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Canucks will move Bieksa ASAP

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Old
10-23-2010, 04:47 PM
  #226
Tiranis
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Originally Posted by PeterTheGreat View Post
About the same defensively. Bieksa slightly more physical. MAB has a much better shot and overall is a better offensive player IMO.

Bieksa is a 1 million dollar, third pairing guy with 2nd unit PP abilities and ZERO PK abilities. Unfortunately (for Canucks fans), he doesn't get paid or played that way.
You're just incredibly overrating MAB and underrating Bieksa. MAB is a complete failure defensively and shouldn't be allowed on the ice except on PP. He's undersized and has trouble handling pretty much all types of forwards, big, small, fast, slow. His shot is his main asset on the PP, he's not a good QB. Good at joinging the rush.

Bieksa, by comparison, might be an adventure defensively but he's playing 22-23 minutes a night and is still managing better in that regard than MAB with 12-13 minutes a night. He's great at joining and more importantly leading the rush — if your team doesn't have a player like that, he's a real asset in that regard. His straight line skating is good, his turning, skating backwards, etc. are lacking for an NHL level player. He doesn't have great hockey sense but he's still a better PP QB than Bergeron. His shot is decent enough and he gets it on net, good at creating opportunities for a deflection. When he decides to he can be a tough guy to play against, unfortunately that side of him is not on display most nights.

This all coming from someone who heavily dislikes the guy and wants him off the team. He's still an NHL defenseman, he's just not delivering what the 'Nucks need.


Last edited by Tiranis: 10-23-2010 at 04:53 PM.
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Old
10-23-2010, 05:22 PM
  #227
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About the same defensively.
I say this as one of the major Bieksa-haters on the Canucks board but this just isn't true. MAB is a complete trainwreck in the defensivve zone, Bieksa is actually quite adequate in the defensive zone most of the time (it's the 5% of the time that he isn't that the entire fanbase facepalms). MAB could QB a PP a bit better, but he's not even close to Bieksa in the defensive zone or as an overall d-man.

If he were getting paid 2.5m, playing 16-18 minutes a night with no PK time as a #4-#5 guy, I guarantee you I and other Canucks fans would love him. He's still an NHL-level defenseman who has been terribly miscast and given free reign to roam around by Vigneault for a reason absolutely none of us can figure out. Nonetheless, he's playing 1st pairing minutes and top opposition with Hamhuis most nights and only failing somewhat instead of miserably so far.

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10-23-2010, 05:26 PM
  #228
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Originally Posted by Red View Post
I say this as one of the major Bieksa-haters on the Canucks board but this just isn't true. MAB is a complete trainwreck in the defensivve zone, Bieksa is actually quite adequate in the defensive zone most of the time (it's the 5% of the time that he isn't that the entire fanbase facepalms). MAB could QB a PP a bit better, but he's not even close to Bieksa in the defensive zone or as an overall d-man.

If he were getting paid 2.5m, playing 16-18 minutes a night with no PK time as a #4-#5 guy, I guarantee you I and other Canucks fans would love him. He's still an NHL-level defenseman who has been terribly miscast and given free reign to roam around by Vigneault for a reason absolutely none of us can figure out. Nonetheless, he's playing 1st pairing minutes and top opposition with Hamhuis most nights and only failing somewhat instead of miserably so far.
No, he's not. I live in Vancouver and watch all their games, and Bieksa is almost a mistake per shift back there. His pinches are terribly timed, his turnovers are horrendous, and his overall lack of awareness on the ice is noticeable. Most of that could be excused, if he was putting up the points, but that seems to have deserted him for the most part as well.

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10-23-2010, 05:27 PM
  #229
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Dunno how desperate Vancouver really is but how about Moen and O'Byrne for Bieksa?

Moen would fit pretty well in Van's bottom 6 and Ryan still has some upsides. Van sheds about a M$

Habs then call up White but dunno if this could really work with our cap.
I think something around Moen for Bieksa makes a lot of sense, but I don't know if the Canucks can really afford to take on another one-way contract in the form of O'Byrne. I'd argue they currently have Ryan Parent playing for them who is a pretty comparable player at the same salary (and is also younger).

I'd think either a younger depth defenseman on a flexible contract or a draft pick along with Moen would work though.

