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Was the goal in?

View Poll Results: Was the goal in?
Yes just look at the video. 144 35.73%
No. Khabby kicked it out. 34 8.44%
Inconclusive 161 39.95%
It was kicked in. 27 6.70%
Games over now so it don't matter 29 7.20%
NHL has a conspiracy againt a canadian team winning 8 1.99%
Voters: 403. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
06-06-2004, 02:34 PM
  #26
Troy McClure
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ObeySteve
In the end, most of you are voting for Inconclusive because you didn't want that to be the SC-winning goal....not because you actually think it isn't clear whether the puck is in the net or not.
Way to tell us why we're voting. I bet the people are voting inconclusive because it is hard to say.

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Old
06-06-2004, 02:37 PM
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Van
I cannot believe the results of this poll. It should be unanimous that the video is inconclusive.

Even Sutter says the video is inconclusive. That erases any debate.
Well its a message board, the board is here to debate.

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Old
06-06-2004, 03:30 PM
  #28
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Ooopsy, I was wrong.

Anyway, I really can't tell if it was in or not. That one perspective clearly shows about an inch of white paint between the puck and the goal line, but considering the angle of the camera, and the elevation of the puck, it's extremely difficult to tell if it's actually in or not.

One thing for sure, the call was botched IMO because there was never a "formal" review after the play, which was needed IMO.

I'm honestly a bit supprised that there are so few angles to be seen.

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Old
06-06-2004, 03:42 PM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ObeySteve
This issue itself should have its own thread. It's become aggravating to the posters of how mods want to try to merge together about 15 different topics into one, when the only thing they end up having in common is something have to do with controversy.

hey, there's the door.

maybe you don't see the big deal, but i didn't make this necessary, either.

SEVERAL posters that can't control themselves and conduct themselves like grown-ups made it necessary. if you had to try to sift through 15 threads that all had the same basic theme to them, looking for SOME intelligent posts, you'd want to make your job easier, too. i've begged, pleaded and threatened everyone to clean it up, but still they don't. in short, don't question my decisions until you've been in my shoes. there are 358979835 other hockey boards that allow you to start all the threads you want and call people "morons" and curse and everything else. if acting like an intelligent HOCKEY FAN is too much to ask of you, then please, find another place to post.

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Old
06-06-2004, 03:57 PM
  #30
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Furthermore, for those of you that think I enforce rules because it's some sort of "fun powertrip," I'd like to bring up something I posted in another thread, a while back:

Quote:
As the mod that I'm sure everyone has their panties in a wad over, allow me to step in and defend my actions.

While it might seem that I've been 'overmoderating,' I can tell you that experience has shown me that it's a necessary evil. Some of the threads might not have seemed that bad, but had that "this is going nowhere, fast" feel to them. Forgive me, but I just feel that "Vinny is a faker" threads are only going to cause problems...and when I take into account the types of volatile posts the people starting these threads are fast building a reputation for...I can only assume they're up to no good. I've been EXTREMELY lenient with what I'm letting fly in the game threads...simply because if I wasn't, one of every three posts would probably get deleted, by HF's standards. The whole thing that's great about this site, or at least the thing that drew me to it...was that by and large, there was no flaming. This was, at one time, *THE* place to talk in an intelligent manner, without some 13 year old clout saying, "U KNO NOTHIN BOUT HOCKEY, UR GAY" just because you said a penalty was unjustified. Is it just me, or does that type of thing kind of kill the atmosphere?

Understand that this is a job that I volunteer for, and donate my own free time to. It's somewhat thankless in that all you really succeed in doing is alienating posters that, while knowledgeable about hockey, can't control their tempers and keep from spitting venom at other people. It's a shame, because there's so much potential for more. We're in the middle of what is, in my opinion, the best Finals in recent memory, and we've got a select few ruining it by whining\attacking\blaming refs\insulting the opposition and most of all, baiting their peers with posts like, "Iginla is a coward!" or "Vinny is a faker!" Can any of you honestly defend that, or see the merit in conversation stemming from that? Probably not, because "conversation" never stems from it. Pissing contests and dunghurling do, so forgive me if I'll occasionally make a pre-emptive strike and close a thread. To my defense, as mentioned above, I've been perhaps too light on the disciplinary action...because I hate to have to send someone away at what should be the most exciting time for hockey talk in the year..but you can complain all you want about trolling threads being closed...but chances are, the ones that are doing the complaining are the ones that have barely dodged the bullet in the past, and that sort of consideration is fast fading from my list of priorities.

