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Old
07-13-2010, 01:36 PM
  #1
nyr2417
 
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nyr-chi (hossa)

Hawks need to clear some cap space I could see them trading hossa...

to nyr: Hossa

to chi: Callahan, Grachev, 2011 1st.

Chicago saves about 3 mill on the cap this season and gets a heart and soul player in callahan who could be a vital asset to another cup run (yes I know hossa is too). They get a top 20 prospect in grachev who projects to be a monster power forward. and a 1st round pick. The value may not exactly be perfect but the reality of the situation is the hawks can't take on any salary so prospects and picks are really the only thing that would interest them. Also, some teams may not be willing to take on a long deal such as hossa's so that can drop his value.

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07-13-2010, 01:39 PM
  #2
Panfork
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nyr2417 View Post
Hawks need to clear some cap space I could see them trading hossa...

to nyr: Hossa

to chi: Callahan, Grachev, 2011 1st.

Chicago saves about 3 mill on the cap this season and gets a heart and soul player in callahan who could be a vital asset to another cup run (yes I know hossa is too). They get a top 20 prospect in grachev who projects to be a monster power forward. and a 1st round pick. The value may not exactly be perfect but the reality of the situation is the hawks can't take on any salary so prospects and picks are really the only thing that would interest them. Also, some teams may not be willing to take on a long deal such as hossa's so that can drop his value.
Too much value going to Hossa between Grachev and the 1st imo, but also take into account that Callahan is part of Slats' "hang up crew", and Grachev has a high ceiling right now, it's just unknown whether or not he's going to reach it.

Not to mention our 1st next season could potentially be a Top 5 pick.


Some good thoughts thrown in here, but I think Sather hangs up the phone on this one.

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07-13-2010, 01:40 PM
  #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nyr2417 View Post
Hawks need to clear some cap space I could see them trading hossa...

to nyr: Hossa

to chi: Callahan, Grachev, 2011 1st.

Chicago saves about 3 mill on the cap this season and gets a heart and soul player in callahan who could be a vital asset to another cup run (yes I know hossa is too). They get a top 20 prospect in grachev who projects to be a monster power forward. and a 1st round pick. The value may not exactly be perfect but the reality of the situation is the hawks can't take on any salary so prospects and picks are really the only thing that would interest them. Also, some teams may not be willing to take on a long deal such as hossa's so that can drop his value.


Failure of epic proportion. I don't undestand the nature of this proposal from a Rangers perspective.

How the **** does this swap improve the Rangers? We take on Salary. We lose our best forward prospect. We lose a top-6 player under 25 who's destined to wear a C on his sweater after Drury's contract expires.

And we give up a 1st round pick. A potential top-10 pick.

Uuuuuggggggg..... Where do you guys come up with this ridiculous crap?

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07-13-2010, 01:42 PM
  #4
Chalfdiggity3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nyr2417 View Post
Hawks need to clear some cap space I could see them trading hossa...

to nyr: Hossa

to chi: Callahan, Grachev, 2011 1st.

Chicago saves about 3 mill on the cap this season and gets a heart and soul player in callahan who could be a vital asset to another cup run (yes I know hossa is too). They get a top 20 prospect in grachev who projects to be a monster power forward. and a 1st round pick. The value may not exactly be perfect but the reality of the situation is the hawks can't take on any salary so prospects and picks are really the only thing that would interest them. Also, some teams may not be willing to take on a long deal such as hossa's so that can drop his value.
that is far to much to give up for a 31yo player in hossa. believe me id love to have hossa but no way for callahan, grachev and a 1st. thats the kind of deal you offer for a YOUNG 1st line player in the league. callahan is a monster heart n soul player, grachev like you said will be a very talented player once he gets used to the North American hockey, and the 1st could be anywhere in the 1st round but prob will be worth a good deal.. just to much for a 31yo hossa. id love it if it was for kane ha.

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07-13-2010, 01:43 PM
  #5
Chris Hansen
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I will continue to wait for hockey fans to realize that Marian Hossa will not be traded.

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07-13-2010, 01:45 PM
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Originally Posted by HawkFan84 View Post
I will continue to wait for hockey fans to realize that Marian Hossa will not be traded.
I'll wait right next to you. I know Hawks have salary cap issues, but they fixed a lot of it already. Hossa is one of the last pieces that's going to be moved to clear salary.

Then again, I thought Ladd was up there as an untouchable.

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07-13-2010, 01:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Boom Boom Geoffrion View Post


Failure of epic proportion. I don't undestand the nature of this proposal from a Rangers perspective.

How the **** does this swap improve the Rangers? We take on Salary. We lose our best forward prospect. We lose a top-6 player under 25 who's destined to wear a C on his sweater after Drury's contract expires.

And we give up a 1st round pick. A potential top-10 pick.