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10-23-2010, 05:59 PM
  #230
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No, he's not. I live in Vancouver and watch all their games, and Bieksa is almost a mistake per shift back there. His pinches are terribly timed, his turnovers are horrendous, and his overall lack of awareness on the ice is noticeable. Most of that could be excused, if he was putting up the points, but that seems to have deserted him for the most part as well.
Bieksa's mistakes are pointed out by at least 10 posters on the Canucks board within seconds of them happening - so don't worry - we are all more than aware of just how bad Bieksa is. He makes about one terrible mistake per game, and sometimes gets caught pinching when a forward doesn't cover (absolutely sucks at timing his pinches) - other than that, he's good at getting the puck out and very good with his break out passes. Sometimes his partner bails him out of those mistakes, sometimes he doesn't. I never said he was a good d-man and would take just a 3rd round pick for him in a trade at this point, but to say he's as bad as MAB defensively is off the wall. He's a serviceable #4-5 defenseman who has been horribly misused and overplayed by AV in a top pairing role (I want Bieksa gone just to save AV from himself and his Bieksa-love in the playoffs...).

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10-23-2010, 06:49 PM
  #231
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The thing with Bieksa is that he's a freaking Katy Perry song in his own end. Hot and cold, it's never a performance where you'll not notice him on the ice for his play. He's too inconsistent to be playing the minutes he's getting, and now it seems the only way Bieksa becomes marginally effective is when he's paired with a defenceman that can cover for his multiple gaffes (read: Mitchell, Salo, Hamhuis). We loved Bieksa when he was an up-and-comer and we were all amazed at his "gritty, canadian, toughness" but we (Canucks fans) overlooked his faults rather drastically. I will always enjoy Bieksa for what he is: a Katy Perry song, nothing more and nothing less.

With that being said, bidding opens at marginal 3rd line center and a mid-round pick.

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10-23-2010, 07:54 PM
  #232
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Originally Posted by Tiranis View Post
Bieksa, by comparison, might be an adventure defensively but he's playing 22-23 minutes a night and is still managing better in that regard than MAB with 12-13 minutes a night. He's great at joining and more importantly leading the rush — if your team doesn't have a player like that, he's a real asset in that regard. His straight line skating is good, his turning, skating backwards, etc. are lacking for an NHL level player. He doesn't have great hockey sense but he's still a better PP QB than Bergeron. His shot is decent enough and he gets it on net, good at creating opportunities for a deflection. When he decides to he can be a tough guy to play against, unfortunately that side of him is not on display most nights.
If Bieksa was all that offensively, he wouldn't have 0 points in 8 games. He's not a bad offensive d-man, but if you play those types of minutes on a top 2 pairing and bring below average defending, you'd better do something offensively ... Alberts has more points for god's sake

Although he does play on an atrocious 2nd pp pairing so I can't blame him there

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Old
10-23-2010, 08:21 PM
  #233
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Jarkko Ruutu and a 3rd? Please.

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10-23-2010, 08:46 PM
  #234
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Jarkko Ruutu and a 3rd? Please.
Been there, done that

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10-23-2010, 08:47 PM
  #235
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Been there, done that
Ruutu was effective here in Vancouver and I would certainly welcome him back. We couldn't sign him because of the cap, not because we didn't want him.

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10-23-2010, 08:59 PM
  #236
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Been there, done that
Ruutu seems like a reasonable option. Cheap, kills penalties and gritty. If Neil or Kelly are available that might change things...

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10-23-2010, 09:28 PM
  #237
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Originally Posted by Saren View Post
The thing with Bieksa is that he's a freaking Katy Perry song in his own end. Hot and cold, it's never a performance where you'll not notice him on the ice for his play. He's too inconsistent to be playing the minutes he's getting, and now it seems the only way Bieksa becomes marginally effective is when he's paired with a defenceman that can cover for his multiple gaffes (read: Mitchell, Salo, Hamhuis). We loved Bieksa when he was an up-and-comer and we were all amazed at his "gritty, canadian, toughness" but we (Canucks fans) overlooked his faults rather drastically. I will always enjoy Bieksa for what he is: a Katy Perry song, nothing more and nothing less.

With that being said, bidding opens at marginal 3rd line center and a mid-round pick.
There's no way anyone kept reading after that part.

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10-23-2010, 09:55 PM
  #238
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Good idea by the Canucks. I know many would be relieved once he exits the locker room.

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10-23-2010, 10:54 PM
  #239
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There's no way anyone kept reading after that part.
You obviously did.

