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The Lars Eller Thread

View Poll Results: Eller: Top[ 6 or top 9?
Top 6 121 66.85%
Top 9 60 33.15%
Voters: 181. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
10-25-2010, 01:12 PM
  #101
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Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
You're generalizing his play. He does make mistakes and sometimes he seems to overthink what he needs to do, but at other times he does all the right things, those little things that can amount to a lot.



That's simply ridiculous. I noticed Eller often controlling the play along the boards and winning battles, stickhandling from back to front to go for open space. He's not missing the fraction of a second, what he is missing is the right decision and the experience to recognize it. And the only way he is gonna get that is if he plays here.
I guarantee if you put Eller in the AHL with the team that we have, he might even lead AHL scoring/points. I'm not even sure if that poster was honestly serious.

He's at a point in his career where he isn't quite NHL top 6 ready but at the same time he's more than ready to be an NHL regular, being in the AHL wouldn't benefit him any nor the team.

He needs time in a top 9 role to develop into the true top 6 player he really is. Problem is with him our team has 7 top 6 forwards. Two of whom are question marks so far, he and Pouliot.

Right now Pouliot has more experience and line chemistry on the second line so the odds of Lars being put there are slim.

Eller's best option is likely centering our 3rd line not centering the 1st line in Hamilton.

We act like we have no room for this guy but we clearly do and no Ryan White couldn't do everything he's doing and better. Ryan White however could compliment him on the 3rd line or be a huge addition to our 4th line.

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10-25-2010, 01:17 PM
  #102
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Originally Posted by neofury View Post
I guarantee if you put Eller in the AHL with the team that we have, he might even lead AHL scoring/points. I'm not even sure if that poster was honestly serious.

He's at a point in his career where he isn't quite NHL top 6 ready but at the same time he's more than ready to be an NHL regular, being in the AHL wouldn't benefit him any nor the team.

He needs time in a top 9 role to develop into the true top 6 player he really is. Problem is with him our team has 7 top 6 forwards. Two of whom are question marks so far, he and Pouliot.

Right now Pouliot has more experience and line chemistry on the second line so the odds of Lars being put there are slim.

Eller's best option is likely centering our 3rd line not centering the 1st line in Hamilton.

We act like we have no room for this guy but we clearly do and no Ryan White couldn't do everything he's doing and better. Ryan White however could compliment him on the 3rd line or be a huge addition to our 4th line.
Yes, I was serious, and yes I think White, right now -- not in the future -- would be better at cutting plays, positioning himself better in the forecheck, and probably even at getting shots on goal, given the linemates he would play with.

No way I think White is better, I just pretend that White is better right now in the context in which Eller is used (bottom 6), and that Eller is not ready to play top 6, so he'd better be in teh AHL for half a season...

But I'm confortable with you thinking I'm wrong.

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10-25-2010, 01:22 PM
  #103
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Originally Posted by LePoche69 View Post
Yes, I was serious, and yes I think White, right now -- not in the future -- would be better at cutting plays, positioning himself better in the forecheck, and probably even at getting shots on goal, given the linemates he would play with.

No way I think White is better, I just pretend that White is better right now in the context in which Eller is used (bottom 6), and that Eller is not ready to play top 6, so he'd better be in teh AHL for half a season...

But I'm confortable with you thinking I'm wrong.
Fair enough I just disagree. I love both players but honestly I think it's the type of situation in 5-10 more games you'll even realize it too.

I think we just have high expectations, especially after being gifted with such a great pick in Subban. Not all players gel right away plus he's been given less than favorable opportunity.

I'd like to see what he could've done in Pyatt's place on the 2nd line but Martin keeps putting Darche, Pyatt etc on that line.

I like White and maybe for the next 3-5 games he could do a better job, but I just think once Eller would be given the chance and given some time to find his groove this wouldn't be the case, hence why I say give him 5-10 games.

That having been said I respect your opinion now that I understand it better, just don't entirely agree with it. I'd say it's more like max 10 games White would be better where as you think maybe for half a season or even the full season he could do the job better. I just think Eller needs a few more games to click, maybe some stable line mates. People forget how tough it is to produce when your line mates are always different, no chance to develop chemistry. Imo that alone makes him look a lot worse than he really is.

Truthfully both should be on the team not one or the other.

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10-25-2010, 01:23 PM
  #104
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Originally Posted by LePoche69 View Post
Yes, I was serious, and yes I think White, right now -- not in the future -- would be better at cutting plays, positioning himself better in the forecheck, and probably even at getting shots on goal, given the linemates he would play with.

No way I think White is better, I just pretend that White is better right now in the context in which Eller is used (bottom 6), and that Eller is not ready to play top 6, so he'd better be in teh AHL for half a season...

