pittsburgh winger problems, you can put almost anyone beside Crosby and Geno and those wingers can produce. Do they produce at a torrid pace, and are they transformered into top 6 wingers? No, not at all. But they can get the job done.

The teams biggest gaping hole was our defense with...

Orpik - Gonchar
Eaton - Letang
Goligoski - Leopold (facepalm)
Mckee/Skoula/Lovejoy

And now we have...

Martin - Michalek
Orpik - Letang
Goligoski - Lovejoy/UFA
Lovejoy/Engelland

... Even with the loss of a true PPQB in the form of Gonchar, I will take that defense over the former 7 days a week and twice on sunday.

This defense will allow Crosby and Malkin to be better. Will allow Crosby to push and put preasure on goal like he enjoys to play, Malkin will be able to sit in the zone and circle waiting for a shooting chance like he feels comfortable with. Instead of having to always be ready to fly on a back check to stop an opposing play 4-6 times a period.

Pittsburgh's PK will just be insane. No doubt about it. And our GA is going to go down I would be on, I would full bet on our goals against going down. This team even if the loss of a true PPQB has gotten a lot better.

Also how much easier is Fleury's job going to be... I be he is on his knees thanking god after the signings today.

Shero can grab up a reclamation project for wing cheaply, or grinders, or farm hands can be plugged beside Crosby and Geno and they will do no worse than Fedo and Poni did last season. And any reclamation could easily expected to get the goals Guerin did this season.

The team is more of the same on offense, and greatly better defensively.

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Old
07-01-2010, 04:24 PM
  #106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fictionzero View Post
A lot of people around the board are talking about how much we are screwed on our PP now. We have rid ourselves of Mike Yeo, and I am not one of these people that thinks Yeo sat at the edge of a bench with a dry erase board with and evil laugh stroking a cat "This plan will destroy my enemies or destroy us all!"

It overall is a coaching thing, but he is the head of the power play, who ever gets put in charge of it and what ever form it takes, maybe not better than our PP when it was at its maximum effectiveness with Gonchar... But I would slap a 20 on the table right now on a bet that it will be more consistent now. Where ever it ends up. We will probably have a middle tier PP, but after the wrinkles get ironed out at the start of the season I would be it will be consistent.

Another thing to look at last season was not Pittsburgh winger problems, you can put almost anyone beside Crosby and Geno and those wingers can produce. Do they produce at a torrid pace, and are they transformered into top 6 wingers? No, not at all. But they can get the job done.

The teams biggest gaping hole was our defense with...

Orpik - Gonchar
Eaton - Letang
Goligoski - Leopold (facepalm)
Mckee/Skoula/Lovejoy

And now we have...

Martin - Michalek
Orpik - Letang
Goligoski - Lovejoy/UFA
Lovejoy/Engelland

... Even with the loss of a true PPQB in the form of Gonchar, I will take that defense over the former 7 days a week and twice on sunday.

This defense will allow Crosby and Malkin to be better. Will allow Crosby to push and put preasure on goal like he enjoys to play, Malkin will be able to sit in the zone and circle waiting for a shooting chance like he feels comfortable with. Instead of having to always be ready to fly on a back check to stop an opposing play 4-6 times a period.

Pittsburgh's PK will just be insane. No doubt about it. And our GA is going to go down I would be on, I would full bet on our goals against going down. This team even if the loss of a true PPQB has gotten a lot better.

Also how much easier is Fleury's job going to be... I be he is on his knees thanking god after the signings today.

Shero can grab up a reclamation project for wing cheaply, or grinders, or farm hands can be plugged beside Crosby and Geno and they will do no worse than Fedo and Poni did last season. And any reclamation could easily expected to get the goals Guerin did this season.

The team is more of the same on offense, and greatly better defensively.
The offensive side is going to have to be bolstered by the fact that Kunitz and Talbot will hopefully be healthy this year.

