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Official Trade Rumours and Proposals Thread Part VIII

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Old
11-19-2010, 10:38 AM
  #276
Wondercarrot
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We need a Richards/Semin hybrid clone.
Leadership, lasergun shot, great playmaking, two way play, dangles and can play wing or center.
Id pay 8 million for that.....

WTF murray get on this, your owner used to own a pharmaceutical company, you know he's got the secret super solider formula.
its these kind of lapses that makes me question murray's judgment.

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Old
11-19-2010, 10:46 AM
  #277
trentmccleary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveMatthew View Post
Would people do a Milan Michalek for Brad Boyes swap?

To guys who were on the right track offensively a couple of years ago but have had some recent struggles. Cap hits are pretty much identical.

Boyes is more of a sniper and I think could benefit from playing with Spezza, while Michalek gets to go back to the West to a young, up and coming strong defensive team.

One of those change of scenery trades.
I'm starting to wonder if Spezza will ever develop great chemistry with a righty sniper. He's had Heatley for years and spurts with Michalek (beg. last season) & Regin (end last season). But seemingly not much of anything with Cheechoo, Bochenski, Eaves and sometimes Alfie.

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11-19-2010, 11:03 AM
  #278
MatthewT
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Originally Posted by trentmccleary View Post
I'm starting to wonder if Spezza will ever develop great chemistry with a righty sniper. He's had Heatley for years and spurts with Michalek (beg. last season) & Regin (end last season). But seemingly not much of anything with Cheechoo, Bochenski, Eaves and sometimes Alfie.
To be fair, its not hard to play with a Heatley and Alfie.

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11-19-2010, 11:06 AM
  #279
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I like this lineup for next year, I am assuming that Edm would accept a trade:
Penner
for
Kelly and Wiercioch

If Rundblad is ready then trade Campoli
IMO I think Ottawa is going to be looking for a big physical D-man(not including cowen) instead of Kuba.
I think our Goaltending will be fine assuming we bring in some better d-fence (Cowen and another Stay at home d-man)

CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Peter Regin ($1.000m) / Jason Spezza ($7.000m) / Dustin Penner ($4.250m)
Milan Michalek ($4.333m) / Brad Richards ($6.500m) / Daniel Alfredsson ($4.875m)
Nick Foligno ($1.200m) / Mike Fisher ($4.200m) / Bobby Butler ($0.900m)
Zack Smith ($0.583m) / Jesse Winchester ($0.750m) / Chris Neil ($2.000m)

DEFENSEMEN
Sergei Gonchar ($5.500m) / Chris Phillips ($3.000m)
Erik Karlsson ($1.300m) / Filip Kuba ($3.700m)
Jared Cowen ($1.295m) / Chris Campoli ($1.400m)
Matt Carkner ($0.700m)

GOALTENDERS
Brian Elliott ($1.800m) /Robin Lehner ($0.900m)

BUYOUTS: Jonathan Cheechoo ($1.166m) / Daniel Alfredsson ($0.700m) / Ray Emery ($0.562m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled using the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $59,400,000; CAP PAYROLL: $59,615,833; BONUSES: $850,000
CAP SPACE (21-man roster): $634,167

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Old
11-19-2010, 11:07 AM
  #280
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wondercarrot View Post
We need a Richards/Semin hybrid clone.
Leadership, lasergun shot, great playmaking, two way play, dangles and can play wing or center.
Id pay 8 million for that.....

WTF murray get on this, your owner used to own a pharmaceutical company, you know he's got the secret super solider formula.
its these kind of lapses that makes me question murray's judgment.
A formula that lets you draft Patrick Traverse and have him play like Scott Stevens? Or draft Pat Fallon and have him play like Cam Neely?

Get 'er done Murray/Eugene !!


Quote:
Originally Posted by wilfred View Post
I like this lineup for next year, I am assuming that Edm would accept a trade:
Penner
for
Kelly and Wiercioch

If Rundblad is ready then trade Campoli
IMO I think Ottawa is going to be looking for a big physical D-man(not including cowen) instead of Kuba.
I think our Goaltending will be fine assuming we bring in some better d-fence (Cowen and another Stay at home d-man)

The problem with this recipe is you have way too much fat, lazy Dustin Penner.

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Old
11-19-2010, 11:08 AM
  #281
DaveMatthew
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Originally Posted by MatthewT View Post
To be fair, its not hard to play with a Heatley and Alfie.
Also, Cheechoo and Bochenski aren't NHLers while Eaves is a 4th liner. Spezza not having success with them probably has more to do with that than their shooting side.

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11-19-2010, 11:10 AM
  #282
Lenny the Lynx
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The weekly Dustin Penner trade rumour. What would this forum be without it?

