It's easier to find a top pairing defenceman in the later rounds then it is to find a first line center. Although these aren't necessarily the exact top 30 centers in the leauge I hope you get the idea.
#1 Centers:
1. Sidney Crosby (1st Overall)
2. Steven Stamkos (1st Overall)
3. Joe Thornton (1st Overall)
4. John Tavares (1st Overall)
5. Vincent Lecavalier (1st Overall)
6. Eric Staal (2nd Overall)
7. Evgeni Malkin (2nd Overall)
8. Jason Spezza (2nd Overall)
9. Tyler Seguin (2nd Overall)
10. Patrick Marleau (2nd Overall)
11. Henrik Sedin (3rd Overall)
12. Matt Duchene (3rd Overall)
13. Jonathan Toews (4th Overall)
14. Nicklas Backstrom (4th Overall)
15. Phil Kessel (5th Overall)
16. Mikko Koivu (6th Overall)
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17. Anze Kopitar (11th Overall) 18. Jeff Carter (11th Overall)
19. Zach Parise (17th Overall)
20. Ryan Getzlaf (19th Overall)
21. Travis Zajac (20th Overall) 22. Ryan Kesler (23rd Overall)
23. Mike Richards (24th Overall)
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24. Derek Roy (32nd Overall)
25. Paul Stastny (44th Overall)
26. Brad Richards (64th Overall)
27. Marc Savard (91st Overall)
28. Pavel Datsyuk (171st Overall)
Defenceman drafted in the top 5 are usually very underwhelming by comparission. Although I like Drew Doughty, Victor Hedman, Erik Johnson, Chris Pronger, and Jay Bouwmeester, I think we have a better chance to draft top pairing defencemen later on in the first round or early in the second. Another point is that defencemen usually take longer to develop and once they actually do they are almost UFA's.
#1 Defencemen:
1. Erik Johnson (1st Overall)
2. Drew Doughty (2nd Overall)
3. Victor Hedman (2rd Overall)
4. Chris Pronger (2nd Overall)
5. Jay Bouwmeester (3rd Overall)
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6. Dion Phaneuf (9th Overall)
7. Tyler Myers (12th Overall)
8. Sergei Gonchar (14th Overall)
9. Brent Seabrook (14th Overall)
10. Mike Green (29th Overall)
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11. Shea Weber (49th Overall)
12. Nicklas Lidstrom (53rd Overall)
13. Duncan Keith (54th Overall)
14. Zdeno Chara (56th Overall)
15. Keith Yandle (105th Overall)
16. Lubomir Visnovsky (118th Overall)
17. Andrei Markov (162nd Overall)
18. Stephane Robidas (164th Overall)
19. Tomas Kaberle (204th Overall)
20. Kimmo Timonen (250th Overall)
21. Mark Streit (262nd Overall)
22. Dan Boyle (Undrafted)
Having said that I think Larsson>>>>Couturier
The centers in bold were drafted in the deepest and best draft in recent memory, take them out of the equation and it's a lot less likely to nab a #1 center outside of the top 5 picks. Adding to that both Parise and Kessel were drafted at center but have spent the best part of their careers as wingers so that IMO is a bit misleading.
That said IMO it comes down to impact on a game, a great defenseman can play 27-30 minutes in a game while a great center would usually be between 20-23 minutes in a game. So this means that if the d-man is your best player he's on the ice for roughly 5-10 more minutes per game than would the center. If we're sure that Larsson has Doughty's offensive upside (which we're not and I don't think that they've touted him as such) I'd draft him in a heartbeat. The only players that I'd consider trading Doughty for would be AO and Crosby and they are generational talents.
__________________ Treat Others As You Would Like To Be Treated
Last edited by Bryanbryoil: 10-19-2010 at 11:29 AM.
Yeah I don't understand why there has to be two threads. Besides, Buggster is legit.
Stop ass kissing.
And everyone else STOP complaining when someone makes a thread, I'm sure there's a reason why they're different, are you mad that you have to click Edmonton Oilers and look at a new thread like MY GOD, if you think it's stupid don't reply, better yet hide thread and SHUT IT.
So many whiners I hate Edmonton fans, but I love the Oilers.
I'm not 100 % sure which is better to get, but as an aside....in the years Weight was here, we won a couple rounds in the playoffs. In Prongers one and only year, we went to the finals and were within a game of winning the cup. That, is some serious impact.
