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Loving the forward depth right now

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Old
07-01-2010, 10:34 PM
  #26
JGRB
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Originally Posted by David_99 View Post
Someone posted this on Eklund, thought it was funny. Yes, Armstrong is paid to blindside, not to score. I know.

Colby Armstrong:
age: 27
6'2" 195lb
GP: 79 G: 15 A:14 Pts: 29
$3,000,000

Dustin Boyd
age: 23
6'0" 192lb
GP: 78 G: 11 A: 13 Pts: 24
$650,000


I never thought of it that way, but I love this signing more and more by the minute.

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Old
07-01-2010, 10:35 PM
  #27
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I was saying in the other thread that the top 6 is terribly weak and was called every name in the book. Habs can't expect to compete with so many question marks

1. Depth at the top 6....(hoping Andrei and Pouillot step up is quite risky). On top of that, what if Cam or Gionta or both get injured...no one can step up. Habs don't have the depth.

2. Defensive corps (not as big an issue as the top 6 but still, Habs D is old and slow....they consistently get pinned in their own zone).

3. Price has come off a tough year...will he rebound? Who knows.

How exactly are the Habs any better than last year?

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07-01-2010, 10:38 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by JayBee View Post
I was saying in the other thread that the top 6 is terribly weak and was called every name in the book. Habs can't expect to compete with so many question marks

1. Depth at the top 6....(hoping Andrei and Pouillot step up is quite risky). On top of that, what if Cam or Gionta or both get injured...no one can step up. Habs don't have the depth.

2. Defensive corps (not as big an issue as the top 6 but still, Habs D is old and slow....they consistently get pinned in their own zone).

3. Price has come off a tough year...will he rebound? Who knows.

How exactly are the Habs any better than last year?
What if Crosby & Malkin get injured? What if Backstrom & Ovechkin get injured? What if both Sedin twins get injured?

We had both those guys out at different times last season, and guess what? Other players did step up. Andrei Kostitsyn played his best hockey while Gionta was out. Pouliot played good hockey while Cammalleri was out. We now have Lars Eller who is another player who can potentially fill a void, even Boyd was a pretty good offensive producer at the AHL/WHL level so with the right line mates I expect he can elevate his game at short runs.

Stop worrying about it.

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07-01-2010, 10:48 PM
  #29
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I still think we need another good fooward with some size (45-50pts), and the way I see it, Raffi Torres is the easy solution right now for me.

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07-01-2010, 10:48 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Hugh Ellerection View Post
What if Crosby & Malkin get injured? What if Backstrom & Ovechkin get injured? What if both Sedin twins get injured?

We had both those guys out at different times last season, and guess what? Other players did step up. Andrei Kostitsyn played his best hockey while Gionta was out. Pouliot played good hockey while Cammalleri was out. We now have Lars Eller who is another player who can potentially fill a void, even Boyd was a pretty good offensive producer at the AHL/WHL level so with the right line mates I expect he can elevate his game at short runs.

Stop worrying about it.
I'm not going to even bother replying.... "hey lets rely on unproven players to step up" I admire your enthusiasm, but even with everyone healthy, this team will struggle to make the playoffs. Add injuries to key players in the top 6 and the Habs are a bottom feeding team.

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07-01-2010, 10:58 PM
  #31
Melvin Udall
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Originally Posted by JayBee View Post
I was saying in the other thread that the top 6 is terribly weak and was called every name in the book. Habs can't expect to compete with so many question marks

1. Depth at the top 6....(hoping Andrei and Pouillot step up is quite risky). On top of that, what if Cam or Gionta or both get injured...no one can step up. Habs don't have the depth.

2. Defensive corps (not as big an issue as the top 6 but still, Habs D is old and slow....they consistently get pinned in their own zone).

3. Price has come off a tough year...will he rebound? Who knows.

How exactly are the Habs any better than last year?
Clearly, unless some players play well above expectations based upon previous levels
of performance, the Habs appear no better than last year when they scored THE lowest number
of goals 5-on-5 in the entire NHL!

Can they continue to benefit from the PP?

Can Price carry the goaltending load (no pun intended).

Coming out of the 2010 playoffs the Habs had (only) two young players to build around for their future...........Subban and Halak - and they trade Halak.....WOW - that's a tough one to understand!

Eller may turn out to be a good player - but how much can he contibute in 2010 -2011?




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Old
07-01-2010, 11:00 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JayBee View Post
I'm not going to even bother replying.... "hey lets rely on unproven players to step up" I admire your enthusiasm, but even with everyone healthy, this team will struggle to make the playoffs. Add injuries to key players in the top 6 and the Habs are a bottom feeding team.
Then again, if the youth explodes like in 2008, this team is Conference Champion material.