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Old
11-19-2010, 11:10 AM
  #283
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Originally Posted by trentmccleary View Post
I'm starting to wonder if Spezza will ever develop great chemistry with a righty sniper. He's had Heatley for years and spurts with Michalek (beg. last season) & Regin (end last season). But seemingly not much of anything with Cheechoo, Bochenski, Eaves and sometimes Alfie.
I know you hate the guy but the guy who could very possibly be a fantastic winger for Spezza is Penner. Say what you want about the guy but he plays a very similar game to Heatley around the net and creates room out there for other guys.

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Old
11-19-2010, 11:12 AM
  #284
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Originally Posted by BumperStumper View Post
The weekly Dustin Penner trade rumour. What would this forum be without it?
In all seriousness, Murray signed him out of college, tried to bring him to Ottawa already, and is possibly a piece The Sens seem to be missing up front with Spezza. A 30 goal scorer that makes life tough for goaltenders and opens up space for everyone else on the ice.

I hope Murray can bring Penner to Ottawa because they will be a better team for it in the end.

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Old
11-19-2010, 11:13 AM
  #285
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wilfred
Thats to much to give up for penner.

To Edmonton
Kelly
Lee
2nd Round Pick

To Ottawe
Penner

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Old
11-19-2010, 11:14 AM
  #286
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Originally Posted by trentmccleary View Post
The trend is that he's a leader on a team that is unwillingly to pay the price physically or work hard defensively to win in the playoffs.

The other problem is that his agent (Mark Gandler) has been essentially black-balled from this team for ages because he's a scum bag who undermines a hockey teams ability to develop young players and create unity.

I don't believe that Semin will ever win anything in the NHL... and it concerns me when people are throwing dollars and term for a guy like that.
Agreeed. Semin is not what The Sens need not to mention the amount of cash the guy will actually earn next year.

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Old
11-19-2010, 11:15 AM
  #287
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Originally Posted by wjhl2009fan View Post
wilfred
Thats to much to give up for penner.

To Edmonton
Kelly
Lee
2nd Round Pick

To Ottawe
Penner

You are pretty much be garaunteed that Foligno and a D man are going back to Edmonton in any deal for Penner.

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Old
11-19-2010, 11:19 AM
  #288
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Billy Madison View Post
You are pretty much be garaunteed that Foligno and a D man are going back to Edmonton in any deal for Penner.
I would not be to sure about that unless something else comming back with penner.

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Old
11-19-2010, 11:24 AM
  #289
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Originally Posted by wjhl2009fan View Post
I would not be to sure about that unless something else comming back with penner.
Kelly is worth a hell of a lot more than Folgino. Foligno has 9 goals and 31 points in the last 80 games... not exactly worth a whole heck of a lot considering the limited role he has forced the coaches into putting him in.

Kelly is not going anywhere.

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Old
11-19-2010, 11:26 AM
  #290
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Originally Posted by Billy Madison View Post
Kelly is worth a hell of a lot more than Folgino. Foligno has 9 goals and 31 points in the last 80 games... not exactly worth a whole heck of a lot considering the limited role he has forced the coaches into putting him in.

Kelly is not going anywhere.
I can see kelly getting moved if the return is good.My point is penner does not have a real big value as some seem to think.I aslo should have been more clear i mean penner plus another player.

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Old
11-19-2010, 11:31 AM
  #291
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Originally Posted by wjhl2009fan View Post
I can see kelly getting moved if the return is good.My point is penner does not have a real big value as some seem to think.I aslo should have been more clear i mean penner plus another player.

I understood what you ment but there is no way Edmonton would add to a deal if it was Foligno instead of Kelly. It would probably be the other way around. Penner is by no means worth a 1st round draft pick of any sort other than maybe LA's, but he's probably worth a prospect.

If I was making the trade, it would be something like this.

Foligno, Campoli, Wiercoich

for

Penner and Omark

As for Kelly being moved, no chance. There is absolutely no one coming back in a trade for him that could replace him on top of there being absolutely no one in the organization that is ready to take his spot or can actually fill it. Maybe O'Brien in like 3 or 4 years but he isn't close to being ready.

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Old
11-19-2010, 12:00 PM
  #292
trentmccleary
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Originally Posted by MatthewT View Post
To be fair, its not hard to play with a Heatley and Alfie.
It can be hard to play with Spezza and Heatley. Alfie's not hard to play with though.

Still, for two players as talented as Alfie and Spezza... they have an awful lot of dead time together.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveMatthew View Post
Also, Cheechoo and Bochenski aren't NHLers while Eaves is a 4th liner. Spezza not having success with them probably has more to do with that than their shooting side.
Everything is relative. He was unable to get anything out of them, whereas he was at least able to get spurts out of the lefties. Cheechoo, Bochenski & Eaves might as well have been playing with Winchester... and it's not like all 3 didn't have their own spurts of offense in the NHL. They just didn't occur with one of the better playmaking centres in the league.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Billy Madison View Post
I know you hate the guy but the guy who could very possibly be a fantastic winger for Spezza is Penner. Say what you want about the guy but he plays a very similar game to Heatley around the net and creates room out there for other guys.
Heatley didn't play around the net and I don't find their styles all that similar.

