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Edmonton - Washington (Revised)

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Old
07-24-2010, 09:30 AM
  #26
wickedwitch
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Quote:
Originally Posted by txpd View Post
The first answer you have to provide is to this question above. The Caps have Mike Green and Alex Ovechkin on the points. Green is the PP QB.

Why do the Caps want/need another player to watch them play?
And they have Carlson who will start getting PP time.

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Old
07-24-2010, 10:09 AM
  #27
bonzaibondra12
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I believe the Caps may have went after Souray in the past when they couldn't move Nylander. But Nylander is buried now, and the Caps have no use for Souray. Not to mention Poti at this point performs better.

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07-24-2010, 01:12 PM
  #28
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Oilers will never throw a pick in going back the other way. Why would they unless they are getting something of value in return. I will guarantee this

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07-24-2010, 03:36 PM
  #29
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Oilers will never throw a pick in going back the other way. Why would they unless they are getting something of value in return. I will guarantee this
Because they would be dumping an extremely bad contract.

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Old
07-24-2010, 03:53 PM
  #30
belair
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Quote:
Originally Posted by txpd View Post
last one....Poti is the only Caps veteran defense. He leads the team in PK minutes.
So, if its vet for vet are you suggesting Souray become the cornerstone of a PK?

Before you believe a rumor, ask yourself if it makes any sense at all.
Once again...the rumour was created with the idea that Washington was in the hunt for a PP QB. Something I didn't make up.

Also, Souray may not be as effective on the PK as Poti may have been, but he does play the PK in Edmonton and generally logs minutes in the upper-20s when healthy. He would be a favourable guy in your Top-4 to replace an upcoming UFA.

DEFENSEMEN
Jeff Schultz ($2.750m) / Mike Green ($5.250m)
Karl Alzner ($1.675m) / Sheldon Souray ($5.400m)
John Erskine ($1.250m) / John Carlson ($0.845m)
Tyler Sloan ($0.700m)


Not bad IMO. But I understand if Caps fans value Poti much higher than I do.

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Originally Posted by third man in View Post
Because they would be dumping an extremely bad contract.
Exactly. Losing Chorney hurts too.

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Old
07-24-2010, 04:36 PM
  #31
txpd
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I didnt say you made up the rumor. I did suggest that you look to see if the rumor makes any sense.

Souray is a PP player. With his salary if he is not on the 1st pp unit and not a primary shooting option he is a waste of money. Would you not agree with that? If you do, then consider the Caps current power play and ask yourself if he is on the first pp unit and if he is what shooting option he is with Mike Green, Alex Ovechkin and Alexander Semin on the ice and Mike Knuble in front of the net?

Next I ask you about Poti. Tom Poti was 3rd on the Caps in TOI last season. 1st in shorthanded TOI. If the Caps defense is as you suggests, who are the 4 defense on the PK?

Jeff Schultz ($2.750m) / Mike Green ($5.250m)
Karl Alzner ($1.675m) / Sheldon Souray ($5.400m)
John Erskine ($1.250m) / John Carlson ($0.845m)

Last question....is Souray really worth more money than Mike Green and does that make any sense to you?

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Old
07-24-2010, 04:38 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by third man in View Post
Because they would be dumping an extremely bad contract.
not gonna give up a prospect or a pick to get rid of souray. rather have him play twenty games and some gm will trade a bad contract for him

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07-24-2010, 05:35 PM
  #33
third man in
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not gonna give up a prospect or a pick to get rid of souray. rather have him play twenty games and some gm will trade a bad contract for him
Fair enough... we didn't make the proposal though.

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07-24-2010, 06:11 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by belair View Post
Also, Souray may not be as effective on the PK as Poti may have been, but he does play the PK in Edmonton and generally logs minutes in the upper-20s when healthy. .
And when he's not healthy, what then? This trade would only make sense if Green went down for the season.

If the Caps want a booming shot on the pp they might as well let Orlov play a couple games, and see what happens.

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Old
07-24-2010, 07:05 PM
  #35
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Souray for 5+ million for two years?

Yeah, like they really want that contract.

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Old
07-24-2010, 07:15 PM
  #36
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Oops lol, something I have overlooked.

But it looked so good on paper.

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Old
07-24-2010, 07:58 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by belair View Post
Edited to attempt to avoid an early thread demise...

If the Caps were in the market for a PP-QB...
Stop right there. Let's not even get to why the Caps would pay so much for a guy who cleared waivers. Why would the Caps need a PP-QB? They had the top PP in the NHL last year with the best PP QB in the NHL on one point and the best PP forward in the NHL on the other point.

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Old
07-24-2010, 10:13 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by CapsWolverinesUSA View Post
Stop right there. Let's not even get to why the Caps would pay so much for a guy who cleared waivers. Why would the Caps need a PP-QB? They had the top PP in the NHL last year with the best PP QB in the NHL on one point and the best PP forward in the NHL on the other point.
Because Eklund said so... it must be true, and part of an elaborate 3-way with a team out west.

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Old
07-24-2010, 11:02 PM
  #39
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Not a bad deal.

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Old
07-24-2010, 11:03 PM
  #40
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Poti was all but run out of town. I Like Chimera but I don't see Poti ever coming back.

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Old
07-24-2010, 11:20 PM
  #41
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I'd take Tom Poti a $3.5 million over Sheldon Souray at $5.4 million every single time.

And Jason Chimera is a hell of a lot more useful to the Caps than Taylor Chorney.

So yeah, this is an awful deal for the Caps.

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Old
07-24-2010, 11:22 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by NobodyBeatsTheWiz View Post
I'd take Tom Poti a $3.5 million over Sheldon Souray at $5.4 million every single time.