As for your belief that...as long as these threads aren't posted on the opposition's board...they aren't trolling...I have to disagree. I think that(and you probably agree,) no Calgary fan wants to read an entire thread devoted to how much of a coward Iginla is because he wears a visor...or an entire thread naming Lecavalier a pansy for "faking" an injury. If you're throwing this stuff out where fans of the other team are going to read\take offense to it, you're baiting\trolling. There is no good nature behind these threads, and I'm positive you're not naive enough to believe otherwise. These threads are posted to get people worked up. Maybe some people enjoy that...but I don't, and the rules here at HF don't, either. If you want to start those threads...I'm sure that they'd find a better home on the Calgary board or the Tampa board..where you can commiserate with your fellow, likeminded fans all you want.

This particular board will continue to be conducted and moderated in accordance with what I believe to be civil, intelligent conversation...pertinent to hockey(and not American\Canadian stereotyping, politics, etc) and if that's a problem to you, feel free to take it up with Buffaloed or Gee Wally, but I'm confident that they'll back me up. I'm simply adhering to the rules, and at the end of the day, you make a choice to post here. If you don't like these rules, the door is on the left, my friend. There are tons of other sites that cater to flamers\trolls. I simply choose not to patronize them.

-nmk

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Old
06-06-2004, 04:00 PM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nomorekids
hey, there's the door.

maybe you don't see the big deal, but i didn't make this necessary, either.

SEVERAL posters that can't control themselves and conduct themselves like grown-ups made it necessary. if you had to try to sift through 15 threads that all had the same basic theme to them, looking for SOME intelligent posts, you'd want to make your job easier, too. i've begged, pleaded and threatened everyone to clean it up, but still they don't. in short, don't question my decisions until you've been in my shoes. there are 358979835 other hockey boards that allow you to start all the threads you want and call people "morons" and curse and everything else. if acting like an intelligent HOCKEY FAN is too much to ask of you, then please, find another place to post.
U KNO NOTHIN BOUT HOCKEY, UR GAY

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Old
06-06-2004, 04:01 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SopelFan
U KNO NOTHIN BOUT HOCKEY, UR GAY

don't make me dig up the archives of the nashville\vancouver 1-1 tie, in which you and i went head to head :lol

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Old
06-06-2004, 04:01 PM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SopelFan
U KNO NOTHIN BOUT HOCKEY, UR GAY
You forgot to mention that the leafs suck. hehe.

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Old
06-06-2004, 04:03 PM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nomorekids
don't make me dig up the archives of the nashville\vancouver 1-1 tie, in which you and i went head to head :lol
Go play your washboard, hillbilly.

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Old
06-06-2004, 04:11 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by SopelFan
Go play your washboard, hillbilly.

go drink your maple syrup, Mountie!

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Old
06-06-2004, 04:13 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ObeySteve
10 minutes ago, the "Inconclusive" choice had more than 10 less votes than it does now.

Not going to jump to conclusions, but common sense says people don't vote that rapidly at this forum.



Hf is in on the conspiracy now too I guess.

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Old
06-06-2004, 05:15 PM
  #37
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I actually think it went in, but I don't blame anyone, even they had reviewed it, for not calling it a goal. It's far too inconclusive for it to decide a game.

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06-06-2004, 05:55 PM
  #38
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There is nothing inconclusive about it - the puck crossed the line and the puck hit the pad right in the bottom, which means it was not in the air. It was a GOAL.

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Old
06-06-2004, 05:59 PM
  #39
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Inconclusive. And bi*tching about it won't help anything. Stop complaining and cheer your team on for game 7.

