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Old
07-19-2010, 06:01 PM
  #26
AntonCH
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love the definition haha
Wikipedia ftw

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Old
07-19-2010, 06:13 PM
  #27
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new CBA

This will all go away when they renegotiate.

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07-19-2010, 06:22 PM
  #28
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Charles Wang was a visionary!
isnt that the truth.

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Old
07-19-2010, 06:36 PM
  #29
Playmaker09
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Hopefully we can get Markov signed to a similar deal (front loaded, ends when he's 40-42, reduced cap hit)

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07-19-2010, 06:38 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Playmaker09 View Post
Hopefully we can get Markov signed to a similar deal (front loaded, ends when he's 40-42, reduced cap hit)
This.

Something like 40 million for 10 years

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Old
07-19-2010, 07:28 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Playmaker09 View Post
Hopefully we can get Markov signed to a similar deal (front loaded, ends when he's 40-42, reduced cap hit)
I'd rather just re-sign him for another 4 years at 5.5-6 million. I think flexibility is more important to success at the cap era than low cap hits.

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07-19-2010, 07:35 PM
  #32
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Lou set precedence with Kovalchuck
If the contract runs till he's 44 then do the same with Markov
So a 12 year front loaded contract that will see him get the majority of the money by 36-37 yrs old, its signed before 35 so when he retires its off the books

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Old
07-19-2010, 07:51 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by buddahsmoka1 View Post
Except Markov is on one of the most reasonable contracts in the league, and makes less than Kovalchuk does NOW. Your logic in this example is extremely flawed.
He said we don't have a player of Kovalchuk's caliber we could perform such a deal with, I countered with the fact Markov is due for an extension after this season. I don't see how you see this as failed logic. His current contract has absolutely no barring on absolutely anything in this discussion.

If Markov is re-signed short-term (3-4, even 5 years) he will get a significant raise from what he currently gets. Fact. He's had his best seasons after signing his 4 year 5.75M contract.

Your logic in interpreting my post is extremely flawed.

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Old
07-19-2010, 07:55 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by Hugh Ellerection View Post
He said we don't have a player of Kovalchuk's caliber we could perform such a deal with, I countered with the fact Markov is due for an extension after this season. I don't see how you see this as failed logic. His current contract has absolutely no barring on absolutely anything in this discussion.

If Markov is re-signed short-term (3-4, even 5 years) he will get a significant raise from what he currently gets. Fact. He's had his best seasons after signing his 4 year 5.75M contract.

Your logic in interpreting my post is extremely flawed.
Wouldn't you say that Markov's contract would be more or less the same as his last one though? Of course it has bearing on the discussion. Why is that a fact? He also had one of his worst seasons last year and is passing his prime of his career, and has lost major mobility and ability.

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07-19-2010, 07:56 PM
  #35
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Who knows what the cap will be in 10 years? Money is worth more today then tomorrow. If the sport continues to grow at 4% pace like is has recently, then the cap will also jump dramatically.

However in the event the sport shrinks, and the cap is lowered; these teams could be screwed.

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Old
07-19-2010, 08:02 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by buddahsmoka1 View Post
Wouldn't you say that Markov's contract would be more or less the same as his last one though? Of course it has bearing on the discussion. Why is that a fact? He also had one of his worst seasons last year and is passing his prime of his career, and has lost major mobility and ability.
What makes you think his contract would be the same as his last one when he just saw a 35 (or was it 36?) year old Gonchar sign for 5.5M for 3 years in Ottawa, which is also in our own division.

One his worst seasons? He had some defensive lapses at times, but he still put up an extremely solid PPG rate despite his injury and the fact he apparently came back early from it. Lost major mobility and ability? He has maybe lost some of his mobility? But as far as his abilities with the puck, his vision, his passing........ When did he lose this? It must have happened during his citizenship ceremony because I didn't see it.

