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08-27-2010, 07:31 PM
  #26
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Originally Posted by 2forsbergaura1 View Post
Sather has this stupid and arrogant way of low-balling good RFAs like Staal, Dubinsky and Callahan...its about time he paid for it.
Sather didn't low-ball Callahan. Nor Dubinsky, for that matter. Brandon wanted 4M a year which is absolutely absurd.

Sather should have been fired a half-decade ago, but not because of the way he handles his RFA's.

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Originally Posted by metalmilitia650 View Post
I'd say that the rangers gm is bad enough that we could get him. Maybe this is were we utilize clowe. Can we trade for rights? What would you guys give up?
Sather is a fool when it comes down to free-agency. But in trades, he truly is exceptional. Look at the trades he's made post-lockout. They're usually tilted in the favor of the Rangers.

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Originally Posted by UniversalRemonster View Post
Sather is screwing with the kid and everyone knows it.

And its not like the Sharks would be good trade partners with them anytime soon. The Sharks are not interested in picking up any overpaid UFAs anytime soon.

So, help the kid out and offer sheet away. 1 year @ $3.8m
If he matches, then who cares? At least its over with and Sather will have to deal with it again next year.
Screwing with this kid? What are you talking about?

Sather has two offers on the table, both exceeding the 3.8M per season. He's not hardballing Staal. He's trying to buy some UFA years. The number of years is why there's a delay. Not because Sather is screwing with him.

Get your facts straight.

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Originally Posted by magic school bus View Post
a trade would have to give Sather value of at least a 1st and 3rd.

im not sure what they would want in terms of prospects. they have a good prospects pool, its pretty well-rounded.
We're in a tough situation. There isn't a single soul on the Rangers roster than can replace Staal. Nobody on this team is reliable enough to defend against guys like AO, Crosby, and Kovalchuk.

We're weak up front. Our top-6 can certainly use a bona fide forward; preferably a playmaking center under 30 who can ultimately grow with the core of this team. But not at the expense of Staal.

It would take a massive overpayment to acquire Marc. His value on this team is as high as it gets.

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08-27-2010, 07:43 PM
  #27
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if it goes to a trade, I have a feeling the rangers will want a center... aside from nichol, I think the other centers are untouchable =/

offer sheet route seems unlikely considering the cap space rangers have

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08-27-2010, 07:43 PM
  #28
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Rangers/Sather will match just about any offer sheet.

Only way to get Staal IMO is through trade which will likely cost a fortune in return.

Don't get your hopes up folks.

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08-27-2010, 07:46 PM
  #29
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Couture isnt untouchable. Pavelski is.

Couture + 1st for Staal?

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08-27-2010, 07:48 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by magic school bus View Post
Couture isnt untouchable. Pavelski is.

Couture + 1st for Staal?
I think it would take more than that since Couture is relatively unproven. IMHO, the Rangers aren't going to trade away their franchise d-man unless they make out like bandits.

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08-27-2010, 07:50 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by SharksAddict View Post
Rangers/Sather will match just about any offer sheet.

Only way to get Staal IMO is through trade which will likely cost a fortune in return.

Don't get your hopes up folks.
Spot-On.

Quote:
Originally Posted by magic school bus View Post
Couture isnt untouchable. Pavelski is.

Couture + 1st for Staal?
Logan doesn't help the Rangers.

Pavelski makes things a little more interesting, but again, unless the Rangers have another trade in the works for a #1 dman it doesn't improve the team.

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08-27-2010, 07:50 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by SharksAddict View Post
I think it would take more than that since Couture is relatively unproven. IMHO, the Rangers aren't going to trade away their franchise d-man unless they make out like bandits.
i'm just trying to think of values in a trade that would be more than what Sather can get as offer sheet compensation (1st and 3rd round pick).

Couture (2007 1st) + 2011 1st

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08-27-2010, 07:58 PM
  #33
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if they don't take couture + 1st, there won't be a trade.

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08-27-2010, 08:06 PM
  #34
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As much as I love Pavelski (my third favorite player on the team), I would involve him in a trade for Marc Staal if that is what they were looking for. If: JT get locked up for 3 more years.

Marleau can center the second line and hopefully Cooter will be ready to take over that duty soon enough.

Gotta give quality to get quality, and Staal would legitimize our blue-line in a big way. My outlook on life in general would increase a billion fold! (since I am such a loser that my life revolves around Sharks Hockey)

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08-27-2010, 08:08 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by MadmanSJ View Post
As much as I love Pavelski (my third favorite player on the team), I would involve him in a trade for Marc Staal if that is what they were looking for. If: JT get locked up for 3 more years.

Marleau can center the second line and hopefully Cooter will be ready to take over that duty soon enough.

