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Nobody will Fight THE BOOG = ineffective enforcer

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Old
10-16-2010, 10:13 AM
  #26
Rangerfans
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Why isn't Boogaard effective? I cannot believe that I am saying this, because rarely do I 'blame' the refs, etc. for a loss.

The NHL is why.

How many times since preseason has Boogey and *insert anyone* been on the verge of dropping gloves OR starting a fight and the referees intervene to prevent said fight from happening?

In fact, both times Prust got into fights were because the referees were too busy preventing Boogey from dropping gloves.

Fact: We came back with fire and heart after Avery's slash to Komi.


P.S. I guarantee that all the Fire Torts! characters are the same who spewFire Renney!

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Old
10-16-2010, 10:15 AM
  #27
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Sorry, I can't help but blame Torts. We all saw how he neutered Avery last season. Now he's doing it to Boogey. Boogey should have just grabbed onto Kessel and started swinging.

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Old
10-16-2010, 10:18 AM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HAPPY HOUR View Post
This franchise has been Stay-Puff for at last 15 years or so and when the GM goes out and gets a monster, this board whines to no end.
The money, the terms, and now, the product on the ice, or lack thereof. Come on. There's only things to complain about so far until I see an actual benefit to having him on the roster.

Toughness SHOULDN'T be this team's problem either. There are physically capable players complimented by tough guys like Prust and cheap-shot artists like Avery and Fedotenko. What they do as individuals just isn't translating into a team that opponents don't want to play against.

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Originally Posted by HAPPY HOUR View Post
Vettel back to back at Suzuka. Both from the pole. Impressive young talent.
Impressive, but probably not as impressive as the Red Bull itself. I see as more of a the next Button than the next Schumacher. Out of the 5 title contenders, I'm pulling for Webber.

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Old
10-16-2010, 10:19 AM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Chimp View Post
At least Orr went dirty on Ovechkin when Brashear targeted Jagr. Boogaard obviously should've ran Kesler.
Yes, the Rangers should let Armstrong know that you can't hit the NYRs best player. But , honestly the hit on Gaborik wasn't as bad as some NYR fans are making out. It was a penalty but some are acting like he skated from half way across the world to deliver a hit from behind that left Gaborik paralyzed. It was a hit that 99 times out of 100 results in no injury.

The comparison to Orr/Ovechkin incident is pretty off base b/c of that. I get what you are saying and it's one of the reasons why Orr was a true enforcer. But, in that particular game Brashear was purposefully going after Jagr shift and shift and then fought Shanahan. Orr finally snapped and did exactly what Brashear was doing, going after the Caps best player.

I was more pissed that there was no reaction (or penalty!!!!) on Phaneuf running into Lundqvist

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Old
10-16-2010, 10:34 AM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Declan View Post
Yes, the Rangers should let Armstrong know that you can't hit the NYRs best player. But , honestly the hit on Gaborik wasn't as bad as some NYR fans are making out. It was a penalty but some are acting like he skated from half way across the world to deliver a hit from behind that left Gaborik paralyzed. It was a hit that 99 times out of 100 results in no injury.

The comparison to Orr/Ovechkin incident is pretty off base b/c of that. I get what you are saying and it's one of the reasons why Orr was a true enforcer. But, in that particular game Brashear was purposefully going after Jagr shift and shift and then fought Shanahan. Orr finally snapped and did exactly what Brashear was doing, going after the Caps best player.

I was more pissed that there was no reaction (or penalty!!!!) on Phaneuf running into Lundqvist
Bingo.

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Old
10-16-2010, 10:41 AM
  #31
HAPPY HOUR
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Originally Posted by Melrose_Jr. View Post
The money, the terms, and now, the product on the ice, or lack thereof. Come on. There's only things to complain about so far until I see an actual benefit to having him on the roster.

Toughness SHOULDN'T be this team's problem either. There are physically capable players complimented by tough guys like Prust and cheap-shot artists like Avery and Fedotenko. What they do as individuals just isn't translating into a team that opponents don't want to play against.



