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Michael Grabner, Steve Bernier, 25th Overall to FLA for Ballard, Oreskovich

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Old
06-25-2010, 10:55 PM
  #1001
BoHorvatFan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GCM View Post
I can't believe some of the uneducated comments coming in... Just unbelievable.

This was a good trade from both sides.

Bernier had negative value. Horrible season, dealing his is from a position of weakness.

Michael Grabner, although a great player, does not have a spot in the top 9 on our team, let alone top six. Shirokov, Schroeder and Hodgson are all above him, not to mention the rest of the depth we have with players like Rodin. He is an asset we have excess of.

The first rounder is being overrated. It's a first round pick, but a LATE first. There's nobody worth drafting for us. There's no stellar defenseman. Merill would've been a nice try, but we don't need a defensemen in 2-3 years, we need one now.

All that is traded for

Keith Ballard. A SIGNED defensemen for the next 5 years. A player that hasn't missed a game in the last 3 seasons. He's a good #2-#3 defenseman and at his age still has potential to get better, especially when playing on a team that is competitive unlike Florida in the past few seasons. He is also a hip-check machine, much needed toughness.

LOTS of teams were interested in Ballard.

Then we get Oreskovich. We all know we're a small team, so this is some size and grit for the 4th line. He's a throw in, but a nice one. Face it, Hordichuk and Rypien just aren't cutting it, we need to develop some more checkers with better skill. This is a step in the right direction, he can turn out to be a good role player.


All in all, this is Grabner & First for Ballard, with Bernier for Oreskovich.

If Byfuglien is worth a First and second/prospect then so is Ballard.


This trade was fair, the Canucks had to sweeten the pot to out-bid other teams.

Grabner's good and he will be a good top 6 forward for them, good for them. You have to trade something of value to obtain something of value. Stop being ridiculous.


Also Raymond > Grabner, for what it's worth.

Agree with everything you posted but where was Michael Grabner a great player?

It sure wasn't in the AHL, NHL, or in either of the past two training camps/preseasons.

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Old
06-25-2010, 10:55 PM
  #1002
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Awesomesauce View Post
Like I said people are massively overrating Ballard who is a mediocre defensmen.
And this statement from someone who clearly overrated the value of the 25th pick
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Originally Posted by Awesomesauce View Post
People keep talking about him like hes going to be this great pickup how he instantly makes us so much better - he doesn't. He will most likely turn out to be a dependable 3-4 guy for us.
A young, durable and dependable 3-4 D man does make us better
Quote:
Originally Posted by Awesomesauce View Post
what do you think Errhoff and Edler are going to want now? Errhoff at 6? Edler at close to that? Because comparatively that's what they deserve now.
Ballard's already signed. His deal could be used for comparative purposes in contract negotiations whether he was in Vancouver or not. The value of Erhoff and Edler will be determined by their individual performance. Besides, Edler is signed through the next THREE seasons.
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Originally Posted by Awesomesauce View Post
I really don't think people are thinking this trade through very well.
Yes, your posts are great example of that.

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06-25-2010, 10:55 PM
  #1003
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Next season's first - offer sheet?

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06-25-2010, 10:55 PM
  #1004
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Originally Posted by Tiranis View Post
Bernier was a cap dump so that has to be considered, clearly negative value there. Gives us extra room to deal, especially if Bieksa gets moved.
Switching pace a little, I'm hoping he uses that money to make an offer to Armstrong.

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06-25-2010, 10:56 PM
  #1005
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As of right now Canucks get the best player in the trade thus they won the trade. Bernier and Grabner are replaceable parts. Especially Bernier, people keep on forgetting he becomes extremely inconsistent and has negative value, he was essentially a salary dump.

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06-25-2010, 10:57 PM
  #1006
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Originally Posted by Wetcoaster View Post
So do you put Bernier trade into the failed category? He was one of the first Gillis moves tagged for Top Six duty - likely with the Sedins.

He cost a 3rd round selection in 2009 and a 2nd round selection in 2010.
I'd say so. But I'd also give credit to Gillies for recovering something useful from the failure.

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06-25-2010, 10:57 PM
  #1007
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Originally Posted by Lucbourdon View Post
wow that's still a damn lot, even with raymond @ 3m, we can get hamhuis for 4m easily
yeah sure, except that he won't sign for 4.

we can afford 5 if Bieksa is gone. Be really tight though.

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06-25-2010, 10:57 PM
  #1008
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We gave up our best scoring prospect and a first round pick for a guy who couldn't even be a decisive #1 D on a weak-nelly team like the Florida Panthers?

Seriously?

WTF?

 
Old
06-25-2010, 10:58 PM
  #1009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucbourdon View Post
wow that's still a damn lot, even with raymond @ 3m, we can get hamhuis for 4m easily
Keep in mind that's only a 17 player roster; so we'll need one more defenseman, and at least four more forwards...including the much coveted 3rd/4th line centre (Malhotra seems popular). So assuming Raymond takes us down to around $7 million in cap space we have that $7 million for 4 more players (1 D 3 O); so if Hamhuis takes up $4 million conservatively you would have $3 million for basically three forwards I would think; with a 22 man roster.

That being said, you waive Hordichuk and/or Alberts and trade Bieksa; you're absolutely singing.

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06-25-2010, 10:58 PM
  #1010
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The way i see it is this:

The canucks major issues to address this offseason was:

1) the blueline
2) the bottom 6 forwards

How do you address those issues? Well from a position of strength. The canucks position of strength is that they have a some good, smaller young forwards and in particular wingers. So that depth was used to address an issue.

at the same time with this acquisition and I expect another addition to the blueline, the likes of Bieksa, Alberts, and SOB can be moved to address the issue in point 2 above.