Uuuuuggggggg..... Where do you guys come up with this ridiculous crap?
1st round pick is a roll of the dice and if we have hossa it sure as hell won't even be a top 15 pick in a weak draft class. Callahan, I love him but he's a 3rd liner. as for grachev who the hell knows what he'll turn out to be as of now he's just a big prospect. you're terrible at evaluating value

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07-13-2010, 01:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Panfork View Post
I'll wait right next to you. I know Hawks have salary cap issues, but they fixed a lot of it already. Hossa is one of the last pieces that's going to be moved to clear salary.

Then again, I thought Ladd was up there as an untouchable.
Nope, Ladd was the same as Versteeg, Byfuglien, Barker, etc... would be nice to keep but probably on his way out.

Hossa, Keith, Seabrook, Toews, Kane... those are the untouchables.

Sharp and Bolland, I'm really not sure... someone (or possibly just both of Reasoner and Kopecky) might have to go if Niemi gets too much in arbitration or a UFA goalie is asking for a bit too much.
At any rate, this thread is not about Chicago's cap situation and it's my fault for bringing that into it

The deal itself is a little silly. The NYR give up a lot... and Chicago gives up a big part of its core.
Why would either team do it?

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07-13-2010, 01:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HawkFan84 View Post
I will continue to wait for hockey fans to realize that Marian Hossa will not be traded.
and certainly not for an overpayment like this.

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Old
07-13-2010, 01:51 PM
  #10
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no thanks


but nice try

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07-13-2010, 01:53 PM
  #11
Kevin27nyi
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i personally think the rangers win this easily but whatever..

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07-13-2010, 01:54 PM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nyr2417 View Post
1st round pick is a roll of the dice and if we have hossa it sure as hell won't even be a top 15 pick in a weak draft class. Callahan, I love him but he's a 3rd liner. as for grachev who the hell knows what he'll turn out to be as of now he's just a big prospect. you're terrible at evaluating value
I'm terrible at evaluating value? Based on what? The fact that I point out how lop-sided, and stupid your proposals are? I'm not the only one that does so, incase you haven't noticed.

How much of an upgrade is Hossa over Callahan at this stage in his career? 3M, + a top-10 pick, + our best forward prospect?



You don't know what you're talking about, as usual buddy. This proposal is beyond terrible from a Rangers pov.

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07-13-2010, 01:55 PM
  #13
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Originally Posted by kevin27NYI View Post
i personally think the rangers win this easily but whatever..
On HFboards, potential is viewed almost as highly as sex, so Grachev is a big piece of this deal.

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07-13-2010, 01:56 PM
  #14
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No reason why the Rangers would do this. None what so ever.


Last edited by vipernsx: 07-13-2010 at 05:35 PM.
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07-13-2010, 01:57 PM
  #15
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Bad deal on both parts especially when the pieces of both team are seen as the future(s) in each organization.

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07-13-2010, 01:58 PM
  #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nyr2417 View Post
1st round pick is a roll of the dice and if we have hossa it sure as hell won't even be a top 15 pick in a weak draft class. Callahan, I love him but he's a 3rd liner. as for grachev who the hell knows what he'll turn out to be as of now he's just a big prospect. you're terrible at evaluating value
So with that evaluation of YOUR OWN TEAM why is there any reason in the world that Chicago would want to do this?

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07-13-2010, 02:05 PM
  #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nyr2417 View Post
1st round pick is a roll of the dice and if we have hossa it sure as hell won't even be a top 15 pick in a weak draft class. Callahan, I love him but he's a 3rd liner. as for grachev who the hell knows what he'll turn out to be as of now he's just a big prospect. you're terrible at evaluating value
As a Ranger fan, I wouldn't do that deal, and I doubt you'll find many Ranger fans who would. What does Hossa do for us? He isn't a center, which is really what we need. At best he makes a bad team mediocre. By the time we even think about competing for a cup he'll be 34.

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07-13-2010, 02:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by t3hg00se View Post
and certainly not for an overpayment like this.
Honestly, I wouldn't do it from the Hawks stand point, but I really don't see how it's anything close to an overpayment. Callahan's a nice player, but he's not Hossa.

Grachev has never taken an NHL shift, and who knows what the **** a draft pick a year from now is going to get you, and when/if it'll EVER contribute.

You're laughing at the idea of getting one of the games top two-way forwards, and a guy with a legitimate shot of netting 40 goals a year...for decent player like Callahan...and some potential?

I'm glad you're not in charge of improving MY team's roster.

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07-13-2010, 02:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nyr2417 View Post
1st round pick is a roll of the dice and if we have hossa it sure as hell won't even be a top 15 pick in a weak draft class. Callahan, I love him but he's a 3rd liner. as for grachev who the hell knows what he'll turn out to be as of now he's just a big prospect. you're terrible at evaluating value
no he's not.