But I'm confortable with you thinking I'm wrong.
But why make it a Eller versus White issue when clearly Eller should be played at center. Why not send Darche back if we want White. Habs will need him back soon enough, so it will only be a fraction of the 500k that they'll have to pay as AHL salary. Nobody's gonna claim him on waivers IMO, not with that one-way contract.

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10-25-2010, 01:27 PM
  #105
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Fair enough I just disagree. I love both players but honestly I think it's the type of situation in 5-10 more games you'll even realize it too.

I think we just have high expectations, especially after being gifted with such a great pick in Subban. Not all players gel right away plus he's been given less than favorable opportunity.

I'd like to see what he could've done in Pyatt's place on the 2nd line but Martin keeps putting Darche, Pyatt etc on that line.

I like White and maybe for the next 3-5 games he could do a better job, but I just think once Eller would be given the chance and given some time to find his groove this wouldn't be the case, hence why I say give him 5-10 games.

That having been said I respect your opinion now that I understand it better, just don't entirely agree with it. I'd say it's more like max 10 games White would be better where as you think maybe for half a season or even the full season he could do the job better. I just think Eller needs a few more games to click, maybe some stable line mates. People forget how tough it is to produce when your line mates are always different, no chance to develop chemistry. Imo that alone makes him look a lot worse than he really is.

Truthfully both should be on the team not one or the other.
I like your "5-10 games in the future" principle. You may very well be right. I certainly hope so. I think that if the kid isn't the type to let himself be discouraged, then I'm all for waiting another 5-10 games, hell maybe even 15-20. But if his confidence is fading and Habs still plays around .500 hockey, then let him dominate in teh AHL.

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10-25-2010, 01:30 PM
  #106
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Originally Posted by buddahsmoka1 View Post
Of course I am serious. Horrible analogy my friend, because Toronto IS a weak team. The Central hasn´t been THAT strong before a couple seasons ago either, Detriot is a powerhouse, but Chicago, Nashville, and Columbus are far from world beaters until Chicago turned into a good team.

All I see here is a bunch of excuses. Like oh, the conference is weaker, the division is stronger. Yawn, who gives a **** man, all that matters in sports is results.

Bottom line, St. Louis has made the playoffs once in the last 5 years, and they got swept that series. They are currently a weak team, its that simple.

And don´t feed me the "we made it, you didn't, so you suck, we're awesome", its painfully misrepresented. I never even said anything about Montreal, which is a middle of the pack team with the pòtential to win playoff series, something the Blues currently are not.
You know as much about baseball as you do about hockey I see. Toronto's Pythagorean record has been in the top 6 or 7 in the entire league for the last few years. Not exactly a weak team.

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10-25-2010, 08:43 PM
  #107
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Originally Posted by icerocket View Post
Drafting is not the problem with this team.

It's player development. Honestly, it's like they have no clue what to do.

Yep, Eller had a promisnig career until he got traded into JMs system.

1) Play him on different lines
2) Limit his ice time to nothing
3) Put him in his natural position; then give him Darche and Moen as wingers
4) Destroy all offensive instincts he has; then his confidence

But put a plugger like Pyatt on he top 4....

How about putting Boyd back in the lineup and put him with Eller, the kid did have some scoring prowess in Jr. and can match Eller's speed.

Geez JM...

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10-25-2010, 08:57 PM
  #108
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McGuire was discussing this on TSN during intermission. He believed sending him down would be beneficial because the likelihood of Eller slotting in the top six as a centerman is exceptionally low. He is not a dynamic goal scorer in any capacity and if the intention is to attempt to develop him into one. He needs time to learn in a less pressured atmosphere. Frankly, this is precisely why I would love Gomez moved or even consider moving Plek to the wing. It would provide Eller an opportunity to play top six minutes at his strength.

Who knows, Plekanec could pull a Patrick Sharp or Ryan Kesler in being capable of multi-position work.

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10-25-2010, 09:15 PM
  #109
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Originally Posted by Bourne View Post
McGuire was discussing this on TSN during intermission. He believed sending him down would be beneficial because the likelihood of Eller slotting in the top six as a centerman is exceptionally low. He is not a dynamic goal scorer in any capacity and if the intention is to attempt to develop him into one. He needs time to learn in a less pressured atmosphere. Frankly, this is precisely why I would love Gomez moved or even consider moving Plek to the wing. It would provide Eller an opportunity to play top six minutes at his strength.

Who knows, Plekanec could pull a Patrick Sharp or Ryan Kesler in being capable of multi-position work.
I understand your point... but removing our best centerman for a prospect who hasn't shown anything yet is ludicrous.

