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What do we have in Alexandre Picard?

View Poll Results: What do we have in Picard?
A career AHLer 23 12.92%
A solid bottom pairing guy 149 83.71%
A solid 2nd pairing guy 6 3.37%
Voters: 178. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
10-28-2010, 01:08 PM
  #26
Monctonscout
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ngc_5128 View Post
O'Byrne is built for that style, but he doesn't use it much any more. JM doesn't believe in O'Byrne because he is still making rookie mistakes and his already fragile confidence goes the rest of the way down the drain after his first mistake. He has confidence issues and hasn't been able to fix them. I really like O'Byrne because he is big, a good skater, and a decent puck mover (when he isn't shaking in his skate boots the entire shift), but I think the only way he will be able to improve is if he gets a fresh start in another city.
He uses it when he's playing, pretty hard to run people over from the press box. The games he dressed he had a lot of hits but he hasn't played in 2 weeks.

I don't think it's his confidence as much as JM pulling the plug on him every mistake he makes, guys like MAB, Spacek, Picard, Subban just to name those recent ones, have not been nailed to the bench despite some brutal giveaways that led to goals or should have led to goals(if not bailed out by CP).

The biggest issue I have is that because JM has no faith in him we'll end up trading O'byrne for a mid round pick(3rd to 5th) and have to overpay(trade or UFA) for a similar player next off season.

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Old
10-28-2010, 01:11 PM
  #27
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We have a 7th dman that certain fans can obsess over...imploring that he needs to be in the lineup.

Not a Habs forum unless there's something to complain about even if the team remains in first place.

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Old
10-28-2010, 01:15 PM
  #28
Bullsmith
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This Poll's missing the only correct answer. IMO Picard is neither a solid top 6 Nhl D, whether it's second pair or third, nor is he a career AHLer. Right now he's a bubble guy, a 7th d. He's young enough that he could turn out to be a solid NHLer, but right now he hasn't proven it.

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10-28-2010, 01:37 PM
  #29
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He's ahead of O'Byrnes in the dept chart no question about. He will step up on the line up this year because our old guys will get hurt or need some time off in the season

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10-28-2010, 03:15 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
He uses it when he's playing, pretty hard to run people over from the press box. The games he dressed he had a lot of hits but he hasn't played in 2 weeks.

I don't think it's his confidence as much as JM pulling the plug on him every mistake he makes, guys like MAB, Spacek, Picard, Subban just to name those recent ones, have not been nailed to the bench despite some brutal giveaways that led to goals or should have led to goals(if not bailed out by CP).

The biggest issue I have is that because JM has no faith in him we'll end up trading O'byrne for a mid round pick(3rd to 5th) and have to overpay(trade or UFA) for a similar player next off season.
When all the players you mentioned make mistakes, they continue playing their game the same way, but when O'Byrne makes a mistake, he basically shuts down and his mistakes start multiplying. Also, it's not that he is making mistakes (no defense man is perfect) that I think the issue is, but more the type of mistakes he is making. He is still making the same rookie mistakes at 25-26 that he was making when he first broke into the league 3 years ago.

I think it's also worth pointing out that Martin appears to have cleared the slate with O'Byrne this year, since he has been getting the same amout of ice time as the guy who has stolen his spot. They are both averaging 14:54 mins of ice time. I think that if Markov wasn't returning this weekend, O'Byrne would be back in the lineup either once the team lost or Picard had a bad game.

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10-28-2010, 08:25 PM
  #31
Hank Scorpio
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
On the other hand, O'byrne brings the bruising style that we clearly need...but JM doesn't believe much in the need for physical players.
I agree with you on what we have in O'byrne but I don't think JM's decision to keep Picard up is rooted in his belief but more so the current needs of the team. Picard and O'byrne play a very different game and right now, the only player consistently providing offense from the back end is Subban. With Spacek's offense being non-existent this season and Markov out until Saturday the idea of playing Picard over O'byrne was to try to replace some of that offense lost from our back end as he is the better offensive option. In terms of the lack of confidence JM has in O'byrne, you can see that he also has the same lack of confidence in Picard as he is getting limited ice time and is usually sent out against 3rd/4th lines which is also why, at the moment, he is a little over glorified.

