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Rangers let Christer Rockstrom go

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Old
07-22-2010, 08:26 PM
  #1
RangerBoy
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Rangers let Christer Rockstrom go

Just read in an Edmonton Journal article which went on line tonight about Robert Nilsson going to the KHL and his father Magic Man resigned as an Oiler scout. The Rangers let Rockstrom go. Did his contract expire?

Quote:
Kent might wind up working for Glen Sather in New York after they let longtime European scout Crister Rockstrom go. Sather traded for Nilsson in 1987 when Nilsson was playing for Minnesota and he won a Cup alongside Mark Messier and Glenn Anderson that spring. Sather also brought Nilsson back for a six-game cameo in 1995 when he was 39 years old.
Read more: http://www.edmontonjournal.com/sport...#ixzz0uSpdUMPj

Rockstrom's influence has waned. Rangers haven't drafted many Swedes. He joined the Rangers in the summer of 1989 when Neil Smith became the GM. The Rangers hired Anders Hedberg about 3 years ago. You never heard that much about Rockstrom. Even when the Rangers recruited and signed MZA,Hedberg was the point man.

Rockstrom is still listed as the Rangers director of player personnel in Europe but the report is probably true or highly accurate.

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07-22-2010, 08:34 PM
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Lion Hound
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Didn't see that coming.

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07-22-2010, 08:36 PM
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free0717
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Did Rockstrom find Lundquist?

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07-22-2010, 08:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by free0717 View Post
Did Rockstrom find Lundquist?
Yep. It was the last real thing he's done for the organization that's panned out as well.

I love Christer and am sad to see him go, but new blood is not always a bad thing. He also might have other interests in Scandinavia that we don't know about as well.

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07-22-2010, 08:51 PM
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About a year ago, I posted here that Rock is overrated by fans. He's no super-scout. The vast majority of is calls did not pan out.

This board went nuts on me. I wonder how people feel about him now.

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07-22-2010, 08:56 PM
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Wasn't this the guy that discovered Lidstrom as well?

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07-22-2010, 09:08 PM
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I don't doubt the validity but couldn't it also be interpreted as "when they do let him go"?

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07-22-2010, 09:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Banks3rdLineCenter View Post
Wasn't this the guy that discovered Lidstrom as well?
he actually WAS a very good scout, he just lost his talent when he came to ny... like everyone else in the organization at every level.

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07-22-2010, 09:20 PM
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DM23BK30
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Ola "Ryno" Sandberg, Johan Witehall "'South Ferry" and Jan "Ethel" Mertzig were my favorite Rockstrom picks

Henrik, Norstrom and Johnsson were about it as far as home runs. I hated the Sundstrom pick. I wanted Allison

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07-22-2010, 10:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerBoy View Post
Rockstrom's influence has waned. Rangers haven't drafted many Swedes. He joined the Rangers in the summer of 1989 when Neil Smith became the GM. The Rangers hired Anders Hedberg about 3 years ago. You never heard that much about Rockstrom. Even when the Rangers recruited and signed MZA,Hedberg was the point man.
I really wish this wasn't the case. I love the way the Swedes (in general) play the game and I think their style is very conducive to winning in the NHL.

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07-22-2010, 11:39 PM
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Seems like Clark and Gorton are really at the helm of influence and probably Luchenko and Hedberg too.

Did Rockstrom find Hagelin and what about Fasth?

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07-23-2010, 01:27 AM
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Rocker was expert on the Russian market too, he is behind all over Russian picks as well. He of course worked in all of Europe.

I have a feeling that he and Slats didn't came along 100%. Rocker have done some commenting for tv in Sweden. And when doing rangergames he praised Renney tremendously as a vppp. You got the sense that since he praised him so much, maybe he weren't 100% found of what came after him.

Which I am not suprised about. Clarke seems obssessed with getting any pick he makes to NA asap (college/juniors), a stance that's extremely debateble. Kids who stay longer just have more success then thoose who leave early. Just look at Detroit as a example who have a outspoken strategy that is the 100% opposite of Clarkes.

Slats brought in a Slats-guy in Clarke. He is a good scout Clarke, but he still goes about business in the 100% Slats manner. No foresight, zero creativity et c. Old school.

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07-23-2010, 01:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Media Savvy Lee View Post
Ola "Ryno" Sandberg, Johan Witehall "'South Ferry" and Jan "Ethel" Mertzig were my favorite Rockstrom picks

Henrik, Norstrom and Johnsson were about it as far as home runs. I hated the Sundstrom pick. I wanted Allison
You also have Tyutin, Zidlicky and co. Given what he have been given to work with, and how the picks were developed in Ny for a long time, he have done a really good job. No doubt.