It's ****ing simple, play him with Gomez and Gionta, not useless pluggers like Pyatt and freakin Moen... if he can't produce... send him down, period.

...btw, the way Halak plays, Eller better become a ppg player... f... you Gauthier.

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10-25-2010, 10:00 PM
  #110
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Originally Posted by LePoche69 View Post
I like your "5-10 games in the future" principle. You may very well be right. I certainly hope so. I think that if the kid isn't the type to let himself be discouraged, then I'm all for waiting another 5-10 games, hell maybe even 15-20. But if his confidence is fading and Habs still plays around .500 hockey, then let him dominate in teh AHL.
Eller was one of our best forwards tonight. Made some good plays both offensively and defensively.

He belongs in the NHL.

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10-25-2010, 11:39 PM
  #111
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I understand why people want to put him on the second line, but i think most are going about it the wrong way. Gomez is the one underachieving on that line, and he can play a third line defensive role until he gets his head out of his ass.

Pouliot-Eller-Gionta
x-Gomez-x

That's a second line that should do some damage in the crease!

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Old
10-26-2010, 12:15 AM
  #112
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Originally Posted by Habitant#1 View Post
I understand why people want to put him on the second line, but i think most are going about it the wrong way. Gomez is the one underachieving on that line, and he can play a third line defensive role until he gets his head out of his ass.

Pouliot-Eller-Gionta
x-Gomez-x

That's a second line that should do some damage in the crease!
If you are going to split up Gomez and Gionta, I would try to make them into a 2A/2B deal, because Gomez will do nothing with a bunch of scrubs...

Maybe:

C-P-K
Boyd-Eller-Gionta
Pouliot-Gomez-Lapierre
Pyatt-Halpern-Moen

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10-26-2010, 01:36 AM
  #113
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Originally Posted by Jakomyte View Post
If you are going to split up Gomez and Gionta, I would try to make them into a 2A/2B deal, because Gomez will do nothing with a bunch of scrubs...

Maybe:

C-P-K
Boyd-Eller-Gionta
Pouliot-Gomez-Lapierre
Pyatt-Halpern-Moen
That's what I would like to see.

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Old
10-26-2010, 02:02 AM
  #114
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Eller belongs in the NHL. That's not a coincidence if 30 seconds into his first shift iwth a quality player the puck was in the net.

He's intense, hard on the puck, has a HUGE range, and is gifted as hell.

It's a typical NHL adjustment for yet another young player.

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10-26-2010, 02:10 AM
  #115
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Originally Posted by Bourne View Post
McGuire was discussing this on TSN during intermission. He believed sending him down would be beneficial because the likelihood of Eller slotting in the top six as a centerman is exceptionally low. He is not a dynamic goal scorer in any capacity and if the intention is to attempt to develop him into one. He needs time to learn in a less pressured atmosphere. Frankly, this is precisely why I would love Gomez moved or even consider moving Plek to the wing. It would provide Eller an opportunity to play top six minutes at his strength.

Who knows, Plekanec could pull a Patrick Sharp or Ryan Kesler in being capable of multi-position work.
You on crack man?..Plekanec is our #1 center. There's no way in hell he'll be moved. Especially not for a rookie with 1pt in 8gp.

The best decision would be to keep Eller at the 3rd line with Pouliot and Lappy/Moen. But I understand that Martin doesn't want to play them together because both still have a lot to learn on how to play both ways.
Because of that, I think it would be best to sign an old veteran like Nolan (as some have brought up before) to bring some kind of offensive depth to the 2nd line, no matter how small it may be.

Personally, I thought Martin was going to be more patient and willing with Pouliot/Eller. Knowing that it would only take 3 games before he decided to put a grinder on the 2nd line, I would have wanted Gauthier to sign or trade for a depth player like we had done with Lang.
I never understood the Darche signing. I felt it was far from a necessity. Considering we lacked scoring last year, I was sure they were going to let Darche go and try to replace him with a more productive NHLer again vet signed to a 1year deal.

Whatever is done, is done now, so it matters little to go back in the past. We still have to complete that 2nd line and moving Plek to the wing is simply not an option.
The only way I'm interested in breaking our current first line, is if A.Ko is moved to the Gomez line and Pouliot tried next to Cammy/Plek.

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10-26-2010, 08:29 AM
  #116
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You on crack man?..Plekanec is our #1 center. There's no way in hell he'll be moved. Especially not for a rookie with 1pt in 8gp.

The best decision would be to keep Eller at the 3rd line with Pouliot and Lappy/Moen. But I understand that Martin doesn't want to play them together because both still have a lot to learn on how to play both ways.
Because of that, I think it would be best to sign an old veteran like Nolan (as some have brought up before) to bring some kind of offensive depth to the 2nd line, no matter how small it may be.

