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Kings vs Lightning - 11/04/10 - POSTGAME THOUGHTS & TIDBITS

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Old
11-05-2010, 12:41 AM
  #76
Cruel11
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A lot of group toughness. Who needs Westgarth?

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11-05-2010, 12:43 AM
  #77
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Originally Posted by Mully12 View Post
Not saying he would have stepped down from Mitchell either, but Willie didnt give him much of an option, stand up for yourself, or I'm gonna stand here and pound your face in for taking runs at my team all game.
You really never know with players of that kind of questionable character. He didn't give him much of a choice but had that been a different player I don't think he would have been as willing to throw down.

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11-05-2010, 12:43 AM
  #78
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Are these Tampa dudes seriously complaining about Drew's "hit" -- if you can even call it that? "(w?)Reckless?" LMFAO. I guess you don't really know what reckless means, seeing as how you can't even spell it, so I'll let it slide here.

What a joke. Having a complete and utter CLOWN on your team must rub off on the fanbase.
FWIW, if spelling it correctly is a requirement, in my post above, I spelled it properly.

I'm perfectly aware what it means. The hit was, in my honest opinion, a hit from behind, and a wreckless one. I don't think it was worth a major, but I thought it was a hit that was dangerous in nature. I think the two minute minor was sufficient, but I was surprised that Doughty made a hit like that, coming off of a concussion himself. It seemed a bit surprising, and of course, in the heat of the moment, as a fan, it pisses you off. Be honest man, if the roles were reversed, and one of the Kings players was hit (with what you felt to be a hit from behind), you'd have a problem with it. It's no different than what I personally feel. I'll certainly agree there are plenty of overreactions over in that thread, but to honestly dismiss the possibility that the hit was at least questionable is not fair at all.

I think the biggest disgrace personally was poor officiating on both sides. Both teams got away with cheap/dirty hits tonight, and I honestly thought Ohlund deserved a misconduct as well after the hit on Brown. I just think it's a shame that two good teams had a game with such pitiful refs.

Look man, I understand where you're coming from. I know Downie's reputation, and we don't have to agree. But think about it from a fan's perspective. You're gonna defend your guys, it's just the way it is. Calling us a joke...probably a bit harsh.

Either way, i'm not here to troll, just simply discuss, and let you guys know I enjoyed the game, and respect the opponent. I wish you guys the best of luck the rest of the way, and I'm sorry if you're bothered by what you read over there.

Cheers.

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11-05-2010, 12:44 AM
  #79
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guys like Downie need to be out of the league... Just no class. Keeps turning down fights from Clifford all night. Then fights a non traditional fighter... then takes a late swing at him after linesman break it up. Charges and jumps at Doughty like he was lebron james going for a block shot.... And he also fakes an injury.... What a loser!! Get him out the league.

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Old
11-05-2010, 12:44 AM
  #80
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Originally Posted by Cruel11 View Post
Who needs Westgarth?
Who ???

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11-05-2010, 12:45 AM
  #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Live in the Now View Post
You really never know with players of that kind of questionable character. He didn't give him much of a choice but had that been a different player I don't think he would have been as willing to throw down.
Ya I agree with you, had it have been Clifford or Westgarth or Simmonds, Downie would've Sean Avery'd it out of there.

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11-05-2010, 12:45 AM
  #82
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Originally Posted by Acehawk74 View Post
I am appaled that the official actually held Downie while Mitchell took a cheap shot at him while he was being held.
When the refs jumped in, Downie swung at Mitchell. I want a video of the fight. I distinctly remember the refs being in between the two before Downie winds up for another punch. If Mitchell took a cheapshot after that, then I have zero problem with it. If Downie wants to take cheap shots with the linesmen in the middle, then it's fair game for Mitchell to do it too. If your alleged cheapshot by downie was before the linesmen, I apologize because I obviously missed it

While you lost respect for Doughty, I lost respect for Downie. As stated before, he turns down fighting Clifford, a guy who WANTS TO FIGHT, and instead wants to fight a guy coming back from a concussion and then ends up fighting a guy who has a concussion history. Yeah, the fight with Mitchell was Mitchell defending his teammate but it doesn't change the fact that Downie ran Doughty, left his feet, intended to injure, and then tried to fight him after that. Slime players like him do NOT belong in the NHL.