Not excellent, but very good.

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07-23-2010, 04:34 AM
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Regarding the recent Russian picks,besides Cherepanov the Russian selections are Paul Theofanous clients. Kuzntetsov like Cherepanov is a Grossman client. Tarasenko is a Liut client. Lutchenko is responsible for Russia. Jan Gadjosik is responsible for Czech Republic and Slovakia. Then you have Hedberg and Rockstrom. Too many guys. Clark is always over there scouting.

Rockstrom was with the Rangers for 21 years.

Detroit has Tatar playing in the AHL as an 18/19 year old. Nyquist is playing for the University of Maine. They have selected a few college players in the first round. Have selected Europeans playing in the CHL. Zetterberg and Datsyuk were taken a long time ago.

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Old
07-23-2010, 04:47 AM
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Yes and statistically, Detroit doesn't draft all that much better than other teams, if at all.

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Old
07-23-2010, 06:21 AM
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Well, for whatever reason, the emphasis this year was Canadian boys. May be a trend, may not be.

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Old
07-23-2010, 06:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerBoy View Post
Regarding the recent Russian picks,besides Cherepanov the Russian selections are Paul Theofanous clients. Kuzntetsov like Cherepanov is a Grossman client. Tarasenko is a Liut client. Lutchenko is responsible for Russia. Jan Gadjosik is responsible for Czech Republic and Slovakia. Then you have Hedberg and Rockstrom. Too many guys. Clark is always over there scouting.

Rockstrom was with the Rangers for 21 years.

Detroit has Tatar playing in the AHL as an 18/19 year old. Nyquist is playing for the University of Maine. They have selected a few college players in the first round. Have selected Europeans playing in the CHL. Zetterberg and Datsyuk were taken a long time ago.
So are you saying that European kids that stays 2 years in Europe don't by a wide and very distinctive margin do better then kids who go over early?

Its impossible to argue otherwise, impossible. Its not a "indication", its a, what was the word Slats used the other week, "chasm". All the Slovak kids are bolting these days, before they produced quite a lot of stars, these days their junior teams struggles to be top 7 and the last 10 years they haven't produced much of anything.

I heard Ken Holland during the WJC's, or it might have been the OG, give a interview where he said the exact same thing. I am basically quoting him. The Detroit example is ridiculos, its not like they don't have a ton of kids playing in Europe.

A Russian who won't get to play in the KHL? Sure bring him over. A Slovak kid who is choosing between the Slovak league and the AHL? Sure bring him over, the slovakleague besides the top 2 teams or something is a beer league. A kid who is a extreme long shot and will have to work extremely hard to get a comlpimentary role in the NHL, why not have him compliment your better kids in the AHL and use him that way instead. But the rest? Postpone their ETA 2 years. Instead of 2 years in the AHL and then the NHL, make it 2 years in the SEL or whatever, 2 years in the AHL and then the NHL.

So you got to ask yourself, why do we so sledom picks Europeans who don't want to play junior hockey in NA, and why do we work so hard to get them over ASAP if drafted?

Clarke have said it himself, "they got to prove themselfs". In other words, nobody in our organization should think that they could be picked in the 7th round, coast around in Europe for a couple of years, and then step right into the NHL. You must have paid your dues, gone the hard way. It should be equal for everyone.

In other words, had Rocker drafted Dats and Zetterberg the two of them quite possibly wouldn't even be in the NHL at this point. They aren't on the same level, but just like Zidlicky and Marek never got to the NHL under Slats.

If you are fine with that its your right. Its "fair" for everyone, no Canadian kid pays his dues in the CHL and subsequently in the AHL only to see some kid from Europe come in and take his spot. I personally would hope that this org wasn't run like it was the 70's, I would rather pick the option that would put the best team on the ice in the NHL. I am not saying that there is intended bias in this org., its just how it always have been it these guys don't ever think about looking outside thoose frames. Like Detroit have done for example.

I know basically as a fact that when Rocker have brought up a finnish or swedish kid who wants to stay in the SEL/SM-liigaa, that he have been told to find out if they want to come over to play in NA right away or not. If they have said no, they haven't been picked. For that reason Rocker have had a strained relation with NY brass, especially with Slats. How do I know that? Because the picks haven't been made.

On a few other notes, Rocker was head of European scouting. Jan G is a amature who scans the Slovak market and tell Rocker who to come and watch. The Russian guy is pretty new in the NYR org, and work full time (or at least used to) with other dutys in Russia. It was the same thing with him.


Last edited by Ola: 07-23-2010 at 07:06 AM.
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Old
07-23-2010, 08:17 AM
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Didn't he find the wonderful Marcus Jonasen , Johan Lindbom and Lauri Korpikoski as well???

