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CIS Hockey: Official Hollywood Top 34: 2010-11

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Old
11-19-2010, 10:22 PM
  #51
FreddtFoyle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VRedsRule View Post
Sixth spot should go to conference that produced last year's champion. A reward for performance!!!
Isn't that how CIS Volleyball handles the wildcard?

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Old
11-19-2010, 11:01 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by RED ARMY EAST View Post
This is the best format (2,2,2), regardless of the OUA having the most teams!
A National Championship is a showcase of the CIS's best talent and I totally disagree with 3 births going to one conference, especially the OUA! "Bob Total Hockey" is dead on when you look at the results dating back to 2004. Even then, UNB outshot UQTR something like 50-20 and lost in the semi-final. That game was stolen by a goaltender that had an unbelievable game. UQTR was the most recent team to win at Nationals from that conference, but unlike some others on this site are led to believe, yes it can happen in a one game final and could happen this year?
An 8 team tournament is to much, that's what the league playoffs are for!
I also like the 2-2-2 format with one team from each conference per pool because it creates interesting matchups that you don't see throughout the year and is easier to see how the conferences match up. I am interested to see games between teams like Saskatchewan and SMU for example, which are not regular occurences. Years where one conference gets 3 teams is frustrating, especially when one conference only has one berth, but has other teams sitting at home that could very well beat most of the rest of the field.

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Old
11-20-2010, 01:24 AM
  #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FreddtFoyle View Post
Isn't that how CIS Volleyball handles the wildcard?
Volleyball has four from the CW and four from the east. The Q and A have only 3 teams each, but still get 3 berths in the nationals! The O has 11 teams and gets one spot.

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11-20-2010, 07:56 AM
  #54
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I thought it was women's hockey who gave the wild card to the conference who produced the previous seasons champion?

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Old
11-20-2010, 08:24 AM
  #55
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Originally Posted by UNB Bruins Fan View Post
I thought it was women's hockey who gave the wild card to the conference who produced the previous seasons champion?
Maybe. I know there is at least one CIS sport that give the wildcard, or extra spot, to the conference of the previous champion, but I can't remember which.

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Old
11-20-2010, 05:04 PM
  #56
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Two huge wins for the Badgers this weekend.

A big 8-2 win over #8 Concordia (CIS rankings) on Friday and a 3-2 SO win over #2 McGill today, handing McGill their first loss of the season.

The Badgers have a very young team that looks to be coming together quite nicely. They are very good defensively and are getting excellent goal-tending from Kurt Jory (6th OUA). The Badgers largest margin of defeat this year was by 2 goals (which has only happened once) to the Laurier Golden Hawks in their third game of the season. The Badgers have played in ten one-goal games with six going to extra time.

The Biggest problem the Badgers have had this year is putting pucks in the net (which is the same problem as last year) but are getting wins because of that strong defensive play. They currently have scored 38 goals, allowed 35 in 13 contests. If the Badgers can find some more offensive firepower and keep up the stong defensive play I think we are going to see good things from the club.

FWIW Hollywood, I was the one doing the Badgers updates last year. I wish I could still cover Brock on a regular basis but career choices have taken me down to Rockford, Illinois.

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Old
11-20-2010, 10:21 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by prefy View Post
Two huge wins for the Badgers this weekend....
Nice to hear from one of the flock who went astray. There is no reason why one cannot follow along anywhere they have the internet. And Brock's website is better than average, too.

I saw Brock play Manitoba in pre-season. You can check the Bison thread and I dissed Brock. They looked way below the calibre of every team in the CW. But maybe some stiff opposition is what they needed. They are now firmly in the mid-range of the OUA. Still this weekend is pretty good. McGill was #8 in the OHT34.

BTW, do you follow the Rockford Icehogs? They split a pair of games in Manitoba this week.


Last edited by Hollywood3: 11-20-2010 at 10:32 PM.
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Old
11-20-2010, 10:39 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Hollywood3 View Post
Nice to hear from one of the flock who went astray. There is no reason why one cannot follow along anywhere they have the internet. And Brock's website is better than average, too.

I saw Brock play Manitoba in pre-season. You can check the Bison thread and I dissed Brock. They looked way below the calibre of every team in the CW. But maybe some stiff opposition is what they needed. They are now firmly in the mid-range of the OUA. Still this weekend is pretty good. McGill was #8 in the OHT34.