Last edited by TonySCV: 11-05-2010 at 12:50 AM. Reason: inflammatory remarks removed
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11-05-2010, 12:49 AM
  #83
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Originally Posted by cnshockey View Post
Sorry....but I know you come in peace but I HAVE to say it....


Are you ****ing blind??? When the refs jumped in, Downie swung at Mitchell. I want a video of the fight. I distinctly remember the refs being in between the two before Downie winds up for another punch. If Mitchell took a cheapshot after that, then I have zero problem with it. If Downie wants to take cheap shots with the linesmen in the middle, then it's fair game for Mitchell to do it too. If your alleged cheapshot by downie was before the linesmen, I apologize because I obviously missed it

While you lost respect for Doughty, I lost respect for Downie. As stated before, he turns down fighting Clifford, a guy who WANTS TO FIGHT, and instead wants to fight a guy coming back from a concussion and then ends up fighting a guy who has a concussion history. Yeah, the fight with Mitchell was Mitchell defending his teammate but it doesn't change the fact that Downie ran Doughty, left his feet, intended to injure, and then tried to fight him after that. Slime players like him do NOT belong in the NHL.
How do you lose, what nobody has ever had?

Downie dives like a baby, doesn't fight actual fighters and then whines like crazy. He's about as classless as they come. Probably related to Cooke somehow

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11-05-2010, 12:49 AM
  #84
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Did Shellz miss Quick's shutout tonight? Haven't seen her posting tonight.

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11-05-2010, 12:50 AM
  #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alpa View Post
I don't know Downie's history but a guy like that has to be stopped BEFORE he hurts someone or even ends someones career.

NHL is talking about preventing injuries, caused by hits to the head and so on, but what is this guy doing on the ice ?...it is far from playing hockey and he will injure someone soon.
Quote:
In his brief career thus far, Steve Downie has been suspended for various incidents, in addition to the Aliu incident mentioned above. During a September 25, 2007, preseason game against the Ottawa Senators, Downie was involved in an incident in which he checked unsuspecting left winger Dean McAmmond into the boards, while Downie's feet were off the ice. Due the extent of McAmmond's injury and that he had left his skates in the hit, Downie was suspended by the NHL for 20 games three days later for deliberate injury to McAmmond, as they were cracking down on any play resulting in a head injury. To date, it is the fifth longest suspension given by the league. [2] [3] One day after the NHL suspension was announced, the Flyers announced they had sent Downie down to the team's American Hockey League (AHL) affiliate, the Philadelphia Phantoms. Per AHL by-laws, Downie was considered automatically ineligible to play pending a review by the AHL (as the AHL honors NHL suspensions). AHL President David Andrews suspended Downie for the first month of the 2007-2008 AHL season as a result of the attempt injuries to McAmmond.
On February 28, 2009, Downie, by this point playing for the Norfolk Admirals (the Lightning AHL affiliate), slashed a linesman in the shin following a controversial empty-net goal in a game against the Hershey Bears, receiving a game misconduct for physical abuse of an official. Under AHL rules, this penalty carries an automatic 20-game suspension, which would be Downie's second such lengthy suspension.
here's what happened with Aliu, referenced in the first part...

Quote:
Not long after being drafted, Downie was suspended for five games early in the 200506 OHL season for an on-ice altercation with teammate Akim Aliu. During a practice on September 28, 2005, Downie blindly cross-checked Aliu in the face without warning, knocking out 3 of his teeth, and then proceeded to fight his smaller, younger teammate.[1] The incident stemmed from 16-year-old Aliu's refusal to take part in a hazing incident, where he would have been forced to stand naked in a cramped bus bathroom with other rookies. The team suspended Downie for five games and Aliu for one, and Downie was told to undergo professional counseling.

this is also the guy responsible for the ire Jack Johnson gets in Canada for an 'injury' he suffered as a result of an elbow Jack threw... to which Jack has sworn up and down that he missed and never even touched him.

you could youtube that video, i think. if not, google Jack Johnson elbows Downey.

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11-05-2010, 12:52 AM
  #86
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Please, Lightning fan, point out Mitchells cheapshot? And please watch right when the linesmen jump in. You see Downies cheapshot? Right. Thanks. Case and point.

Quote:

How do you lose, what nobody has ever had?

Downie dives like a baby, doesn't fight actual fighters and then whines like crazy. He's about as classless as they come. Probably related to Cooke somehow

Never really knew the guy. I respect any player who can play in the NHL until they do something to lose my respect.