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06-06-2004, 06:07 PM
  #40
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Some oxymoron fans who do not care for justice are trying to shut Flames fans up, but the truth is the Stanley Cup should have been hoisted by Flames 15 hours ago

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Old
06-06-2004, 06:10 PM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Siberian
Some oxymoron fans who do not care for justice are trying to shut Flames fans up, but the truth is the Stanley Cup should have been hoisted by Flames 15 hours ago

perhaps through your extremely biased eyes, that's true.

the poll says it. most impartial fans, and even a lot of FLAMES fans feel it wasn't conclusive enough to be a goal. Sutter even said it. Flames players are saying it. What gives you this special insight that causes you to believe that the Flames are just victims of some great conspiracy, again? You're the only one vehemently crying about this, now...and it's making you look bad. Move on to the next game.

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Old
06-06-2004, 06:21 PM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Siberian
Some oxymoron fans who do not care for justice are trying to shut Flames fans up, but the truth is the Stanley Cup should have been hoisted by Flames 15 hours ago
Complain all you want but it's not going to get you far, and in fact it's only going so far as to give you an ulcer.

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Old
06-06-2004, 06:37 PM
  #43
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I love New York...

Well, at least New York can't be blamed for this one. This comes under Toronto's jurisdiction. And please Mr. Sutter, give New York a break, we already have enough problems!

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06-06-2004, 06:44 PM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Siberian
There is nothing inconclusive about it - the puck crossed the line and the puck hit the pad right in the bottom, which means it was not in the air. It was a GOAL.
On the angle I saw the puck was within a 1/2 inch (looked like on) the ice, but the puck was on edge, so the widest part of the puck would be 1 1/2 " higher or well within 2 inches of the ice. I think a little math could prove it was in though characteristics of the camera lense as well as angle would have to be considered. I doubt the Video Judge ruled on it as the NHL claims. If they missed it before the next puck was dropped fine. It's no goal on that alone. Human error is part of the equation. The Hull goal was different because the puck was never dropped. That time the decision was gutless and self serving whereas this time it's merely a self serving statement that is irrelevant. That said, if they were fumbling through the evidence as the puck was being dropped and knowing it was that close....

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Old
06-06-2004, 06:45 PM
  #45
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The one angle that I've seen over and over again, at least a hundred times shows that it is clearly, 100%, no doubt about it, conclusively inconclusive.

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06-06-2004, 06:49 PM
  #46
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as a neutral fan i can only hope for the flames to win game 7 so this discussion will be ended.

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06-06-2004, 08:39 PM
  #47
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I still have yet to see anyone give a good explanation as to why it's inconclusive.

If anyone can do so, please do.

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06-06-2004, 09:03 PM
  #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Snakeeye
And that is the argument Colin Campbell should have used, rather than try to state the puck was not in despite the video. Why lie to everyone's faces when a perfectly acceptable, and legitimate, explanation exists?

And that is my problem more than anything. I don't know if it was a goal or not, one angle appears to say so but it could be an illusion, but why tell us they reviewed it when there is no way they could have loaded up every replay, do slow mo on them, blow up the picture like CBC/ABC did in between puck drops, maybe 20 seconds. It just not plausible. At least say, no one even thought it was in, Calgary didn't make any request to check, so we didn't have time.

Also, where are all these other replays that off ice officials supposedly have. Remember they have more replays/angles than TV crews. It would be interesting to see these replays, sadly we won't. Calgary may or may not have been screwed, but the league lying to everyone leads to the conspiracy theorist around here.

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Old
06-06-2004, 09:09 PM
  #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ObeySteve
I still have yet to see anyone give a good explanation as to why it's inconclusive.

If anyone can do so, please do.

because, if they're anything like me...upon seeing the replay several times(in my case, in high definition,) i see nothing that clearly shows the entire puck crossing the line?

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06-06-2004, 09:38 PM
  #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ObeySteve
I still have yet to see anyone give a good explanation as to why it's inconclusive.

If anyone can do so, please do.

The only camera that showed the puck was a side camera at an angular position. That angle has possibilities for optical illusions. If the puck was in the air, the white ice you see between the puck and the goal line is under the puck, not beside it. Since it cannot be determined if the puck was in the air or on the ice, there cannot be conclusive evidence from that angle that the puck completely crossed the line.

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