BTW, do you follow the Rockford Icehogs? They split a pair of games in Manitoba this week.
Ya I think it was more of the fact that in the team is so young and in the pre-season it was many of the guys first time together. From what I have heard the team is really coming together and rallying around Kurt Jory.

As for following the team it is more of a time issue for me. I'm working with the IceHogs (broadcasting intern), so my schedule is pretty hectic.

I have started up a blog, I do have a guy that writes for me on a regular basis about the Badgers. I also write IceHogs and AHL stuff there too. I can't post a link to it on the forums (as it is against their rules) but you can fire me a pm if you want a link.

Props on the OHT34! I like the rankings.

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Old
11-21-2010, 11:56 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by prefy View Post
Two huge wins for the Badgers this weekend.

A big 8-2 win over #8 Concordia (CIS rankings) on Friday and a 3-2 SO win over #2 McGill today, handing McGill their first loss of the season.

The Badgers have a very young team that looks to be coming together quite nicely. They are very good defensively and are getting excellent goal-tending from Kurt Jory (6th OUA). The Badgers largest margin of defeat this year was by 2 goals (which has only happened once) to the Laurier Golden Hawks in their third game of the season. The Badgers have played in ten one-goal games with six going to extra time.

The Biggest problem the Badgers have had this year is putting pucks in the net (which is the same problem as last year) but are getting wins because of that strong defensive play. They currently have scored 38 goals, allowed 35 in 13 contests. If the Badgers can find some more offensive firepower and keep up the stong defensive play I think we are going to see good things from the club.

FWIW Hollywood, I was the one doing the Badgers updates last year. I wish I could still cover Brock on a regular basis but career choices have taken me down to Rockford, Illinois.
Brock and Laurier are both young teams and it looks like Brock is indeed coming together. In the preseason both Laurier and Brock got outshot around 35-15 and lost 5-1 against Guelph. It was around that time Brock went out to Manitoba. They seem to be playing much better hockey, and some of their new guys are scoring more, and I think some guys (like Thomas Stajan) have untapped offensive potential.

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Old
11-22-2010, 12:47 AM
  #60
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Official Hollywood Top 34 - #8

November 21, 2010

THE OFFICIAL HOLLYWOOD TOP 34 ~ 2010-11

It seems like the season just started, yet here we are at week #8 of THE OFFICIAL HOLLYWOOD TOP 34. And as usual, here are the links:Here are last week's results:
  • Nov. 17
    Acadia 5 Saint Mary's 8
    StFX 5 Dalhousie 2

    Nov. 19
    Moncton 1 UNB 3
    St. Thomas 3 UPEI 6
    Saint Mary's 4 StFX 5
    Acadia 3 Dalhousie 4 OT
    McGill 3 York 2
    Concordia 2 Brock 8
    Carleton 5 UOIT 3
    Ryerson 0 Waterloo 4
    UQTR 5 Windsor 4
    Queen's 3 Guelph 6
    RMC 2 Laurier 9
    Toronto 5 Western 4 OT
    Nipissing 1 Lakehead 10
    Regina 3 Lethbridge 2 OT
    Saskatchewan 4 Alberta 6
    Manitoba 2 UBC 3 OT

    Nov. 20
    UQTR 3 Windsor 2
    McGill 2 Brock 3 OT
    Dalhousie 2 Saint Mary's 1 OT
    Moncton 3 UPEI 6
    Ottawa 3 York 4
    RMC 3 Guelph 7
    Queen's 1 Laurier 2
    Nipissing 3 Lakehead 4 OT
    Concordia 4 UOIT 6
    Ryerson 3 Western 6
    Toronto 1 Waterloo 3
    Regina 0 Lethbridge 4
    Saskatchewan 4 Alberta 3 OT
    Manitoba 3 UBC 4 OT

    Nov. 21
    St. Thomas 0 UNB 4
And here are the rankings:
Code:

                ------------------------------------------
               |   A  |   B  |   C  |   D  |  CIS | TOTAL |
 ---------------------------------------------------------
|   A          |      |      |      |      |      |       |
| 1 UNB        | 1-1-0| 7-1-0| 0-0-0| 2-0-0| 4-0-0|14-2-0 |
| 2 ALBERTA    | 0-0-0| 6-1-1| 4-0-0| 0-0-0| 0-1-0|10-2-1 |
|---------------------------------------------------------|
|   A-         |      |      |      |      |      |       |
| 3 ST MARY'S  | 1-1-0| 5-3-1| 0-0-0| 0-0-0| 0-0-0| 6-4-1 |
|---------------------------------------------------------|
|   B+         |      |      |      |      |      |       |
| 4 UPEI       | 2-1-1| 4-2-0| 0-0-0| 2-0-0| 1-0-0| 9-3-1 |
| 5 MANITOBA   | 0-0-0| 2-0-4| 4-2-0| 0-0-0| 2-0-0| 8-2-4 |
| 6 CALGARY    | 0-3-1| 4-1-1| 2-0-0| 0-0-0| 0-2-0| 6-6-2 |
| 7 W. ONTARIO | 0-0-0| 3-0-0| 8-0-2| 0-0-0| 0-0-0|11-0-2 |
| 8 MCGILL     | 0-0-0| 0-0-0|11-0-1| 2-0-0| 0-0-0|13-0-1 |
|---------------------------------------------------------|
|   B          |      |      |      |      |      |       |
| 9 SASK.      | 1-1-0| 4-2-0| 2-2-0| 0-0-0| 0-0-0| 7-5-0 |
|10 ST F-X     | 2-2-0| 3-3-1| 0-0-0| 1-0-0| 1-0-0| 7-5-1 |
|11 MONCTON    | 0-3-0| 4-3-0| 0-0-0| 1-0-1| 0-0-0| 5-6-1 |
|12 UBC        | 1-1-0| 2-2-2| 2-1-1| 0-0-0| 0-0-0| 5-4-3 |
|13 ACADIA     | 0-3-0| 3-2-2| 0-0-0| 2-0-0| 1-1-0| 6-6-2 |
|14 DALHOUSIE  | 1-2-0| 3-4-0| 0-0-0| 2-0-0| 0-0-0| 6-6-0 |
|---------------------------------------------------------|
|   B-         |      |      |      |      |      |       |
|15 WATERLOO   | 0-0-0| 1-4-0| 8-1-0| 0-0-0| 0-0-0| 9-5-0 |
|16 LAKEHEAD   | 0-0-0| 1-0-1| 8-4-0| 0-0-0| 0-0-0| 9-4-1 |
|17 CONCORDIA  | 0-0-0| 0-1-0| 7-4-0| 2-0-0| 0-0-0| 9-5-0 |
|18 CARLETON   | 0-0-0| 1-0-0| 5-3-2| 2-0-0| 0-0-0| 8-3-2 |
|---------------------------------------------------------|
|   C+         |      |      |      |      |      |       |
|19 LETHBRIDGE | 0-2-0| 2-2-2| 1-0-1| 0-0-0| 0-0-0| 3-4-3 |
|20 REGINA     | 0-2-0| 4-6-0| 1-1-0| 0-0-0| 0-0-0| 5-9-0 |
|21 LAURIER    | 0-0-0| 1-3-1| 5-1-1| 1-0-0| 0-0-0| 7-4-2 |
|22 NIPISSING  | 0-0-0| 3-4-1| 3-1-2| 0-0-0| 0-0-0| 6-5-3 |
|23 UQTR       | 0-0-0| 0-2-0| 7-2-0| 2-0-0| 2-3-0|11-7-0 |
|24 GUELPH     | 0-0-0| 0-5-0| 7-0-0| 1-0-0| 0-2-0| 8-7-0 |
|25 OTTAWA     | 0-0-0| 0-2-0| 5-3-1| 2-0-0| 0-0-0| 7-5-1 |
|---------------------------------------------------------|
|   C          |      |      |      |      |      |       |
|26 BROCK      | 0-0-0| 2-1-1| 3-4-2| 0-0-0| 0-2-0| 5-7-3 |
|27 WINDSOR    | 0-0-0| 2-0-1| 4-7-0| 0-0-0| 0-0-0| 6-7-1 |
|28 UOIT       | 0-0-0| 2-2-1| 3-5-1| 0-0-0| 0-0-0| 5-7-2 |
|29 QUEEN'S    | 0-0-0| 1-5-0| 4-3-0| 0-0-0| 0-0-0| 5-8-0 |
|30 YORK       | 0-0-0| 2-6-0| 3-3-0| 0-0-0| 0-0-0| 5-9-0 |
|31 TORONTO    | 0-0-0| 3-3-2| 0-4-1| 0-0-0| 0-0-0| 3-6-3 |
|---------------------------------------------------------|
|   C-         |      |      |      |      |      |       |
|32 RYERSON    | 0-0-0| 1-7-0| 1-4-0| 2-0-0| 0-0-0| 4-11-0|
|---------------------------------------------------------|
|   D          |      |      |      |      |      |       |
|33 ST THOMAS  | 0-2-0| 1-6-2| 0-0-0| 0-0-0| 1-1-0| 2-9-2 |
|34 RMC        | 0-0-0| 0-6-0| 0-7-1| 0-0-0| 0-0-0| 0-13-1|
 --------------------------------------------------------- 
This was a week where the big shake-ups came in the lower end of the B range and down. The OUA west pretty much dominated the OUA east in their first weekend of interlock. I have also added A-, B-, and C- categories. In the West, Regina falls behind Lethbridge and therefore falls from B to C. Waterloo and Lakehead jump from C to B, joining Concordia and Carleton in the newly minted B- category. I suspect Lethbridge may soon be joining them. BTW, Lakehead plays Concordia twice on the weekend.