Gotta give quality to get quality, and Staal would legitimize our blue-line in a big way. My outlook on life in general would increase a billion fold! (since I am such a loser that my life revolves around Sharks Hockey)
You'd give Pavelski, our future captain for Staal? Staal is a good young defenseman, but I'd rather have Pavelski.

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08-27-2010, 08:09 PM
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And yes I realize that Pavelski just signed a new contract and took a home town discount... err sorry, "team building payroll" contract.

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08-27-2010, 08:19 PM
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Originally Posted by USF Shark View Post
You'd give Pavelski, our future captain for Staal? Staal is a good young defenseman, but I'd rather have Pavelski.
I would. We have the need there, and Staal is the kind of piece you can build your blue-line corps around. Beyond Boyle, there is not much in the way of heroic play. We have learned that Boyle can't do it all, and there is no one there that has shown they can pick up the slack. Every other team that has won it recently has had a premier 1-2 punch followed by an almost equally solid 3-4 pair.

Pavelski is clutch. I love him. He is money on the shootout. He shows emotion out there. He has carried the team. He was also shut down in a big way when the other team shifted their attention to him these past playoffs (Det game 3 and beyond). One playoffs doesn't tell the whole story, and Pavelski is the definition of intangibles.. but again: Quality for quality.

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08-27-2010, 08:20 PM
  #38
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DW doesn't do sign and trades.

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08-27-2010, 08:23 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by Ulrich Liechtenstein View Post
DW doesn't do sign and trades.
I know it would never happen.. but the cupboard is bare and DW has run out of options. I would thin the price would be cheaper now than come trade deadline.. but who knows.. DW likes to work on those deals that span months to a year wearing the other GM down.

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08-27-2010, 08:28 PM
  #40
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I don't see DW sending any more offersheets, so that means it's likely a trade rumor if anything.

Rangers defense would be pretty shoddy if they trade away Staal. It's equivalent to the Sharks trading away Vlasic except worse. Plus Sather is high on Staal so it's going to have to be a pretty big deal if he's dealt.

The only other big need of NY is a legitimate top-6 center and possibly a forward. We can assume Pavelski is untouchable since he just got a contract, so that leaves Couture and maybe Clowe. I'm not very fond of dumping Couture since he's unproven and his value will likely go much higher in a few seasons, but let's humor it for a bit:

Both Staal and Couture are roughly the same age. Future development and youth would still be kept by both teams, just switched in position. Staal is still looking for a contract, while Couture is still relatively cheap. If Sharks do intend to sign Staal, then more players would have to be dealt. Ideally it would be Huskins or Murray, since we can't really afford to deal Clowe with no top-6 replacement.

So the only beneficial trade would be:

To SJ:
Staal

To NY:
Couture
1st and/or 2nd and/or AHL prospects (like Joslin)
Maybe throw in Huskins for free so they can at least dress 6 NHL defenseman.


From a Sharks perspective this is great. We're out a 3rd line center but we can pick up someone like Nolan to fill in the role.

Looking at it from NY's perspective, there's no way Sather does this deal. He improves his forward depth a little, but at the cost of dismantling is defense. Couture's value isn't at the point where he can entice a GM's best asset, at least not yet.

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08-27-2010, 08:30 PM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by triplea112 View Post
if they don't take couture + 1st, there won't be a trade.
If the situation was reversed you would want a hell of a lot more than Couture and a 1st for Marc. Believe me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by USF Shark View Post
You'd give Pavelski, our future captain for Staal? Staal is a good young defenseman, but I'd rather have Pavelski.
Ryan Callahan is the future captain of the Rangers, but If we could move him for 1st line, or 1st pairing talent that can play tomorrow, it's a no-brainer.

Pavelski>Cally, so don't think I'm comparing their skills or value. Just providing some food for thought.

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08-27-2010, 08:31 PM
  #42
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Why Couture and not Clowe? Is Ryane Clowe the type of player the Rangers lust after?

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08-27-2010, 08:33 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by ChompChomp View Post
Why Couture and not Clowe? Is Ryane Clowe the type of player the Rangers lust after?
Trading Clowe leaves a top-6 hole in the line-up that the Sharks can't fill. It would strengthen our defense for sure, but our forwards would take a hit. Plus I think the Rangers would rather get a natural center.

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08-27-2010, 08:34 PM
  #44
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I'd probably do Thornton for Staal in a perfect world but it won't happen and I probably wouldn't do it right now with circumstances being what they are, even though the value would be tremendous.

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08-27-2010, 08:36 PM
  #45
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Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd View Post
I'd probably do Thornton for Staal in a perfect world but it won't happen and I probably wouldn't do it right now with circumstances being what they are, even though the value would be tremendous.
I disagree. Don't get me wrong, Staal is a great defenseman and would help out the defense immensely, but I think he's a little overrated due to his surname reputation.

