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Ranking the top 6 D of each Franchise

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Old
08-24-2010, 03:59 PM
  #26
IggyFan12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stank Mahovlich View Post
Justification:

Snepsts = 4th all-time in team games played. Tough, reliable, rock solid defensive defenseman. Was the team's best defenseman as he helped the Canucks to the 1982 Cup finals.

Butcher = 11th in games for the Canucks, similar in style of Snepsts. Solid, tough. Both players mostly flew under the radar due to non flashy play but both were very solid players.

I'm assuming you looked at point totals to put Lanz ahead of both Snepsts and Butcher.

I can't put Salo top six; the talent is there, and so is the slapshot, but his injury history is too troublesome.

Pairings:

Ohlund - Jovanovski
Lumme - Snepsts
Lidster - Butcher
Great post!! This is the kind of insight I need because I'm not a Cannucks fan and haven't followed hockey since 1982! I want the true top 6 that only fans of their teams can provide.

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Old
08-24-2010, 04:10 PM
  #27
TheDevilMadeMe
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I would give Fetisov to Detroit though - he was much better in Detroit than NJ. That way, you can also keep Fetisov-Konstantinov together on the 2nd pair.

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Old
08-24-2010, 04:17 PM
  #28
tarheelhockey
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I realize this lineup violates the rules, but I just had to do it for Boston...

Orr Bourque
Shore Park
Chara Clapper

How many teams would choose to simply forfeit the game?

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Old
08-24-2010, 04:18 PM
  #29
Dissonance
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stank Mahovlich View Post
Justification:

Snepsts = 4th all-time in team games played. Tough, reliable, rock solid defensive defenseman. Was the team's best defenseman as he helped the Canucks to the 1982 Cup finals.

Butcher = 11th in games for the Canucks, similar in style of Snepsts. Solid, tough. Both players mostly flew under the radar due to non flashy play but both were very solid players.

I'm assuming you looked at point totals to put Lanz ahead of both Snepsts and Butcher.

I can't put Salo top six; the talent is there, and so is the slapshot, but his injury history is too troublesome.

Pairings:

Ohlund - Jovanovski
Lumme - Snepsts
Lidster - Butcher
Solid list, though I'd consider swapping Butcher out for Dennis Kearns, who was the team's top defender in those brutal early years (even if he was sometimes/often a nightmare in his own zone), at least until Snepsts came along.

...unless we're accounting for the fact that the Butcher trade laid the foundation for those great early '90s Canucks squads, in which case definitely keep him in.


Last edited by Dissonance: 08-24-2010 at 04:25 PM.
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Old
08-24-2010, 04:27 PM
  #30
kmad
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I considered Kearns, but he was a little too much of a nightmare. I've taken the word of people who saw him play - think Marc-Andre Bergeron/Tom Poti/Andy Delmore.

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Old
08-24-2010, 04:27 PM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BiLLY_ShOE1721 View Post
It depends on how you're looking at the top 6 D. If you want the 6 best defensemen to ever put on a Flyers jersey, you're looking at:

Pronger-Coffey
Howe-Desjardins
Timonen-Jimmy Watson

If you're going for what they've accomplished as a Flyer, then it would look much different. Something like:

Howe-Desjardins
Jimmy Watson-Timonen
Joe Watson-Bladon/Therien
Brad McCrimmon needs to be on the all-Flyers squad.

Howe-McCrimmon was probably the best defensive pair of the 1980s.

Modified Flyers:

Mark Howe - Brad McCrimmon
Eric Desjardins - Jimmy Watson
Ed Van Impe - Andre "Moose" Dupont

Nashville needs Timonen more than Philly does.

Pat Stapleton - Bill White was one of the best pairs of the 1970s and absolutely has to be on the Blackhawks.

Modified Blackhawks:


Chris Chelios - Doug Wilson
Pat Stapleton - Bill White
Duncan Keith - Keith Magnuson

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Old
08-24-2010, 04:28 PM
  #32
BillyShoe1721
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ReenMachine View Post
Pronger went to the finals with the Flyers playing elite hockey it's probably more than Therien ever did.
Pronger's on the Blues.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Regal View Post
Timonen is on the Preds, which he probably deserves. I'd put McCrimmon on the team though.
Good call, how could I forget The Beast?

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Old
08-24-2010, 04:32 PM
  #33
kmad
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I'd consider Ed Van Impe for the Flyers.

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Old
08-24-2010, 04:36 PM
  #34
IggyFan12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Regal View Post
I'm not really a fan of the one team per player idea, because some guys just deserve to be on two. Not guys who only played a bit with another team, like Bourque for Colorado or Pronger for Edmonton, but MacInnis, like you mentioned might have been the best defenseman in both Calgary and St. Louis history (he and Pronger are a coin flip). But as for the actual lists:

Jim Schoenfeld deserves a place somewhere on the Sabres

I'd say Chara probably belongs on the Sens even though he won a Norris in Boston.

Pat Stapleton and Bill White have a case for being on the Blachhawk

Craig Hartsburg should probably be on the Stars

As was mentioned, Dave Burrows deserves a spot on the Pens, and Barclay Plager on the Blues
Chara was really good for Ottawa but he didn't have the impact as he does in Boston IMO. He's their captain and he won a Norris.

