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Changes Coming in Oil Country ?

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Old
12-03-2015, 05:40 PM
  #1
Macker88
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Changes Coming in Oil Country ?

Put together some possibilities on who may leave Edmonton and who may be coming in, in any possible trades.

http://overtimesportsnation.com/chan...n-oil-country/

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12-03-2015, 05:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Macker88 View Post
Put together some possibilities on who may leave Edmonton and who may be coming in, in any possible trades.

http://overtimesportsnation.com/chan...n-oil-country/
Rnh for Jones.

Or Yak plus Schultz/Fayne for Harmonic.

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12-03-2015, 05:48 PM
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My amateur sportswriter compatriot,

Your trades are absolute poison. Every single one of them involves Edmonton trading RNH for a combination of overpaid, overrated hockey players and every single one of them has the main piece being a winger coming back.

I'm not trying to nuke your clicks, which is why I won't your exact deals, but those trades would get Chiarelli summarily dismissed from his role.

You don't trade an RNH for 'a veteran winger that provides size, skill, versatility and veteran/playoff experience'. That's a really, really, no good, very bad idea.

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12-03-2015, 05:54 PM
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Originally Posted by ChaoticOrange View Post
My amateur sportswriter compatriot,

Your trades are absolute poison. Every single one of them involves Edmonton trading RNH for a combination of overpaid, overrated hockey players and every single one of them has the main piece being a winger coming back.

I'm not trying to nuke your clicks, which is why I won't your exact deals, but those trades would get Chiarelli summarily dismissed from his role.

You don't trade an RNH for 'a veteran winger that provides size, skill, versatility and veteran/playoff experience'. That's a really, really, no good, very bad idea.
I especially liked the glossing over of the Oilers situation and somehow coming up with "yep, Nuge is definitely the guy you move, now let's see what kind of garbage he can fetch."

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12-03-2015, 06:02 PM
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Ah yes, the "please give us a no.1 overall center to the Leafs" from a Toronto writer. What a shocking surprise that he thinks Nugent Hopkins to the Leafs is a great idea, lol. Of course you do.

If RNH is going anywhere it's for a Seth Jones type. Plain and simple.

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12-03-2015, 06:04 PM
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Ah yes, the "please give us a no.1 overall center to the Leafs" from a Toronto writer. What a shocking surprise that he thinks Nugent Hopkins to the Leafs is a great idea, lol. Of course you do.

If RNH is going anywhere it's for a Seth Jones type. Plain and simple.
Why hasnt that move been made already?

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12-03-2015, 06:08 PM
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Why hasnt that move been made already?
Because it would cripple the already hobbled Oilers.

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12-03-2015, 06:10 PM
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Why hasnt that move been made already?
Because they are likely making the playoffs this year, teams that are in a playoff spot (or trending there) generally don't make big moves (unless they are rental additions) until the summer after mulling over another dissapointing too short playoffs.

I have a feeling changes are coming to both St. Louis and Nashville if they do not get the job done this spring and go deep in the playoffs.

The difference this summer is we can move a RNH in the summer if we have to. We haven't had that luxury in year's past.

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12-03-2015, 07:24 PM
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I have no idea why your team is not better. I have no idea what your missing ingredient is. I am also not sure what you will gain by trading away one of your young stars. I guess that's why I am just an internet dummy and not an NHL GM.

I miss watching McDavid. God speed, McJesus. The game is less fun without you.

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12-03-2015, 08:03 PM
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Team is soft overall and doesn't have enough players that play a hard game and pay the price to get into areas where games are won and lost... ie... driving to the net, mucking it up along the boards and getting in the face of opponents instead of letting them impose their will instead.

-More grit/physicality
-More heart/determination

It's intangibles... not skills that are missing on the team.

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12-03-2015, 08:12 PM
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I doubt much will happen besides maybe getting Hamonic, but even then I say the odds are really low there.

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12-03-2015, 08:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Lord J T Shark View Post
I think you are trying to nuke his clicks--his ideas are just as viable as yours have been so far--but your ideas have the oilers winning all trades while giving up very little
I just think it's a slippery slope - you force a trade and you end up regretting it.

Just wait until McDavid comes back and see how the team is doing.

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12-04-2015, 09:54 AM
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I think some people do not like the ideas being tossed put the bloh because it actually has the oilers giving something of value up to get something and not may people want to give up something of value

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12-04-2015, 10:02 AM
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Musing about King Joffery Lupul alone is enough to warrant setting his computer on fire.