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11-05-2010, 12:55 AM
  #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cnshockey View Post
Sorry....but I know you come in peace but I HAVE to say it....


Are you ****ing blind??? When the refs jumped in, Downie swung at Mitchell. I want a video of the fight. I distinctly remember the refs being in between the two before Downie winds up for another punch. If Mitchell took a cheapshot after that, then I have zero problem with it. If Downie wants to take cheap shots with the linesmen in the middle, then it's fair game for Mitchell to do it too.

While you lost respect for Doughty, I lost respect for Downie. As stated before, he turns down fighting Clifford, a guy who WANTS TO FIGHT, and instead wants to fight a guy coming back from a concussion and then ends up fighting a guy who has a concussion history. Yeah, the fight with Mitchell was Mitchell defending his teammate but it doesn't change the fact that Downie ran Doughty, left his feet, intended to injure, and then tried to fight him after that. Slime players like him do NOT belong in the NHL.
I disagree with what you're saying. I'll get that out of the way first thing.

I'd like to see the fight as well again. Hockeyfights will probably have it up tomorrow. I did not see a cheap shot at Mitchell, but I assure you, I'm not ****ing blind. I'll watch it again, and if I catch it this time, I'll be happy to back off that point, as if that were the case, then it's fair game.

As for Doughty, I said in a few posts up that saying that I lost respect for Doughty was a bit harsh on my part. More reactionary than anything. Watching the game again with emotions removed (as I'm doing right now), i'm seeing a couple of hits that got both sides more irritated with each other that were allowed to happen. I still think Doughty's shot was a wreckless hit, but not necessarily with the intent to be dirty/cheap.

Downie's game is an agitatior, and that's well known. He's got good hands, skates well, and gets under opponents skin pretty well. His game over the past year and through this year has been changing, and he's cleaned up his act signifigantly. The word is down here in Tampa that he does have some whiplash type effects, which is why he went back to the locker room. I seriously doubt he was faking the injury.

As for Clifford, I honestly think him backing off fighting at that point was something that the coach simply told him to stay away from doing. One of Coach Boucher's goals for Downie this year is to stop doing stupid things...starting fights, etc. He's trying to implement more a value to his game than just being an agitator. Downie's done a pretty good job with it this year, but tonight, he lost that track a bit. I think the blame falls on him obviously, a few Kings players, and mostly , the officials, as they were letting these cheap, little hits go on without recourse all night from both sides.

I'm certainly not going to disagree about Downie getting under skin, but I do not think he was trying to hit Doughty with an intent to injure at all. He should've (imo) been given 2 minutes for charging, 5 for fighting, and a 10 minute misconduct. He did leave his feet, but he went into the boards practically backwards. He was trying to hit him, but I don't think injury was the goal. We'll never know, and I'm going off deductive reasoning (as I don't see many players go into trying to injure someone with just one shoulder, or backwards into the boards).

Either way, Downie's improving his mentality, and he's not the thug he once was. I respect if you don't agree with that, and you'll probably not see eye to eye with me on it, and that's fine. I just simply thought it's worth putting my thoughts out there.

So, i'm not ****ing blind, I promise. I'll look at the fight again as soon as a youtube of it is up. My DVR cut off before that whole incident happened, so I only got mostly periods 1 and 2.

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Old
11-05-2010, 12:56 AM
  #88
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Originally Posted by Acehawk74 View Post
FWIW, if spelling it correctly is a requirement, in my post above, I spelled it properly.

I'm perfectly aware what it means. The hit was, in my honest opinion, a hit from behind, and a wreckless one. I don't think it was worth a major, but I thought it was a hit that was dangerous in nature. I think the two minute minor was sufficient, but I was surprised that Doughty made a hit like that, coming off of a concussion himself. It seemed a bit surprising, and of course, in the heat of the moment, as a fan, it pisses you off. Be honest man, if the roles were reversed, and one of the Kings players was hit (with what you felt to be a hit from behind), you'd have a problem with it. It's no different than what I personally feel. I'll certainly agree there are plenty of overreactions over in that thread, but to honestly dismiss the possibility that the hit was at least questionable is not fair at all.

I think the biggest disgrace personally was poor officiating on both sides. Both teams got away with cheap/dirty hits tonight, and I honestly thought Ohlund deserved a misconduct as well after the hit on Brown. I just think it's a shame that two good teams had a game with such pitiful refs.

