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Caps/Sens/Blackhawks proposal

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Old
06-02-2004, 01:20 AM
  #1
EroCaps
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Caps/Sens/Blue Jackets proposal

To Ottawa: Olaf Kolzig, 2nd round pick, 57th overall (04)
To Washington: Patrick Lalime, 1st round pick (04)

To Columbus: (1st)22nd,(1st) 26th/27th,(2nd) 33rd overall(04)
To Washington: 4th overall

Flame away. :devil:


Last edited by EroCaps: 06-02-2004 at 04:57 AM.
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Old
06-02-2004, 03:17 AM
  #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EroCaps
To Ottawa: Olaf Kolzig, 2nd round pick, 57th overall (04)
To Washington: Patrick Lalime, 1st round pick (04)

To Chicago: (1st)22nd,(1st) 26th/27th,(2nd) 33rd overall(04)
To Washington: 3rd overall

Flame away. :devil:
#1.) No thank you to his $6.sth contract. I would rather have one of the good Caps goalie prospects, before Kölzig.

#2.) I'm not sure, if the Hawks want those low 1st rounders. I think I have a better proposal.

Hawks: LA's 1st (11th overall), WSH 2nd (26th overall)
Caps: CHI 1st (3rd overall)
Kings: Maxime Ouellet


Last edited by Safir*: 06-02-2004 at 03:21 AM.
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Old
06-02-2004, 04:03 AM
  #3
EroCaps
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TomACE
#1.) No thank you to his $6.sth contract. I would rather have one of the good Caps goalie prospects, before Kölzig.

#2.) I'm not sure, if the Hawks want those low 1st rounders. I think I have a better proposal.

Hawks: LA's 1st (11th overall), WSH 2nd (26th overall)
Caps: CHI 1st (3rd overall)
Kings: Maxime Ouellet
I figure that Ottawa almost can't go into the 04-05 campaign with Lalime, and considering the near deal on draft day for Kolzig and Witt, the two teams are well acquainted with the possibility. There aren't many other options for Muckler, either.

It's fairly common knowledge that McPhee likes Barker, and I've heard that Chicago may pass on D for depth, with Babchuck and Seabrooke in the system;also losing Sullivan, Zhamnov, and w/Daze's difficulties.

Lalime would be the perfect G to split duties w/Ouellet next season, Kolzig would get his opportunity in Ottawa, and the Caps move up to 3rd, holding onto that last first rounder for a depth pick.

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06-02-2004, 04:35 AM
  #4
Behn Wilson
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An emphatic no from Chicago's persepective on both proposed deals above.

We have a shot at an impact player at 3 in Olesz, Barker, or Ladd and already have 4 2nd rounders including the 2nd pick in the second round.

We arent trading down to pick up another pick.

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06-02-2004, 04:36 AM
  #5
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Lots of sense for you guys, You get cheaper and you get younger. Like Tomace I don't see Kolzig as the answer. You caps guys can dress it up anyway you like, but I'm not for giving you the moon and a stick for a debatable upgrade over Lalime. Frankly, I think such a deal would be terrible asset management.

Ottawa can always just turn to a Prusek and Emery combo next year. Or they could look at someone like Gerber or Garon and do it platoon style.

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06-02-2004, 04:54 AM
  #6
EroCaps
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Behn Wilson
An emphatic no from Chicago's persepective on both proposed deals above.

We have a shot at an impact player at 3 in Olesz, Barker, or Ladd and already have 4 2nd rounders including the 2nd pick in the second round.

We arent trading down to pick up another pick.
I forgot about the 4 2nds, that does change things from Chicago's perspective. I wonder how Columbus would feel if offered the same package?

It still would make some degree of sense for Ottawa, though. I agree that the difference/level of play between Lalime/Kolzig is arguably minute, but you can't ignore other factors weighing heavily. Namely, Ottawa in "win-now mode", probably doesn't want their Cup chances resting on Prusek or Emery.

Melynk wanted changes after they were defeated by TO, did he not? Ottawa was just shy of landing Kolzig at the deadline, and wasn't Melynk initially upset the deal didn't go through? What else can Ottawa do this offseason to address that need? I thought it made sense for both WSH/OTT.

