Believe it or not working retail in the west island, I've come across many. When I first started working when I was younger my French was way worse than it is now, and that's saying a lot. So before I learned all the common phrases/words for the job, I was slow in French. We would get these blue collar workers who would come in who didn't speak a word of English so naturally I served them in French, to the best of my abilities. I didn't know what "straw" or "knife" were in French at the time, first couple weeks on the job. Stuff like that people would get so pissed. Often times I even knew the person could speak English but was just refusing to in order to be an *******. This one guy would be like "un paille un paille un paille UN PAILLE!!!!" angrily. I would turn to a co-worker, what the **** is a "paille" and then give him one. The dude would roll his eyes. From that day forward nothing was ever right with this customers order.
First of all at Tim Horton's we don't put the peanut butter on due to possible cross contamination. This guy would harass me to do it anyways which I wouldn't. Then in his coffee nothing was ever the right amount of cream. I think I would know being that I serve you every day and not only is the machine calibrated but I know what color you like your coffee, if it's the same or different from day to day. Without fail every single time the guy would give me a hard time. Often times even saying stuff like "this is Quebec, here you speak French" (but in French). By the first week of serving the guy I had all the words I needed to know and he still gave me a hard time for months afterwards lmao.
This is just one instance but it's happened many times before. The worst is when you're actually making an effort but for some people that isn't good enough. You'll say something as clearly as you can in French using the proper words even and they'll pretend like they still can't understand you, just because you aren't using a perfect accent or something. It's like a game to some people I guess.
I don't know about you guys but I don't mind serving somebody in either language but if somebody is trying to learn my language, rather then being a ***** and making them not want to care, I'm sympathetic and I do my best to have the conversation and understand them as best as I can. I don't understand why people make such a big deal about language. The same people who complain everyone should learn French are the same to shoot you down the first second you try and don't speak it perfectly. When you have learning disabilities and find languages very difficult to grasp, this can be quite infuriating.
A lot of people complain English people don't learn French or French people don't learn English, or complain about people who don't in general, but some people have a tough time learning and shooting them down isn't going to make them want to try any harder. I know a lot more French people are bilingual than English people are around here, but I've rarely seen a French person being ridiculed for attempting to speak English, but I've seen the opposite several times.
I've been told to "speak Canadian" on a bus in Calgary once and I was 14 years old at the time. (speaking French with my dad). We just thought it was so rediculous that we basically bursted out laughing.
Trust me, what you say goes both ways in Canada. You just have to shrug off the insecure morons.
Personally I was raised as a francophone in Ontario, trust me, people make fun when you don't speak English properly.
By the way, did you know there is a Society for the Preservation of the English language in Ontario?
lmao.
There are biggots and idiots everywhere but trust me the cool open people with a head on their shoulder do outnumber them. We're just not as loud and obnoxious
For your customer, the fact that you were speaking bad french was a product of a personnal failing from your part ("you're just a stupid anglo who hasn't learned french) instead of a product of your environment (you just started).
That's called the "fundamental attribution error". It's a basic psychological observation. People tend to interpret the behavior of others as a consequence of personality, and their own behavior as a consequence of the environment.
this may be true but the majority of human beings west of st laurent blvd are bilingual. and off island, umm no, it's not entirely francophone...there are large districts on west island (ok not off island but far enough - esp. kirkland pointe claire etc) and south shore that are anglophone and bilingual
I've been told to "speak Canadian" on a bus in Calgary once and I was 14 years old at the time. (speaking French with my dad). We just thought it was so rediculous that we basically bursted out laughing.
Trust me, what you say goes both ways in Canada. You just have to shrug off the insecure morons.
Personally I was raised as a francophone in Ontario, trust me, people make fun when you don't speak English properly.
By the way, did you know there is a Society for the Preservation of the English language in Ontario?
lmao.
There are biggots and idiots everywhere but trust me the cool open people with a head on their shoulder do outnumber them. We're just not as loud and obnoxious
Oh I know the rest of Canada are morons in reverse to French people so don't get me wrong.
I was just saying it's funny how in the city there are so few problems with this (I myself have never had any issues either) but in the West Island where half the people are English and it's a primarily English neighborhood in terms of Quebec, you get these people who come out of the woodwork and act like a bunch of morons.