Pacioretty, Subban, Eller, even Weber, Pyatt and Maxwell/White, if two of them break the big leagues hard, we'll be in business.

Just gotta hope Markov stays healthy.

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Old
07-01-2010, 11:17 PM
  #33
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I like the lineup, i prefer a bunch of young wolves who all want to prove they are nhl caliber, then old washed up players almost ready for retirement.

The Plekanec-Cammy-A Kost line was one of the top in the league last year for a while and it's still considered the second line.

Name me three second lines in the nhl who have got a potentiel 30 and 40 goal scorer and a 70 points center. Not much.

If you name Gomez gionta pouliot as the second line the question is the same a 25, 30 goals and 65 points. (I talk about potential here Gionta could net 35 and gomez have 70 points)

I think we have got two second lines but they are the best second lines in the nhl.



Some people have forgotten that last year it was only in the playoff that the habs had a 100 % healthy team. We always had a guy injured Markov, Gomez ,Gionta, Cammalleri name it. And where did this healthy team go in the playoff? Yeah ECF.

I think the key to have little or great success next year is in the hand of Andrei Kostitsyn.

Like Bob Gainey said last year, i will say it again this year Could this team miss the playoffs? Who Knows? Could this team win the stanley cup? Who Knows? Let's just get together and play.

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Old
07-01-2010, 11:20 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by Dharvey33 View Post
I like the lineup, i prefer a bunch of young wolves who all want to prove they are nhl caliber, then old washed up players almost ready for retirement.

.
Something in between A and Z isn't possible?

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Old
07-01-2010, 11:24 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by #57 View Post
TOP-6 FORWARDS PAID TO PRODUCE:
Mike Cammalleri
Brian Gionta
Scott Gomez
Tomas Plekanec
Andrei Kostitsyn

WILDCARD OFFENSIVE GUYS:
Benoit Pouliot
Lars Eller
Max Pacioretty

CHECKING LINE PLAYERS:
Travis Moen
Maxim Lapierre
Tom Pyatt
Mathieu Darche
Ryan White
Dustin Boyd (could also put up some points)

NHL-READY OUT OF HAMILTON:
Ben Maxwell
Brock Trotter
David Desharnais
Aaron Palushaj
Let's compare this with the team that was stronger in the playoffs :

PHILADELPHIA

TOP-6 FORWARDS PAID TO PRODUCE
Mike Richards
Jeff Carter
Daniel Brière
Simon Gagné
Claude Giroux
Scott Hartnell
Ville Leino

WILDCARD OFFENSIVE GUYS
James Van Riemsdyk

CHECKING LINE PLAYERS
Dan Carcillo
Ian Laperrière
Jody Shelley
Blair Betts
Darroll Powe
Riley Cote

NHL-READY OUT OF AHL
Patrick Maroon
David Laliberté
Andreas Nodl
Stefan Legein

I think the Flyers still have much more depth. Their offensive guys are more talented, their wildcard has more potential, and their bottom 6 is much tougher to play against.

In the end, we still have to rely on only 4 guys for a steady offensive contribution (Cammy, Gionta, Plek and Gomez). We'll have to cross our fingers for the others to produce, and hope that our goalie can do miracles again.

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Old
07-01-2010, 11:26 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by 1UP View Post
Then again, if the youth explodes like in 2008, this team is Conference Champion material.

Pacioretty, Subban, Eller, even Weber, Pyatt and Maxwell/White, if two of them break the big leagues hard, we'll be in business.

Just gotta hope Markov stays healthy.
LOL, that's a BIG "if". Lets be real here, Habs haven't had just 1 breakout season from an unproven player in YEARS....maybe Ryder and Higgins....that's all I can think of. What makes you think even half of our youth will break out?

I feel uneasy relying on Pouillot as a top 6 player. I'd like him better on the 3rd line. Habs need a proven top 6'er who can pot at least 25 goals consistently.

We'll see what happens but if Gauthier keeps the team as is...I really see them struggling.

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Old
07-01-2010, 11:49 PM
  #37
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I personally like the additions of Lars Eller and Dustin Boyd. Both are young and versatile two-way hockey players, can play Centre or Wing. They have untapped offensive potential and can be placed on the top 2 lines when needed to be. This puts an end to those Mathieu Darche and Travis Moen experiments on Gomez's or Plekanec's line.

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Old
07-02-2010, 12:07 AM
  #38
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I like the addition of Boyd. He was a wildcard in my mind and I'm happy to know he finally got to sign an offer the Habs threw to him. Fortunately, it's for even less than I anticipated.

Still...


