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More Ice Time for Iggy?

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Old
11-15-2010, 12:35 PM
  #1
MarkGio
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More Ice Time for Iggy?

Don cherry thinks Jarome Iginla needs more ice time
Here's the proof: (http://www.cbc.ca/sports/hockey/stor...hs-corner.html)

I'm not sure Brent Sutter feels the same...
Iginla started on the 4th line, along with Jackman & Meyers, against San Jose, which corresponds with Iginla's average ice time of 18.46 mins in the last ten games

Although Don Cherry makes an interesting point, is Brent Sutter going to reward a minus 6 player? Only Ian White is playing with a worse plus/minus stat on the flames roster.

Let the Iginla saga continue...

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11-15-2010, 02:17 PM
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Flames101
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I agree with more ice time. This is Iginla were talking about. At the end of the SJS game he started playing like a beast, he still has it in him , he just needs to work some stuff out.

On a separate Iggy note, I am very disappointed with the Flames fans who are throwing him under the bus. Yes he is struggling, but to toss him now is just sheer stupidity. He is in a slump right now, give him time, let him work himself out of it. Sutter should be supporting him with whatever he needs to break out. Every player hits a slump Iggy is no exception. If he finishes this year with the current production he is giving now, then fine, feel free to slag him, but a bad month is nothing to pitch your franchise player about.

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11-15-2010, 02:19 PM
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tfong
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Originally Posted by Flames101 View Post
I agree with more ice time. This is Iginla were talking about. At the end of the SJS game he started playing like a beast, he still has it in him , he just needs to work some stuff out.

On a separate Iggy note, I am very disappointed with the Flames fans who are throwing him under the bus. Yes he is struggling, but to toss him now is just sheer stupidity. He is in a slump right now, give him time, let him work himself out of it. Sutter should be supporting him with whatever he needs to break out. Every player hits a slump Iggy is no exception. If he finishes this year with the current production he is giving now, then fine, feel free to slag him, but a bad month is nothing to pitch your franchise player about.
Hes been slumping for over a year now really

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11-15-2010, 02:22 PM
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Iginla's avg ice-time has dropped from 21:36 under Keenan to 19:04 this season under Sutter... even last season Iginla lost a full minute per game from the previous season... so Cherry may have a point

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11-15-2010, 02:45 PM
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tfong
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The whole "he plays bad, give him more icetime" seems so counter intuitive to me.

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11-15-2010, 02:51 PM
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The whole "he plays bad, give him more icetime" seems so counter intuitive to me.
because negative enforcement is the ony answer

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11-15-2010, 03:01 PM
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Johnny Hoxville
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Well I don`t think that pairing him Jackman, demoting him to the 4th, or making him watch a game from the press box is the answer either. Does anyone think that Iginla doesn`t know that he is playing badly. I am sure he does not need anyone to tell him this and I am sure he already has the message. Demoting, benching or reducing his minutes will only make the situation worse IMO.

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11-15-2010, 03:12 PM
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Focusing on one month, really? This guy has stuck with this sinking franchise for 10 bloody years and you fans won't stick with him for ten games. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt because he's earned it. Iggy's performance over the past ten years has proved deserving of a little more ice time, and considering the pros outweight the negatives, its not much of a gamble putting Iggy on the ice. It's just ice time, I mean, we're not talking about an contract extension people. Plus Don Cherry knows his hockey. I'll give Don Cherry the benefit of the doubt as well. Brent Sutter, on the other hand, hasn't done much to prove his knowledge....so I'm for giving Iggy more ice time.

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11-15-2010, 03:23 PM
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Don't have to demote him to 4th line...what about demoting him to 2nd line? Hard to justify playing any player even more time when he isn't doing much with what he is already given. If you look at it the other way, why don't the guys who are putting up the points given increased ice time per game then just that game or maybe the next game only before getting demoted back down? For example, Bourque leads the teams in goals and points as well as 2nd in PP points but plays more then 2 minutes less on average then Iggy, why not give him 18-19 minutes per game (swap lines for say 5-10 games)?. Iginla's 3 goals in last 27 games (includes last season) is quite a concern and while I really really hope he breaks out, it's looking pretty tough.