Look man, I understand where you're coming from. I know Downie's reputation, and we don't have to agree. But think about it from a fan's perspective. You're gonna defend your guys, it's just the way it is. Calling us a joke...probably a bit harsh.

Either way, i'm not here to troll, just simply discuss, and let you guys know I enjoyed the game, and respect the opponent. I wish you guys the best of luck the rest of the way, and I'm sorry if you're bothered by what you read over there.

Cheers.
If it were any other guy than Downie it would be much more believable, but this is what happens when a guy builds a negative reputation for himself. He went down like he was shot and laid on the ice as if he were out cold. He was clearly trying to sell a 5 minute major and a game misconduct for a hit to the head that never happened. Then a few minutes later, he out there leaving his feet, fighting, trying to take a poke a Mitchell after the linesmen step in, then when Mitchell takes a poke at him, he goes ape **** on the ref.

Not sure what else you could add to that to make that come out as the textbook definition of a *********. Tampa has a hell of a team, and this was a very entertaining game, but seriously, Downie is garbage.

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Old
11-05-2010, 12:57 AM
  #89
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Originally Posted by cnshockey View Post
When the refs jumped in, Downie swung at Mitchell. I want a video of the fight. I distinctly remember the refs being in between the two before Downie winds up for another punch. If Mitchell took a cheapshot after that, then I have zero problem with it. If Downie wants to take cheap shots with the linesmen in the middle, then it's fair game for Mitchell to do it too. If your alleged cheapshot by downie was before the linesmen, I apologize because I obviously missed it

While you lost respect for Doughty, I lost respect for Downie. As stated before, he turns down fighting Clifford, a guy who WANTS TO FIGHT, and instead wants to fight a guy coming back from a concussion and then ends up fighting a guy who has a concussion history. Yeah, the fight with Mitchell was Mitchell defending his teammate but it doesn't change the fact that Downie ran Doughty, left his feet, intended to injure, and then tried to fight him after that. Slime players like him do NOT belong in the NHL.

Yeah, Downie did hit him when the refs got in. I think that's why he got a 10 Min Misconduct.

I have no problem with AceHawk74. He sees the game from the opposite side as us.

But I will state my own opinion....When you watch it in full speed it doesn't seem as his head hits the ice at all. Then when you watch it in slow motioned it validates what you see in full speed he did not hit the ice with his head. Downie did try and get a call their, which he should try to do. Thats one of the biggest parts of his game to get calls for his team.

I do think Downie is a bit of a ***** though. Sorry AceHawk. But Clifford tried to fight him 4 times tonight and he refuses.

And if I am looking at the hit over again the only thing that seemed to indicate it was a hard hit was the fact that his helmet swung over his face. But that happened 3 times in this game tonight. Kid should tighten his strap.

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Old
11-05-2010, 12:57 AM
  #90
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Originally Posted by Acehawk74 View Post
but I was surprised that Doughty made a hit like that, coming off of a concussion himself. It seemed a bit surprising, and of course, in the heat of the moment, as a fan, it pisses you off.
It's just this portion here. Doughty definitely caught Downie not looking and turned away, but it's not the same kind of hit that took Doughty out for the past few games. Doughty got hit on the head, and Downie did not. Doughty skated into Downie kind of upright and his hands made contact with his back. Near the boards, this kind of contact is dangerous because, well, that's boarding - which incidentally is what happened to Brown by Ohlund. Instead, this Doughty hit on Downie was an open ice hit, and in both fast and slow motion, isn't anywhere near as vicious or malicious as many other "noteworthy" hits in the past.

Blindside hit? I'm willing to concede that, but even the league sent out tapes to the teams on what will and won't be penalized under the new rule - the primary issue being contact with the head.

And this is debatable, but I think the only reason Doughty got a penalty in the first place was because Downie seemed to be injured - and at that point the game was plenty chippy so the refs decided to try to take control of the game.

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11-05-2010, 12:58 AM
  #91
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"where he would have been forced to stand naked in a cramped bus bathroom with other rookies."
ahh brings back memories of Midget hockey like it was yesterday...

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11-05-2010, 12:59 AM
  #92
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ahh brings back memories of Midget hockey like it was yesterday...
your handle just made so much more sense... and now i'm quite aroused.