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Old
10-24-2010, 11:53 AM
  #240
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What about this trade which I think will help all teams involved:
3 way Vcr-Mtl-Philly

1)Montreal gets Luongo and Bieksa (cap hit around 9 million). Bieksa adds grit they need and Luongo would only waive his no trade/movement to his hometown where his parents live

2)Philly gets: Hamrlik,Rypien, Hodgson, Mtl first 2011,Vcr 1st round 2011 and choice of prospect in Mtl organization and benefits from some cap relief they really need. Cap hit around $6M and Hamrlik off books end of year. Gives them room at trade deadline to accept cap heavy contract

3) Vancouver gets Carter, Price and Carcillo Cap hit around 8.5M

Sedin-Sedin- Burrows
Raymond-Carter-Kesler
Torres-Malhotra-Samuelsson
Hansen-Tambellini/Bolduc-Carcillo

We add grit, youth at goalie position for years and best top 6 in the league IMO...

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10-24-2010, 12:27 PM
  #241
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Originally Posted by walgrove View Post
What about this trade which I think will help all teams involved:
3 way Vcr-Mtl-Philly

1)Montreal gets Luongo and Bieksa (cap hit around 9 million). Bieksa adds grit they need and Luongo would only waive his no trade/movement to his hometown where his parents live

2)Philly gets: Hamrlik,Rypien, Hodgson, Mtl first 2011,Vcr 1st round 2011 and choice of prospect in Mtl organization and benefits from some cap relief they really need. Cap hit around $6M and Hamrlik off books end of year. Gives them room at trade deadline to accept cap heavy contract

3) Vancouver gets Carter, Price and Carcillo Cap hit around 8.5M

Sedin-Sedin- Burrows
Raymond-Carter-Kesler
Torres-Malhotra-Samuelsson
Hansen-Tambellini/Bolduc-Carcillo

We add grit, youth at goalie position for years and best top 6 in the league IMO...


Incredible trade . i like it, except mike Gillis will never trade Luongo. if cory Schneider plays like he is now, for the rest of the season its a deal

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10-24-2010, 12:36 PM
  #242
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Incredible trade . i like it, except mike Gillis will never trade Luongo. if cory Schneider plays like he is now, for the rest of the season its a deal
I think Price would alleviate concerns about Schneider in the short term anyways:-)

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10-24-2010, 12:39 PM
  #243
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Originally Posted by PeterTheGreat View Post
No, he's not. I live in Vancouver and watch all their games, and Bieksa is almost a mistake per shift back there. His pinches are terribly timed, his turnovers are horrendous, and his overall lack of awareness on the ice is noticeable. Most of that could be excused, if he was putting up the points, but that seems to have deserted him for the most part as well.
That to a degree may be true, but to say he's as poor defensively as MAB is just wrong.

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10-24-2010, 01:07 PM
  #244
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Originally Posted by BlamBlam View Post
Jarkko Ruutu and a 3rd? Please.
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Originally Posted by Winroba View Post
Been there, done that
I would LOVE to have Ruutu back on this team.

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Old
10-24-2010, 01:12 PM
  #245
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Todd White, Matt Gilroy, and a 4th?

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10-24-2010, 01:18 PM
  #246
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You obviously did.
How do you figure?

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Old
10-24-2010, 01:27 PM
  #247
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Originally Posted by walgrove View Post
What about this trade which I think will help all teams involved:
3 way Vcr-Mtl-Philly

1)Montreal gets Luongo and Bieksa (cap hit around 9 million). Bieksa adds grit they need and Luongo would only waive his no trade/movement to his hometown where his parents live

2)Philly gets: Hamrlik,Rypien, Hodgson, Mtl first 2011,Vcr 1st round 2011 and choice of prospect in Mtl organization and benefits from some cap relief they really need. Cap hit around $6M and Hamrlik off books end of year. Gives them room at trade deadline to accept cap heavy contract

3) Vancouver gets Carter, Price and Carcillo Cap hit around 8.5M

Sedin-Sedin- Burrows
Raymond-Carter-Kesler
Torres-Malhotra-Samuelsson
Hansen-Tambellini/Bolduc-Carcillo

We add grit, youth at goalie position for years and best top 6 in the league IMO...
No thanks....

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Old
10-24-2010, 01:42 PM
  #248
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Well lets see... Bieksa plays 22+ minutes a game for one of the better teams in the NHL. Bergeron couldn't get an NHL try-out.

You're probably right, they're pretty comparable. Except that they're completley different players in almost every conceivable way.
Calm down, I asked because many Canucks fans around here are saying Bieksa is terrible in his own end, best suited for PP duty, etc.

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Old
10-24-2010, 01:45 PM
  #249
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How do you figure?
Crystal ball.

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10-24-2010, 01:49 PM
  #250
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Good idea by the Canucks. I know many would be relieved once he exits the locker room.
You pulling that out of your ass, or...?

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