Getting back to the actual question, I believe what we have in Picard is another 7th defense man (with O'byrne being the other) who will come in as an offensive option when needed. When Markov comes back into the line up I think he will be sent down and O'byrne will stay with the team simply because of their contracts.

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Old
10-28-2010, 08:42 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bullsmith View Post
This Poll's missing the only correct answer. IMO Picard is neither a solid top 6 Nhl D, whether it's second pair or third, nor is he a career AHLer. Right now he's a bubble guy, a 7th d. He's young enough that he could turn out to be a solid NHLer, but right now he hasn't proven it.
IMO if you aint crackin the starting lineup, you are as good as an AHLer...

So for the sake of the poll, vote that.

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Old
10-28-2010, 08:53 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by Toro View Post
Solid bottom pairing guy.

he will no doubt be in the way of Carle. Because Picard has done well i see no future for Carle here. They are very similar role playing Defeneman. Both will be bottom pairing mobile puck moving guys with limited toughness and physicality but steady2-way guys.
JM made that decision before camp even started. Remember when this guy's play was less than ordinary in the preseason he still got +20 minutes of ice time in the games he played. I think he was ahead of OB as well and I agree that Carle and probably Weber have no future with the Habs.

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Old
10-28-2010, 10:17 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by Hank Scorpio View Post
I agree with you on what we have in O'byrne but I don't think JM's decision to keep Picard up is rooted in his belief but more so the current needs of the team. Picard and O'byrne play a very different game and right now, the only player consistently providing offense from the back end is Subban. With Spacek's offense being non-existent this season and Markov out until Saturday the idea of playing Picard over O'byrne was to try to replace some of that offense lost from our back end as he is the better offensive option. In terms of the lack of confidence JM has in O'byrne, you can see that he also has the same lack of confidence in Picard as he is getting limited ice time and is usually sent out against 3rd/4th lines which is also why, at the moment, he is a little over glorified.

Getting back to the actual question, I believe what we have in Picard is another 7th defense man (with O'byrne being the other) who will come in as an offensive option when needed. When Markov comes back into the line up I think he will be sent down and O'byrne will stay with the team simply because of their contracts.

Why ? The Habs have only 22 players on the active roster. Markov will be the 23rd. They gonna keep both O'Byrne and Picard + a 13th forward (Boyd for the moment). Maybe a trade will send one of our d-man away - Spacek or O'Byrne...

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10-28-2010, 10:44 PM
  #35
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I like Picard a lot better than O'Byrne. Look at the Habs record and tell me why Picard shouldn't be the 7th D man when Markov returns. Sure, he has made some mistakes, but he has done much more good. I like his defensive play.

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10-28-2010, 10:50 PM
  #36
Hank Scorpio
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CanadienErrant View Post
Why ? The Habs have only 22 players on the active roster. Markov will be the 23rd. They gonna keep both O'Byrne and Picard + a 13th forward (Boyd for the moment). Maybe a trade will send one of our d-man away - Spacek or O'Byrne...
My mistake! I was writing under the assumption that we would have to send someone down. Nonetheless, I still think he will be sent down if it comes down to it only because he wouldn't have to go through waivers.

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10-29-2010, 01:22 AM
  #37
Kimota
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
On the other hand, O'byrne brings the bruising style that we clearly need...but JM doesn't believe much in the need for physical players.
If only O'Byrne had a bruising style. He has completly stopped hitting. For a guy that was supposed to be Komi 2, our next hard hitting, he's been pretty mellow.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ToysInTheAttic View Post
I like Picard a lot better than O'Byrne. Look at the Habs record and tell me why Picard shouldn't be the 7th D man when Markov returns. Sure, he has made some mistakes, but he has done much more good. I like his defensive play.
It's even hard seeing him as a 7th guy given how he's played better than more than a few of our regular Ds. If he continues playing this well, when Markov comes back, he should get the second pairing job.