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11-05-2010, 01:01 AM
  #93
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Originally Posted by Acehawk74 View Post
I disagree with what you're saying. I'll get that out of the way first thing.

I'd like to see the fight as well again. Hockeyfights will probably have it up tomorrow. I did not see a cheap shot at Mitchell, but I assure you, I'm not ****ing blind. I'll watch it again, and if I catch it this time, I'll be happy to back off that point, as if that were the case, then it's fair game.

As for Doughty, I said in a few posts up that saying that I lost respect for Doughty was a bit harsh on my part. More reactionary than anything. Watching the game again with emotions removed (as I'm doing right now), i'm seeing a couple of hits that got both sides more irritated with each other that were allowed to happen. I still think Doughty's shot was a wreckless hit, but not necessarily with the intent to be dirty/cheap.

Downie's game is an agitatior, and that's well known. He's got good hands, skates well, and gets under opponents skin pretty well. His game over the past year and through this year has been changing, and he's cleaned up his act signifigantly. The word is down here in Tampa that he does have some whiplash type effects, which is why he went back to the locker room. I seriously doubt he was faking the injury.

As for Clifford, I honestly think him backing off fighting at that point was something that the coach simply told him to stay away from doing. One of Coach Boucher's goals for Downie this year is to stop doing stupid things...starting fights, etc. He's trying to implement more a value to his game than just being an agitator. Downie's done a pretty good job with it this year, but tonight, he lost that track a bit. I think the blame falls on him obviously, a few Kings players, and mostly , the officials, as they were letting these cheap, little hits go on without recourse all night from both sides.

I'm certainly not going to disagree about Downie getting under skin, but I do not think he was trying to hit Doughty with an intent to injure at all. He should've (imo) been given 2 minutes for charging, 5 for fighting, and a 10 minute misconduct. He did leave his feet, but he went into the boards practically backwards. He was trying to hit him, but I don't think injury was the goal. We'll never know, and I'm going off deductive reasoning (as I don't see many players go into trying to injure someone with just one shoulder, or backwards into the boards).

Either way, Downie's improving his mentality, and he's not the thug he once was. I respect if you don't agree with that, and you'll probably not see eye to eye with me on it, and that's fine. I just simply thought it's worth putting my thoughts out there.

So, i'm not ****ing blind, I promise. I'll look at the fight again as soon as a youtube of it is up. My DVR cut off before that whole incident happened, so I only got mostly periods 1 and 2.
Look up. I posted the fight video. PLEASE point out any type of cheapshot by Mitchell. You mean the one where Mitchell stood there and Downie clearly skates backwards into him? Right. Such a cheap shot.

So....you admit Downie deserved 2, 5, and 10 but wasn't intent to injure? Just leaving his feet? huh. Why would he ever want to leave his feet? Who knows....maybe to hit a guy in the head who just recovered from a concussion. You know...just throwing ideas out here. I don't see how you can't call it intent to injure. He saw it was Doughty, went as fast as he could, left his feet, and obviously wanted to hurt Doughty. No other reason to leave his feet.

And explain at all why a coach wouldn't want Downie to fight in a 0-0 game?!? If he wins, he gets momentum for his team and fires them up. Makes zero sense.

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11-05-2010, 01:04 AM
  #94
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Looks like our boys have a theme song...


http://video.kings.nhl.com/videocent...d=731&id=81553

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11-05-2010, 01:04 AM
  #95
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Originally Posted by riseandfall9 View Post
Yeah, Downie did hit him when the refs got in. I think that's why he got a 10 Min Misconduct.

I have no problem with AceHawk74. He sees the game from the opposite side as us.
Thought it was cuz he was dropping F-bombs at the ref. Right after the two linesmen jump in, Downie is clearly fuming at someone off to the right, and it looks like it's at the ref.

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11-05-2010, 01:05 AM
  #96
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Wow! Thanks for your info guys, what a piece of ****, meant Downie of course.

..and wow too how he possibly still can be around in this League.

..and another wow too how can Lightning keep a guy like that.

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11-05-2010, 01:06 AM
  #97
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Originally Posted by riseandfall9 View Post
Yeah, Downie did hit him when the refs got in. I think that's why he got a 10 Min Misconduct.

I have no problem with AceHawk74. He sees the game from the opposite side as us.