We'd be paying an awfully high price in trade and salary for a guy who we would be expecting to be made to look good by the great player we already have.

If he cost almost nothing in trade and made half as much money, I'd be more willing to give him a tryout... and "tryout" is exactly the way I'd look at it. Penner shouldn't be a key a player on any team and I wouldn't want to commit very much to him until I believed that we could recoup it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Billy Madison View Post
In all seriousness, Murray signed him out of college, tried to bring him to Ottawa already, and is possibly a piece The Sens seem to be missing up front with Spezza. A 30 goal scorer that makes life tough for goaltenders and opens up space for everyone else on the ice.

I hope Murray can bring Penner to Ottawa because they will be a better team for it in the end.
He tried to bring him to Ottawa in exactly the same deal that he brought Michalek in. That we have Michalek now probably means that we aren't in the market for Penner anymore.

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Old
11-19-2010, 12:04 PM
  #293
MatthewT
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Originally Posted by trentmccleary View Post
It can be hard to play with Spezza and Heatley. Alfie's not hard to play with though.

....
Heatley is probably one of the more easier players to play with IMO, hes a underrated playmaker, opens up space for his other linemates and can find holes in the offensive zone

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Old
11-19-2010, 12:08 PM
  #294
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Originally Posted by trentmccleary View Post
It can be hard to play with Spezza and Heatley. Alfie's not hard to play with though.

Still, for two players as talented as Alfie and Spezza... they have an awful lot of dead time together.



Everything is relative. He was unable to get anything out of them, whereas he was at least able to get spurts out of the lefties. Cheechoo, Bochenski & Eaves might as well have been playing with Winchester... and it's not like all 3 didn't have their own spurts of offense in the NHL. They just didn't occur with one of the better playmaking centres in the league.



Heatley didn't play around the net and I don't find their styles all that similar.

We'd be paying an awfully high price in trade and salary for a guy who we would be expecting to be made to look good by the great player we already have.

If he cost almost nothing in trade and made half as much money, I'd be more willing to give him a tryout... and "tryout" is exactly the way I'd look at it. Penner shouldn't be a key a player on any team and I wouldn't want to commit very much to him until I believed that we could recoup it.



He tried to bring him to Ottawa in exactly the same deal that he brought Michalek in. That we have Michalek now probably means that we aren't in the market for Penner anymore.
You realize he was a huge part of that Ducks team that won the cup, right? The PPG line was enormous for them and pretty tough to contain. I don't think you are giving him enough credit personally. I'll give into the fact he is on a pretty big contract right now, but with the cap going up next year I don't think it's all that big of a factor.

In terms of my comparisson with Heatley, I said around the net, not their overall game. I would be a fool to say Penner is on Heatley's level but the strengths Penner has in his game will compliment Spezza's in much the same way Heatley's did, i.e big body in front of the net, cleans up garbage, and tough to move with a scoring touch. Heatley's shot and hockey sense are much better than Penner's ever will be.

I wouldn't give up a 1st rounder for the guy nor would I be giving up a prospect with a high ceiling. I like Penner and think he is exactly the type of winger Spezza needs to play with on a regular basis.

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11-19-2010, 12:11 PM
  #295
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Originally Posted by Billy Madison View Post
I understood what you ment but there is no way Edmonton would add to a deal if it was Foligno instead of Kelly. It would probably be the other way around. Penner is by no means worth a 1st round draft pick of any sort other than maybe LA's, but he's probably worth a prospect.

If I was making the trade, it would be something like this.

Foligno, Campoli, Wiercoich

for

Penner and Omark

As for Kelly being moved, no chance. There is absolutely no one coming back in a trade for him that could replace him on top of there being absolutely no one in the organization that is ready to take his spot or can actually fill it. Maybe O'Brien in like 3 or 4 years but he isn't close to being ready.
If you read my original post Kelly would go if we got Richards in the Off-season. Fisher would move down to #3 and Ottawa could afford to lose Kelly. Trading Kelly right now would not work very well unless Regin goes back to playing center, Fisher moves down to the third line.

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Old
11-19-2010, 12:27 PM
  #296
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Heatley is probably one of the more easier players to play with IMO, hes a underrated playmaker, opens up space for his other linemates and can find holes in the offensive zone
Heatley needs somebody who can work the boards, enter the zone and be a great set up man. There aren't a lot of players like that and I think it'd be awful to see him trying to play on a Varada/Arvedsson - Bonk - Hossa or a Schaefer/Ardvedsson - White - Alfie type line with him trying to carry the play.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Billy Madison View Post
You realize he was a huge part of that Ducks team that won the cup, right? The PPG line was enormous for them and pretty tough to contain. I don't think you are giving him enough credit personally. I'll give into the fact he is on a pretty big contract right now, but with the cap going up next year I don't think it's all that big of a factor.