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11-15-2010, 03:43 PM
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Originally Posted by MarkGio View Post
Focusing on one month, really? This guy has stuck with this sinking franchise for 10 bloody years and you fans won't stick with him for ten games. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt because he's earned it. Iggy's performance over the past ten years has proved deserving of a little more ice time, and considering the pros outweight the negatives, its not much of a gamble putting Iggy on the ice. It's just ice time, I mean, we're not talking about an contract extension people. Plus Don Cherry knows his hockey. I'll give Don Cherry the benefit of the doubt as well. Brent Sutter, on the other hand, hasn't done much to prove his knowledge....so I'm for giving Iggy more ice time.
Someone didn't watch many flames games last season either. This streak he's on has been longer than just this season. Im all for giving him more ice time, but you cant say its only been like this for 10 games.

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11-15-2010, 03:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Lunatik View Post
because negative enforcement is the ony answer
It is when the coach is Brent Sutter.

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11-15-2010, 03:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Skobel55 View Post
Someone didn't watch many flames games last season either. This streak he's on has been longer than just this season. Im all for giving him more ice time, but you cant say its only been like this for 10 games.
you can't use last season in calling anything a streak... a streak is not broken up by a summer

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11-15-2010, 03:54 PM
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Bourque leads the teams in goals and points as well as 2nd in PP points but plays more then 2 minutes less on average then Iggy, why not give him 18-19 minutes per game (swap lines for say 5-10 games)?
I don't think Borque's points speak volumes about his performance. I'll admit borque can find the back of the net, but Borque doesn't backcheck, pass the puck, or finish his checks most nights (lately anyways). He was in the doghouse too earlier this season for his lack of effort, and most of Borque's goals comes from Hagman doing all the dirty work to get the puck out from the boards and into the slot.

I don't disagree with you in that good players deserve more ice time, but sometimes stats don't reflect a players performance, it only reflects who scored, who contributed to it, and to some extent, who didn't prevent it. Ice-time is more of a performance reflection, from the coach's perspective anyways, if you consider what type of role a player has (Ex. Jackman). But even then, one would have to consider the game played because a penalty killer would get alot of ice time if there were a lot of lopsided penalties called, despite the pk-specialist's overall performance.

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11-15-2010, 04:02 PM
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Someone didn't watch many flames games last season either. This streak he's on has been longer than just this season. Im all for giving him more ice time, but you cant say its only been like this for 10 games.
I see your point, and agree to some extent. And I watched almost every game last year. But by using your philosophy, one could argue that Iginla is on a 444 goal scoring streak in the past 1,040 games. That's a relatively hot streak. Just saying... it's your philosophy

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11-15-2010, 04:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Lunatik View Post
you can't use last season in calling anything a streak... a streak is not broken up by a summer
Fine.

He played terrible near the end of last season. It continued for the start of this season. He hasn't been producing for a while now.


Last edited by Skobel24: 11-15-2010 at 04:11 PM.
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11-15-2010, 04:44 PM
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It is when the coach is Brent Sutter.

Brent Sutter is not the problem with this team.

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11-15-2010, 05:13 PM
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tfong
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I don't think Borque's points speak volumes about his performance. I'll admit borque can find the back of the net, but Borque doesn't backcheck, pass the puck, or finish his checks most nights (lately anyways). He was in the doghouse too earlier this season for his lack of effort, and most of Borque's goals comes from Hagman doing all the dirty work to get the puck out from the boards and into the slot.