But I will state my own opinion....When you watch it in full speed it doesn't seem as his head hits the ice at all. Then when you watch it in slow motioned it validates what you see in full speed he did not hit the ice with his head. Downie did try and get a call their, which he should try to do. Thats one of the biggest parts of his game to get calls for his team.

I do think Downie is a bit of a ***** though. Sorry AceHawk. But Clifford tried to fight him 4 times tonight and he refuses.

And if I am looking at the hit over again the only thing that seemed to indicate it was a hard hit was the fact that his helmet swung over his face. But that happened 3 times in this game tonight. Kid should tighten his strap.
Nor do I. It's just that sometimes you need to see it from both sides. Sorry AceHawk but you have a very biased opinion obviously seeing is Downie is on your team. I'm not going to call the Doughty hit on Downie exactly a great hit and I even thought it should have been a cross check. BUT! Downie sold the hell out of that call. Yeah whiplash blah blah blah....his head didn't hit the ice, he wasn't hit in the head, and he acted like someone Marty McSorely'd him. Downie is slime in my eyes after tonight

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11-05-2010, 01:07 AM
  #98
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No problems, you guys don't have to see it the same way as I do.

I agree, Downie was playing like a little whiny brat tonight. I'm not disagreeing with any of you on that.

As for the fight, CNS, I saw Downie's head pop backwards at the 53 second mark, under the officials' arm. I saw Mitchell's head pop backwards about a second prior. I'll call that a Wash, but it was BS by both of them to do that. They both cheapshotted each other, which I'll concede is a wash. Not sure why you're so curt about it though man, i'm not coming at you from a harsh angle. Just discussing it.

I think the whole incident is just awkward. Doughty did a blindside hit, that slightly (not badly) injured Downie, and got what I personally feel was a fair penalty for the hit. The "respect lost" comments I made earlier I have retracted, as I said they were too harsh, so that's something I'd like to put to rest.

Anyways guys, I just wanted to give some reasoning that you might not have seen/heard about Downie, which might explain why he was backing down earlier in the game from Clifford more than anything. Regardless, not one of his finer nights, but I don't think it's as sleazy as you guys feel it is. That said, I won't argue it, I'd be defending my guy just as stringently if I were in your shoes.

You guys have a good fanbase here, and I respect that. I've got to go for now, so thanks for letting me spend some time here discussing the game guys. I'm glad nothing came of it injury wise either way, and I look forward to the next time. Cheers, and gnight.

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11-05-2010, 01:08 AM
  #99
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Originally Posted by alpa View Post
Wow! Thanks for your info guys, what a piece of ****, meant Downie of course.

..and wow too how he possibly still can be around in this League.

..and another wow too how can Lightning keep a guy like that.
We kept Sean Avery for a while. The Rangers are keeping Sean Avery too. The thing is is that their job is to be pests but both of them are *****es and don't belong in the NHL. At this point, I think I'd take Avery back over ever having Downie on the Kings.

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11-05-2010, 01:09 AM
  #100
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Originally Posted by cnshockey View Post
Look up. I posted the fight video. PLEASE point out any type of cheapshot by Mitchell. You mean the one where Mitchell stood there and Downie clearly skates backwards into him? Right. Such a cheap shot.

So....you admit Downie deserved 2, 5, and 10 but wasn't intent to injure? Just leaving his feet? huh. Why would he ever want to leave his feet? Who knows....maybe to hit a guy in the head who just recovered from a concussion. You know...just throwing ideas out here. I don't see how you can't call it intent to injure. He saw it was Doughty, went as fast as he could, left his feet, and obviously wanted to hurt Doughty. No other reason to leave his feet.

And explain at all why a coach wouldn't want Downie to fight in a 0-0 game?!? If he wins, he gets momentum for his team and fires them up. Makes zero sense.
I did comment. Please see the above post. I don't get why you're coming at me from such an aggressive angle though man, it's as if I offended you because I don't see it your way. Just trying to discuss it with civility.

Edit: I honestly do not have a biased opinion. I call things like I see them regardless of who the player is. Notice I called for Ohlund to get a Game Misconduct (and I honestly would agree with 1 game suspension) for the boarding on Brown. I just honestly do not think Downie was trying to injure him. That said, I'll do as you requested, and rewatch the video..but I'm gonna wait till tomorrow as I wont' be giving it a fair look at this point considering I'm pretty much asleep while typing.

Thanks for posting the video. I'll watch it in more detail after I get home from work tomorrow.

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