Part of the reason I mentioned they were mostly blue collar workers is because this has never actually happened to me with any white collar workers before. Funny part is the people who do this kind of stuff always act entitled and speak as if they're better than you, it's like an inferiority complex or something. They work at some ***** manual labor job, so they go to the one place somebody in the world has a ****tier job (tim hortons, mcdonalds etc) to belittle the employees. It's just funny because I rarely see this out of the white collar working class. Though this one time I went to my mechanic this ********* shows up in a lexus and he was being a real ********* saying "I have a 90,000$ car, you think I have time to waste here" blah blah blah, talking down to the guy like he's some "chump mechanic". (The guy was the owner of the garage lol, mechanics who own garages that are successful make good money, even if they're technically a blue collar worker getting greasy working on cars and not just being management, some people need to get off their high horse)
It's just a funny comparison though, Montreal vs The West Island, we have more people prejudice/mistreating anglo's here then in the city.
Even funnier part about it is the people who are blue collar 15$/hr workers talking down to you because you work at a Tim Horton's and are English. I have nothing against blue collar work by the way, I just think it's funny that somebody who works his god damn ass off probably to make that 15$/hr is looking down on other people. Not like you're a doctor or something saving lives making 90k a year or something, get off your high horse, you're closer to a Tim Horton's employee then you are to an SAQ/government employee's wage and you work probably twice as hard as either. It's not something to be ashamed of, and I do know plenty of blue collar workers who make more than that, but these guys weren't exactly Bombardier's finest or something. They were your typical factory workers. Point is, it's not something you shouldn't be proud of either but it's not something that puts you in a position to look down on people, imo nothing really is but in terms of money you make, social status, job you have, any kid out of high school can get one of those jobs with a good CV and I know from experience and from friends who have had several factory type jobs that in most cases they worked their ***** off for little pay and to get ***** by a union.
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Originally Posted by CHill Seeker
this may be true but the majority of human beings west of st laurent blvd are bilingual. and off island, umm no, it's not entirely francophone...there are large districts on west island (ok not off island but far enough - esp. kirkland pointe claire etc) and south shore that are anglophone and bilingual
I wouldn't say especially. All the west island cities are pretty equal in that regard. MAYBE Kirkland/Beaconsfield are more anglo not sure why they would be though.
I live in Beaconsfield, have lived in Pointe-Claire twice and DDO most of my life. I've never felt it wasn't about equal in any of the other cities.
Separatists generally have a higher level of culture than the rest of the population
I guess it's true if you define "culture" narrowingly to mean "quebec francophone ethnic culture". For any other broader definition (scientific culture? political culture?), it's ridiculously false.
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The only hatred remaining against anglos come from some regions that aren't separatist (Ora few old retards I've met in Montreal).
So you think that the separatist movement (I'm not talking about nationalists, but really separatists) ISN'T fuelled by any ressentment against english canadians? That's... so wrong I can't even know how to address this. The separatist movement started as a backslash against pre-quiet revolution english domination, and is pretty much fueled from it since then.
You seem to be trying to paint separatism as what you would want it do be, not as it is really.
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The reality is that the hatred against anglos in Quebec comes from retards that doesn't care about politics.
I would say that hatred against anglos has little to do with politics.
I guess it's true if you define "culture" narrowingly to mean "quebec francophone ethnic culture". For any other broader definition (scientific culture? political culture?), it's ridiculously false.
So you think that the separatist movement (I'm not talking about nationalists, but really separatists) ISN'T fuelled by any ressentment against english canadians? That's... so wrong I can't even know how to address this. The separatist movement started as a backslash against pre-quiet revolution english domination, and is pretty much fueled from it since then.
You seem to be trying to paint separatism as what you would want it do be, not as it is really.
I would say that hatred against anglos has little to do with politics.
I would have just said everything but since you so eloquently put it...
As far as I know, Quebec is still part of Canada, which means there are 2 official languages
Exactly, as far as I'm concerned learn the languages you want to learn, make an effort and be polite when speaking to people in different languages etc. This isn't just a rule for English/French but for everyone. There's no reason why we need to divide ourselves as a society based on race, culture, religion, language, blood, whatever dumb reasons people segregate society these days.