Impressive, but probably not as impressive as the Red Bull itself. I see as more of a the next Button than the next Schumacher. Out of the 5 title contenders, I'm pulling for Webber.
There we can agree.

Not going to debate the above, because like me, You will not be changing your mind on this topic. Nor do I care to debate (anymore) about an enforcers contributions. Its a waste of time for both of us. I should have been born a Flyer fan. I love the way they play the game. Even when they sucked.

I also love Brian Burkes approach to the game. On here, I guess I am most certainly a minority for that opinion.

Both opinions have been beaten to death by both sides with no change in heart or mind. I will continually attempt to respectfully agree to disagree on this. Tired of debating this with every mod new or old on this board..

Its become boring for all of us.

Yeah, Mark Webber is a class act (thought he was gonna kill Vettel earlier this year) and Red Bull is just an awesome team. The wife loves Jensen Button, But I'm pulling for Webber too. Vettel will be a champion someday though imo..


Last edited by HAPPY HOUR: 10-16-2010 at 10:46 AM.
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Old
10-16-2010, 10:52 AM
  #32
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First off Boogey was fine in game 1 vs Buffalo the line was effective on their 3 shifts together no goals against and 2 chances for. No fighters on Buffalo

game 2 vs Islanders he missed the first 5 mins with a skate issue then played a great shift nailed a d-men has a scoring chance and then doesn't play the next 39 mins of game. Gillies was willing and able had 2 shifts Torts didn't use Boogey on either of them .

Game 3 Leafs Orr was under strict orders not to fight because of being ko'd 36hrs earlier. Boogey helped turn the game around with a great 2 line pass to Boyle which leads the Rangers come back then draws one on Orr that leads to a power play he also nailed Dion one time and forced the leafs d to be a little jumpy a few times on the fore-check. Torts was forced to use him last night and he did just fine. gabby was hit and to be honest the Rangers on the ice needed to grab Armstrong and handle it the second it happened. All you guys that claim he is no effective or not doing his job are nuts and just being anal . What more could he do with the limited ice and use he is getting ?

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Old
10-16-2010, 10:56 AM
  #33
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Saying our guys (especially Boogaard) should have targeted Kessel makes me laugh. Believe me, every Ranger was trying to lay one on him, but the dude is a lightning bolt. There is no way in hell a guy like Boogaard could even get close to him.

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Old
10-16-2010, 12:48 PM
  #34
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I knew Orr would not fight Boogey after getting kabonged the other night.

With that said, I'm not sure he'll find that many takers this year (also his lack of ice time will hurt in finding takers).

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Old
10-16-2010, 12:51 PM
  #35
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boy im sure glad we signed Boogaard, now nobody will run Lundqvist!!! oh wait, Phaneuf did last night.


Well, at least nobody will take shots at Gabby! Oh wait...Armstrong did last night.


I recall a few ppl trying to convince me that Boogaard was a good signing and used those 2 reasons repeatedly as to why hes worth his weight in gold, and how i said, repeatedly, thats complete and utter BS.

Ppl kept saying how nobody would dare touch Henrik or Gabby for fear of the Boogey man. Yeah, they looked awfully scared of him.

Today, I dont mind saying I told you so.

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Old
10-16-2010, 12:57 PM
  #36
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okay so fine, then Orr couldn't go for reasons that he was just recently knocked out and woulkd risk serious injury. That's on the Leafs coach for dressing him then, not ours. The Leafs were taking liberties with our players. So send Boogs out theere to take liberties with theirs. Doesn't have to be a heavyweight.

Heck, take a run at Phaneuf for all i care, but do something. If Torts isn't going to take advantage of the advantage the Leafs coach gave us by dressing a heavyweight that can't fight, don't dress Boogs then. Plain and simple

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Old
10-16-2010, 01:00 PM
  #37
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Canucks fan here. Ive seen a lot of Boogaard over the years and ave said this exact same thing.

If no one fights him, hes useless. Except now, hes useless and overpaid.

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Old
10-16-2010, 01:09 PM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rangerfans View Post
Why isn't Boogaard effective? I cannot believe that I am saying this, because rarely do I 'blame' the refs, etc. for a loss.

The NHL is why.

