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NHLPA makes offer to league

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06-10-2004, 12:12 PM
  #1
goodrev
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NHLPA makes offer to league

http://www.thefourthperiod.com/cba2.html
Players' Association makes offer

As the NHL and the NHLPA continue their attempt to prevent a lockout next season, Quebec sports station RDS reports the Players' Association has made an attempt to keep the 2004-05 season on schedule.
Citing a source, RDS claims the Players' Association has offered a 10% reduction on salaries, a luxury tax starting at $45 million, and a rookie cap at $850,000, which includes all bonuses.

Additionally, the Players' Association has suggested that unrestricted free agency begin at 28 or 29, rather than the current mark of 31-year-old.



Meanwhile, Bob Goodenow, the head of the PA, appears upset with the effort of Commissioner Gary Bettman.

Bettman apparently insists on a hard salary cap around the $35 million mark.

Many hockey enthusiasts and players are concerned over the possibility of there being a lockout next season.

"If I was to wager a guess right now, I'd say there won't be hockey," Lightning defenseman Jassen Cullimore told the Tampa Tribune. "I don't see a light at the end of the tunnel."

It's uncertain, at this point, how the league will counter the PA's offer


this sounds like a pretty reasonable offer to me, i think the nhlpa knows that the sport can not afford a lockout and naturally want to have a season next year. this deal is very good if you ask me, the only problem i have with it is that i would like the 45 million dollar luxury tax to be a salary cap, OR be have a thing in the contract that integrated it into a salary cap over a few years

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06-10-2004, 12:30 PM
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Just a poisin pill offer for public relations. A 10% reduction on the at best 1/3 of the leagues players. The other players still can demand as they wish, and when the 1/3 's contracts expire , most the very next season, they'll want that back and alot more. You don't say what the luxury tax rate is . 1% maybe. A luxury tax starting at 45 million? Why don't they just say free market system? The idea is that the management makes some money, not maintaining the status quo. It's great that you think it's reasonable, but I'm guessing it's not your money, either way.

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06-10-2004, 12:57 PM
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i know the NHLPA will not take a 35 or 31 million dollar cap, or maybe even a cap at all, but i think that the NHLPA is taking steps to try and get this thing resolved with this offer which i dont think is that horrible... i am just happy to see that the NHLPA is offering things before 1 week before the start of the scheduled season which is what i expect them to do because that is when they hold all their leverage, so all in all the NHLPA making this offer is a great thing and the NHL should jump on this and negotiate down from here... this is just a starting point and hopefully both teams will get what they want (and i think the 10% is on more than 1/3 the players, and if it isnt than it is on the big contracts like jagr, leclair etc... 6-7 mill+)

i agree with the lowering of free agents age to 28-29 because at 31 a player is allready on his way out of his prime. i have been saying all along that there is no way that the NHLPA goes for a cap around 31-35 million because that is simply too low in their eyes, if the nhl got them to agree to a cap at 40-45 mill they should jump on it without thinking twice... the reason i know 35 mill is to little, BOTH tampa and calgary if they resign most of their key FA's will have a salary near 40 million, and the big thing with them was that they had such low salaries and were in the stanley cup, whoo hoo!!! small market teams cannot ice a 40 million dollar team, but with other teams not spending big on big players like they have, they would be able to get a big player for cheaper, and even more a good player for even less than that...

the low point of the NHL's existance and sign that something really needed to change immediately- bobby holik getting a 9 mill a year contract, as i tell all my friends that are ranger fans, he is a great 4 million dollar a year player, and that will all be changed with a hard cap

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06-10-2004, 01:33 PM
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The PA is really pissing me off, noone deserves more than 5 million, it's ridiculous.
Stop being a bunch of babies and swallow it. You're still getting paid plenty of money to play hockey. I wonder how long these idiots would last working an 8-5 job at minimum wage.

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06-10-2004, 01:49 PM
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New reality TV show John leclair works at MCdonalds


John:so how much u payin me

Manager:4.15

John: U mean 4.15 million?

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06-10-2004, 01:51 PM
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I like the offer a lot, actually. It's something I was hoping the NHL and NHLPA would come to a compromise at in the end.

Bettman wants a $35 million cap? What horse ****. You'd think the guy that put the NHL in the situation it is today would be more in favor of a gradual change.