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Old
07-01-2010, 04:35 PM
  #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vyktor View Post
The offensive side is going to have to be bolstered by the fact that Kunitz and Talbot will hopefully be healthy this year.
The extra time off will help Kunitz, from what I read he has had the injury since the start of the playoffs last season. So a longer off season will have helped him and hopefully let him heal.

If Talbot spends the offseason conditioning, he will come back and be able to fulfill his role completely.

Over all, having a chance to have an extended offseason will help this team all over. They have played an insane amount of hockey over the past handful of seasons.

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Old
07-01-2010, 04:42 PM
  #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by regard View Post
I did the same thing only with Letestu centering the 4th line and no Johnson.

I REALLY hope Tangradi is ready now so our PP can be:
[net]
Tangradi
---------Crosby
Letang GoGo Malkin

I agree with the GOGO comment, Id be talking to Dallas right now.



Also this gives us a logjam on D in the next few years. Which is good.
We can eventually trade guys like Bortozzo or Strait for forwards who are similirly ready, or Despres might make GoGo or Letang redundant in a few years.


Also-For people who think Godard should be waived for Cap Space look at what NYR and PHilly did. Were going to need him and hes going to earn his paycheck whether you like that part of hockey or not.
Agree with the Gogo/Bortuzzo/Strait/add Sneep thoughts. I'd be shopping Gogo for a similarly priced winger and consider one of the other guys for a similar prospect winger at this point. The top 4 of Martin, Michalek, Orpik, Letang all signed for at least 4 years, and Lovejoy, though unproven currently, a cheap contract for #6/7.

Those other guys are now valuable as trading pieces.

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Old
07-01-2010, 04:47 PM
  #109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fogel View Post
Next year will be a bit rough. Talbot, Dupuis, Godard, Rupp, Adams, kennedy come off, but only at $5.3M. The bottom guys might be able to be replaced at <1M, but we count Talbot and/or Dupuis as a top 6 so it will be a big year for forward prospects to fill in important roles.
Might be a good reason to stress developing some of these WBS players.

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Old
07-01-2010, 05:00 PM
  #110
jmelm
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Updated

Based on this line-up...

Kunitz-Crosby-Dupuis
Tangradi-Malkin-Johnson
Cooke-Staal-Kennedy
Rupp-Adams-Talbot
Godard

Martin-Michalek
Orpik-Letang
Goligoski-Lovejoy
Engelland D ($500K)


Total Cap Hit: $58,278,000

Cap Space: $1,122,000


IF the Pens get another winger, they will be replacing either Dupuis, Johnson or Tangradi in that line-up, so you can add their salary to the available cap space and figure out how much room we have to spend.

If they want to sign someone other than Engelland to play 7th D, that will change it, as well.


Last edited by jmelm: 07-01-2010 at 10:00 PM.
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Old
07-01-2010, 05:06 PM
  #111
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Quote:
"Now that Koivu is signed in Anaheim look for Kariya as a possibility...Kariya also rumored to NY Isles, Penguins, Preds"
- Eklund
Apparently we're in the running for Kariya.

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Old
07-01-2010, 05:13 PM
  #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmelm View Post
Based on this line-up...

Kunitz-Crosby-Dupuis
Tangradi-Malkin-Johnson
Cooke-Staal-Kennedy
Rupp-Adams-Talbot
Godard

Martin-Michalek
Orpik-Letang
Goligoski-Lovejoy
Engelland D ($500K)


Total Cap Hit: $58,428,000

Cap Space: $972,000


IF the Pens get another winger, they will be replacing either Dupuis, Johnson or Tangradi in that line-up, so you can add their salary to the available cap space and figure out how much room we have to spend.

If they want to sign someone other than Engelland to play 7th D, that will change it, as well.
You are slightly off on the salary a bit.

