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Old
05-16-2010, 05:34 PM
  #1
yanokovich
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David Fischer?

What happen,do the Habs will sign him?

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05-16-2010, 05:38 PM
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Lucky Luke
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Wonder if they might call him up to cover Claude Giroux.

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Old
05-16-2010, 05:40 PM
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RoyBoyCoy
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I'd much rather the compensation 2nd rounder... I hope Gauthier doesn't sign him...

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05-16-2010, 05:45 PM
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Em Ancien
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Originally Posted by RoyBoyCoy View Post
I'd much rather the compensation 2nd rounder... I hope Gauthier doesn't sign him...
Doesn't work that way. It's if he doesn't sign that we get compensation, not if we don't give him an offer.

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05-16-2010, 05:50 PM
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beowulf
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Sometimes I wonder if he could surprise and turn into a decent dman. Who knows....

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05-16-2010, 05:52 PM
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RoyBoyCoy
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Originally Posted by MTLPacman67 View Post
Doesn't work that way. It's if he doesn't sign that we get compensation, not if we don't give him an offer.
Right! Damn. I always forget about that.

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05-16-2010, 06:54 PM
  #7
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Get him over in Hamilton ASAP

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Old
05-16-2010, 07:00 PM
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macavoy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MTLPacman67 View Post
Doesn't work that way. It's if he doesn't sign that we get compensation, not if we don't give him an offer.
Where does the 2nd rounder come from, the end of the 2nd round?

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Old
05-16-2010, 07:05 PM
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We are clearly trying to sign Emelin and have Fischer walk so we get a pick

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05-16-2010, 07:05 PM
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Schooner Guy
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Originally Posted by macavoy View Post
Where does the 2nd rounder come from, the end of the 2nd round?
It would be 20th pick of the 2nd round in 2011 (it's #20 because that's when we got him in the 1st round of 2006). As was mentioned, Fischer would have to turn down an offer from the Habs in order for us to receive that compensation.

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Old
05-16-2010, 07:06 PM
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Em Ancien
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Originally Posted by macavoy View Post
Where does the 2nd rounder come from, the end of the 2nd round?
Nah, they add a pick a round (30 picks) away from the pick with which the player was chosen.

It'd be the 51st pick if I'm not mistaken.

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Old
05-16-2010, 07:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Schooner Guy View Post
It would be 20th pick of the 2nd round in 2011 (it's #20 because that's when we got him in the 1st round of 2006). As was mentioned, Fischer would have to turn down an offer from the Habs in order for us to receive that compensation.
So, makes up for pick we gave up for Moore. In the end trade is Fisher for Moore. Good trade as doubt Fisher will ever make it

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Old
05-16-2010, 07:10 PM
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Em Ancien
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So, makes up for pick we gave up for Moore. In the end trade is Fisher for Moore. Good trade as doubt Fisher will ever make it
Why would he turn down a contract offer?

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05-16-2010, 07:11 PM
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Schooner Guy
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Originally Posted by GNick42 View Post
So, makes up for pick we gave up for Moore. In the end trade is Fisher for Moore. Good trade as doubt Fisher will ever make it
Easy now...let's not get ahead of ourselves! First of all, we have to make Fischer an offer (not sure if he's still in Habs plans). Second of all, Fischer would have to turn the offer down (doubt if he would do this).

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05-16-2010, 07:20 PM
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macavoy
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Kinda looks like we should have kept our pick and not traded SJ and drafted Ty Wishart, the guy who SJ drafted.

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05-16-2010, 07:23 PM
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Originally Posted by macavoy View Post
Kinda looks like we should have kept our pick and not traded SJ and drafted Ty Wishart, the guy who SJ drafted.
correct me if I'M wrong but we could have had SAnguinitti... thats the guy I wanted

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05-16-2010, 07:39 PM
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Schooner Guy
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Originally Posted by macavoy View Post
Kinda looks like we should have kept our pick and not traded SJ and drafted Ty Wishart, the guy who SJ drafted.
Wishart isn't exactly a high-end prospect these days. We essentially got Fischer and Carle in return for our original 1st rounder (I believe it was #16). You win some, you lose some.

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Old
05-16-2010, 07:42 PM
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RoyBoyCoy
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Originally Posted by macavoy View Post
Kinda looks like we should have kept our pick and not traded SJ and drafted Ty Wishart, the guy who SJ drafted.
Well if you want to play that game.. We should have not traded our pick and taken Chris Stewart.. Or trade our pick and take Giroux or Berglund..

But that's a game no one wants to play.

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Old
05-16-2010, 07:45 PM
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Love the Giroux comment. Because that's EXACTLY who Timmins-the-Hulk should have drafted, but since he wasn't really scouting the Q, and was in love with Minnesota, he preferred this loser to a future star.

Are the Wild looking for the head scout? He'd fit in perfectly.

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Old
05-16-2010, 07:56 PM
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Schooner Guy
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Originally Posted by deandebean View Post
Love the Giroux comment. Because that's EXACTLY who Timmins-the-Hulk should have drafted, but since he wasn't really scouting the Q, and was in love with Minnesota, he preferred this loser to a future star.

Are the Wild looking for the head scout? He'd fit in perfectly.
Wow, hindsight's a wonderful thing, isn't it? I guess 100% draft success rates are a common thing. All the other scouting directors who passed up on Giroux should be tarred and feathered too.

You normally post better than this one.

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Old
05-16-2010, 08:04 PM
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Garo
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Am I allowed to be pissed if I wanted Giroux at the time?