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07-23-2010, 08:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blueblood 2 View Post
Well, for whatever reason, the emphasis this year was Canadian boys. May be a trend, may not be.
With the risk of getting flamed for saying this, I hope the trend becomes more North American and further, more Western Canadian as they tend to play a more physical game.

It's nice to have that european flair on the team as I would have loved to have drafted Tarasenko or Burmistrov or Johansen at #10 this year, or Kabanov in the 2nd round, but if there is a trend being set up, I'd prefer to have that trend on the Western Canadian NA kids.

Just me.

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07-23-2010, 08:39 AM
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Originally Posted by pld459666 View Post
With the risk of getting flamed for saying this, I hope the trend becomes more North American and further, more Western Canadian as they tend to play a more physical game.

It's nice to have that european flair on the team as I would have loved to have drafted Tarasenko or Burmistrov or Johansen at #10 this year, or Kabanov in the 2nd round, but if there is a trend being set up, I'd prefer to have that trend on the Western Canadian NA kids.

Just me.
No reason what-so-ever to be flamed for. I don't dissagree either, at least not when it comes to earlier picks. But I wonder if you can get the same potential for the buck with a 5rd pick from the WHL as you can with a 5th round gamble on a euro, but with that said I am not advocating that all later picks should be euros, but they should at least be looked at.

If anything, I would say that if ONE thing is important in drafting its to draft from the right place at the right time. Why? A hockeyplayer seems to be product of his environment more then anything else, more so then talent, and that environment is constantly changing. Sometimes Sweden is very good at developing kids, sometimes the Finns are doing really well, sometimes the Russians have a strong stretch. Its very obvious that Sweden for example develop our best players in lumps so to speak.

Like you said, its nice to have a mix, I think some markets are pretty shaky right now and Canada is on a very solid pace, like they so often are, but not always (the Jason Bosignore/Daniel Tkachuk/Lundmark years are definitely proof that even Canada have some off years too). Its a safe bet to draft from Canada in other words.

In the end you only get so many games to "cross scout" kids, with uncertain results. Like I think its pretty easy to rank the Swedes 1 to 10, as well as the Russians and Finns and Czechs, and Canadians, but whats hard is to put together thoose lists. Some years the Swedes top 10 will produce one marginal NHLer, some years you'll get 10 NHLers with a couple of them becoming stars. Then you can make steels, the off years you can be the best scout in the game and still make bad picks.

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07-23-2010, 08:43 AM
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Ola
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Originally Posted by Punxrocknyc19 View Post
Didn't he find the wonderful Marcus Jonasen , Johan Lindbom and Lauri Korpikoski as well???
Whats your point?

As opposed to what? Sanguinetti, Jordan Foote and Bruce Graham?

Ridiculos post.

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07-23-2010, 08:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pld459666 View Post
With the risk of getting flamed for saying this, I hope the trend becomes more North American and further, more Western Canadian as they tend to play a more physical game.

It's nice to have that european flair on the team as I would have loved to have drafted Tarasenko or Burmistrov or Johansen at #10 this year, or Kabanov in the 2nd round, but if there is a trend being set up, I'd prefer to have that trend on the Western Canadian NA kids.

Just me.

I suspect it may have something to do with Torts and Messier having input now. Unless there is a gem that drops to us in a best player available situation, the toss up pick will be North American. Ola made some good points as to why. Right or wrong.

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07-23-2010, 08:47 AM
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Ola
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Originally Posted by Levitate View Post
Yes and statistically, Detroit doesn't draft all that much better than other teams, if at all.
On or two things can be said about that...

...depends on what stats you look at. Like the stat that is about being able to build a dynasty with homegrown superstars or some other stat, which of I am not sure you are refeering too.

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07-23-2010, 09:01 AM
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Not a bad thing. Our European scouting has been sub-par the last few years. Could probably do with a fresh set of eyes.

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07-23-2010, 09:08 AM
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Did Rockstrom find Lundquist?
Rockstrom got the credit for Lundqvist as he was at the front of the European scouts for the Rangers, but it was a guy under him that kept pushing the Henrik envelope. If Rockstrom truly wanted Henrik, they would have never drafted him in the 7 round.

I remember hearing at the time he was pushing for Marcel Hossa, but without a first rounde they couldn't swing a deal to get him.

But...Instead he managed to convince the organization to draft Premsyl Duben and Sven Helfenstein in front of Henrik. I guess at the end of the day what I am saying is that Rockstrom is noted for bringing Henrik here, but I don't think he was the real driving force that wanted him.

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