At the top of the rankings there were losses all around, the exception being UPEI. While they only beat STU and Moncton they nevertheless never lost. Further down, St FX and UBC also had bumps with 4 point weeks.


Last edited by Hollywood3: 12-01-2010 at 10:17 PM.
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Old
11-22-2010, 07:23 AM
  #61
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Out of Curiosity, what Makes Calgary Ranked number 6, and Saskatchewan number 9

Calgary is 6-8 and Saskatchewan and is 7-5

Calgary is 0-4 againts A Teams and Sask is 1-1

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Old
11-22-2010, 10:21 AM
  #62
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Originally Posted by cishockeyfan View Post
Out of Curiosity, what Makes Calgary Ranked number 6, and Saskatchewan number 9

Calgary is 6-8 and Saskatchewan and is 7-5

Calgary is 0-4 againts A Teams and Sask is 1-1
Actually each side has 14 points through 12 games (in league play) and Calgary has had a tougher schedule. So I have one team on either side of the OUA division leaders.

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11-22-2010, 12:19 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by cishockeyfan View Post
Out of Curiosity, what Makes Calgary Ranked number 6, and Saskatchewan number 9

Calgary is 6-8 and Saskatchewan and is 7-5

Calgary is 0-4 againts A Teams and Sask is 1-1


That is an interesting observation, CiS fan . . .

Also, Calgary is now 7-12-0 overall, while Saskatchewan is 11-7-0. Saskatchewan has beaten Calgary twice in three meetings this year and none of them were held in Saskatoon. Two were in Calgary and one in Edmonton.

The CIS Top 10 voters have been putting Saskatchewan ahead of Calgary, but Hollywood sees things a little differently. (Hope he doesn't get a banjo smashed over his head or pushed down his throat by the Banjo Mutts!)

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11-22-2010, 01:42 PM
  #64
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Well this Top 10 voter has Saskatchewan in, and Calgary out ... for what it is worth.

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Old
11-22-2010, 02:39 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by puck passion View Post
That is an interesting observation, CiS fan . . .

Also, Calgary is now 7-12-0 overall, while Saskatchewan is 11-7-0. Saskatchewan has beaten Calgary twice in three meetings this year and none of them were held in Saskatoon. Two were in Calgary and one in Edmonton.

The CIS Top 10 voters have been putting Saskatchewan ahead of Calgary, but Hollywood sees things a little differently. (Hope he doesn't get a banjo smashed over his head or pushed down his throat by the Banjo Mutts!)
Calgary had a lousy pre-season which carried into their first weekend against Alberta. I admit that at this point of the season I do not count the intra-conference pre-season exhibitions nor games outside the CIS. Since they each have 14 points in 12 games and Calgary has had the tougher schedule, Calgary gets the nod.