Last edited by habsprospects: 10-29-2010 at 01:31 AM.
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Old
10-29-2010, 01:39 AM
  #38
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A decent 7th defenseman.. If Im OByrne, Im worried..

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10-29-2010, 01:46 AM
  #39
Kimota
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A decent 7th defenseman.. If Im OByrne, Im worried..
Spacek and Hammer should be worried too.

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10-29-2010, 01:53 AM
  #40
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Originally Posted by natey2k4 View Post
I think he has the potential to be a second pairing guy type player. He's only 25-years old and there are a lot of defenseman who don't hit their stride until their mid-late 20's.
[.....]
Also, Picards first pass is just awesome so far. He's so calm with the puck and that's something I didn't expect from the last handful of times I've seen him. He rarely makes a bad decision with the puck.
Kind of a stark contrast to own goal O'byrne.

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Old
10-29-2010, 06:56 AM
  #41
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Picard at the moment is a 7th. Nothing special, still reliable. Could end up a bottom-pairing guy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ngc_5128 View Post
...I really like O'Byrne because he is big, a good skater, and a decent puck mover (when he isn't shaking in his skate boots the entire shift), but I think the only way he will be able to improve is if he gets a fresh start in another city.
I hope you're wrong.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
... I still think that if JM put faith in O'byrne that he'd add another dimension on defense, he had some stretches with Markov last year that he was a pillar back there.
Agree. Plus players show more respect to Markov when he has someone like Komisarek or O'Byrne to stick up for him.

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10-29-2010, 07:50 AM
  #42
Monctonscout
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Originally Posted by Kimota View Post
If only O'Byrne had a bruising style. He has completly stopped hitting. For a guy that was supposed to be Komi 2, our next hard hitting, he's been pretty mellow.

Who do you want him to hit, the reporters in the press box?

He was by far our most physical guy in the games he played. In the NHL stats he has 11 hits in 3 games, the team leader is Pouliot with 23 in 9 games. Gorges leads the defense with 15 in 9 games. Had he played all 9 games he'd surely be among the nHL leaders. The top guy is Schenn with 34 in 9 games, 10th is a group of guys at 25.

It's not like those hits are just light bumps, I recall at least 4 or 5 of those that were bone jarring where the player ends up on his butt.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AllCanadienFan View Post
JM made that decision before camp even started. Remember when this guy's play was less than ordinary in the preseason he still got +20 minutes of ice time in the games he played. I think he was ahead of OB as well and I agree that Carle and probably Weber have no future with the Habs.
Saying Carle and Weber have no future in Montreal is ridiculous considering that Spacek, Harmrlik and Gill could all be gone in 2 years, possibly Markov also if they can't work out an extension. The dumbest things the Habs can do in the next 24 months is trade away defensive depth. Having all those vets at 35 or over is part of the reason they signed guys like Nash, Kluberantz and Picard, plus drafted Tinordi(though he is probably 3-5 years away). Carle is not a blue chip prospect so he may never become an NHL regular, but given the age of the defense I think he'll get a shot here in the next 2 years.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hank Scorpio View Post
I agree with you on what we have in O'byrne but I don't think JM's decision to keep Picard up is rooted in his belief but more so the current needs of the team. Picard and O'byrne play a very different game and right now, the only player consistently providing offense from the back end is Subban. With Spacek's offense being non-existent this season and Markov out until Saturday the idea of playing Picard over O'byrne was to try to replace some of that offense lost from our back end as he is the better offensive option. In terms of the lack of confidence JM has in O'byrne, you can see that he also has the same lack of confidence in Picard as he is getting limited ice time and is usually sent out against 3rd/4th lines which is also why, at the moment, he is a little over glorified.

Getting back to the actual question, I believe what we have in Picard is another 7th defense man (with O'byrne being the other) who will come in as an offensive option when needed. When Markov comes back into the line up I think he will be sent down and O'byrne will stay with the team simply because of their contracts.
His lack of confidence is probably liked to getting nailed to the bench every mistake he makes.