How many times since preseason has Boogey and *insert anyone* been on the verge of dropping gloves OR starting a fight and the referees intervene to prevent said fight from happening?

In fact, both times Prust got into fights were because the referees were too busy preventing Boogey from dropping gloves.

Fact: We came back with fire and heart after Avery's slash to Komi.


P.S. I guarantee that all the Fire Torts! characters are the same who spewFire Renney!

Noticed that too, refs are really responsive.

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Old
10-16-2010, 01:13 PM
  #39
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The issue is that there's no pride in hockey anymore. The older days of sticking up for your teammates and fighting are over. A player can challenge any one on the other team and it doesn't matter anymore. Avery is probably the prime example as he gets other guys to drop their gloves all the time yet, he rarely drops them. It's just a different game. You need two willing competitors.


But as far as Boog ... Twice last night he tried to get a breakaway. I think Torts does want to turn him into an actual hockey player.

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10-16-2010, 01:14 PM
  #40
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Here's what you should do. If they run Lundqvist, you send Boogy out there to run over their goalie. Let him take 2, or even 4 minutes, but make sure it counts.

If they board Gaborik, you send Boogy out there to punch the living **** out of one of their star players.

You give them the PP. You might give up a goal now and maybe a point or two because of it. But in the long run, it's in the teams best interest to do these things now.

It's quite simple, to be honest. Make sure that if they're hurting your team, you hurt their team. It's a lose-lose situation. But that's ok, because it will make it less likely to happen to you again.

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Old
10-16-2010, 01:21 PM
  #41
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As per Glen Sathers quote after the signing of Boogaard.

"Derek is obviously the biggest and the toughest and I think we needed that presence here."

"There was just too many times when I saw guys scraping and snowing Henrik's face and I didn't like it, and I dont think we are gonna see it any longer here."


When Henrik got run over last night, i was waiting for retaliation... and waiting....

The problem is the Boogieman has to take matters in his own hands and send a message on the next shift.

But it's Torts whos got to send him out there.

His acquisition as defined by Sather is to pummel some poor soul with skill or running the opposing goalie on the next shift, after Henrik is run or when players take liberties with ranger players.

That's his purpose according to Mr. Magoo.


Last edited by The Mouth: 10-16-2010 at 01:31 PM.
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Old
10-16-2010, 01:26 PM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
boy im sure glad we signed Boogaard, now nobody will run Lundqvist!!! oh wait, Phaneuf did last night.


Well, at least nobody will take shots at Gabby! Oh wait...Armstrong did last night.


I recall a few ppl trying to convince me that Boogaard was a good signing and used those 2 reasons repeatedly as to why hes worth his weight in gold, and how i said, repeatedly, thats complete and utter BS.

Ppl kept saying how nobody would dare touch Henrik or Gabby for fear of the Boogey man. Yeah, they looked awfully scared of him.

Today, I dont mind saying I told you so.
Everything you say here is true, but I wonder if this is proof of Boogaards ineffectiveness, or proof of Torts inability to properly utilize his enforcer.

If Torts taps boogaard or prust on the shoulder after phanuef runs hank, and says go grab the best player on the ice and pummel him, than that may develop the deterent people are looking for.
Staged fights between top enforcers do not deter anything, but letting your goons, go goon all over other teams stars MAY cause caution when the fear of retaliation isnt on your goon, but on your star players.

For a period of time, Torts is going to have to learn that his guys are going to take some penalties before other teams view the rangers as a team that sticks up for eachother, and will extract revenge on your top players.

The failure here is on the coach and management.

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Old
10-16-2010, 01:35 PM
  #43
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And of coure Koci is injured, that would have been a pretty good scrap.

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Old
10-16-2010, 01:37 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by Tumsh View Post
Here's what you should do. If they run Lundqvist, you send Boogy out there to run over their goalie. Let him take 2, or even 4 minutes, but make sure it counts.

If they board Gaborik, you send Boogy out there to punch the living **** out of one of their star players.

You give them the PP. You might give up a goal now and maybe a point or two because of it. But in the long run, it's in the teams best interest to do these things now.

