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Gretzky's 163 assists in 1985-86 Will Never Be Broken

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Old
07-28-2010, 11:47 AM
  #76
unknown33
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Sedin's Hart

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Originally Posted by BraveCanadian View Post
The funny thing is that you are comparing these guys to all time greats and they can't even separate themselves distinctly from Sedin.
Mindless point counting with the wrong assumption that assist are equally valuable as goal.

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Old
07-28-2010, 11:58 AM
  #77
Rhiessan71
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Originally Posted by unknown33 View Post
Mindless point counting with the wrong assumption that assist are equally valuable as goal.
I don't find it mindless.
Elite players should never have an issue separating themselves from non elite players.
If they can't, then they're simply not elite.

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07-28-2010, 04:34 PM
  #78
revolverjgw
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Originally Posted by BraveCanadian View Post

The funny thing is that you are comparing these guys to all time greats and they can't even separate themselves distinctly from Sedin.
That's like saying "Yzerman never separated himself from John Cullen, Mark Recchi, Tim Kerr, Jimmy Carson, Hakan Loob, Mike Bullard, Jeremy Roenick, Pierre Turgeon", all guys that had outscored or kept pace with him in different seasons during his early and prime years. Crosby has absolutely separated himself from Sedin, one anomalous season doesn't change that. Sedin had an INCREDIBLE year and has a synergy with his brother that the league has probably never seen two players have.

How does Sedin's last 5 years compare to Crosby's as a whole? What is Sedin's playoff resume and reputation like? Who regularly tops "best player in the league" lists? Who led the league in goals with Bill Guerin as their regular winger, who plays with Daniel Sedin (who's just as elite as Henrik)? Crosby is on another level than Sedin, and barring a big regression, he's well on the way to having a better career than Sakic or Yzerman. He's been way better than they were to this age, very clearly and decisively.

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Originally Posted by bravecanadian
Yes Crosby is only 22 and has accomplished an awful lot. Lets see how he does when he is on a team as poor as the mid-80s Detroit.

He has been fortunate to be an extremely talented player in ideal situations so far...
He scored 102 points as an 18 year old on a team where nobody else had more than 57. It took Yzerman 6 years to beat that in an era with way more scoring. It's safe to say Crosby would be smoking out the league no matter what team he plays on. There's only so far you can take the "but look at the teams!" argument. Crosby has left no doubt as to how great he is, in every possible environment with every possible variable. He scores at amazing paces on trash teams, he wins scoring titles with poor linemates, he leads good teams to Cups, he scores at the same pace in both the regular season and playoffs.


Last edited by revolverjgw: 07-28-2010 at 04:46 PM.
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Old
07-28-2010, 06:13 PM
  #79
Kyle McMahon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhiessan71 View Post
I don't find it mindless.
Elite players should never have an issue separating themselves from non elite players.
If they can't, then they're simply not elite.
You're acting like Yzerman was the clear and away best player in the league after Lemieux and Gretzky, which just wasn't the case. In Yzerman's highest scoring years he was still considered amongst guys like Messier, Neely, Lafontaine, Oates, Hull, etc. If Crosby does not fit your definition of elite, I fail to see how Yzerman would either.

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07-29-2010, 01:43 AM
  #80
shazariahl
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Quote:
Originally Posted by unknown33 View Post
Mindless point counting with the wrong assumption that assist are equally valuable as goal.
It's not mindless point counting when you consider that Sedin also won the Hart.

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