2010-11 NHL Salary Cap Calculator
2010-11 MONTREAL CANADIENS
CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR
FORWARDS
Benoit Pouliot ($1.350m) / Scott Gomez ($7.357m) / Brian Gionta ($5.000m)
Mike Cammalleri ($6.000m) / Tomas Plekanec ($5.000m) / Andrei Kostitsyn ($3.250m)
Travis Moen ($1.500m) / Lars Eller ($1.271m) / Dustin Boyd ($0.650m)
Mathieu Darche ($0.500m) / Tom Pyatt ($0.500m) / * Maxim Lapierre ($0.800m)
DEFENSEMEN
Andrei Markov ($5.750m) / Jaroslav Spacek ($3.833m)
Roman Hamrlik ($5.500m) / P.K. Subban ($0.875m)
Hal Gill ($2.250m) / Josh Gorges ($1.100m)
Ryan O\'Byrne ($0.942m)
GOALTENDERS
* Carey Price ($1.750m) / Alex Auld ($1.000m)
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS
(these totals are compiled using the bonus cushion)
ROSTER: 21; CAP:$59.4m; PAYROLL: $56.678m; CAP ROOM: $3.147m BONUSES: $0.425m

I can't believe we can't somehow add another guy with this cap space to help our secondary scoring. Boyd is already some skills for Eller to work with. Add them Torres, who won't command all that much, and they'd be a great 3rd line.

One minor 2,500,000 signing can make all the difference in the world here.

One more thing. You might wait until Pacioretty scores his 10th AHL career goal to call him a potential offensive player as soon as this season.


Last edited by TankEller*: 07-02-2010 at 12:18 AM.
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Old
07-02-2010, 12:28 AM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by #57 View Post
TOP-6 FORWARDS PAID TO PRODUCE:
Mike Cammalleri
Brian Gionta
Scott Gomez
Tomas Plekanec
Andrei Kostitsyn

WILDCARD OFFENSIVE GUYS:
Benoit Pouliot
Lars Eller
Max Pacioretty

CHECKING LINE PLAYERS:
Travis Moen
Maxim Lapierre
Tom Pyatt
Mathieu Darche
Ryan White
Dustin Boyd (could also put up some points)

NHL-READY OUT OF HAMILTON:
Ben Maxwell
Brock Trotter
David Desharnais
Aaron Palushaj

Except for the fact that we don't have any *real* superstar, this forward group is extremely solid.

Any surprises in camp?
I could see White really pushing Lapierre for a roster spot out of camp... we'll see what happens with MaxL, he played pretty well in the playoffs after a dismal season, but if he didn't go into the off-season determined to get better/thinking he has a spot locked up, I could see him quickly on the outside looking in thanks to Eller/Boyd/White... not too mention what Desharnais/Palushaj/Trotter/Maxwell will show in camp.

in that sense, I think we have great NHL-ready depth players... which is good to have, but unfortunately none of those guys are really top-6 material, or ready for it (save Eller), and if they are destined to be bottom-6 role players, i think even in that role they are probably a few years away from being as reliable as the grizzled vets (like moen/metroplolit/moore).

it's like we have a bunch of Moore/Metropolits, guys with top-6 skill sets not quite good enough for the top-6, but who will need more seasoning before being effective bottom 6 players (that's how i see Boyd, Desharnais, Trotter, Palushaj, Maxwell... maybe MaxPac (still hoping for more from him)

up front (top 6), if Cammalleri really did have a "breakthrough" experience in the playoffs, and comes into the season with the confidence/attitude/work ethic to be a 50 goal scorer, then we are in a pretty good spot.

Gionta is good for 25+,
Plekanec will continue to get better (not necessarily much more production, but I don't see him regressing at all, solid for 65-75pts barring injury)
Gomez is what he is... a 50-60pt guy, solid/very good as a #2 centre (too bad he's paid among the best #1's, but so be it)

A.Kost is the constant egnigma... with his brother gone, so goes his last excuse. either he steps up and plays consistent hockey (which would mean 25+ goals), or he continues to frustrate us all and ends up traded or benched the way Ryder was in his last year here.

Pouliot has 30+ goal potential in him if he shows up ready to go, which I think he will.

so all in all, our top 6 looks pretty solid.
Cammalleri/A.Kost/Pouliot, those are the 3 wild cards imo. If 1-2 of them have "play to their potential" type seasons, we could easily be a top half of the league team in goals scored. If all 3 do it, we should be in the upper echelon of the league...
if none of them do, b/c of poor performance of injury, than we will be back where we were this year, a brutal team 5 on 5 that still probably does well on the pp.

our bottom six will be solid, if unspectacular. but i don't think we can rely on them for much secondary scoring, unless Eller proves to be a gem, and develops some chemistry with whomever he ends up playing with.