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11-30-2010, 08:59 PM
  #66
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OHT34 #9 - the first half is almost over poll

November 28, 2010

THE OFFICIAL HOLLYWOOD TOP 34 ~ 2010-11

Wow, that first half of the season went fast. This upcoming week will have games for some teams but for many it is exam time. So week #9 of THE OFFICIAL HOLLYWOOD TOP 34 will be the last full update until the new year. Here are the links:Here are last week's results:
  • Nov. 22
    Carleton 5 UQTR 3

    Nov. 25
    York 3 Ryerson 4

    Nov. 26
    StFX 6 Moncton 5 OT
    UNB 2 Acadia 3
    Saint Mary's 9 St. Thomas 2
    UPEI 5 Dalhousie 6 OT
    UOIT 2 Ottawa 3 2OT
    Brock 4 Carleton 2
    Waterloo 4 RMC 3
    Guelph 4 UQTR 5 OT
    Lakehead 11 Concordia 2
    Laurier 1 Toronto 2 OT
    W. Ontario 5 Queen's 2
    Lethbridge 4 Saskatchewan 2
    Calgary 3 Regina 0
    Alberta 2 Manitoba 4

    Nov. 27
    Windsor 5 Nipissing 1
    Lakehead 7 Concordia 4
    Laurier 2 Ryerson 3 OT
    York 0 Carleton 8
    UPEI 2 Acadia 3
    StFX 2 St. Thomas 3
    Saint Mary's 2 Moncton 1
    UNB 3 Dalhousie 6
    Guelph 4 McGill 5 OT
    Brock 3 Ottawa 4 OT
    W. Ontario 3 RMC 4 OT
    UOIT 2 Toronto 3 OT
    Waterloo 4 Queen's 3 OT
    Lethbridge 1 Saskatchewan 10
    Calgary 5 Regina 6
    Alberta 3 Manitoba 2

    Nov. 28
    Windsor 1 Nipissing 2
And here are the rankings:
Code:

                ------------------------------------------
               |   A  |   B  |   C  |   D  |  CIS | TOTAL |
 ---------------------------------------------------------
|   A          |      |      |      |      |      |       |
| 1 ALBERTA    | 1-1-0| 6-1-1| 4-0-0| 0-0-0| 0-1-0|11-3-1 |
| 2 UNB        | 2-2-0| 6-2-0| 0-0-0| 2-0-0| 4-0-0|14-4-0 |
|---------------------------------------------------------|
|   A-         |      |      |      |      |      |       |
| 3 ST MARY'S  | 2-2-0| 4-3-1| 0-0-0| 1-0-0| 0-0-0| 7-5-1 |
| 4 UPEI       | 2-1-1| 4-3-1| 0-0-0| 2-0-0| 1-0-0| 9-4-2 |
| 5 MANITOBA   | 1-1-0| 2-0-4| 4-2-0| 0-0-0| 2-0-0| 9-3-4 |
|---------------------------------------------------------|
|   B+         |      |      |      |      |      |       |
| 6 MCGILL     | 0-0-0| 0-0-0|12-0-1| 2-0-0| 0-0-0|14-0-1 |
| 7 DALHOUSIE  | 3-3-0| 3-3-0| 0-0-0| 2-0-0| 0-0-0| 8-6-0 |
| 8 CALGARY    | 1-3-2| 3-1-0| 3-1-0| 0-0-0| 0-2-0| 7-7-2 |
| 9 SASK.      | 2-2-0| 3-1-0| 3-3-0| 0-0-0| 0-0-0| 8-6-0 |
|10 W. ONTARIO | 0-0-0| 3-0-0| 9-0-2| 0-0-1| 0-0-0|12-0-3 |
|11 ACADIA     | 3-3-0| 2-2-2| 0-0-0| 2-0-0| 1-1-0| 8-6-2 |
|12 ST F-X     | 2-4-0| 4-1-1| 0-0-0| 1-1-0| 1-0-0| 8-6-1 |
|---------------------------------------------------------|
|   B          |      |      |      |      |      |       |
|13 UBC        | 3-1-0| 0-2-2| 2-1-1| 0-0-0| 0-0-0| 5-4-3 |
|14 LAKEHEAD   | 0-0-0| 1-0-1|10-4-0| 0-0-0| 0-0-0|11-4-1 |
|15 MONCTON    | 1-5-0| 3-2-1| 0-0-0| 1-0-1| 0-0-0| 5-7-2 |
|16 WATERLOO   | 0-0-0| 1-4-0| 9-1-0| 1-0-0| 0-0-0|11-5-0 |
|17 CARLETON   | 0-0-0| 0-0-0| 8-4-2| 2-0-0| 0-0-0|10-4-2 |
|---------------------------------------------------------|
|   C+         |      |      |      |      |      |       |
|18 LETHBRIDGE | 1-3-0| 2-2-2| 1-0-1| 0-0-0| 0-0-0| 4-5-3 |
|19 REGINA     | 1-5-0| 4-4-0| 1-1-0| 0-0-0| 0-0-0| 6-10-0|
|20 UQTR       | 0-0-0| 0-3-0| 8-2-0| 2-0-0| 2-3-0|12-8-0 |
|21 GUELPH     | 0-0-0| 0-5-1| 7-0-1| 1-0-0| 0-2-0| 8-7-2 |
|22 LAURIER    | 0-0-0| 1-3-1| 5-1-3| 1-0-0| 0-0-0| 7-4-4 |
|23 OTTAWA     | 0-0-0| 0-1-0| 7-4-1| 2-0-0| 0-0-0| 9-5-1 |
|24 CONCORDIA  | 0-0-0| 0-3-0| 7-4-0| 2-0-0| 0-0-0| 9-7-0 |
|---------------------------------------------------------|
|   C          |      |      |      |      |      |       |
|25 BROCK      | 0-0-0| 2-1-1| 4-4-3| 0-0-0| 0-2-0| 6-7-4 |
|26 NIPISSING  | 0-0-0| 2-3-1| 5-3-2| 0-0-0| 0-0-0| 7-6-3 |
|27 WINDSOR    | 0-0-0| 2-0-1| 5-8-0| 0-0-0| 0-0-0| 7-8-1 |
|28 UOIT       | 0-0-0| 1-2-1| 4-5-3| 0-0-0| 0-0-0| 5-7-4 |
|29 TORONTO    | 0-0-0| 1-3-2| 4-4-1| 0-0-0| 0-0-0| 5-6-3 |
|30 QUEEN'S    | 0-0-0| 1-4-1| 4-5-0| 0-0-0| 0-0-0| 5-9-1 |
|---------------------------------------------------------|
|   C-         |      |      |      |      |      |       |
|31 YORK       | 0-0-0| 2-7-0| 3-4-0| 0-0-0| 0-0-0| 5-11-0|
|32 RYERSON    | 0-0-0| 1-5-0| 3-6-0| 2-0-0| 0-0-0| 6-11-0|
|---------------------------------------------------------|
|   D          |      |      |      |      |      |       |
|33 ST THOMAS  | 0-5-0| 2-4-2| 0-0-0| 0-0-0| 1-1-0| 3-10-2|
|34 RMC        | 0-0-0| 1-5-0| 0-9-1| 0-0-0| 0-0-0| 1-14-1|
 ---------------------------------------------------------
This was a funny little week. The OUA East won 11 of 18 interlocking gams against the OUA West. The Pids and RMC both won games. Anyhow, with the mid-terms upon us I have a general upgrading going on to even out the grading curve a little. Once some of the B+ teams can prove themselves over more games my guess is we'll see some more A level teams.

