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NHL may reject KOVY and Luongo deals. Issues Ultimatium.

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Old
09-01-2010, 11:55 PM
  #151
Classic Devil
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Griffin View Post
Has anyone aside from Larry Brooks reported this latest ultimatum given by the NHL?
Larry is bad for a lot of things, but he's usually spot on when it comes to NHL/NHLPA stuff.

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09-01-2010, 11:56 PM
  #152
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Quote:
Originally Posted by go_leafs_go02 View Post
Citing Larry Brooks. Just curious that no other reporters/insiders have any information...

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Old
09-01-2010, 11:57 PM
  #153
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This is awesome Go NHL!!

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Old
09-01-2010, 11:59 PM
  #154
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Griffin View Post
What would be the point of that?
The way it's worded, years after the age of forty would not be counted towards the salary cap. It'd be legalizing back-loaded circumventing contracts

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Old
09-02-2010, 12:00 AM
  #155
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Originally Posted by JuniorNelson View Post
This could escalate into something as ugly as a walkout. This is push coming to shove in labour relations terms.
This. The NHL has really proven they are truly a joke. Such incompetence.

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09-02-2010, 12:00 AM
  #156
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Quote:
Originally Posted by None Shall Pass View Post
Hide ya contracts, cawse they voidin errbody out here



Run tell dat, GARY
My contract was attacked by some idiot in the NHL offices

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09-02-2010, 12:07 AM
  #157
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Originally Posted by bluesfan94 View Post
The way it's worded, years after the age of forty would not be counted towards the salary cap. It'd be legalizing back-loaded circumventing contracts
But what player is going to sign a contract where they get the bulk of their payday in their 40's?

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09-02-2010, 12:08 AM
  #158
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Originally Posted by Reverend Mayhem View Post
This. The NHL has really proven they are truly a joke. Such incompetence.
So incompetent they turned a failing business model into a successful one.

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09-02-2010, 12:10 AM
  #159
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Griffin View Post
But what player is going to sign a contract where they get the bulk of their payday in their 40's?
There was a situation described earlier.
Just as a basis
12 yr 56 mil
30-34 10m/yr
34-40 1m/yr
41 10m/yr

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09-02-2010, 12:10 AM
  #160
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bluesfan94 View Post
My contract was attacked by some idiot in the NHL offices

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09-02-2010, 12:10 AM
  #161
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Classic Devil View Post
Larry is bad for a lot of things, but he's usually spot on when it comes to NHL/NHLPA stuff.
The only thing I'm not sure I believe is the ultimatum characterization of the proposed settlement. For all we know this is the result of a back-and-forth negotiation and the deadline extension was to allow the PA to vote on it.

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09-02-2010, 12:12 AM
  #162
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bluesfan94 View Post
There was a situation described earlier.
Just as a basis
12 yr 56 mil
30-34 10m/yr
34-40 1m/yr
41 10m/yr
Except for the fact that is a completely illegal contract as far as the current CBA is concerned given the drastic drop in salary.

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09-02-2010, 12:13 AM
  #163
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very interesting.

i expect the PA to battle. That may mean luongo and hossa are out of luck.

NHL could face a pretty interesting PR battle, especially regarding hossa considering his play in the playoffs leading to the cup. If that contract is voided, it opens a lot of questions.

PA will have to fight the usual "players are greedy" thing, but this is about more than just these three players, it's about the battle with the NHL as well.

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Old
09-02-2010, 12:13 AM
  #164
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Griffin View Post
Except for the fact that is a completely illegal contract as far as the current CBA is concerned given the drastic drop in salary.
Well right, but something to that effect. Where it's loaded on both ends.

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09-02-2010, 12:15 AM
  #165
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If these contracts are signed in "good faith", why should the PA have any issues with future contracts under these rules?

I mean, you always hear the GM say the player will play until he's 40/41/42, etc

Should be fine.

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09-02-2010, 12:15 AM
  #166
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This has probably already been pointed out but Luongo has yet to play under his new contract, this will be the first year of it coming it. Brooks is wrong when he says it's the second year, like Hossa.

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Old
09-02-2010, 12:17 AM
  #167
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I can hear it now...

Yeah yeah Marian, we know you went to the Finals for three consecutive years and finally won the Cup BUT we're gonna need that ring back.

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09-02-2010, 12:18 AM
  #168
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Originally Posted by The Big Foot View Post
This has probably already been pointed out but Luongo has yet to play under his new contract, this will be the first year of it coming it. Brooks is wrong when he says it's the second year, like Hossa.
Brooks has corrected himself.

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Old
09-02-2010, 12:21 AM
  #169
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueChipProspect View Post
If these contracts are signed in "good faith", why should the PA have any issues with future contracts under these rules?