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Old
08-24-2010, 04:41 PM
  #35
BillyShoe1721
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Guys to add to certain teams:

Habs-Jacques Laperriere(even if you're only counting past 1967)

Doughty-he's accomplished more than Hardy in less years

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Old
08-24-2010, 04:50 PM
  #36
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These are some of the teams I would do:

SABRES
Phil Housley- Mike Ramsey
Jim Schoenfeld - Jerry Korab
Bill Hajt - Alexei Zhitnik

STARS
Sergei Zubov - Darryl Sydor
Derian Hatcher - Richard Matvichuk
Criag Hartsburg - Curt Giles

AVALANCHE
Sandis Ozolinsh - Alexei Gusarov
Adam Foote - Curtis Leschyshyn
Mario Marois - Normand Rochefort

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Old
08-24-2010, 04:55 PM
  #37
IggyFan12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BiLLY_ShOE1721 View Post
Guys to add to certain teams:

Habs-Jacques Laperriere(even if you're only counting past 1967)

Doughty-he's accomplished more than Hardy in less years
I was thinking Doughty, but didnt know if he has played in the league long enough? I think he should be in there do more people agree?

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Old
08-24-2010, 06:33 PM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IggyFan12 View Post
Because I put Coffey on the Oilers and Carlyle with the Coyotes/Jets. Which team was he most remembered for?
i didn't see the part where they were only allowed on 1 team, coffey makes sense now.

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Old
08-24-2010, 07:15 PM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IggyFan12 View Post
Chara was really good for Ottawa but he didn't have the impact as he does in Boston IMO. He's their captain and he won a Norris.
I thought Chara had a few more years in Ottawa than he did. I'd say its a bit of a pick-'em actually, with him playing 4 years with each, and having a mediocre first year with both. His Norris finishes are pretty close with 1, 3, 8 with Boston, 2, 4, 7 with Ottawa. I suppose the fact that he's Captain and is there for at least another year means he can be on the Bruins, but he probably is more important to the Sens franchise than he has been the to Bruins all-time

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Old
08-25-2010, 08:50 AM
  #40
tarheelhockey
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Regal View Post
I suppose the fact that he's Captain and is there for at least another year means he can be on the Bruins, but he probably is more important to the Sens franchise than he has been the to Bruins all-time
That's a good way to put it. The Bruins are more important to Chara but Chara is more important to the Sens.

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Old
08-25-2010, 09:41 AM
  #41
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Not to get too bogged down in the weeds on methodological grounds, but the modern-era and one-team-only restrictions really take the starch out of this exercise. There is a quick explanation of what the rules are in the OP, but not the explanation for why they are present. Justification? At any rate, the restrictions certainly make the title misleading. This isn't going to produce a ranking of the top six defense for each franchise at all.

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08-25-2010, 01:48 PM
  #42
IggyFan12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drake1588 View Post
Not to get too bogged down in the weeds on methodological grounds, but the modern-era and one-team-only restrictions really take the starch out of this exercise. There is a quick explanation of what the rules are in the OP, but not the explanation for why they are present. Justification? At any rate, the restrictions certainly make the title misleading. This isn't going to produce a ranking of the top six defense for each franchise at all.
The reason why I choose to include players who played only in the modern era is because most people have never seen players before the modern era play. Its unfair to compare a player based on stats alone with one we have seen our selves play.

Also I choose to include players on one team only because it seems wrong to compare the same player but in a different uniform. For example comparing Al McCinnis during his Flames days and Blues days doesnt seem right. Its like the Baseball Hall of Fame you can only go in with one team.

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08-25-2010, 11:34 PM
  #43
Hardyvan123
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stank Mahovlich View Post
In order:

Mattias Ohlund
Jyrki Lumme
Harold Snepsts
Doug Lidster
Ed Jovanovski
Garth Butcher

HMs to Sami Salo and Willie Mitchell
I like this but I would put Liddy ahead of #27 Snepsts and I think Kearns and McCarthy shoudl get honourable mentions as well.

pretty weak group overall though, i wonder why we have enver won the CUP...lol

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Old
08-26-2010, 07:44 AM
  #44
tony d
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Ottawa:

Chara-Phillips
Redden-York
Rachunek-Maciver

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Old
08-26-2010, 11:16 AM
  #45
Drake1588
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IggyFan12 View Post
The reason why I choose to include players who played only in the modern era is because most people have never seen players before the modern era play. Its unfair to compare a player based on stats alone with one we have seen our selves play.

Also I choose to include players on one team only because it seems wrong to compare the same player but in a different uniform. For example comparing Al McCinnis during his Flames days and Blues days doesnt seem right. Its like the Baseball Hall of Fame you can only go in with one team.
Although I never saw him play in the flesh, Doug Harvey would make my list of the Canadiens' top six defensemen.

Although I was only barely skating by the time Brad Park was heading for his third NHL team, I can still place him among the top six defensemen for both the Rangers' and Bruins' franchises.

While neither practice ought to be abused, there are certain players in the distant past or whose careers were bisected, such that they left indelible marks on multiple franchises, whose absences are deeply felt on such lists.

Al McInnis, to use one of your own examples, simply has to be on both the Calgary and St. Louis lists. They suffer if the rules prevent it.

The Hockey Hall of Fame doesn't induct players under one franchise name. In the new age of more fluid player movement, I would not be surprised to see Cooperstown abandon the practice as an anachronism as well, as more ball players who played over the last 20 years reach eligibility.

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