Personally, I thought Martin was going to be more patient and willing with Pouliot/Eller. Knowing that it would only take 3 games before he decided to put a grinder on the 2nd line, I would have wanted Gauthier to sign or trade for a depth player like we had done with Lang.
I never understood the Darche signing. I felt it was far from a necessity. Considering we lacked scoring last year, I was sure they were going to let Darche go and try to replace him with a more productive NHLer again vet signed to a 1year deal.

Whatever is done, is done now, so it matters little to go back in the past. We still have to complete that 2nd line and moving Plek to the wing is simply not an option.
The only way I'm interested in breaking our current first line, is if A.Ko is moved to the Gomez line and Pouliot tried next to Cammy/Plek.
I thought he retired. If he didn't, might be worth the try.

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10-26-2010, 08:56 AM
  #117
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Given the fact that Gomez is playing like ***** right now, I'd try this to give a real chance to Eller:

A.K. - Plek - Cammy
Pouliot - Eller - Gionta
Boyd - Gomez - Pyatt
Moen - Halpern - Lapierre

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10-26-2010, 08:59 AM
  #118
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Originally Posted by Jakomyte View Post
If you are going to split up Gomez and Gionta, I would try to make them into a 2A/2B deal, because Gomez will do nothing with a bunch of scrubs...

Maybe:

C-P-K
Boyd-Eller-Gionta
Pouliot-Gomez-Lapierre
Pyatt-Halpern-Moen
That's a good point. I just figured Gomez was doing nothing either way! Both ideas are worth a try IMO!

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10-26-2010, 09:10 AM
  #119
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I would just put pouliot with eller if he is going keep pouliot off of the second line anyways. Then you have 1 line and 2 pairs that could possibly work out and plug people on the lines to see what works the best.

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10-26-2010, 09:14 AM
  #120
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In my opinion all it would take is one of Pouliot or Eller to start producing with Gomer + Gio to decide which one gets a 10 game stint with them. Then give them the 10 games to develop chemistry, if it works out keep them like that, if it doesn't give the other guy a shot. Basically force them to compete for that top six spot.

I still think Pouliot on the third line with Laps is decent, would just need to light a fire under maybe Boyds ass and it would be set.

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10-26-2010, 09:40 AM
  #121
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Pouliot - Eller - X
X - Gomez - Gionta

Then we will have lines 2A and 2B. Please no longer mention line 1A and 1B as we have only one #1 line.

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10-26-2010, 09:45 AM
  #122
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Originally Posted by zzoo View Post
Pouliot - Eller - X
X - Gomez - Gionta

Then we will have lines 2A and 2B. Please no longer mention line 1A and 1B as we have only one #1 line.
Reverse Pouliot and Gionta. Give each a veteran to play with. Eller needs a finisher. Gomez has got his chance with Gionta. Time to try something new.

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10-26-2010, 09:57 AM
  #123
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Reverse Pouliot and Gionta. Give each a veteran to play with. Eller needs a finisher. Gomez has got his chance with Gionta. Time to try something new.
This is a pretty good idea. Then have Boyd on one of those two lines and we have two mediocre/possibly decent 2nd line (which is better then what we have now). I see Lapierre playing with Pouliot so...

Pouliot-Gomez-Lapierre
Boyd-Eller-Gionta

Both lines have size too, which helps. Gomez-Gionta simply lacks weight, no matter who the left winger is. Pyatt&Moen can get some shifts instead of Lapierre and Boyd, since Martin loves them SO much and hates trios.

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10-26-2010, 10:02 AM
  #124
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You can't just give your newbie the spot he wants. Has Eller been amazing on the 4th? No. He has one assist and no goals. Yes, he might have higher points with better linemates, but he's literally a non-factor. If he was like Plek, who had to move up from the 4th to where he currently is now, then he would get the breaks he deserves.

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10-26-2010, 10:04 AM
  #125
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You can't just give your newbie the spot he wants. Has Eller been amazing on the 4th? No. He has one assist and no goals. Yes, he might have higher points with better linemates, but he's literally a non-factor. If he was like Plek, who had to move up from the 4th to where he currently is now, then he would get the breaks he deserves.
Excuse me, Benoit, but had he played with someone else than molasses Darche and stonehands Moen he'd have a couple more points. Darche-Eller-Moen is quite possibly the worse trio combo ever.

By the way, what has Pyatt done to deserve so much ice time on the top6? What about Moen or Darche? None of these players are permanent solutions on the top6, Pouliot or Eller are because these guys have the talent (and they did look good when they were given chances with other talented players).

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