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05-16-2010, 08:07 PM
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macavoy
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Am I allowed to be pissed if I wanted Giroux at the time?
Only if you quote a post from before the draft where you said this.

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Old
05-16-2010, 08:12 PM
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Schooner Guy
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Am I allowed to be pissed if I wanted Giroux at the time?
I wanted Berglund but I didn't spend 1000's of hours watching these players like our scouting staff did so I'm not going to play the hindsight game and pretend I knew better. I do understand that drafting isn't an exact science and I'm not going to blow my lid over one pick. One year later, we may have plucked a franchise D-man in Subban in the 2nd round. Every team in the NHL had a chance to get him (well, except the Leafs because they traded their 1st and 2nd on draft day for Toskala).

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Old
05-16-2010, 08:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Schooner Guy View Post
I wanted Berglund but I didn't spend 1000's of hours watching these players like our scouting staff did so I'm not going to play the hindsight game and pretend I knew better. I do understand that drafting isn't an exact science and I'm not going to blow my lid over one pick. One year later, we may have plucked a franchise D-man in Subban in the 2nd round. Every team in the NHL had a chance to get him (well, except the Leafs because they traded their 1st and 2nd on draft day for Toskala).
Wanted Berglund as well but Giroux was right up there too. Nobody had Fischer that soon. Nobody. At best he was a HM on McKenzie list for the 1st round. HM.

What pisses me off the most about the Habs is just their lack of respect for the Q. No full time scouts, only part timers that were hired not that long ago with 1 guy with no experience at all and the other who had the great Dany Roussin as his best move in LA. Clearly, Timmins men of confidence are located in the US. And it shows.

Now, I'm not saying that we passed on 1000 Q players. We didn't. But clearly, with more experience here and a neat presence, we might have been able to sell Giroux to Timmins more than what we did.

Add the fact that when I asked him about Giroux, Timmins said to me how he didn't like his foot speed and that at our own combine, Mathieu Carle ate him alive. Said that it played a big part in not choosing him. Not inventing this. Now, I do have the right to believe that with nobody to sell the kid, there was no chance we'd picked him.

Yes it's one mistake. 2003, was another one. It's just 2 mistakes on top of others. But 1st round mistakes are big ones. And might chance the face of a franchise from better or worst. Anaheim with Getzlaf and Perry and a Cup. Philly with Richards and Carter and the 3rd team in the past years with the most victories in the playoffs and that WITHOUT a goalie.

You talked about the others that made mistakes. Well of course. And it shows on their performance. Don't ask why teams don't seem to be able to improve....it's mostly about their draft picks. Let's hope we don't compare ourselves to the worst, and let's aim the best. You can't have a superior salary structure for players, but you can't make everything you can so that everything is put down so that you limit as much as you can mistakes in the draft, especially the 1st rounders when, in general, you are able to add a top player, and especially in a salary cap era, where great but cheap players are the way to go.

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Old
05-16-2010, 08:58 PM
  #25
Schooner Guy
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Wanted Berglund as well but Giroux was right up there too. Nobody had Fischer that soon. Nobody. At best he was a HM on McKenzie list for the 1st round. HM.

What pisses me off the most about the Habs is just their lack of respect for the Q. No full time scouts, only part timers that were hired not that long ago with 1 guy with no experience at all and the other who had the great Dany Roussin as his best move in LA. Clearly, Timmins men of confidence are located in the US. And it shows.

Now, I'm not saying that we passed on 1000 Q players. We didn't. But clearly, with more experience here and a neat presence, we might have been able to sell Giroux to Timmins more than what we did.

Add the fact that when I asked him about Giroux, Timmins said to me how he didn't like his foot speed and that at our own combine, Mathieu Carle ate him alive. Said that it played a big part in not choosing him. Not inventing this. Now, I do have the right to believe that with nobody to sell the kid, there was no chance we'd picked him.

Yes it's one mistake. 2003, was another one. It's just 2 mistakes on top of others. But 1st round mistakes are big ones. And might chance the face of a franchise from better or worst. Anaheim with Getzlaf and Perry and a Cup. Philly with Richards and Carter and the 3rd team in the past years with the most victories in the playoffs and that WITHOUT a goalie.

You talked about the others that made mistakes. Well of course. And it shows on their performance. Don't ask why teams don't seem to be able to improve....it's mostly about their draft picks. Let's hope we don't compare ourselves to the worst, and let's aim the best. You can't have a superior salary structure for players, but you can't make everything you can so that everything is put down so that you limit as much as you can mistakes in the draft, especially the 1st rounders when, in general, you are able to add a top player, and especially in a salary cap era, where great but cheap players are the way to go.
McKenzie also had Patrick Berglund (the guy you and I both wanted) ranked as an HM so what's your point? Fischer was ranked #25 by THN and #29 in NA by CSB....both ahead of Giroux. RLR had Fischer ahead of Giroux. I'd hardly call Fischer a reach like you're claiming.

San Jose took Ty Wishart ahead of Giroux. Does that mean their amateur scouting isn't up to snuff? As I said, you win some....you lose some.

For all the whining about Giroux, I'd rather have Milan Lucic than five Claude Giroux's. Every team passed up on Lucic. Let go of the whining and the hypocrisy!

Regarding QMJHL scouts, I'm glad they knew enough to recommend Timmins not to take Esposito in 2007. The majority of this forum wanted Espo and thought they knew better than our scouts.

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