There is no reason to believe he won't get a raise, he still has a solid 3 seasons of prime ahead of him. I'll be the first one to say I'll be satisfied with a 4-5 year deal for Markov at his current salary... But if we start handing out MORE cap space, it becomes a serious liability.

We have no way of seeing what kind of raises are potentially in the pipeline for other players, but can we afford to give Markov a 750 000+ increase on our cap hit for the next 3-4 years with Gomez, Cammalleri, Gionta and Pleks 5M+ contracts? We don't know how our goalie situation looks going forward either.

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Old
07-19-2010, 08:26 PM
  #37
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front loading isnt bad if its not abused. It essentially allows a player in his prime to get his juicy contract, and then his slowing down, retirement rate all in one contract. Anything long term is a gamble though. Instead of signing that 5 year prime contract and then hitting the FA market every year for a senior rate of 1.5 millie until you retire, or hitting the odd 2yr deal, the player has that part secured. And some elite players want/deserve that stability. Its the abuse that needs to stop.

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Old
07-19-2010, 08:33 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by Hugh Ellerection View Post
What makes you think his contract would be the same as his last one when he just saw a 35 (or was it 36?) year old Gonchar sign for 5.5M for 3 years in Ottawa, which is also in our own division.
Because Gonchar was a free agent that signed with another team.

Quote:
One his worst seasons? He had some defensive lapses at times, but he still put up an extremely solid PPG rate despite his injury and the fact he apparently came back early from it. Lost major mobility and ability? He has maybe lost some of his mobility? But as far as his abilities with the puck, his vision, his passing........ When did he lose this? It must have happened during his citizenship ceremony because I didn't see it.
34 points in 45 games is now considered a PPG pace? He did lose abilities for sure, which can be evidenced by the fact that he only got 5 PPP in his last 22 games last season. He was fine at even strength, as he always was, but his PP production regressed last season. Of course, he spent a lot of time injured, but he has definitely lost some mobility and ability this season. This was also the first season in a long time for him where he was not used against the opponent's top players the majority of the time.

Quote:
There is no reason to believe he won't get a raise, he still has a solid 3 seasons of prime ahead of him. I'll be the first one to say I'll be satisfied with a 4-5 year deal for Markov at his current salary... But if we start handing out MORE cap space, it becomes a serious liability.
I think 4 years at 6 million is a realistic probability, and that is more than fair moving forward. But I don't think it is out of the question that he gets signed at a cheaper or similar contract than his previous one.

His contract will also depend largely on how he bounces back this upcoming season.

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Old
07-19-2010, 08:39 PM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buddahsmoka1 View Post
Because Gonchar was a free agent that signed with another team.



34 points in 45 games is now considered a PPG pace? He did lose abilities for sure, which can be evidenced by the fact that he only got 5 PPP in his last 22 games last season. He was fine at even strength, as he always was, but his PP production regressed last season. Of course, he spent a lot of time injured, but he has definitely lost some mobility and ability this season. This was also the first season in a long time for him where he was not used against the opponent's top players the majority of the time.



I think 4 years at 6 million is a realistic probability, and that is more than fair moving forward. But I don't think it is out of the question that he gets signed at a cheaper or similar contract than his previous one.

His contract will also depend largely on how he bounces back this upcoming season.
I didn't say it was a PPG pace as in 45 pts in 45 games... I meant his amount of points per game was very similar to the 2 previous years, it was elite. Pro-rate it and see for yourself. It's almost 62 points over 82 games... Which we both know for a defenseman is lights out elite in the NHL... Not to mention coming off an injury you are saying effected his level of play? He played those games after the injury!

Our PP as whole was rather ineffective at times, with or without Markov.. We have new weapons like Subban to help take some of the load or perhaps pressure if you want to call it that off of Markov..

Your 100% right though... A lot of it will depend on how he rebounds next year, obviously there is no way in knowing how much his latest injury has healed yet, but I have always been very high on Markov since his days in the AHL and unlike Price (whom I have little faith in) I have no question if he stays healthy he will put up 55+ points.