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06-10-2004, 01:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ObeySteve
I like the offer a lot, actually. It's something I was hoping the NHL and NHLPA would come to a compromise at in the end.

I really don't think that is much of a compromise. Teams like Pitt and Car still lose because there is no cap plus the tax level is higher that a lot of teams can afford to spend. Also, players get a chance for free agent money much sooner which will drive up salaries. This deal hurts small market teams more than the current deal does. The PA is plan out using smoke amd mirrors so they look like the good guys.


Last edited by Cuiff: 06-10-2004 at 02:04 PM.
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06-10-2004, 02:01 PM
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35 Million is too low and will never happen. It's Bettman's pipe dream, I can't wait to see him get the @#$% out of dodge.

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06-10-2004, 02:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Teezax
35 Million is too low and will never happen. It's Bettman's pipe dream, I can't wait to see him get the @#$% out of dodge.

I agree but salary taxes don't work. Look at baseball and basketball. Salaries are totally out of control in those sports. The NFL has it right!

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06-10-2004, 02:40 PM
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thats right, salary taxes do not work and will never work because teams will continue to spend pay the tax and continue to spend... there has to be a hard cap instated otherwise the whole salary controll system will not work period

that is unless the tax is around 40-50%, i would definately think twice of overspending then

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06-10-2004, 02:56 PM
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Goodenow denies this report on ww.tsn.ca

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06-10-2004, 03:15 PM
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Originally Posted by George Bachul
Goodenow denies this report on ww.tsn.ca

lol...and I was just about to comment that acknowledging the problem is a start.

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06-10-2004, 03:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cuiffitelli
I agree but salary taxes don't work. Look at baseball and basketball. Salaries are totally out of control in those sports. The NFL has it right!
You can't compare the NFL to any other league. They get a ridiculous national TV contract.

You wouldn't think it was so great to be a member of the NFLPA.

You realize that if the NHL all of a sudden had a $35 million hard cap that the only thing that would change is that Ed Snider/Comcast would be making $20-30 million per season.

Ticket prices would NOT go down and at least one NHL season would be lost.

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06-10-2004, 03:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cuiffitelli
I agree but salary taxes don't work. Look at baseball and basketball. Salaries are totally out of control in those sports. The NFL has it right!
Uh, the NBA has the best system of the 4 sports. No franchise is having any real financial problems, while teams don't get penalized for being successful and dynasties can still exist in the NBA.

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06-10-2004, 03:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goodrev
thats right, salary taxes do not work and will never work because teams will continue to spend pay the tax and continue to spend... there has to be a hard cap instated otherwise the whole salary controll system will not work period

that is unless the tax is around 40-50%, i would definately think twice of overspending then
Um, most of the ideas for a soft cap include a 100% tax for each dollar spent after a team spends their first $45 million, or whatever the number is set at.

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06-10-2004, 03:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ObeySteve
Uh, the NBA has the best system of the 4 sports. No franchise is having any real financial problems, while teams don't get penalized for being successful and dynasties can still exist in the NBA.

Sure, giving $4 mil to a player who comes off the bench is a good financial plan

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06-10-2004, 04:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cuiffitelli
Sure, giving $4 mil to a player who comes off the bench is a good financial plan
So basically you'd prefer the owners to get rich, rather than the players.

I could care less, which of the two sides gets rich, just give me a good product to watch, and no work stoppage.

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06-10-2004, 04:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ObeySteve
Uh, the NBA has the best system of the 4 sports. No franchise is having any real financial problems, while teams don't get penalized for being successful and dynasties can still exist in the NBA.
That is because they have lower expenses. They have fewer players to sign (which allows them to spend more per player), no farm system and a decent TV deal.

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06-10-2004, 04:21 PM
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I am willing to agree on $35 or 40 Millions cap if owners willing to reduce the ticket prices... Will they do that? Offcourse not... In that case I will support NHPA... These owners are already rich and yes it is a business but how much profit is enough for them! I guess we all are greedy... Nothing is enough for us... If owners don't ruduce the price of ticket than I will say owners are being too greedy and I am supporting the NHLPA on this one...

