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Philadelphia's Official 2004 Draft Thread (now with draft order on post #2)

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Old
05-31-2004, 08:02 AM
  #26
GKJ
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Quote:
Originally Posted by King Fish
I disagree. I think Handzus is our best trade bait. He is in his prime (27-30) and is at best a 20 goal scorer. I am thinking of the future, we'll get nothing for LeClair, Recchi, Amonte etc... and we need a good LW prospect. I say sign Zhamnov and Primeau as our top two vet centers and get the kids in. Eager could be a good third line LW, at best second line and he is our best prospect at that position. I honestly don't us getting more than a late first round pick if that for Zeus, but we need to build on Carter and Richards.

That's why there is a draft. And Handzus isn't going to get a good LW prospect that will be good enough in time to make the team. Handzus would be better served to play LW himself. Trade Handzus is absurd and out of the question, and I seriously question Clarke's ability to be a solid GM if he trades him unless we win the trade...easily.


And If we 'needed' and LW prospect so bad, maybe we shouldn't have traded all of our 1st and 2nd round picks.

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05-31-2004, 08:45 AM
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by King Fish
I disagree. I think Handzus is our best trade bait. He is in his prime (27-30) and is at best a 20 goal scorer. I am thinking of the future, we'll get nothing for LeClair, Recchi, Amonte etc... and we need a good LW prospect. I say sign Zhamnov and Primeau as our top two vet centers and get the kids in. Eager could be a good third line LW, at best second line and he is our best prospect at that position. I honestly don't us getting more than a late first round pick if that for Zeus, but we need to build on Carter and Richards.
You are making quite a few assumptions here though.

First, that Carter and Richards will make the club and stay here. Clarke has unearthed some first round gems like Gagne and Williams, but that's no guarentee that they will stick. Both are prospects, and could just as easially turn into Ryan Sittler or Darren Rumble.

Second, that we could get proper value for Handzus. I highly doubt that we'll be able to get what he's worth. Short of trading him for another Joni Pitkanen (draft wise) I don't see this happening.

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05-31-2004, 10:30 AM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by go kim johnsson
Why are we moving Handzus to make room for the future. If anything, Handzus is part of it, and Zhamnov, LeClair and Amonte are not.


John LeClair has been too slow for years, and he managed to stay around. In 3 years Handzus will be a 25 goal possibly 50 point player and John LeClair will be toiling around on someone's sinking ship.
Do u think any one would be interested in a deal involving Zhamnov, Leclair, and Amonte. lol i mean we could pick up a mid to late first round pick for that. But i think it might be to much to give up

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05-31-2004, 12:28 PM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by go kim johnsson
That's why there is a draft. And Handzus isn't going to get a good LW prospect that will be good enough in time to make the team. Handzus would be better served to play LW himself. Trade Handzus is absurd and out of the question, and I seriously question Clarke's ability to be a solid GM if he trades him unless we win the trade...easily.


And If we 'needed' and LW prospect so bad, maybe we shouldn't have traded all of our 1st and 2nd round picks.
I'm not concerned if the pick we got for Zues makes the team next year, we just need a good prospect (mid-late 1st round). We are loaded up at center and Zues could fetch the best return. I think Carter will make the team out of camp and force a move if Zues is not moved on draft day. We need to retool this team and keep a couple of vets for leadership or scoring, Handzus provides neither IMO. I can't wait for next year!

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06-01-2004, 08:38 PM
  #30
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Well, the Anaheim Mighty Sucks () didn't sign Tim Brent. For those who don't know, Tim Brent was on Canada's WJC team, and was an Alternate Captain. I don't know if our 3rd round pick will be high enough to get him, but he is the guy I want.

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06-01-2004, 08:55 PM
  #31
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That decision will come back to haunt the Ducks.... there will be a ton of interest in him, but I'd love to see him in a Flyers jersey!

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06-02-2004, 07:14 AM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by go kim johnsson
Well, the Anaheim Mighty Sucks () didn't sign Tim Brent. For those who don't know, Tim Brent was on Canada's WJC team, and was an Alternate Captain. I don't know if our 3rd round pick will be high enough to get him, but he is the guy I want.
Uh?? That's really surprising! He is a good prospect though.
He can be a good fit in Philly only if he can play wing because he is listed as a centerman.

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06-02-2004, 07:25 AM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by King Fish
We need to retool this team and keep a couple of vets for leadership or scoring, Handzus provides neither IMO. I can't wait for next year!
You're clearly are not watching this team because without Michal Handzus, Keith Primeau isn't the shutdown center. And now we're moving around other guys to be the checking line. Next thing you know Brashear, Sharp and Radivojevic is your 3rd line, and we're not past the Maple Leafs. There have been quite a few times while he has been with the Flyers that Michal Handzus scored some big goals. Handzus is not only a vital part of the team he is a vital part of the future and Zhamnov, LeClair, Roenick and Amonte are not, and Keith Primeau before long will only be good at being the shutdown center and not to score.


To trade Michal Handzus at this time is not only stupid it is insane and absurd.

But say we do, and Carter/Richards prove that they can't handle playing the vital role Michal Handzus does. One of those guys has to score 25 goals and 50 points for this team to be successful next year, and that is not happening.