You are the guy that is giving up way to much here.

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07-13-2010, 02:32 PM
  #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nyr2417 View Post
Hawks need to clear some cap space I could see them trading hossa...

to nyr: Hossa

to chi: Callahan, Grachev, 2011 1st.

Chicago saves about 3 mill on the cap this season and gets a heart and soul player in callahan who could be a vital asset to another cup run (yes I know hossa is too). They get a top 20 prospect in grachev who projects to be a monster power forward. and a 1st round pick. The value may not exactly be perfect but the reality of the situation is the hawks can't take on any salary so prospects and picks are really the only thing that would interest them. Also, some teams may not be willing to take on a long deal such as hossa's so that can drop his value.
I like the idea, but I'm sour on the guys..

Plus, if the Law of Averages holds, the Rangers will need to make 3 Stanley Cup finals in order to win one if we make this trade and well...frankly....we're just not that lucky to end up in ONE cup final per decade, let alone 3 in 11 years.

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07-13-2010, 03:11 PM
  #21
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Originally Posted by Retail1LO View Post
Honestly, I wouldn't do it from the Hawks stand point, but I really don't see how it's anything close to an overpayment. Callahan's a nice player, but he's not Hossa.

Grachev has never taken an NHL shift, and who knows what the **** a draft pick a year from now is going to get you, and when/if it'll EVER contribute.

You're laughing at the idea of getting one of the games top two-way forwards, and a guy with a legitimate shot of netting 40 goals a year...for decent player like Callahan...and some potential?

I'm glad you're not in charge of improving MY team's roster.
You're missing the point. It's not that Hossa isn't the best player in the deal. He's better than Callahan will ever be. He's very likely better than Grachev or that 1st will ever be. But he's 31 years old, carries a 5+ mil cap hit and the Rangers aren't a Marian Hossa away from competing for a cup.

So why give up all those assets to get him? It makes no sense.

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07-13-2010, 03:31 PM
  #22
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Aren't the lop-sided proposals supposed to be from fans of the OTHER team?

Epic failure.

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Old
07-13-2010, 03:38 PM
  #23
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Glen Sather, circa 2002, is that you?

How about we take a shot with our own guys for a change?

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Old
07-13-2010, 04:02 PM
  #24
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Don't get me wrong I love cally but the the rangers fan base completely over values him, he is a very replaceable player. With 2 years nhl experience dane byers or dale weise can be bigger versions of cally. Grachev is nothing more than a prospect who let me remind you potted 12 goals I think this year in the ahl. And a 1st round pick is a roll of the dice. When I make proposals I try to get trades where the value is right, and this is the right value for hossa. Admittedly up until about 3 months ago I was god awful with proposals but now I'm right on the ball

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07-13-2010, 04:20 PM
  #25
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Originally Posted by nyr2417 View Post
Don't get me wrong I love cally but the the rangers fan base completely over values him, he is a very replaceable player. With 2 years nhl experience dane byers or dale weise can be bigger versions of cally. Grachev is nothing more than a prospect who let me remind you potted 12 goals I think this year in the ahl. And a 1st round pick is a roll of the dice. When I make proposals I try to get trades where the value is right, and this is the right value for hossa. Admittedly up until about 3 months ago I was god awful with proposals but now I'm right on the ball
So unproven prospects like Weise and Byers can replace Callahan in 2 years.

But we should trade Grachev for a 31 year old winger because he's just a prospect who scored 12 goals in the AHL last season.

Do you know who Evgeni was playing with in Hartford, btw?

Let me ask you this. Are you high on Anisimov? Do you consider him a keeper? Part of the future? His rookie season wasn't exceptional either.

In 1 thread you defend Grachev's production because he was a 19 year old rookie adapting to a different league, and here you just basically ignore all of that.

This is the type of trade Sather used to do in the past. The type of trade, that basically forced him to auction off players like Brian ****ing Leetch who should have retired a Ranger whenever he felt like it.

We've been down this road before. Trading youth; prospects; unproven's with upside, for veterans. It only worked once. 1 time. Before you started watching hockey. Unless your team is in a position to do so, you don't trade youth for vets, even of Hossa's capability's.

He's a veteran. He's still a very solid player, superior to whatever Callahan will ever be. But he's going to start regressing, and the difference in Cap between the players, on top of Grachev, and our upcoming 1st, isn't worth the investment from our POV.

The proposal is brutal. One of the worst I've seen from a Rangers standpoint.

If you're going to make a proposal, put some effort into actually improving both teams, instead of trying to nail value. The fact that both fanbases are basically ****ing on this proposal is all the proof you need that you're still waaaaaay ooooooofffff when it comes to making a proposal.

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