(13.825M) - Kunitz (3.725M) - Crosby (8.700M) - Dupuis (1.400M)
(10.046M) - Tangradi (0.846K) - Malkin - (8.700M) - Johnson (0.500K)
(06.525M) - Cooke (1.800M) - Staal - (4.000M) - Kennedy (0.725K)
(03.175M) - Rupp (0.825K) - Adams (0.550K) - Talbot (1.050M) / Godard (0.750K)


(09.000M) - Martin (5.000M) - Michalek (4.000M)
(07.250M) - Orpik (3.750M) - Letang (3.500M)
(02.833M) - Goligoski (1.833M) - Lovejoy (0.500K)/ Engelland (0.500K)

(33.571M) - Forwards
(19.083M) - Defense
(05.600M) - Goalies
(58.254M) - Cap Hit
(00.137K) - Bonuses
(01.009M) - Cap Space

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Old
07-01-2010, 05:17 PM
  #113
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I think Shero will move Dupuis if we're going to try for Kariya.

We'd just be too close to the cap if we didn't, and Shero loves to tweak at the Deadline.

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07-01-2010, 05:26 PM
  #114
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With all the blue-liners we have now, and signed long term, it may not be a bad idea to move a D prospect for a W prospect at this time. I'd be in favor of moving Brian Strait. Not sure who I'd target, to be honest. Oscar Moller? Michal Repik?

Strait is pretty redundant now, no?

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07-01-2010, 05:26 PM
  #115
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Looking through the UFA list at capgeek now that a bunch of names weeded out, and am intrigued by a name I never noticed before..

Sean Bergenheim

He was at $862,500 last year...around a similar salary, he could be Malkin's version of Kunitz? Penciling in Tangradi AND Johnson scares me. Granted, Bergenheim would not be any improvement offensively over Fedotenko, but he wouldn't be any worse, would be cheaper, and would actually contribute even when not scoring.

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Old
07-01-2010, 05:39 PM
  #116
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Originally Posted by Jag68Sid87 View Post
With all the blue-liners we have now, and signed long term, it may not be a bad idea to move a D prospect for a W prospect at this time. I'd be in favor of moving Brian Strait. Not sure who I'd target, to be honest. Oscar Moller? Michal Repik?

Strait is pretty redundant now, no?
Agreed. No chance we get Moller just for Strait. Repik? Eh, possibly but probably need to add something small.

I agree with the concept though. Now that we have all this defense, I would have no qualms about trading one of Strait, Sneep, Bortuzzo, maybe Samuelsson, hell even Despres or Gogo for the right return. But the first three before even considering dealing the fina two.

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Old
07-01-2010, 05:42 PM
  #117
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Yeah, I'd be willing to move Goligoski or Despres now if the return was right.

Yesterday, I'd have said no chance.

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07-01-2010, 05:58 PM
  #118
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I'd rather keep Despres and Bortuzzo. But I think we can look at moving any of the other three, or even Lovejoy.

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07-01-2010, 05:58 PM
  #119
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FORWARDS
Evgeni Malkin ($8.700m) / Sidney Crosby ($8.700m) / Eric Tangradi ($0.846m)
Chris Kunitz ($3.725m) / Jordan Staal ($4.000m) / Pascal Dupuis ($1.400m)
Tyler Kennedy ($0.725m) / Maxime Talbot ($1.050m) / Matt Cooke ($1.800m)
Eric Godard ($0.750m) / Michael Rupp ($0.825m) / Craig Adams ($0.550m)
* Chris Conner ($0.500m)
DEFENSEMEN
Paul Martin ($5.000m) / Zbynek Michalek ($4.000m)
Brooks Orpik ($3.750m) / Kristopher Letang ($3.500m)
Alex Goligoski ($1.833m) / Ben Lovejoy ($0.525m)
Simon Despres ($0.870m)
GOALTENDERS
Marc-Andre Fleury ($5.000m) / Brent Johnson ($0.600m)
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS
(these totals are compiled using the bonus cushion)
ROSTER: 22; CAP:$59.4m; PAYROLL: $58.649m; CAP ROOM: $0.888m BONUSES: $0.138m