And Jason Chimera is a hell of a lot more useful to the Caps than Taylor Chorney.

So yeah, this is an awful deal for the Caps.
Really? Poti is awful. Souray is at least useful and can score. And he only has one year left on his deal, so if the Caps want to re-sign Semin, they'd get 5.4 mil freed up to do so. It's a good deal for both IMO.

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07-24-2010, 11:25 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by HockeyIsDifferentHer View Post
Really? Poti is awful. Souray is at least useful and can score. And he only has one year left on his deal, so if the Caps want to re-sign Semin, they'd get 5.4 mil freed up to do so. It's a good deal for both IMO.
Poti isn't close to awful. He's a legit top-4 defenseman, despite his reputation.

Souray just cleared waivers and you expect him to return something of value?

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07-24-2010, 11:27 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by HockeyIsDifferentHer View Post
Really? Poti is awful. Souray is at least useful and can score. And he only has one year left on his deal, so if the Caps want to re-sign Semin, they'd get 5.4 mil freed up to do so. It's a good deal for both IMO.
No. Poti was (kinda) awful for the Rangers. He's been a solid player for every other team he has played with. How many years will it take for Rangers fans to understand this?

And your salary numbers make no sense.

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07-24-2010, 11:40 PM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by txpd View Post
I didnt say you made up the rumor. I did suggest that you look to see if the rumor makes any sense.

Souray is a PP player. With his salary if he is not on the 1st pp unit and not a primary shooting option he is a waste of money. Would you not agree with that? If you do, then consider the Caps current power play and ask yourself if he is on the first pp unit and if he is what shooting option he is with Mike Green, Alex Ovechkin and Alexander Semin on the ice and Mike Knuble in front of the net?

Next I ask you about Poti. Tom Poti was 3rd on the Caps in TOI last season. 1st in shorthanded TOI. If the Caps defense is as you suggests, who are the 4 defense on the PK?

Jeff Schultz ($2.750m) / Mike Green ($5.250m)
Karl Alzner ($1.675m) / Sheldon Souray ($5.400m)
John Erskine ($1.250m) / John Carlson ($0.845m)

Last question....is Souray really worth more money than Mike Green and does that make any sense to you?
Yes Souray is a powerplay threat. He is also a veteran, physical defenseman, who is a leader in the locker room. Something that tends to be overlooked. Poti is not physical whatsoever.

As for who plays the PK...Obvious choices are Schultz, Souray, Erskine...then one of the rookies.

Should he make more than Mike Green? With him at 70 points a season? Hell no.

The reason Souray was not claimed off of waivers was not because he wouldn't contribute positively to another team...It was because his cap hit was an albatross if nothing went back the other way.

In this proposal a lot of salary does go the other way. But, I suppose I have made the gross mis-assessment that Tom Poti is nothing more than a serviceable veteran with an expiring 3.5M cap-hit. Honestly, I still wouldn't see the Caps getting much for him via the trade market. Admittedly, Chimera was the main piece of value for the Oilers.

These aren't gems coming to Edmonton in this deal. They are similar salary going back for Souray, who is the best player in the deal.

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07-24-2010, 11:53 PM
  #46
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Chimaira is under contract in 2011/12.

As for the 3.5 cap hit. Alzner, Erskine, Gordon and one of either Varlamov or Neuvirth are likely to get considerable raises next summer. Laich sticks around at about 2.5M. Semin stays around his 6.0M hit or he's likely to be moved at the deadline. With their current 11/12 salary structure at 30M, it's not entirely unfathomable that Washington could eat Souray's salary if need be.
Chimera*

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Old
07-25-2010, 12:02 AM
  #47
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Chimera*
If you'll take a gander at the post above yours, I've already remedied that error. But hey, what ever gets your post count up.

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Old
07-25-2010, 07:40 AM
  #48
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Originally Posted by belair View Post
But, I suppose I have made the gross mis-assessment that Tom Poti is nothing more than a serviceable veteran with an expiring 3.5M cap-hit. Honestly, I still wouldn't see the Caps getting much for him via the trade market. Admittedly, Chimera was the main piece of value for the Oilers.
many think poti stinks. that he is the whipping boy he was in edmonton and ny rangers. he's not, but from edmonton you wouldn't know that.

the change really came with the islanders. he was a main reason why the islanders managed to make the playoffs a couple seasons ago. when he left for the caps as a ufa he was a main reason why they failed to make the playoffs anytime after that.

he had become a valuable defensive defenseman. he is not phyisical, but he doesnt commit the gaffes that souray does and his passing out of the defensive zone is more reliable than souray.

further, souray's job, if replacing poti would be as the stay at home for either green or carlson who are the attack players.

in short swapping those two players is not a good fit for the caps. lastly, trading poti the way he has played and with only one season left on a $3.5m deal would be a piece of cake. he is not an albatross in any sense of the term.

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Old
07-25-2010, 07:56 AM
  #49
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The reason Souray was not claimed off of waivers was not because he wouldn't contribute positively to another team...It was because his cap hit was an albatross if nothing went back the other way.
Teams can easily as Edmonton has, hide someone in the minors if they choose to claim Souray. There's no reason for them to give up assets to acquire him.

Not to knock on Souray but Washingston is one of the teams that don't need him, especially not when it forces Carlson to play 3rd pairing and mentoring Alzner.

If Washingston was to trade for him, I rather it be Kaberle or Bieksa.

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Old
07-25-2010, 02:12 PM
  #50
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No, Poti was run out of town before so this trade would make no sense to bring him back again.

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