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08-27-2010, 08:38 PM
  #46
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Rangers defense would be pretty shoddy if they trade away Staal. It's equivalent to the Sharks trading away Vlasic except worse. Plus Sather is high on Staal so it's going to have to be a pretty big deal if he's dealt.

The only other big need of NY is a legitimate top-6 center and possibly a forward. We can assume Pavelski is untouchable since he just got a contract, so that leaves Couture and maybe Clowe. I'm not very fond of dumping Couture since he's unproven and his value will likely go much higher in a few seasons, but let's humor it for a bit:

Both Staal and Couture are roughly the same age. Future development and youth would still be kept by both teams, just switched in position. Staal is still looking for a contract, while Couture is still relatively cheap. If Sharks do intend to sign Staal, then more players would have to be dealt. Ideally it would be Huskins or Murray, since we can't really afford to deal Clowe with no top-6 replacement.

So the only beneficial trade would be:

To SJ:
Staal

To NY:
Couture
1st and/or 2nd and/or AHL prospects (like Joslin)
Maybe throw in Huskins for free so they can at least dress 6 NHL defenseman.


From a Sharks perspective this is great. We're out a 3rd line center but we can pick up someone like Nolan to fill in the role.

Looking at it from NY's perspective, there's no way Sather does this deal. He improves his forward depth a little, but at the cost of dismantling is defense. Couture's value isn't at the point where he can entice a GM's best asset, at least not yet.
Couture and a 1st doesn't help. It really doesn't. Picks and prospects don't help much either. We're not rebuilding. Lundqvist isn't getting younger. We have guys like Dubinsky and Anisimov which can center the 2nd line just fine. Drury will stay on the third line. Boyle or Avery will center the 4th line. Prospal or EC will most likely center Gabby's line.

Next season Stepan should make the team. Top-6 potential. We also have some nice forward prospects like Grachev and Kreider. On defense we should see McDonagh make his debut with the team. We have Gaborik who can make any center look good. We also added Frolov which should help things out offensively.

It's not really a matter of not giving up enough for Staal. At the end of the day, does this trade make the Rangers (And Sharks) a better team? The answer to that is I don't think so.

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08-27-2010, 08:41 PM
  #47
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Originally Posted by Boom Boom Geoffrion View Post
Couture and a 1st doesn't help. It really doesn't. Picks and prospects don't help much either. We're not rebuilding. Lundqvist isn't getting younger. We have guys like Dubinsky and Anisimov which can center the 2nd line just fine. Drury will stay on the third line. Boyle or Avery will center the 4th line. Prospal or EC will most likely center Gabby's line.

Next season Stepan should make the team. Top-6 potential. We also have some nice forward prospects like Grachev and Kreider. On defense we should see McDonagh make his debut with the team. We have Gaborik who can make any center look good. We also added Frolov which should help things out offensively.

It's not really a matter of not giving up enough for Staal. At the end of the day, does this trade make the Rangers (And Sharks) a better team? The answer to that is I don't think so.
Which is why I don't see this trade happening. It doesn't fit NY's needs well enough and that's pretty much the extent that the Sharks can offer.

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08-27-2010, 08:42 PM
  #48
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Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd View Post
I'd probably do Thornton for Staal in a perfect world but it won't happen and I probably wouldn't do it right now with circumstances being what they are, even though the value would be tremendous.
Really? I guess it depends on what you mean by a perfect world. Thornton contributes more to the team offensively than Staal would ever do defensively. Not to mention he brings in all of the casual hockey fans; shut-down defensemen don't really do anything flashy.

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08-27-2010, 08:50 PM
  #49
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If the situation was reversed you would want a hell of a lot more than Couture and a 1st for Marc. Believe me.
I agree. and that's probably as much as the sharks would conceivably give up, so, no trade.

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08-27-2010, 08:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Chubbs View Post
Trading Clowe leaves a top-6 hole in the line-up that the Sharks can't fill. It would strengthen our defense for sure, but our forwards would take a hit. Plus I think the Rangers would rather get a natural center.
Right now we have a gaping top 4 defenseman hole that the Sharks seemingly can't fill. I'd rather fill out the top 4 dmen and take a small hit in the top 6 forwards, than vice versa. But maybe that's just me. I mean, you saw what our vaunted top 6 forwards did against the Hawks, and you also saw what Niclas Wallin and Kent Huskins did against them too.

Clowe for Kaberle made no sense with Kabs being an impending UFA. But Clowe for Staal? Seems to be an even forward for defense trade, maybe the Sharks even win a little too with Staal's age.

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