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Old
07-02-2010, 12:36 AM
  #40
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I think there will be lots of people to agree with the sandpaper comment including me but I think it's also pretty obvious this is not what Martin and co. are all about. They want speed, intelligence and a high compete level. They're not looking to build a team with an intimidating presence or guys to dominate down low.

For better or worse, this is what we'll be seeing this year. Lots of speedy and smart players playing a fast up tempo but conservative defense first style. As such their logic was respected, they weeded out the last square peg round hole type of players we had like Laraque and now they're ready to give those spots to guys who will create a more homogeneous group.

We'll see how that turns out.
The other thing that the Habs sorely lack is a big body that can stand in front of the net effectively. I know Gionta will do it, but someone has to cause the opposing goaltender some trouble seeing the puck. Not sure if Pouliot could be that guy, or if AK46 can do it game in, game out...but when their PP went south in the playoffs, having a big body in front of the net would have helped.

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07-02-2010, 12:39 AM
  #41
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I hope Trotter get a shot at making the NHL. Guy Boucher had very good words for him at the end of the season|playoffs.
he is too soft for the NHL, our lineup is small enough as it is, adding him as a top 6 piece in the playoffs would spell doom.

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Old
07-02-2010, 12:41 AM
  #42
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Aside from O'Byrne and Moen, this lineup still lacks muscle. I see Gauthier waiting at the waiver deadline to add some beef or possibly picking up Todd Fedoruk. Andy Sutton would be a nice addition, but I suspect that he would be too expensive.

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07-02-2010, 01:04 AM
  #43
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Aside from O'Byrne and Moen, this lineup still lacks muscle. I see Gauthier waiting at the waiver deadline to add some beef or possibly picking up Todd Fedoruk. Andy Sutton would be a nice addition, but I suspect that he would be too expensive.
Sutton is the type of guy you pick up at the deadline. He's too slow and probably too expensive.

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07-02-2010, 01:12 AM
  #44
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Is it possible now to make an offer sheet to any RFAs..say a certain James Neal? From what I remember, David Perron, Erik Johnson, James Neal, Bobby Ryan, and Marc Staal did not sign with their respective team yet. I would really like the addition of James Neal with us..it would bring our top 6 to another level. How much would it cost to take him away from Dallas? 5 - 6 M$?

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07-02-2010, 01:30 AM
  #45
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Not saying that I would put them together as of game 1 but i wonder if for the 3rd line if we looking for duos (Gomez& Gionta ..... Plekanec & Cammalleri) I wonder if Lars Eller & Aaron Palushaj might make a duo into the season seeing both came out of the St Louis Organization.

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07-02-2010, 02:10 AM
  #46
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Originally Posted by JayBee View Post
LOL, that's a BIG "if". Lets be real here, Habs haven't had just 1 breakout season from an unproven player in YEARS....maybe Ryder and Higgins....that's all I can think of. What makes you think even half of our youth will break out?

I feel uneasy relying on Pouillot as a top 6 player. I'd like him better on the 3rd line. Habs need a proven top 6'er who can pot at least 25 goals consistently.

We'll see what happens but if Gauthier keeps the team as is...I really see them struggling.
The new NHL is all about young (read: cheap) guys giving you production. You have to give guys like Boyd, Eller, Pouliot a chance. Otherwise you spend 2.5-3 mil per year on guys like Malhotra and Armstrong. Yuck.

You want money to go after a couple top tier UFA's next year? Then you can't sign/trade for mediore longterm crap this year. Our young guys are freerolls. If one of them pans out into a 20 goal scorer, we just saved 3 mil. If not, we can always make some deals during the season.

This team IS better then last year, simply because:

1) They've all been together for a whole year now, and have chemistry together.
2) They've weeded out the poor work ethic guys. Everyone who's still here works hard. (We'll see on Andrei I guess.)
3) Our young guys are a year older, and that much closer to being NHL producers. (You know, the Sedin's started as 30 pts. forwards for 3 straight years. You have to grow your youth slowly, and by giving them experience.)
4) We have more/better quality depth then last year.

Is it Stanley Cup winning quality? No, its not. Is it better? Yes. And hey, lots of 'not SC winning quality' teams have, you know, WON THE STANLEY CUP. Its why we play the games???

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Old
07-02-2010, 09:56 AM
  #47
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How exactly are the Habs any better than last year?
Last season started with players wearing "HELLO, my name is ..." name tags at practice. This year the team starts off as a cohesive unit with chemisty who made it to the conference finals. Add in a couple of depth pieces and this team starts off better than last season. As for goaltending, it also starts off the same, Price is the man.

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07-02-2010, 10:11 AM
  #48
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way to many wild cards there that is for sure.

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