Meanwhile, Tim Brent is the top prospect winger you're looking for and can be had at most, moving around some draft picks, and is ready to play next year.

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Old
06-03-2004, 11:28 AM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by King Fish
I'm not concerned if the pick we got for Zues makes the team next year, we just need a good prospect (mid-late 1st round). We are loaded up at center and Zues could fetch the best return. I think Carter will make the team out of camp and force a move if Zues is not moved on draft day. We need to retool this team and keep a couple of vets for leadership or scoring, Handzus provides neither IMO. I can't wait for next year!
so say we trade Zues, and lets just say Carter and or Richards prove to be not ready for the NHL yet. and lets just speculate further that JR retires( i dont think he will but like i said its just speculation) and ok we sign Zhamnov. so we would have Primeau and Zhamnov at center. so who plays center after that? Patrick Sharp? not sure if hes even ready to be a top 9 guy yet.
as GKJ said earlier having Hanzus puts Primeau on the 3rd line where he is most effective.

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06-03-2004, 12:24 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by daynus
so what you you guys/gals anticipate for a breakdown.:
I'm guessing 2 dmen,1 wingers and 2 goalies. The remaining picks will be traded so Bobby can hit the green a little earlier.

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Old
06-03-2004, 02:42 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by go kim johnsson
To trade Michal Handzus at this time is not only stupid it is insane and absurd.
Sums it up perfectly.

Handzus is a keeper. The only way he gets moved is if it's for somebody younger, who has already established themselves in the NHL. Trading him for draft picks and/or unproven prospects would border on lunacy.

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06-03-2004, 05:54 PM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toonces
Sums it up perfectly.

Handzus is a keeper. The only way he gets moved is if it's for somebody younger, who has already established themselves in the NHL. Trading him for draft picks and/or unproven prospects would border on lunacy.
I hear what you are saying but would you trade him + a pick or whatever to move up target a top LW prospect like Ladd? I guess we would have to move up to 5 or 8 to get him.

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06-08-2004, 01:21 PM
  #38
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I don't care what players we come out of the draft with this year, but I expect Clarke to do a number of things:

1. Look to move a marginal roster player and picks to move up to the 1st round, if they can get somebody they really like.

2. Trade round 7, 8, and 9 picks for 5, 6, and 7 round picks next year.

3. Look at drafting players who re-opted into the draft after having not been signed. A guy that he thinks might be closer to helping in the NHL.

4. Draft some overage overseas players like Razin or Cechmanek, to fill holes on next years team. We have taken players like this before and had them help us the next year. Some helped more than others (Cechmanek helped, Dopita didn't) but I still think you will see Clarke move for at least 1 guy like this.

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Old
06-08-2004, 03:29 PM
  #39
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how about blake wheeler? if he's still around in the 3rd round i think we should consider drafting him. we need some wingers!!

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06-11-2004, 08:08 AM
  #40
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Look for Clarke to do a major over haul on this team. Amonte, LeClair, Burke bought out and gone. Recchi and Zhamnov come back only at a reasonable price. Brashear for all of his "toughness" was a high maintenance (DUI issues) waste of time and money. New faces could be Drozdetsky, Eager and Ruzicka(sp?). In fact, the makeup of the roster may surprise a lot of people. If the run for the cup t his year taught anything it is that older guys break down. The best thing that happened to Primeau was getting his bell rung so that he was fresh for the playoffs. This has to make Hitchcock take another view of the way that they approach the regular season. Its tough to not be in first place in Philly during the season but I think that the fans would acept that if they saw that the new faces were progressing for a good playoff run.

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06-11-2004, 09:08 AM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by go kim johnsson
You're clearly are not watching this team because without Michal Handzus, Keith Primeau isn't the shutdown center. And now we're moving around other guys to be the checking line. Next thing you know Brashear, Sharp and Radivojevic is your 3rd line, and we're not past the Maple Leafs. There have been quite a few times while he has been with the Flyers that Michal Handzus scored some big goals. Handzus is not only a vital part of the team he is a vital part of the future and Zhamnov, LeClair, Roenick and Amonte are not, and Keith Primeau before long will only be good at being the shutdown center and not to score.
Umm, wrong. Keith can still be the shutdown centerman. Remember we essentially have two number one centermans in Roenick and Zhamnov. Why not resign Zhamnov and package Handzus in a deal to get some depth on the wings? We do have Carter and Richards as centers, so it's not like we're out with regards to centermen.