But unlike last year, UNB and Alberta cannot be considered A+ at this time. Both sides appear more vulnerable to more teams this year than last. I still have them a cut above, but at A level. SMU have not been able to truly dominate the B level so I have them at A- still. Only now they are joined by UPEI and Manitoba.

This week's results caused me to move McGill back up to #6. Their only demerit is an OTL to rising Brock whilst the Urban Cowboys have been downed by Toronto and RMC. A level teams don't lose to RMC. Calgary and Sask both split with C+ teams. For either to bump into A level they need a few sweeps of such series. Dal, Acadia, and St FX are solid B+ teams and can't be counted out.

So if McGill can jump to #6 why do they remain B+, you ask? It is their schedule. They were unimpressive with a one-goal win over lowly York and split a pair of OT games, losing to Brock and defeating Guelph. Hardly an A-level performance. And, they have played predominantly the bottom half of their division. They have 13 games left: 4 each with Carleton and Ottawa, 3 with Concordia, and 2 with UQTR. They are done with Nipissing, Toronto, Ryerson, Queen's and RMC.

Also, Concordia drops from B- to C+. They have slumped to #5 in the OUA East. 'Nuff said. I almost moved Lethbridge up from C+ to B-. They are at the top of C+ but their 10-1 loss to Saskatchewan dulled the impact of their split. Still, I could see a B rating for them in the new year. Their performance against UBC next weekend could help.


Last edited by Hollywood3: 12-01-2010 at 10:17 PM.
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12-01-2010, 08:53 AM
  #67
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Hollywood, let me start by saying that I really like what do to create these rankings and I think, for the most part, they provide a clearer picture of the "right" order compared to the CIS rankings.

