Markov Subban Tinordi OB Weber Spacek are or will > Gorges
So Gorges = 1.85M year
Markov = our #1.
Subban = on any given night can be our #2, definitely top 4 right now.
Spacek = on the decline. Will he put in some excellent games? Probably, the amount of them your going to see in the next two years vs what his peak was in his prime will be significantly lower. Only around for 2 more seasons.
Hamrlik = Another decliner, still a solid 2nd pairing D man when he's on his game. Likely won't be back after this season unless he resigns on the serious cheap.
Those are the guys you could make cases for being our current top 4 on most nights. 2 of them are in their last contract year, 1 of which is on a serious decline. The other one is 37 years old and has seen his best days...
The other names you mentioned simply haven't proved themselves yet. Weber will have to show he can rebound in the AHL this season before he gets another real solid look at. Tinordi is at the very least IMO, 2 seasons away if not 3 or 4. O'Byrne has played significant ice time at the NHL level and has yet to out perform Gorges so I don't see where your getting your information in this case.
With Hamrlik, Gill, and Spacek all leaving in the next 2 seasons we need to keep as many avenues as possible open (notice they are all left-handed too, with only Tinordi as a high-end potential replacement for them in the system).
In a perfect world, I agree with you that Gorges isn't top 4.. Because that means our defense is stacked.
Markov Subban Tinordi OB Weber Spacek are or will > Gorges
So Gorges = 1.85M year
Tinordi..won't be pro for at least another 3years.
Weber..couldn't be used as an adequate call up last year even though we had massive injuries. It'll be interesting to see if he improved over the summer.
O'Byrne..has had difficulty every year securing a top 6 spot.
Meanwhile, Gorges was the 4th most used player per game during the season, the 1st in PK. During the POs where he stepped up big time, he was the player that played the most out of our whole team, he played 50min more than the following Dman (Hamrlik). He only trailed Markov for TOI/GP and lead again in PK minutes.
Thinking that O'Byrne, Weber and Tinordi can just take him over easily is foolish imo. Especially considering none have shown signs that they could.
And before they move him to the side, Gill and Hamrlik will be goners by season's end. Next year, Spacek will also be gone.
So, you have for sure at least half of your D corps that will have changed before Tinordi even becomes pro.
People mentioning Tinordi make me laugh..was the same thing with Mcdonagh, the future Chris Chelios.
Anything over 4 years and you should get something closer to 2M/per.
7.5 for 3 years
9.5 for 4 years
11 for 5
12.5 for 6
anything in that range sounds good to me. He does rack off enough points to be regard as a 3M defenseman imo (although he might very well be worth it on the short term imo) That would put him in the "grossly overpaid" catergory for every fan of other teams, yet we would all be relatively ok with it. He's that kind of player, he's worth so much more when you truely watch him play on a regular basis.
I wouldn't extend Josh Gorges longterm at all. Don't get me wrong. The man has a lot of heart and determination. But there are things he doesn't have.
1. No shot.
2. Hits but will never have an "impact" hit.
3. He gets physically overpowered in the crease IMO thus ending up the goaltender's area.
I've been impressed with some of the younger D-men to come up in recent years who have the potential for a well rounded game. I wouldn't want to clog up the roster with a pretty one dimensional d-man. He's a very good bottom pairing d-man but I think the money should be spent elsewhere.
1. No shot I wont argue with that. That's not his role, though
2. Hits but will never have an "impact" hit. Who cares if he doesnt have an impact hit. Does that make bouillon an untouchable d-man? He's impressive in terms of winning puck battles along the boards... who cares how he gets the job done?
3. He gets physically overpowered in the crease IMO thus ending up the goaltender's area. I disagree. Gorges positions himself very well so that you have to go through him to get where you want to go, and he's not afraid of taking the abuse in order to make the play. You'll see him around the crease when it needs to be protected, you dont see him there because someone is overpowering him. Besides, even if this is your concern, you can pair him up with a bigger guy to clear the crease... like Gill
Gorges' role in the playoff run may not have been flashy but it was extremely valuable. I was very happy with him when spacek and markov were down as he picked up alot of responsibility and passed with flying colours.
You give me a mobile d-man that can win the majority of puck battles and is a contender for the captaincy.... and I'll call that a valuable asset. Habs have some skilled d-men but the shutdown guys like hammer, and gill are in their final year... spacek isnt getting any younger, and OB has a ways to go.
I'd try to lock up gorges to 3-4 years. Considering that a guy like ruslan salei can make 3.5 mil, I think it would be terrific to get gorges for less than 3 mil.
After seeing Gorges improve the last couple of seasons, his outstanding play in the playoffs why would any of you sell him short. This guy is solid, plays good minutes and leads by example. I would go 5 years 2.75 - 3.0 per. He deserves it and there are other teams out there who would pay him that, so it may as well be the Habs. I would go so far as to play him as the 4th D.
Markov - O'Byrne (Markov plays his best with this type of D-Man)
Gorges - Subban ( good first pass, break out speed and sound D)
Spacek - Hammer (limited minutes, more effective)
Gill ( All the PK he can handle and some regular minutes)
That's my take on Gorges, again you can't ignore what he brings because of the things he can't bring. He will wear an "A" sometime soon as well.
P.S if O'B can't handle the top pairing I would rotate with Spacek and Hammer and give Gill some extra minutes on the bottom pair.
Anything over 4 years and you should get something closer to 2M/per.
7.5 for 3 years
9.5 for 4 years
11 for 5
12.5 for 6
anything in that range sounds good to me. He does rack off enough points to be regard as a 3M defenseman imo (although he might very well be worth it on the short term imo) That would put him in the "grossly overpaid" catergory for every fan of other teams, yet we would all be relatively ok with it. He's that kind of player, he's worth so much more when you truely watch him play on a regular basis.
Stop being so realistic. You're out of place here.
Anything over 4 years and you should get something closer to 2M/per.
7.5 for 3 years 9.5 for 4 years
11 for 5
12.5 for 6
anything in that range sounds good to me. He does rack off enough points to be regard as a 3M defenseman imo (although he might very well be worth it on the short term imo) That would put him in the "grossly overpaid" catergory for every fan of other teams, yet we would all be relatively ok with it. He's that kind of player, he's worth so much more when you truely watch him play on a regular basis.
Gorges is the other guy you want playing a shut down role, the one that make the combination work. He sticks to his position which is usually in the shooting lanes which forces players to play against him. What I mean by that is that players have to play through him, he's mobile enough that he's difficult to play around and patient enough not to force a play that takes himself out of position. He's also good at complimenting his partner, or most notably Gill's, weaknesses which allows his partner to play their game. I think him and O'byrne will make a great pairing in the near future as O'byrne brings that element of strength and physical play to the table and is more mobile then Gill. All he needs is a few lessons on playing in front of the net and we'll have a good shut down pair for the near future. I say sign him 4-6 years.
I love this guy, he is a heart and soul guy. Of course he is essentialy only a defensive defenseman so he should not garner the amount an offensive D gets. I would give him 2.5M max per season, but i would not be afraid to give him a really long term deal because you know this guy would not sit on his contract. This guy is the grittiest player on this team, not for he dishes out but what receives game in game out and always get out of the corner with the puck.