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12-04-2015, 10:09 AM
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Originally Posted by Lord J T Shark View Post
I think some people do not like the ideas being tossed put the bloh because it actually has the oilers giving something of value up to get something and not may people want to give up something of value
It has the Oilers giving up something of value to get (1) next to nothing and/or (2) something we absolutely do not need i.e. overpaid/overrated wingers

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12-04-2015, 10:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Lord J T Shark View Post
I will be given as much as I get from certain people on this board and if it custer's last stand do be it. The top 6 is the problem--not the bottom 6 and if we can fix the D that will fix the G--but to fix the problems it will cost and other nhl teams are not going to do the oilers any favour and it has been proven that teams will take less from other teams to keep players away from the oilers that would help us(Hamilton and Cory Schnieder are two prime examples of that)
Bolded: I agree, we need to fix the D. I also agree you need to give to get; this also implies that you actually get when you give, lol. Which of his trades does this? You really want Bobby Ryan (@ over $7M!)/Ryan Callahan/Brad Marchand as the main piece coming back for RNH?!

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12-04-2015, 10:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Lord J T Shark View Post
I think some people do not like the ideas being tossed put the bloh because it actually has the oilers giving something of value up to get something and not may people want to give up something of value
But those things aren't anything we need. How he managed to make a blog with several RNH trades and not have a single defenceman as the centre piece coming back is bizarre.

People aren't saying they aren't willing to give up value to get value, they are saying these returns don't address team needs or make us better.


Last edited by The Nuge: 12-04-2015 at 02:47 PM.
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12-04-2015, 01:04 PM
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I didn't say target Ryan Callahan I mentioned him as being available and his veteran presence helping, but the deal would need to involve a high end young player like Kucherov or Namestnikov.

Why wouldnt JVR and Bozak for Nugent Hopinks work. JVR is a 30 goal scorer, 60+ point guy with size and speed locked in a reasonable cap it and is only 26. On top of that Bozak can play any where in the line up, can help but the PK and PP and while he may not be an ideal 1 or 2 centre he certainly got the puck to Phil Kessel effectively. Why couldn't he the same for Yakupov, Hall or Eberle, while providing more versatility and better defensive zone play. *Also for another poster I know Lupul used to play in Edmonton, again I didn't say he'd be an ideal fit I simply said he and JVR are Toronto's sizable wingers that can produce and skate well enough to play with speed.

Bobby Ryan would be a long shot but I included him because of Ottawa's need for a number one centre an he is the only real value in Ottawa and the deal would likely have much more surrounding it but those players would be the centerpieces.


Last edited by The Nuge: 12-04-2015 at 02:29 PM.
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12-04-2015, 01:25 PM
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While one flipping of players likely won’t solve the Oilers issues, I believe it will be a start and with the play of Anders Nilsson in goal and the Oilers young blue liners stepping up the forward core should be the first to be addressed
The fact remains you've suggested a number of trades involving Oilers' two best chips and somehow failed to include a decent d-man coming back in any of them, which suggests you're out of touch as to Edmonton's actual needs and motivations for possibly trading RNH or Eberle. Indeed, you admit as much herE:

You've got it exactly backasswards. AFAIC, the Oilers priorities are, in order: veteran blueline presence, reliable goaltending, a more productive and effective bottom six, and then, maybe, balance in the top six.


Last edited by The Nuge: 12-04-2015 at 02:32 PM.
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12-04-2015, 01:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Macker88 View Post
I didn't say target Ryan Callahan I mentioned him as being available and his veteran presence helping, but the deal would need to involve a high end young player like Kucherov or Namestnikov.
Kucherov's value is far and away higher than Namestnikov's value. I didn't address the exact trades initially because I wanted people to click on your article and actually read it rather than have me out the actual deals. You're welcome.

Quote:
Why wouldnt JVR and Bozak for Nugent Hopinks work. JVR is a 30 goal scorer, 60+ point guy with size and speed locked in a reasonable cap it and is only 26. On top of that Bozak can play any where in the line up, can help but the PK and PP and while he may not be an ideal 1 or 2 centre he certainly got the puck to Phil Kessel effectively. Why couldn't he the same for Yakupov, Hall or Eberle, while providing more versatility and better defensive zone play. *Also for another poster I know Lupul used to play in Edmonton, again I didn't say he'd be an ideal fit I simply said he and JVR are Toronto's sizable wingers that can produce and skate well enough to play with speed.
Because Edmonton is taking back too much money (adding 2.425 million annually), because non-physical wingers and mediocre centres aren't needs for Edmonton, because JVR and Bozak are indifferent at best defensively, because Edmonton shouldn't be looking to give another team a number one centre unless the return fills a huge area of need (that would be top pairing defence), because Edmonton isn't looking to sell off RNH at any cost, rather, use him or Eberle or picks to fill an area of need (again, defence) and because if Edmonton trades RNH they absolutely desperately need a defenceman coming back. Pick one or all.