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Old
07-19-2010, 09:04 PM
  #40
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same guys who complain will love it if the habs do it for markov

these contracts do have RISKS tho, it's not all gravy.

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Old
07-19-2010, 09:07 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by scottyG View Post
This.

Something like 40 million for 10 years
Why stop there? Honestly, we should make it 45 for 15 years. 3 million cap hit.

I'm not kidding, what's stopping us? The NHL wont. We should be all over this.

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Old
07-19-2010, 09:24 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by Hugh Ellerection View Post
Markov is not a defensive equivilant of Kovalchuk? I think we have a player of his caliber right there. Think we'll offer him a 8 year deal to bring him to 40 and maximise our cap value? I doubt it. We'll probably give him a 4-5 year deal with 6.5-7M a season because we are cap-tarded in Montreal.
Markov isn't the same player since he came back from his injury, he looked slow this year and it hurt his game a lot.

Maybe he'll eventually recover, but I would wait before offering him a big contract.

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Old
07-19-2010, 09:26 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by Gustave View Post
Why stop there? Honestly, we should make it 45 for 15 years. 3 million cap hit.

I'm not kidding, what's stopping us? The NHL wont. We should be all over this.
Still not ambitious enough, I have Markov signed until he's 55, average cap hit of 2.1 million.

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Old
07-19-2010, 09:27 PM
  #44
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Emo has been associated with a stereotype that includes being particularly emotional, sensitive, shy, introverted, or angst-ridden.
It has also been associated with depression, self-injury, and suicide.
And PMS (pre-menstrual syndrome)

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Old
07-19-2010, 09:34 PM
  #45
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Originally Posted by Gustave View Post
Why stop there? Honestly, we should make it 45 for 15 years. 3 million cap hit.

I'm not kidding, what's stopping us? The NHL wont. We should be all over this.
You think Gauthier the clone of Gainey have the balls to do this ? We will spend to the cap and still have a lower TRUE cap compared to the others.

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Old
07-19-2010, 09:39 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by SeriousFan09 View Post
Still not ambitious enough, I have Markov signed until he's 55, average cap hit of 2.1 million.
Well at least you get the point. I know you're saying it tongue in cheek, but who's to say what's ok and not from this point onward?

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07-19-2010, 09:39 PM
  #47
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Originally Posted by LeMAD View Post
Markov isn't the same player since he came back from his injury, he looked slow this year and it hurt his game a lot.

Maybe he'll eventually recover, but I would wait before offering him a big contract.
And yet he was still the best player (except Halak) on the team. Take a look at the standings with and without him in the lineup last season and you will see he was as important in the success of this team as ever. He deserves a very long contract and to retire as a Hab. Hopefully he will be signed way before his UFA status kicks in and the loophole is closed.

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Old
07-19-2010, 09:43 PM
  #48
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Originally Posted by ReVeuF View Post
You think Gauthier the clone of Gainey have the balls to do this ? We will spend to the cap and still have a lower TRUE cap compared to the others.
He has the balls (Halak trade), but does he have the brains? If we decide not to trade Markov then there isn't any logical reason for us not to front load a 13 year deal.

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Old
07-19-2010, 10:30 PM
  #49
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Not that it makes a difference but if kovy plays out his contract which I doubt. the last 4 to 5 years will be at 550 , 000 approx. If in 12 years from now the minimum salary is say 1,000,000 dollars do they go by the contract signed or does that affect the contract?

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Old
07-19-2010, 10:33 PM
  #50
AntonCH
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Originally Posted by morgan_mtl View Post
Not that it makes a difference but if kovy plays out his contract which I doubt. the last 4 to 5 years will be at 550 , 000 approx. If in 12 years from now the minimum salary is say 1,000,000 dollars do they go by the contract signed or does that affect the contract?
Cap hit will still be 6 mill

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