I mean, you always hear the GM say the player will play until he's 40/41/42, etc

Should be fine.
Right. Except now they would be able to be backloaded so that that money doesn't count towards the cap hit.

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09-02-2010, 12:22 AM
  #170
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You know whats halarious? Hossa FINALLY get his ring and if he gets his ring taken away...

The guy goes to the final 3 times and finally gets it .
Now that Chicago takes a step back he should sign with someone else, like Toronto, a guaranteed stanley cup final appearance.

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Old
09-02-2010, 12:23 AM
  #171
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Originally Posted by bluesfan94 View Post
Right. Except now they would be able to be backloaded so that that money doesn't count towards the cap hit.
You are correct, but why would a player want to back load it? Better yet, why would a team want to back load an old guys contract a lot? Why would they even want a guy with a high cap hit if he's starting the contract in his 30's? This is usually when the guys on the decline.

I can see if he's in his 20's though. A player could get injured or have to retire before he hits his late 30's and such.

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09-02-2010, 12:40 AM
  #172
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Epsilon View Post
This entire issue has been one of the biggest examples of making mountains out of molehills that I can remember. It affects a tiny percentage of players and a tiny percentage of hockey-related revenue payed out to players, yet everyone acts like its the biggest problem ever and the veritable end of the world.
It effects all the players.

The teams only have X cap dollars to spend. If they are forced to spend more of that number on their top end players, then they will be forced to employ more players under bargain contracts. This could foresee-ably shrink the middle class of players in the NHL, you would have a lot fewer guys making those 1.5-3 million dollar contracts who were now playing for less so that teams could pay their top end guys.

Think of it like this, if 5 players have to take 200k pay cuts on their next contract to make room for Luongo's extra million cap hit, there will probably be two or three guys looking at 10-20% pay cuts (and two more looking at smaller percentage losses, of course). That's five guys who's earning capacity was negatively impacted because the league wants to force the teams to honor the intent of the CBA (which they should).

It's the right thing for the league to do, and the NHLPA should be fighting it because it isn't in the best interest of their clients. Bettman should have nipped this in the bud, or the GM's should not have circumvented the cap so flagrantly . . . now the two sides could conceivably arrive at an impasse, only five years after the last lock out....

Sucks.

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09-02-2010, 12:40 AM
  #173
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bluesfan94 View Post
Right. Except now they would be able to be backloaded so that that money doesn't count towards the cap hit.
I fail to see why a player would play for a sum so little that it would significantly reduce the cap hit while they are still in their mid 30s. The only case where we see the dummy years in the current contract is well after a player expects to retire. Like 38+. Why would a player agree to earn so little at the age of 34 like you suggested?

In any situation, a player will have to play for $1M before earning his pay day in his 40s. No player in their right mind would do that.

Back loading a contract just wont happen. Players would never agree to contracts designed like the one you suggested earlier.

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Old
09-02-2010, 12:48 AM
  #174
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueChipProspect View Post
You are correct, but why would a player want to back load it? Better yet, why would a team want to back load an old guys contract a lot? Why would they even want a guy with a high cap hit if he's starting the contract in his 30's? This is usually when the guys on the decline.

I can see if he's in his 20's though. A player could get injured or have to retire before he hits his late 30's and such.
The Sedin twins. To play together for instance. IF they were free agents at the end of the season, they could theoretically sign deals like this so they could play together on a contending team that might not have the cap space to sign them to significant deals. Teams do it so that they can sign better players.

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09-02-2010, 12:50 AM
  #175
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Originally Posted by danishh View Post
very interesting.

i expect the PA to battle. That may mean luongo and hossa are out of luck.

NHL could face a pretty interesting PR battle, especially regarding hossa considering his play in the playoffs leading to the cup. If that contract is voided, it opens a lot of questions.

PA will have to fight the usual "players are greedy" thing, but this is about more than just these three players, it's about the battle with the NHL as well.
The report says the NHL will open an investigation on Hossa, not that they'd specifically void it. Maybe someone who knows more about the CBA can clear this up, but if Chicago is found guilty of circumventing with Hossa, the NHL doesn't HAVE to forfeit all their wins do they? That's just one option among penalties is it not? A cap penalty would be appropriate.

Unfortunately any CBA without a hard cap will always have loopholes to exploit and this is what happens when too many GM's try to sneak things through. NHL is basically saying "you had your fun but you pushed it too far so we're getting serious" and if they want to avoid any more crazyness between now and the next CBA they had to put their foot down and good on them. You just know that the next CBA these contracts are going to be a sticking point and we will all remember that it was the summer of '10 where the Devils and Kovy were the straw that broke the camels back.

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