I'm a little confused why some people are upset at this trade because if Gillis continues to follow through he will have addressed the weaknesses that everybody had identified as holding the team back. And then we wait and see if the players he addressed the weaknesses with were evaluated properly.

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Old
06-25-2010, 10:58 PM
  #1011
GCM
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Originally Posted by HenrikSedinFan View Post
Agree with everything you posted but where was Michael Grabner a great player?

It sure wasn't in the AHL, NHL, or in either of the past two training camps/preseasons.
Thanks.

And I meant Grabner will be a great player. He's only 23, scores at the NHL level and has a lot of speed. I'd consider someone like that as a second line winger and I'd say that qualifies as great.

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06-25-2010, 11:00 PM
  #1012
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Perspective:

Jarrko Ruutu has out-scored Michael Grabner in both the AHL and NHL

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Old
06-25-2010, 11:00 PM
  #1013
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Originally Posted by Dado View Post
We gave up our best scoring prospect and a first round pick for a guy who couldn't even be a decisive #1 D on a weak-nelly team like the Florida Panthers?

Seriously?

WTF?
XFD "Best scoring prospect"?

This is a joke post right?

Hodgson and Schroeder have more upside in that department and Shirokov gives Grabby a run for his money.

Plus with the Sedins, Burrows, Samuelsson, Raymond, and Kesler do you really think we're hurting in the "goals for" category?

Didn't think so.


"goals against" however...

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06-25-2010, 11:00 PM
  #1014
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"Gillis pursuing picks in the second and/or third rounds"
http://twitter.com/BotchonCanucks/status/17062929000

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06-25-2010, 11:00 PM
  #1015
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BotchonCanucks
Gillis pursuing picks in the second and/or third rounds

I wonder by trading who?!?

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06-25-2010, 11:00 PM
  #1016
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Botchford just said they are going for 2nd and 3rd round picks

I think Bieksa has to be the bait

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Old
06-25-2010, 11:00 PM
  #1017
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BotchonCanucks - Gillis pursuing picks in the second and/or third rounds

No surprise. Should be an exciting day tomorrow.

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06-25-2010, 11:01 PM
  #1018
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I think this is overpayment by Gillis but it's not by much. It only goes to show the premium teams have to pay for top 4 defencemen. I hate giving up Grabner who was finally showing signs he can produce in the NHL, and I don't get people who say he was expendable because of Schroeder, Rodin, and Shirokov coming up. Yes, we have a ton of skilled wingers in the pipeline, but in the end this comes down to asset management. This trade was bad asset management no matter how you look at it. More had to come from Florida to even out this trade.

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Old
06-25-2010, 11:02 PM
  #1019
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dado View Post
We gave up our best scoring prospect and a first round pick for a guy who couldn't even be a decisive #1 D on a weak-nelly team like the Florida Panthers?

Seriously?

WTF?
We gave up Schroeder or Hodgson?

Well that is bad.

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Old
06-25-2010, 11:02 PM
  #1020
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GCM View Post
Thanks.

And I meant Grabner will be a great player. He's only 23, scores at the NHL level and has a lot of speed. I'd consider someone like that as a second line winger and I'd say that qualifies as great.
Well, I think it's a risky assumption to say he'll score at the NHL level. He's shown me some great moments, no doubt, but I really don't know if he can score consistently.

I think something that has not been mentioned thus far is that Gillis clearly is not high on Grabner. There's no way he could do this deal if he thought Grabner was as good as some of you claim. Plus, we have no room for Grabner next year.

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Old
06-25-2010, 11:02 PM
  #1021
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiranis View Post
What's he going to say? "Oh yeah, I totally wanted to be traded, hated that dump that they made me play in." What if he ever goes back in his career?
My post was more tongue-in-cheek than anything else.

Just wanted to post Ballard's initial reaction.

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Old
06-25-2010, 11:02 PM
  #1022
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CanucksOo View Post
BotchonCanucks
Gillis pursuing picks in the second and/or third rounds

I wonder by trading who?!?
Bieksa seems most obvious. Right now we have 5 defencemen making over $3 million dollars (Salo, Edler, Ehrhoff, Bieksa and Ballard). One of them's got to go.

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06-25-2010, 11:02 PM
  #1023
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A need was filled. Grabner, BernYAY and the 25th were not needs.

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Old
06-25-2010, 11:03 PM
  #1024
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Originally Posted by Meganuck View Post
Obviously Bernier isnt worth a 1st rounder, but trading for a guy whose salary wanted to be dumped should have been something like Bernier + 1st or Berner + Grabner. Not all 3.

Oreskevich is AHL/ECHL bound.
He played 50 NHL games for the Panthers last season and the Canucks need to replace Bernier's size - this guy does that.

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Old
06-25-2010, 11:03 PM
  #1025
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GCM View Post
Hodgson and Schroeder have more upside in that department and Shirokov gives Grabby a run for his money.
That's delusional. Shirokov actually made the the team out of training camp and failed miserably when the games started to matter. Hodgson has not only failed to make the team 2 years running, he now has what is likely a chronic injury situation.

Grabner has *actually* scored at the NHL level and *actually* showed something in games that matter.

We just gave away a first round pick and a top prospect for a second-rate defenseman. Is Gillis now that desperate, or has the past two years of "restocking the cupboard" yapping just been more of the same ******** we've gotten from pretty much every Canuck GM?

 
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