In terms of my comparisson with Heatley, I said around the net, not their overall game. I would be a fool to say Penner is on Heatley's level but the strengths Penner has in his game will compliment Spezza's in much the same way Heatley's did, i.e big body in front of the net, cleans up garbage, and tough to move with a scoring touch. Heatley's shot and hockey sense are much better than Penner's ever will be.

I wouldn't give up a 1st rounder for the guy nor would I be giving up a prospect with a high ceiling. I like Penner and think he is exactly the type of winger Spezza needs to play with on a regular basis.
He was the worst player on their 2nd line and finished 11th in team playoff scoring behind the entire 3rd line and 3 defensemen. The only top-9 forward not to outproduce him was Kunitz and that's because he missed half of the postseason.

On the ice, he was a slow, 1-way player who knocked in a couple of garbage goals and didn't have any impact on whether Anaheim won or not. He was their Peter Schaefer.

Heatley was primarily a sniper for Spezza and Penner is not a sniper. We might as well use Michalek or Regin as a sniper for Spezza for in that case.

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11-19-2010, 12:41 PM
  #297
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Originally Posted by trentmccleary View Post
Heatley needs somebody who can work the boards, enter the zone and be a great set up man. There aren't a lot of players like that and I think it'd be awful to see him trying to play on a Varada/Arvedsson - Bonk - Hossa or a Schaefer/Ardvedsson - White - Alfie type line with him trying to carry the play.



He was the worst player on their 2nd line and finished 11th in team playoff scoring behind the entire 3rd line and 3 defensemen. The only top-9 forward not to outproduce him was Kunitz and that's because he missed half of the postseason.

On the ice, he was a slow, 1-way player who knocked in a couple of garbage goals and didn't have any impact on whether Anaheim won or not. He was their Peter Schaefer.

Heatley was primarily a sniper for Spezza and Penner is not a sniper. We might as well use Michalek or Regin as a sniper for Spezza for in that case.
Not sure what player you're watching but Penner is not slow. He's huge and may look it, but he isn't. He gets up and down the ice just fine.

As far as ignoring the fact he was a huge part of the PPG line, I'll just let you think w/e you wish despite what the majority of people say. I'll also let you think Penner wasn't the guy that totally burried The Sens in game 4 of that finals too.

If and when they hit 30 goals then we will talk. Hell, Regin hasn't and probably won't come close to hitting 20 any time soon. Michalek has never reached Penner's 2 best season's in goal so... that's playing with Spezza and Thornton, Penner played with a 20 year old Getzlaf and... Horcoff... Gagner...Cogliano... not the greatest centers in the league. Penner is a better goal scorer than anyone The Sens have other than Alfi and Spezza.

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11-19-2010, 01:08 PM
  #298
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Originally Posted by Billy Madison View Post
If and when they hit 30 goals then we will talk. Hell, Regin hasn't and probably won't come close to hitting 20 any time soon. Michalek has never reached Penner's 2 best season's in goal so... that's playing with Spezza and Thornton, Penner played with a 20 year old Getzlaf and... Horcoff... Gagner...Cogliano... not the greatest centers in the league. Penner is a better goal scorer than anyone The Sens have other than Alfi and Spezza.
2006-07 to present:
Penner = 107 goals / 341 games played = 25.73 goals per 82 GP.
Michalek = 99 goals / 315 games played = 25.77 goals per 82 GP.

Peter Regin is just starting his career and will likely be more of a playmaker than a goalscorer. But his shot is very good and he showed the ability to score off of Spezza's wing leading up to and in the playoffs last season (scoring as many goals in in 6 games of 1 round last year as Penner did in 21 games of 4 rounds in 2006-07).

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11-19-2010, 05:47 PM
  #299
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Originally Posted by Wondercarrot View Post
We need a Richards/Semin hybrid clone.
Leadership, lasergun shot, great playmaking, two way play, dangles and can play wing or center.
Id pay 8 million for that.....

WTF murray get on this, your owner used to own a pharmaceutical company, you know he's got the secret super solider formula.
its these kind of lapses that makes me question murray's judgment.
Zach Parise
Yes, he's and RFA and its taboo, but I think he's exactly what this team needs right now. If he isnt resigned by the end of this season, I say throw a rather short term (5 year), huge dollar (7-8 million) contract and see what happens...

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Old
11-19-2010, 05:48 PM
  #300
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How about we trade for him

Kuba ( They need a PMD really bad)
Weircioch ( blue chip prospect)
2011 1st
Foligno (Gritty LWer)

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