Quote:
Originally Posted by go kim johnsson
To trade Michal Handzus at this time is not only stupid it is insane and absurd.
The fact that our window of opportunity has come and gone to win the cup, dealing Handzus and restocking the roster isn't a bad move at all. Let's face it, nobody wants Johnny L., Tony A., or Eric D. Handzus could fetch quite a return. I mean, he'd be a perfect fit in Florida and you know Iron Mike is probably shopping their pick like mad. It may be a weak draft this year, but the top 10 doesn't look too bad at all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by go kim johnsson
But say we do, and Carter/Richards prove that they can't handle playing the vital role Michal Handzus does. One of those guys has to score 25 goals and 50 points for this team to be successful next year, and that is not happening.
You say it's not going to happen. It might. Both guys have the talent to do so. However, what you're also forgetting is that Patrick Sharp is more than capable. He's proved he can put the puck in the net in College and in the A, so why not give him a chance here? It's amazing what players can do when they get a chance. The problem in Philadelphia isn't the young players. It's a coach who doesn't want to give opportunities to young players to succeed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by go kim johnsson
Meanwhile, Tim Brent is the top prospect winger you're looking for and can be had at most, moving around some draft picks, and is ready to play next year.
Tim Brent will probably be taken late first, early second. It's bad enough we foolishly blew all our second round picks this year. It's bad enough we blew our 1st round pick this year. It's bad enough we blew our second round pick next year. Tell you what. If Handzus fetches a 1st this year and second next year (Daymond Langkow anyone?) I would be more than ecstatic. Truth of the matter is that the window of opportunity for this team to win the Stanley Cup officially closed this year. It's time to start fresh and get a serious infusion of youth into the lineup. To be honest, I'd say buy out Roenick, let Zhamnov walk, keep Primeau, deal Handzus, let go of Fridge, buy out Amonte and Leclair and deal Desjardins and let Ruzicka, Eager, Sharp, Carter, Richards, and Seidenberg all get spots on the team. Let them learn together. Let them develop chemistry together. Let them play. Let them make a mistake and not be afraid that they won't play again for two or three games. Like I said, our window of opportunity closed. We all need to wake up and realize this. It's not rocket science. Let the youngsters step in and play. Do I like the thought of dealing Handzus? No, not particularly. However, if the return is great, then do it.

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Old
06-13-2004, 08:15 AM
  #42
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So not only did we foolishly blow our 2nd round picks (one of them got us Zhamnov). You want to re-sign Zhamnov TO dump Handzus, but trade Handzus because this team's time has passed. If it has passed, that's all the more reason to dump Roenick, Primeau and Zhamnov and make Handzus the first line center. Your post made a whole lot of no sense. Handzus is the one guy whose job should be safe, and would be terrible asset management if he's the one to go.

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06-13-2004, 08:20 AM
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyman
Uh?? That's really surprising! He is a good prospect though.
He can be a good fit in Philly only if he can play wing because he is listed as a centerman.
He was a wing at the WJC's and he was one of their best forwards.

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06-13-2004, 10:53 AM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pontifex Maximus
Just got my Hockey News Draft Issue. Looks very weak. We don't pick until the 3rd round but supposedly guys they have listed in the first round could be available then. Here are some guys I like:

Lauri Korpikoski (22)
Petteri Nokelainen (25)
Bruce Graham (30)
Zdenek Bahensky (39)
Juraj Gracik (45)
Viktor Alexandrov (47)
Aki Seitsonen (53)
Ryan Garlock (55)

All forwards, because that is what we need.
Are we allowed to be homers when it comes to the draft? If so I'd love the Flyers to draft Garlock, being a Windsor Spitfire. He seems to be projected as a 2nd rounder though so I'm not sure if he'll still be around when the Flyers pick. My other option would be Mitch Maunu, he's a defenseman who should go in the 4th round.

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06-14-2004, 06:43 PM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by go kim johnsson
So not only did we foolishly blow our 2nd round picks (one of them got us Zhamnov). You want to re-sign Zhamnov TO dump Handzus, but trade Handzus because this team's time has passed. If it has passed, that's all the more reason to dump Roenick, Primeau and Zhamnov and make Handzus the first line center. Your post made a whole lot of no sense. Handzus is the one guy whose job should be safe, and would be terrible asset management if he's the one to go.
We can get more for Zues than Zhamnov, that's why you trade him! We have past our prime and Zues is not one to build a team around. Sorry, I'm just not a fan of slow canters who can only play defense. As a 2/3 center with the ammount of ice time he got he should put up more points especially when Primeau is playing the part of shut down center!

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Old
06-15-2004, 01:33 PM
  #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by go kim johnsson
If anything, Handzus is part of it
I think that the Philly article where Clarke is saying they are going to lock up some of their core would agree with your statement.

Quote:
Clarke also said the Flyers have been talking with some of the players who form the core of their young talent to get them signed, including left wingers Simon Gagne and Todd Fedoruk, center Michal Handzus, right winger Branko Radivojevic, and defenseman Kim Johnsson.

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06-16-2004, 04:06 PM
  #47
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I thought we had Washington's 7th for Yushkevich, but I guess it was conditional.

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06-16-2004, 11:39 PM
  #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iceman42
I think that the Philly article where Clarke is saying they are going to lock up some of their core would agree with your statement.
Fedoruk and young tallent do not belong together!
I guess I disagree with Clarke about Zues.

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Old
06-17-2004, 07:25 PM
  #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pontifex Maximus

I thought we had Washington's 7th for Yushkevich, but I guess it was conditional.
It went in a trade. I don't remember if it was Zhamnov or Timmander.

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Old
06-17-2004, 07:44 PM
  #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fully spectrumed
It went in a trade. I don't remember if it was Zhamnov or Timmander.

It was Timander

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