I agree completely with your comment that "A teams don't lose to RMC" and for that, Western needs to pay a price in the ranking. But herein lies an issue I have with (how I think) you are ranking. Is a win, is a win, is win? In other words, do a regulation, OT and SO win all carry the same weight? In my mind they shouldn't. To me, Western should be punished because they ended regulation time tied with the last place team in the conference. But to lose in a shootout - let's face it, it's basically luck whoever wins. My point is that had Western won that shootout, I assume it would show as a win and they would not have been punished in your ranking calculation. It feels to me that they get dinged too hard for bad luck in the shootout and not enough if they have good luck in the shootout. I may be completely off base here because I don't know how your caluclations work, but I'd be interested in your thoughts.

BTW, even though I think winning and losing in OT is also different than a regulation win or loss, it's in a category much more similar to regulation than to a shootout.

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12-01-2010, 10:02 AM
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But as a Top 10 voter, for me, all wins are not equal.

As much as I respect quantitative rankings systems like Hollywood's or the RPI over at CISBlog, their flaw (which is also a strength) is their lack of subjectivity. I agree that "reputation" shouldn't win you ranking spots, but history matters, which is why I always factor in preseason out-of-conference games, such as UNB's 6-2 humbling of Alberta in September. But, and it is a big but, the subjectivity is that today UNB has four or five key players injured and out of the line-up who played in that game. UNB now is not the same as UNB then, so I would have to make a mental adjustment. There are dozens of these little things (like the Western example of losing in a shootout) that to me colour a win or loss, and should be reflected in ranking teams.

There is no perfect system. There are too many variables, and too many are subjective. And your subjectivity shouldn't overrule objectivity, such as placing too much faith in your local conference (like the weak OUA East) because that is the one you see each week.

I'll get off my high horse and say that it is too bad that many CIS voters, who have the opportunity to subjectively tweak their rankings, apparently just rank off the standings and wins and losses. If all voters used that method, we might as well combine Hollywood's Top 34 with RPI and get rid of the voters.

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12-01-2010, 01:05 PM
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Language Question

Sorry to get off topic (OHT34), but couldn't you have said "UNB's win over Alberta" rather than what you did say.
In the same context you could look at DAL's 6-3 "humbling" of UNB as a factor why UNB should NOT be ranked highly.

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12-01-2010, 01:17 PM
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Originally Posted by AUS Fan View Post
Sorry to get off topic (OHT34), but couldn't you have said "UNB's win over Alberta" rather than what you did say.
In the same context you could look at DAL's 6-3 "humbling" of UNB as a factor why UNB should NOT be ranked highly.
Fair Warning!

By ending the 1st half with 10 points,and the return of injuries,the return of Dietrich to complement the Wild West Line and the addition of 2(count them) highly skilled D-men,then I will be calling for "the break-up of the TOMMIES" and look out AUS and certainly Coach Eagles will deserve a nomination for Coach of the Year.YEAH BABY!

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12-01-2010, 03:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AUS Fan View Post
Sorry to get off topic (OHT34), but couldn't you have said "UNB's win over Alberta" rather than what you did say.
In the same context you could look at DAL's 6-3 "humbling" of UNB as a factor why UNB should NOT be ranked highly.
By the way chromy,Dal has won 5 of 7, including wins over UNB, Saint Marys, UPEI and Acadia. AUS is the strongest conference in the country!, everyone is very competitive outside of STU. It isn't a shock to see SMU or UNB lose back to back road games in this league. Yes, UNB slips in the rankings, but to say they shouldn't be ranked highly makes very little sense.

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12-01-2010, 08:17 PM
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I think you missed my sarcasm, Red Army. I think 'Foyle gets it.

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12-01-2010, 10:55 PM
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Originally Posted by northvanman View Post
Hollywood, let me start by saying that I really like what do to create these rankings and I think, for the most part, they provide a clearer picture of the "right" order compared to the CIS rankings.

I agree completely with your comment that "A teams don't lose to RMC" and for that, Western needs to pay a price in the ranking. But herein lies an issue I have with (how I think) you are ranking. Is a win, is a win, is win? In other words, do a regulation, OT and SO win all carry the same weight? In my mind they shouldn't. To me, Western should be punished because they ended regulation time tied with the last place team in the conference. But to lose in a shootout - let's face it, it's basically luck whoever wins. My point is that had Western won that shootout, I assume it would show as a win and they would not have been punished in your ranking calculation. It feels to me that they get dinged too hard for bad luck in the shootout and not enough if they have good luck in the shootout. I may be completely off base here because I don't know how your caluclations work, but I'd be interested in your thoughts.