I don't disagree with you in that good players deserve more ice time, but sometimes stats don't reflect a players performance, it only reflects who scored, who contributed to it, and to some extent, who didn't prevent it. Ice-time is more of a performance reflection, from the coach's perspective anyways, if you consider what type of role a player has (Ex. Jackman). But even then, one would have to consider the game played because a penalty killer would get alot of ice time if there were a lot of lopsided penalties called, despite the pk-specialist's overall performance.
Iginla played one good game sofar a bunch of mediocre games and a bunch of bad ones. Yet Borq has had multiple good games and only some mediocre ones but I haven't seen him play a horrible game yet. Plus we don't want either Borq or Iggy passing anyways, we have Tanguay for that already.

Just watching the game Iginla looks slow and light. He doesn't barrel through players anymore and his goal the other night seemed like an awfully low percentage shot as well since he was on the far side of the circle. Pretty sure fans are justified for having an underachieving captain. I mean its fine when he scores and we still lose. But when we lose AND he isn't scoring...well he wasn't paid big money to be a defensive forward (not that he is) so what exactly is he being paid for?

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11-15-2010, 05:17 PM
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Originally Posted by StreakingRed View Post
Brent Sutter is not the problem with this team.
Everyone has done their part, now the players need to respond. There is no reason a team with these players shouldn't be playing well.

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11-15-2010, 05:33 PM
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The situation may be solved already. Iginla had that monster shift in the 3rd period and later scored a goal. His ice-time is going to go back to +20 territory soon.

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11-15-2010, 05:42 PM
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MarkGio
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Iginla played one good game sofar a bunch of mediocre games and a bunch of bad ones. Yet Borq has had multiple good games and only some mediocre ones but I haven't seen him play a horrible game yet....

Just watching the game Iginla looks slow and light. He doesn't barrel through players anymore and his goal the other night seemed like an awfully low percentage shot as well since he was on the far side of the circle. Pretty sure fans are justified for having an underachieving captain. I mean its fine when he scores and we still lose. But when we lose AND he isn't scoring...well he wasn't paid big money to be a defensive forward (not that he is) so what exactly is he being paid for?
I agree it appears that way, but its not our position to determine who's having a good game or not, and that was my point with regards to ice time. It may seem to you and I, and even the stats, that Borque is playing better than Iggy, but that depends on what you define better playing. I'd say Sutter has defined better playing in his system, and based on ice-time, I'd say Iggy is "playing better" than Borque. For example, Jokinen said in an interview earlier that we need a team of 4th liners, and it doesn't matter who scores the goals. I'd say that's a reflection from Sutter, and If borque is not playing like a fourth liner (finishing checks, backchecking, etc) then he gets less ice time. I like goals, but Iggy is a leader and Borque isn't. If Iggy decides go outside the system and play his own game, I can guarantee he'd have more goals, but have less ice-time. So perhaps is not fine to Brent Sutter when we lose and Iggy scores a ton of goals. Maybe that's why Iggy is in this slump? He takes the heat from the media because of a lack of offense, but at the same time he has to be a leader in a defensive-only team. And honestly, I guarantee Daryl Sutter gave Iggy his salary to be a team player, whether that's a defensive forward or not.

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11-15-2010, 05:43 PM
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Originally Posted by StreakingRed View Post
Brent Sutter is not the problem with this team.
He's part of it IMO

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11-15-2010, 06:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Lunatik View Post
He's part of it IMO
I agree, I think he has a lot to do with our struggles.

I believe he is a very stubborn coach who does not like to adapt his system if it is not working, although he says otherwise I just have not seen any difference from the play on the ice.

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11-15-2010, 06:18 PM
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tfong
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But we also blamed Keenan and Playfair

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11-15-2010, 06:22 PM
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StreakingRed
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I believe he is a very stubborn coach who does not like to adapt his system if it is not working...

You could say the exact same thing about the players, and their stubborness to adapt to Sutter's system. Only thing is, we've actually seen that Sutter's system works when they stick with it. It only takes a one or two goal deficit for this mentally fragile team to get away from the system and start free lancing all over the ice, and that's where the problems come from.

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11-15-2010, 06:25 PM
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But we also blamed Keenan and Playfair
not all of us

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