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06-02-2004, 05:30 AM
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EroCaps
I agree that the difference/level of play between Lalime/Kolzig is arguably minute
This is the key point. And I am thankful that a caps fan has finally said it. It is a debatable upgrade, yet we're seeing proposals where Ottawa adds an extra 4 million onto the payroll (reducing the capability to take more on elsewhere) *and* throw in a 1st or Bonk or Volchenkov.

Quote:
but you can't ignore other factors weighing heavily. Namely, Ottawa in "win-now mode", probably doesn't want their Cup chances resting on Prusek or Emery.
I like to call it win forever mode. Mucks has made it clear he believes in Prusek. Does Prusek have weaknesses in his game? Absolutely. Every goalie does tho. I would hope that Ottawa doesn't bow to public pressure but instead makes hockey decisions.

Quote:
Melynk wanted changes after they were defeated by TO, did he not? Ottawa was just shy of landing Kolzig at the deadline, and wasn't Melynk initially upset the deal didn't go through? What else can Ottawa do this offseason to address that need? I thought it made sense for both WSH/OTT.
This is all speculation. Garrioch got a sniff of it and ran with it. However, Ottawa has more pressing needs to address imho and will need to manage its assets carefully.

1. Redden's Partner. Mucks may have dropped the ball on the de Vries trade (which I loved at the time). If Greg can't play with Redden then we've got quite a big hole to fill. We somehow have to arrange the pairings to get de Vries to eat 20+ minutes a night. You've got Chara and Phillips who are set. You then have Redden who you then might have to play with a combination of Pothier, Volchenkov, de Vries and maybe even Lechsychen if he comes back next year. How many goals did we give away to Toronto due to bad pinching? Quite a few. Redden was a team leading -5, next Bondra a -4, then Pothier and de Vries on -2. Redden had 1 point in 7 games. Now the previous year Redden was regarded as Ottawa's best defenceman in the playoffs and we were all crapping ourselves when he went down in the NJ series (I think it was game 3 or 4). Redden had 1 goal and 8 assists during that time and finished a +1 (mainly due to Rachunek's play tailing off in the NJ series and becoming a giveaway machine). That for me is what the #1 priority of the team should be. We need two solid pairings. If de Vries can't fill the void and is going to become the vet on the bottom pairing then its either Volchenkov or someone else.

2. Dirty goal man, we don't get enough garbage goals. Number of guys on the team who could fill the role (Fisher, Schaefer, Varada)

3. Scoring from the left side, I'd like to see more balance in our scoring. Oh what assets I'd give for Ryan Smyth!

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06-02-2004, 08:15 AM
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EroCaps
To Ottawa: Olaf Kolzig, 2nd round pick, 57th overall (04)
To Washington: Patrick Lalime, 1st round pick (04)

To Columbus: (1st)22nd,(1st) 26th/27th,(2nd) 33rd overall(04)
To Washington: 4th overall

Flame away. :devil:
I can't see any reason why the Caps would do the first deal with Ottawa, not do I see any reason why Columbus would do the second part of the deal.

Washington does not need Lalime. It is a much better idea to just sign a free agent goaltender like Potvin or Dafoe for a year or two to help out the young guys than to get Lalime. If Kolzig is dealt they are going to get a young defensman or forward.

And Columbus would never do this deal. This draft is so weak they basically get the value of 3 2nd round picks for Barker. Would you want the Caps to do that deal?

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Old
06-02-2004, 09:38 AM
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spezza
This is the key point. And I am thankful that a caps fan has finally said it. It is a debatable upgrade, yet we're seeing proposals where Ottawa adds an extra 4 million onto the payroll (reducing the capability to take more on elsewhere) *and* throw in a 1st or Bonk or Volchenkov.
I like to call it win forever mode. Mucks has made it clear he believes in Prusek. Does Prusek have weaknesses in his game? Absolutely. Every goalie does tho. I would hope that Ottawa doesn't bow to public pressure but instead makes hockey decisions.
This is all speculation. Garrioch got a sniff of it and ran with it. However, Ottawa has more pressing needs to address imho and will need to manage its assets carefully.