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Old
07-01-2010, 06:08 PM
  #120
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bRODD View Post
FORWARDS
Evgeni Malkin ($8.700m) / Sidney Crosby ($8.700m) / Eric Tangradi ($0.846m)
Chris Kunitz ($3.725m) / Jordan Staal ($4.000m) / Pascal Dupuis ($1.400m)
Tyler Kennedy ($0.725m) / Maxime Talbot ($1.050m) / Matt Cooke ($1.800m)
Eric Godard ($0.750m) / Michael Rupp ($0.825m) / Craig Adams ($0.550m)
* Chris Conner ($0.500m)
DEFENSEMEN
Paul Martin ($5.000m) / Zbynek Michalek ($4.000m)
Brooks Orpik ($3.750m) / Kristopher Letang ($3.500m)
Alex Goligoski ($1.833m) / Ben Lovejoy ($0.525m)
Simon Despres ($0.870m)
GOALTENDERS
Marc-Andre Fleury ($5.000m) / Brent Johnson ($0.600m)
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS
(these totals are compiled using the bonus cushion)
ROSTER: 22; CAP:$59.4m; PAYROLL: $58.649m; CAP ROOM: $0.888m BONUSES: $0.138m
You have Kennedy and Cooke both on opposite wings, flip them. Letestu would be better in the L3 role as center than Talbot, Talbot can have L4 C/RW. And Conner would not be the 13th forward. Goddard would, and behind him Johnson. And if we do not bring in a UFA vet for the 7th Dman, Engelland will have that job. Not Despres.

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07-01-2010, 07:21 PM
  #121
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I'd say with Michalek and Martin signed long term, either Strait or Bortuzzo will be used as trade bait.

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07-01-2010, 08:00 PM
  #122
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JTG32005 View Post
I'd say with Michalek and Martin signed long term, either Strait or Bortuzzo will be used as trade bait.
Might be able to get more for Goligoski but that would mean two rookies on D. I wish no one had ever mentioned the possibility of trading for Jamie Benn (before the deadline) because now that I've watched him a bit, it makes my soul ache to know there's not much chance or reason for Dallas to trade him, but that would be worth considering. Do we play:

Martin - Michalek
Orpik - Lovejoy
Bortuzzo - Letang

so we can field

Benn - Sid - Dupuis
Kunitz - Malkin - Tangradi
?

Maybe throw in a 2011 4th for good measure if Dallas says it's not a fair swap?

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07-01-2010, 08:29 PM
  #123
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Martin and Michalek won't be on the same pairing. That isolates the defensive help, which was desperately needed.

The more I think about it, Michalek's stay-at-home style suits playing with Kris Letang very well.

Martin's situation is tougher to figure. He's so similarly good offensively and defensively, picking one player who could use his presence best is tough. You want a puck mover on each pairing, so I think he plays with either Lovejoy or Orpik. I consider Michalek and Orpik both good puck movers even though they aren't known for it, which is nice since it gives the Pens five of six defensemen with good transitional capabilities. I also don't want the two young guys (Gogo and Lovejoy) on the same pair, but putting Lovejoy with Martin gives him more icetime than he should probably have thrown at him as a rookie.

One of these two options is a good starting point:

Goligoski-Martin
Michalek-Letang
Orpik-Lovejoy

OR

Orpik-Martin
Goligoski-Michalek
Letang-Lovejoy

The team won't have a "top" pairing. They're all going to be pretty good, which I dig.

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Old
07-01-2010, 09:39 PM
  #124
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You're reducing Michalek's effectiveness by putting a righty on the left side. And our two softest defensemen together? I think if things stay the way they are on D, putting the two newcomers together makes sense because they can learn the new system together. Keep Orpik-Letang together and hope Goligoski-Lovejoy or Engelland can be effective enough with third-pairing minutes.

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Old
07-01-2010, 10:02 PM
  #125
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Goligoski is going no where unless Letang becomes a powerplay QB

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