To be fair Pronger was a much more dominant defenseman than Weight was a centerman, it's not really a fair comp.
i dont know about adam larsson being picked over couturier/RNH anymore and it might be just a slump or a down year but he is starting out slooooooow offensively this year with just 2 assists through 11 games and a 9 games pointless drought. David Runblad has really taken over larssons offensive role on the team
There’s a few thing to look at before drafting prospects/rookies-BEFORE THE DRAFT-league interest and attribute ratings, and where there coming from. So the better, more sot after guys will have high interest, and for ratings look for green across the board(the three number 9.5, 8.0, 7.0 ex) Also where are they from just because Larsson doesn’t have 50 pts doesn’t mean he sucks, its because there’s a lot more good players coming from North America then Sweden. Reason why he doesn’t have 50 pts is because he has no one to play with-I WANT EVERONE RIGHT NOW TO LOOK AT OVECHKINS RUSSIAN STATS, there not as high as you’d expect because he has no one to play with that’s any good. Lastly what do you need more-DEFENCE OR OFFENCE OR GOALTENDING?????Only you can answer this! AFTER THE DRAFT-Look up Couturier and RNH, and other rookies that got you interest, and check out there current rating and Potential and if ones better than the other-TRADE FOR THEM In my dynasty this is how all them turned out, but it can differ a lot! Larsson drafted at 70 with POT A A A, after 4 yrs is 84 and still A-A-A-, Couturier drafted at 68 with POT A B A-, after 4 yrs he’s 83 and still A, B A-, and RNH is drafted at 70 POT A, B, B, 4 yrs after is 79 POT B, B, B
Hey i noticed that players grow in the game....Tyler Myers grew to 6'11'' 220 lbs, and Victor Hedman grew to 6'10'' 248 lbs HOW TALL DID THEY GET IN UR DYNASTY?????????? plz respond
I'd take Larsson for sure with the number one pick, but I hope the Oilers don't get it and end up getting one of the forwards instead. I just think it'd be fun to have that much talent at forward.
As much as I like RNH (and whom I think will be a better player then Couturier) I'm not sure how the Oilers would look with 2 smallish centers (gagner being the second). I think we could use his faceoff winning abilities, leadership, and workethic down the middle but I'm not sure if his size keeps him out of the Oilers picture despite the BPA rule. Its not like our GM is the greatest wheeler and dealer. At some point we are either going to have to draft for need or trade some centers.
As much as I like RNH (and whom I think will be a better player then Couturier) I'm not sure how the Oilers would look with 2 smallish centers (gagner being the second). I think we could use his faceoff winning abilities, leadership, and workethic down the middle but I'm not sure if his size keeps him out of the Oilers picture despite the BPA rule. Its not like our GM is the greatest wheeler and dealer. At some point we are either going to have to draft for need or trade some centers.
The centers in bold were drafted in the deepest and best draft in recent memory, take them out of the equation and it's a lot less likely to nab a #1 center outside of the top 5 picks. Adding to that both Parise and Kessel were drafted at center but have spent the best part of their careers as wingers so that IMO is a bit misleading.
That said IMO it comes down to impact on a game, a great defenseman can play 27-30 minutes in a game while a great center would usually be between 20-23 minutes in a game. So this means that if the d-man is your best player he's on the ice for roughly 5-10 more minutes per game than would the center. If we're sure that Larsson has Doughty's offensive upside (which we're not and I don't think that they've touted him as such) I'd draft him in a heartbeat. The only players that I'd consider trading Doughty for would be AO and Crosby and they are generational talents.
Nice read. I chose a centre, but after reading all these comments its now come down to - team need & bpa at the time. When the bingow balls drop and we know our draft position we will be sure to do this. I hope.
And everyone else STOP complaining when someone makes a thread, I'm sure there's a reason why they're different, are you mad that you have to click Edmonton Oilers and look at a new thread like MY GOD, if you think it's stupid don't reply, better yet hide thread and SHUT IT.
So many whiners I hate Edmonton fans, but I love the Oilers.
There’s a few thing to look at before drafting prospects/rookies-BEFORE THE DRAFT-league interest and attribute ratings, and where there coming from. So the better, more sot after guys will have high interest, and for ratings look for green across the board(the three number 9.5, 8.0, 7.0 ex) Also where are they from just because Larsson doesn’t have 50 pts doesn’t mean he sucks, its because there’s a lot more good players coming from North America then Sweden. Reason why he doesn’t have 50 pts is because he has no one to play with-I WANT EVERONE RIGHT NOW TO LOOK AT OVECHKINS RUSSIAN STATS, there not as high as you’d expect because he has no one to play with that’s any good. Lastly what do you need more-DEFENCE OR OFFENCE OR GOALTENDING?????Only you can answer this! AFTER THE DRAFT-Look up Couturier and RNH, and other rookies that got you interest, and check out there current rating and Potential and if ones better than the other-TRADE FOR THEM In my dynasty this is how all them turned out, but it can differ a lot! Larsson drafted at 70 with POT A A A, after 4 yrs is 84 and still A-A-A-, Couturier drafted at 68 with POT A B A-, after 4 yrs he’s 83 and still A, B A-, and RNH is drafted at 70 POT A, B, B, 4 yrs after is 79 POT B, B, B
Nice read. I chose a centre, but after reading all these comments its now come down to - team need & bpa at the time. When the bingow balls drop and we know our draft position we will be sure to do this. I hope.