1. Redden's Partner. Mucks may have dropped the ball on the de Vries trade (which I loved at the time). If Greg can't play with Redden then we've got quite a big hole to fill. We somehow have to arrange the pairings to get de Vries to eat 20+ minutes a night. You've got Chara and Phillips who are set. You then have Redden who you then might have to play with a combination of Pothier, Volchenkov, de Vries and maybe even Lechsychen if he comes back next year. How many goals did we give away to Toronto due to bad pinching? Quite a few. Redden was a team leading -5, next Bondra a -4, then Pothier and de Vries on -2. Redden had 1 point in 7 games. Now the previous year Redden was regarded as Ottawa's best defenceman in the playoffs and we were all crapping ourselves when he went down in the NJ series (I think it was game 3 or 4). Redden had 1 goal and 8 assists during that time and finished a +1 (mainly due to Rachunek's play tailing off in the NJ series and becoming a giveaway machine). That for me is what the #1 priority of the team should be. We need two solid pairings. If de Vries can't fill the void and is going to become the vet on the bottom pairing then its either Volchenkov or someone else.

2. Dirty goal man, we don't get enough garbage goals. Number of guys on the team who could fill the role (Fisher, Schaefer, Varada)


3. Scoring from the left side, I'd like to see more balance in our scoring. Oh what assets I'd give for Ryan Smyth!
Great post, only thing I would add is that hopefully #2 and #3 can be accomplished with 1 player.
The Devries for Racunek and Giroux trade looks worse everyday. Slats took Mucks to school.

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Old
06-02-2004, 09:42 AM
  #10
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I am confused

r we talking about the BLUE JACKETS or the BLACK HAWKS--BJ's have number 4 and haks have number 3?

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06-02-2004, 10:34 AM
  #11
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Columbus won't give up the #4 for three picks when the highest one is only #22 overall. I doubt they would drop beyond the top five, to be honest, but certainly not outside the top ten. I think they want Barker, and might want him enough to flip something to Chicago to move into the #3 to make sure they get their man.

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06-02-2004, 10:41 AM
  #12
EroCaps
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drake1588
Columbus won't give up the #4 for three picks when the highest one is only #22 overall. I doubt they would drop beyond the top five, to be honest, but certainly not outside the top ten. I think they want Barker, and might want him enough to flip something to Chicago to move into the #3 to make sure they get their man.
So all in all, not my best proposal?


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06-02-2004, 11:23 AM
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EroCaps
To Ottawa: Olaf Kolzig, 2nd round pick, 57th overall (04)
To Washington: Patrick Lalime, 1st round pick (04)

To Columbus: (1st)22nd,(1st) 26th/27th,(2nd) 33rd overall(04)
To Washington: 4th overall

Flame away. :devil:
I assume you're thinking Barker at 4th overall with that trade...I just dont see him being the clear cut #1 dmen in this years draft...Id rather see the caps take quanity over quality with later 1st round or 2nd round picks, seems like the majority of dmen in this years draft are not seperated by a whole lot

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06-02-2004, 11:34 AM
  #14
Drake1588
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EroCaps
So all in all, not my best proposal?

Heh. I just think those teams will opt to take either the strong prospect defenseman or one of the high-caliber forwards available in those slots. One or both may maneuver around, depending on how badly one of the top five or eight teams wants a particular player, but I don't see either Columbus or Chicago being interested in trading down to beyond about #5-#8 overall. Teams like Atlanta, NYR might be able to get a trade done, dangling their first rounders plus something else. Teams dangling picks in the #15 range and later are probably out of luck.

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06-02-2004, 12:55 PM
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drake1588
Heh. I just think those teams will opt to take either the strong prospect defenseman or one of the high-caliber forwards available in those slots. One or both may maneuver around, depending on how badly one of the top five or eight teams wants a particular player, but I don't see either Columbus or Chicago being interested in trading down to beyond about #5-#8 overall. Teams like Atlanta, NYR might be able to get a trade done, dangling their first rounders plus something else. Teams dangling picks in the #15 range and later are probably out of luck.
I think Columbus is interested in trading down, but #22 is just way too far for them to fall for their first pick. They're a young franchise. They're starting to accumulate good depth, but the need to snatch up blue chippers while they can outweighs the need to stock their prospects right now.

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Old
06-03-2004, 09:37 PM
  #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EroCaps
To Ottawa: Olaf Kolzig, 2nd round pick, 57th overall (04)
To Washington: Patrick Lalime, 1st round pick (04)

To Columbus: (1st)22nd,(1st) 26th/27th,(2nd) 33rd overall(04)
To Washington: 4th overall

Flame away. :devil:
(1) Lalime has no value to washington so no

(2) No because Columbus would not trade that pick

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