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Old
10-29-2010, 08:13 AM
  #43
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A guy that can still progress and shouldn't have his potential roofed to an exclusive definition.

For now, the guy is a NHLer. If he can stay constant and perform well, he will open himself up a spot for next year. He used to be seen as the future replacement of Desjardins in Philly a few years back. He's still young, he's got talent, and some players can take more time. He might end-up being an average top pairing D, but in all likelyhood, I see him in the two last pairings in the future. I believe Martin's teachings will greatly help him progress. He seems more solid then when he was playing in Ottawa last season. Picard has good chances of creating himself a niche here in Montreal, especially since he has chemistry with the Chocolate Rocket.

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Old
10-29-2010, 08:22 AM
  #44
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I past few games I'v actually been quite happy with him. In the pre-season he was pretty bad, but now he looks like a serviceable bottom pairing guy. He'll most likely stay as 7th defenseman when Markov returns

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10-29-2010, 09:11 AM
  #45
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Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
A guy that can still progress and shouldn't have his potential roofed to an exclusive definition.

For now, the guy is a NHLer. If he can stay constant and perform well, he will open himself up a spot for next year. He used to be seen as the future replacement of Desjardins in Philly a few years back. He's still young, he's got talent, and some players can take more time. He might end-up being an average top pairing D, but in all likelyhood, I see him in the two last pairings in the future. I believe Martin's teachings will greatly help him progress. He seems more solid then when he was playing in Ottawa last season. Picard has good chances of creating himself a niche here in Montreal, especially since he has chemistry with the Chocolate Rocket.
I don't see Picard as Subban's partner going forward, mostly because they are both barely adequate defensively. They had some nightmare shifts where Price had to bail them out 2-3 times,

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Old
10-29-2010, 09:19 AM
  #46
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Subban has covered for Picard nicely in certain situations. Should Gill need a break I wouldn't mind seeing Picard with Gorges. I wouldn't mind even if Gill doesn't need a break. Picard is still young and there some good d-men on the Habs' roster who could teach him some things. I thought Bergeron actually did learn positioning as the season wore on last year. He just doesn't have the physical attributes to ever be a good d-man but Picard does.

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10-29-2010, 09:26 AM
  #47
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Originally Posted by Habs 4 Life View Post
I wouldn't be surprised if he didn't ask Gauthier already.We would all do the same,we are there to play and if we are always a healthy scratch eventually you get fed up and asked to be moved to a team that will use you

As for Picard,I think he could end up being a really good #5-6 for us
I'm assuming you mean "if he did"

It's funny it's like a double negative. I wouldn't be surpised if he DIDN'T ask Gauthier already

I'd be surprised if he did ask Gauther already would then technically what you said but didn't mean. :hossa:

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10-29-2010, 09:47 AM
  #48
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I'd be content to see him play regularly on our bottom pairing. I don't think his overall game is solid enough for him to be a Top 4 guy. But still, a decent bottom pairing guy. Almost a luxury as a 7th D, really.

Long-term, I do think that it drastically reduces OB or Carle's chances of making this team on a regular basis.

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10-29-2010, 02:02 PM
  #49
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I like O'Byrne for these reezins.

1-He plays with a big apostrophe. We had two apostrophes with D'Agostini so I don't think we should get rid of both.

2-He can bust guys up in front of the net better than Spacek and Hamrlik and can induce a bit of fear into opponents. He's the only one who can do that.

3-As for his first pass, I say just tell him to bang it off the boards and we'll be alright.

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10-29-2010, 03:10 PM
  #50
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this reminds me of bouillon. never understood the label he had here. He logs 20mins of icetime more often then not with the predators and is relied upon in various defensive situations, has good wheels, hits...ect...

but here he was called a career AHLer countless times. its always the extremes here... our players are norris candidates OR career ahler and there is no room in between for decent contributors like picard.

picard is a SOLID bottom pairing DMen with a clear chance to get better considering his age and the experience he already has. Speculate when he actually plays a bad game, until then... well chill out ?


Last edited by THE HOFF: 10-29-2010 at 03:16 PM.
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