For all the flack Montreal and Quebec get for people who are like this, we have far more people who aren't, who are great even despite not speaking both languages, and many who are great people who do. We're also very culturally diverse as well as religiously diverse in this province. If all these races, cultures and religions can get along then so can we
It's funny that people around here (Quebec) make a big fuss about languages and such where in the US (around NYC where I've been last week) they translate a lot of signs to Spanish. I mean, I know the Hispanic population is huge in the US but as far as I know it's not an official language... here we fight about what should be in French, English, who should speak French, etc..
It's funny that people around here (Quebec) make a big fuss about languages and such where in the US (around NYC where I've been last week) they translate a lot of signs to Spanish. I mean, I know the Hispanic population is huge in the US but as far as I know it's not an official language... here we fight about what should be in French, English, who should speak French, etc..
I guess it's true if you define "culture" narrowingly to mean "quebec francophone ethnic culture". For any other broader definition (scientific culture? political culture?), it's ridiculously false.
So you think that the separatist movement (I'm not talking about nationalists, but really separatists) ISN'T fuelled by any ressentment against english canadians? That's... so wrong I can't even know how to address this. The separatist movement started as a backslash against pre-quiet revolution english domination, and is pretty much fueled from it since then.
You seem to be trying to paint separatism as what you would want it do be, not as it is really.
I would say that hatred against anglos has little to do with politics.
Nationalism is (or was) partly fueled by resentment against anglos. But there are as much nationalists amongst federalists than amongst separatists.
Nationalism/patriotism is the problem, and it's a huge problem all over the world, but still as I said earlier, hatred between anglos and francos are pretty much a thing of the past in Quebec.
(btw for those who don't know, ie europeans, what we call nationalism here is what others call patriotism. It doesn't have a racist or isolationnist connotation by itself)
Edit: and of course I was talking about Quebec's national culture. That would suck if us, or any other culture would end up becoming american/generic, fueled by mass medias. And I most people would agree with this.
I was in Italy last year and most radio stations play english music 100% of the time. And there's a freaking McDonalds in Venice.
Nothing against America, but we don't want every country to become America...
It's funny that people around here (Quebec) make a big fuss about languages and such where in the US (around NYC where I've been last week) they translate a lot of signs to Spanish. I mean, I know the Hispanic population is huge in the US but as far as I know it's not an official language... here we fight about what should be in French, English, who should speak French, etc..
Not a big fan of language laws, but as long as we're part of Canada, they are necessary. French could easilly be wiped out of North America in a few decades. The same cannot be said about english.
But the Americans are on the verge on freaking out about immigration, which was never the case in Quebec.
It's funny that people around here (Quebec) make a big fuss about languages and such where in the US (around NYC where I've been last week) they translate a lot of signs to Spanish. I mean, I know the Hispanic population is huge in the US but as far as I know it's not an official language... here we fight about what should be in French, English, who should speak French, etc..
Well, technically the Spanish have no official language rights in the States, whereas Canada was colonized by both the French and the English and the Official Languages Act(1969) officially recognizes the bilingualism of the Canadian Government. (something a surprising amount of Canadians don't know). The reason/difference lies in historical roots of each country.
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Originally Posted by LeMAD
Not a big fan of language laws, but as long as we're part of Canada, they are necessary. French could easilly be wiped out of North America in a few decades. The same cannot be said about english.
But the Americans are on the verge on freaking out about immigration, which was never the case in Quebec.
That I agree with. But Quebec separating from Canada in my opinion would only speed up the process. Quebec within Canada is very very important for the preservation of the language outside of the Quebec borders. If Quebec separates say goodbye to French language rights outside the province within a short few years imo.
this may be true but the majority of human beings west of st laurent blvd are bilingual. and off island, umm no, it's not entirely francophone...there are large districts on west island (ok not off island but far enough - esp. kirkland pointe claire etc) and south shore that are anglophone and bilingual
In fact, 96% of the Island population know at least ''basic'' french.
Quebec City might be a better looking city, but if you had to choose one based purely on convenience, location, etc, would you really choose Quebec City? Sure it's a city not some small town, but it's not some where I'd want to live. Would much prefer Laval.
Laval is one of the worst place to live , next to Iraq and Korea.
It really is horrible , and I still can't forget their commercials they made not long ago comparing themselve to Mtl it was hilarious.
nothing to be jealous from.