How about this a 15% reduction on salaries of every player making over $5 Millions and 10% reduction on salaries of every player making below $5 Millions, a luxury tax starting at $40 million dollars for dollars; example: (if u go $5 Millions over $40 Millions you have to pay $5 Millions taxes) and these money will equally distribute to the teams that actually lossing money or can't compete with big market teams, these teams also have to share their profits with small market teams that cannot compete with big market teams and a rookie cap at $500,000, which includes all bonuses. If a player who is 28 years old can be unrestricted free agent...

What's your thought on my offer....

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06-10-2004, 04:22 PM
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I think that the NHL should just work down to a hard-cap at 45 mill and also put a limit on player salary. the problem is that the players would never accept this and it'll take them a year playing in europe to realize how good they had it in the NHL.

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06-10-2004, 06:31 PM
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Once again, we keep getting the general "owners are money-grubbing and trying to exploit the workers/players" argument that comes up in just about any argument in the world relating to businesses.

By the way...I can't help but laugh at how people look at the NFL and say that a hard cap would work wonders for the NHL like it apparently did for them.

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06-10-2004, 07:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cuiffitelli
I really don't think that is much of a compromise. Teams like Pitt and Car still lose because there is no cap plus the tax level is higher that a lot of teams can afford to spend. Also, players get a chance for free agent money much sooner which will drive up salaries. This deal hurts small market teams more than the current deal does. The PA is plan out using smoke amd mirrors so they look like the good guys.
It could work though, at least it is a more manageable offer.

A hard cap of 35 million is ridiculous. You cannot expect teams to shave off 30 million dollars in payroll.

It is a starting point, although Goodenow said that he didn't offer this and that it is just a rumour. He has denied.

What I think the best situation would be is a hard cap at 50 million dollars. But have a luxury tax begin at say 37 million dollars. That way it allows teams to spend the money but it also will tax them. As opposed to hard capping around the salaries of the Pittsburgh's and to begin with.

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06-10-2004, 07:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ObeySteve
Once again, we keep getting the general "owners are money-grubbing and trying to exploit the workers/players" argument that comes up in just about any argument in the world relating to businesses.

By the way...I can't help but laugh at how people look at the NFL and say that a hard cap would work wonders for the NHL like it apparently did for them.
Completely different leagues. The NFL doesn't need to promote players to succeed in the US. The NHL needs to do that. Having things like non-guaranteed contracts would kill the NHL even further if say a team like Washington sells all their players to go for the #1 pick, but say there is no New York that will take Jagr salary so they cut him.

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06-10-2004, 07:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan
You can't compare the NFL to any other league. They get a ridiculous national TV contract.

You wouldn't think it was so great to be a member of the NFLPA.

You realize that if the NHL all of a sudden had a $35 million hard cap that the only thing that would change is that Ed Snider/Comcast would be making $20-30 million per season.

Ticket prices would NOT go down and at least one NHL season would be lost.
Actually, you can compare the model the NFL uses with regards to salary structure. The NFL has it right. Star players get star money, low end players get low end money. The fact that they have a crazy TV contract is irrelevant. They got the contract because they are THE #1 rated sport in the USA. That's the fact of the matter. As well, the players union and the owners are on the same page and are always looking out for the best interests of the game. The same cannot be said for the NHL. Even MLB owners and players are getting on the same page. So, in order for the NHL to get on the same page as the NFL and other franchises, the two unions need to work on working together, not proposal/counter-proposal. Instead of talking about what needs to be fixed, how about talking about what is working and go from there? To me, to start out adversarial right off the bat is counter productive. To be honest, both just don't get it and that is the reality of the situation.

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06-10-2004, 07:57 PM
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i think a hard cap would be great, it would put a end to teams buying veterans at the trade deadline and force teams to go into the playoffs with what they have had all season

if there is a cap installed the trade deadline needs to be moved up so that they have to be accountable for the salaries they are taking on, if they dont then they can just trade for 50 guys at the deadline and say well most of his salary is paid allready... thats one thing i hate about the NHL is the selling of players at the trade deadline where teams out of contention will trade EVERY veteran they have and go into rebuilding, that kills fanbases. it just bothers me i think the deadline is very exciting, but i think it is way too late, teams should decide wether or not they are making a playoff push before the last month of the season

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