It's quite simple, to be honest. Make sure that if they're hurting your team, you hurt their team. It's a lose-lose situation. But that's ok, because it will make it less likely to happen to you again.
completely agree have boogey run the **** out of their goalie take the 2 mins and potentially even break even if someone on the other team gets a roughing. In the Gabby situation have Boogey go out there and throw a glove punch at one of the other teams best players after the whistle, take the 2 for roughing and potential 10 min misconduct (who cares). In the end this will solve our problems

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Old
10-16-2010, 01:52 PM
  #45
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The notion that an enforcer can protect just doesn't fit the modern game... Due to the instigator, lack of respect between players, league interference, or any other number of factors that might be chosen. Sad but true.

The point is, because of the instigator rule, players can get away with a lack of respect. As a result, stars are being run and getting injured left and right. When a piece of garbage, like Armstrong, pulls this crap, he should be challenged. He shouldn't be rewarded when he pretends to fight only to draw a penalty for his team. Without the instigator, Boog is the one who challenges him and he has no choice if he's going to be in a fight. Get rid of the instigator and injuries will decline. Especially hits like the one on Gaborik...


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Old
10-16-2010, 01:58 PM
  #46
I Am Chariot
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Seriously OPENING NIGHT AT MSG AND WHAT DO WE GET?

Lundqvist Run Over, Gabby boarded and out for 3 weeks...

Its ridiculously embarrassing that this team did not make Armstrong pay. OPENING NIGHT!!!

Again, Ill give props to Avery who at least challenged Armstrong and when he refused to go took opportunity to go after other key players on the Leafs + upped his game. Thats because Sean plays with emotion. Sometimes it hurts him, but at least its honest and effective at giving this team some kind of grit, edge.

Boog doesnt have to skate with Kessel. He waits till the whistle blows and than he pushes him into the corner and beats him up. Message sent.

If he gets suspended... thrown out of the game.... so what???!! His role is to PROTECT GABBY

Last night... OPENING NIGHT AT HOME ... he failed.

Failed to protect.... failed to retaliate appropriately.

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Old
10-16-2010, 02:00 PM
  #47
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Originally Posted by darrenturcotte#8 View Post
The point is, because of the instigator rule, players can get away with a lack of respect. As a result, stars are being run and getting injured left and right. When a piece of garbage, like Armstrong, pulls this crap, he should be challenged. He shouldn't be rewarded when he pretends to fight only to draw a penalty for his team. Without the instigator, Boog is the one who challenges him and he has no choice if he's going to be in a fight. Get rid of the instigator and injuries with decline. Especially hits like the one on Gaborik...
**** the instigator rule. Sometimes you just have to get it done and take the penalty. I'd rather deal with the fallout of the rule than have team think the Rangers stars are free to target with hits like last night... running the King.

Its ********. The Boog needs to beat these pissants down. Period

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Old
10-16-2010, 02:00 PM
  #48
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I dont know if its just me but it seems this team really has a disconnect between many players. I dont know when this happened or why but it seems there are a bunch of seperate players on the ice. Now with Boogard, it seems like he doesent know who is who on the Rangers. This was the most meaningless pick up the Rangers made, along with Brasher( who i thought atleast could play hockey more then this guy). Why? because he is scary looking we sign him to a huge contract. Another bad contract for the books. The list goes on and on.

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Old
10-16-2010, 02:01 PM
  #49
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Originally Posted by satrabyk View Post
I dont know if its just me but it seems this team really has a disconnect between many players. I dont know when this happened or why but it seems there are a bunch of seperate players on the ice. Now with Boogard, it seems like he doesent know who is who on the Rangers.
He knows who wear #10

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Old
10-16-2010, 02:05 PM
  #50
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Boogey needs to be unleashed
Goon it up
Send a message - "eye for an eye - tooth for a tooth".
Create a "all for one - one for all" attitude on this young team
He needs to do this NOW
Or else this is an entire misuse of space - both roster and cap wise.
Instill fear and respect - or begone.
Glenn needs to tell Torts why he thought he signed him.
WTF is going on?
Cannot wait until the 21st of October in Toronto...

Guess I am in for a dissapointment

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