IMO we can't go wrong with any of the big three in this years draft, however having only seen Larsson play I'm hardly an expert. IMO our biggest weaknesses as a team are a stud center and a stud defenseman. Goal can come later. IF Hall moves to center then we are just a top end d away. That said if Hall moves to center and we draft 2nd and Larsson is off the board, I don't draft Musil I draft Couturier or RNH.
I would take the center if all things are equal. I think Larsson is amazing and easily could be the top player out of this draft. HOWEVER, so many big name d-men have come from rounds 2-7, nearly as many as taken in the 1st round. Lidstrom, Chara, Weber, Keith, Boyle, etc.
Heck even look at the 03 draft and the "big 3" d-men in that draft. While all 3 are solid, Phaneuf was considered the most 1 dimensional out of he, Coburn and Suter. Phaneuf might be this and he might be that, but no question he is the best d-man out of those 3, and some would argue Seabrook is the best to come from that 1st round (I wouldn't).
Who is to say currently that Petry wouldn't be that guy (not that I'm in anyway expecting it)? Or a kid like Plante? Marincin? We honestly don't know. I sure as hell hope the organization isn't banking on these guys becoming stud d-men, but nobody knows.
So while Larsson would be incredible to snag, and of course you take BPA but we are talking if all things are even, I take the center. 1st line centers RARELY come out of nowhere, stud d-man do a lot more often. Either way though if we end up with a top 3 pick this year, we will be well setup for many years to come!
Hmm. I already said that I'd take the franchise dman over the franchise centre but I'm starting to doubt that. I mean, if I had to choose between an established franchise dman or centre I'd be inclined to take the dman. But when it comes to the draft and you're picking in the top 5 or so I think I'd rather take the centre. It's certainly more of a sure thing and as people have pointed out already dmen that are drafted really high aren't always great.
To top it off Larsson is starting out slow this year. I'll have to watch the season unfold but at this point I'm starting to lean towards RNH or Couturier. Which centre I'd rather have is a totally different conversation.
Oh, I forgot that this draft has the next Messier/Gretzky and not the next Pronger!!!
My point was that Pronger, or a D man of his calibre, can take a good/average or even below average team and elevate them a lot.
I have to lean towards Larsson for his size, speed and all the comparisons of him to Pronger. Yes, I know he's Swedish.
Get a guy like that and our GAA improves, less shots, better outlet etc. It changes a whole team.
Agreed. Pronger is like a vacuum cleaner in the defensive zone. Somehow the pucks always seem to come to him. The number of shots taken from dangerous areas increased by tons after Pronger left.
If Larsson turns out to be true to what the scouts are saying about him, we'd be crazy not to draft him if he had the chance IMO.
IMO we can't go wrong with any of the big three in this years draft, however having only seen Larsson play I'm hardly an expert. IMO our biggest weaknesses as a team are a stud center and a stud defenseman. Goal can come later. IF Hall moves to center then we are just a top end d away. That said if Hall moves to center and we draft 2nd and Larsson is off the board, I don't draft Musil I draft Couturier or RNH.
Agreed. Pronger is like a vacuum cleaner in the defensive zone. Somehow the pucks always seem to come to him. The number of shots taken from dangerous areas increased by tons after Pronger left.
If Larsson turns out to be true to what the scouts are saying about him, we'd be crazy not to draft him if he had the chance IMO.
Yea, as a 16 year old he definitely looked like a phenom. I'm sure his play is still good, obviously I don't get to watch SEL games but his stats are suffering...
I'm not 100 % sure which is better to get, but as an aside....in the years Weight was here, we won a couple rounds in the playoffs. In Prongers one and only year, we went to the finals and were within a game of winning the cup. That, is some serious impact.
For starters that 05-06 team probably had double the payroll of the late 90s teams by the time the trade deadline rolled around, not to mention the other teams also had even spending at that time (meaning Dallas couldn't ice a team with 3x our payroll against us).
Secondly ... people need to realize something ... Pronger is a very, very rare kind of player, not just "franchise D-Man". That's like saying "franchise center" and expecting to get Wayne Gretzky.
Pronger is probably the best NHL d-man outside of Lidstrom of the past 20 years (and yes, even above Neidermayer, Neids just played on better teams). Also even with Pronger, lets not forget the 05-06 Oilers and the Flyers last year came within a hair of missing the playoffs entirely (Pronger Superhero Doll* goaltending not included, Mrs. Pronger Whining Doll sold seperately).
Lets not also forget also that Pronger's development was a loooooooooooooooooong one, he was part of many St. Louis teams that choked in the playoffs for many years before taking his game to the next level here in Edmonton (his 13th NHL season).
Larsson maybe the second coming ... but then again, every d-man coming from Sweden is supposed to be the "next Lidstrom" and every good forward gets compared to Peter Forsberg. Hedman was supposed to be the greatest thing since sliced bread, and now he's apparently yesterday's news because Larsson is the new "it" Swedish prospect. Don't get me wrong, I'd run a lap around my neighborhood naked right now to ensure him in Oiler silks next year, but lets not discount what having a very good-great center can do either.