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Bobby Ryan would be a long shot but I included him because of Ottawa's need for a number one centre an he is the only real value in Ottawa and the deal would likely have much more surrounding it but those players would be the centerpieces
.

Ottawa's need, not Edmonton's need. Again. Too much money, fills no needs, and we take back Colin 'The Cap Dump' Greening, because reasons.


Last edited by The Nuge: 12-04-2015 at 02:34 PM.
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12-04-2015, 01:48 PM
  #21
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Originally Posted by Macker88 View Post
Why wouldnt JVR and Bozak for Nugent Hopinks work. JVR is a 30 goal scorer, 60+ point guy with size and speed locked in a reasonable cap it and is only 26. On top of that Bozak can play any where in the line up, can help but the PK and PP and while he may not be an ideal 1 or 2 centre he certainly got the puck to Phil Kessel effectively. Why couldn't he the same for Yakupov, Hall or Eberle, while providing more versatility and better defensive zone play. *Also for another poster I know Lupul used to play in Edmonton, again I didn't say he'd be an ideal fit I simply said he and JVR are Toronto's sizable wingers that can produce and skate well enough to play with speed.
It's not like adding JVR would be a bad thing in a vacuum, but this particular trade is using our most valuable theoretically-moveable asset in order to acquire... a middle six center and another "good but not quite elite" winger. It doesn't do anything to address the glaring lack of a #1D (or even, really, a good #2) that the Oilers are currently suffering from, which is a problem that weakens our entire d-corps, as basically every defenseman on the Oilers is playing higher in the lineup than they should be in a perfect world.

On top of that, Bozak's attributes being extolled are basically just "worse than RNH at everything but maybe defensive zone coverage". RNH is already playing in all situations, is consistently one of the highest forwards in ice time (last season, this was true across the entire league), and is still on pace for over 50 points even though he's been somewhat poor of late. The Oilers would be substantially downgrading at center in order to upgrade on the wings, which is poor asset management IMO, especially given that we already have Hall, Pouliot, Eberle, and Yakupov on the wings in the top 6. JVR is definitely better than Pouliot and Yakupov, probably on par with Eberle, and worse than Hall. Sure, acquiring a big, fast guy who can score would be great, but it's simply not priority number one.

Quote:
Bobby Ryan would be a long shot but I included him because of Ottawa's need for a number one centre an he is the only real value in Ottawa and the deal would likely have much more surrounding it but those players would be the centerpieces.
This is the same issue. Bobby Ryan is a good player, arguably in that same "good but not quite elite" tier as JVR (although personally I prefer JVR over Ryan). If we made this kind of trade, we'd be left with one of McDavid or Draisaitl having to take on the "plays in all situations" role that RNH is currently filling, as Lander and Letestu are incompatible with scoring roles.

The Oilers have a lot of problems with their roster, which does include the lack of big bodies in the top six, but this is a concern which is much further down the list. Our entire defensive lineup is playing tougher opposition than they can really handle due to the lack of a true top pairing d-man. This hole in the roster affects the entire team, since every single defenseman is out of their depth, it's limiting the ability of the entire Oilers lineup to get out of the defensive zone. A big winger would help the top six look better, sure, but wouldn't improve the overall team performance that much.

If you're trading a premiere asset like RNH, you need to address the big concerns first, rather than addressing issues like balance in the top 6 or effective role players in the bottom 6. Yes, these problems need to be solved, but you don't expend your best assets to do so.


Last edited by The Nuge: 12-04-2015 at 02:48 PM.
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Old
12-04-2015, 02:18 PM
  #22
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Ya, we're going to take a little break.

Let's try this again. I understand everyone is frustrated right now, but that type of thing isn't acceptable. I'm giving everyone a break on that, but if it happens again when this starts back up, I won't be as lenient.

You are allowed to criticize a post (or article), but not the poster themselves.

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