BTW, even though I think winning and losing in OT is also different than a regulation win or loss, it's in a category much more similar to regulation than to a shootout.
Maybe if the season was longer I could sub-divide the categories into wins and losses by more than 2 goals. But I won't.

In going over results I sometimes consider margin of defeat in extreme cases. For example, Lethbridge's pounding by Sask last weekend. But, by and large, I stick to what the point system provides. The current point system, IMO, is dumb in that some games are worth 3 points whilst others are worth 2. On this subject, I have started compiling "what if" standings based on the 3-2-1 system used in IIHF tournaments, i.e. a regulation time win is worth 3 points. I intended to raise this during the CIS break. But the leagues make the rules of competition and the ability of teams to succeed or fail under those rules is what counts, and that's the bottom line.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FreddtFoyle View Post
But as a Top 10 voter, for me, all wins are not equal.

As much as I respect quantitative rankings systems like Hollywood's or the RPI over at CISBlog, their flaw (which is also a strength) is their lack of subjectivity. I agree that "reputation" shouldn't win you ranking spots, but history matters, which is why I always factor in preseason out-of-conference games, such as UNB's 6-2 humbling of Alberta in September. But, and it is a big but, the subjectivity is that today UNB has four or five key players injured and out of the line-up who played in that game. UNB now is not the same as UNB then, so I would have to make a mental adjustment. There are dozens of these little things (like the Western example of losing in a shootout) that to me colour a win or loss, and should be reflected in ranking teams.

There is no perfect system. There are too many variables, and too many are subjective. And your subjectivity shouldn't overrule objectivity, such as placing too much faith in your local conference (like the weak OUA East) because that is the one you see each week.

I'll get off my high horse and say that it is too bad that many CIS voters, who have the opportunity to subjectively tweak their rankings, apparently just rank off the standings and wins and losses. If all voters used that method, we might as well combine Hollywood's Top 34 with RPI and get rid of the voters.
FWIW, I do count the non-conference games against CIS teams from other conferences and the mid-season tournament games. However, these are not of the same import as the regular season games and are in a column of their own.

There are a few things which blunt UNB's butt kickings in Saudi Alberta as a rankings tool:

First, UNB went back home and cleaned SMU in a similar fashion. This indicates that they were really more ready than anybody for the start of the season. (Maybe a little too ready?)

Second, there were no more CW-AUS games.

Third, the AUS teams had their problems with UQTR (3-2 record) whilst UQTR got their butts kicked by OUA teams to start the season.

Fourth, other than UNB's and UQTR's extended trips, the only interlocking games were UPEI's OTW over Guelph and Manitoba's ritualized slaughter of Brock in two games.

I also have a problem using injuries as an excuse. For one thing, few people cover the CIS well enough to know each team's injuries, and how significant they may be. For example, Manitoba has not had 12 healthy forwards since the regular season started. This weekend they dressed 20 players for the first time in ages (in one game), and 8 were defencemen.

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12-02-2010, 07:19 AM
  #74
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I'm not using UNB injuries as an "excuse", but rather to make the point that skill-wise/depth wise UNB right now isn't as good a team as the UNB team that played Alberta back in September. So even though I factor preseason out of conference games when comparing and ranking teams like Alberta and UNB, too many things have changed (like the injuries) now to make a September game a valid comparison for those two teams today.

As for the UQTR games, they beat a not-good STU team and had a split against Acadia who got off to a really slow start this year. Not a valid comparison now. What will be a more valid comparison is when McGill comes east to play StFX and UNB after Christmas.

Yes, injuries are a subjective matter, but if I'm aware that a team has just lost a key player(s) for a significant time, it does factor how I rank them going forward. For example last season, once Western lost their best goalie they seemed to stop winning the close games, and I ranked them lower as a result, despite their record built up to then.

And yes AUS Fan, I got the sarcasm ...
Pretty good win by SMU last night, btw.

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12-02-2010, 07:51 AM
  #75
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"And yes AUS Fan, I got the sarcasm ...
Pretty good win by SMU last night, btw."

Hope you are feeling better. If you're in town over the holidays, give me a shout and we'll go for Wings and things.

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