HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > The History of Hockey
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
The History of Hockey Relive great moments in hockey history and discuss how the game has changed over time.

Doug Bodger - Under appreciated?

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
11-18-2010, 08:25 PM
  #1
Habsfan18
Registered User
 
Habsfan18's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 23,581
vCash: 500
Doug Bodger - Under appreciated?

Drafted 9th overall in 1984 by Pittsburgh, he played 4 seasons there before being dealt to Buffalo in the Barrasso trade. Also had stints in San Jose, New Jersey, Los Angeles and Vancouver.

40+ points 6 times, and almost made it 8 times with seasons of 37 and 39 points. Finished his career with 528 points in 1071 games to go along with 24 playoff points in 47 games.



Underrated?

Habsfan18 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-18-2010, 08:35 PM
  #2
Ziggy Stardust
Master Debater
 
Ziggy Stardust's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Parts Unknown
Posts: 33,287
vCash: 500
I don't think he was underrated. I don't think he was good enough to be considered in the upper echelon of defensemen during that era, but he was a very good #2-3 guy.

He reached his offensive peak in the early 90s (plus it helped that he played with one of the most productive players and lines of that era). After 92-93, his numbers took a huge dip and started to decrease significantly.

He wasn't a type of defenseman who could control the game like MacInnis, Coffey, Bourque, Stevens, Leetch, Lidstrom, Housley, etc. He was more along the lines of a players like Kevin Lowe, Steve Smith, Petr Svoboda, players who were well rounded and more than dependable.

Ziggy Stardust is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
11-18-2010, 09:20 PM
  #3
Hardyvan123
tweet@HardyintheWack
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Vancouver
Country: Canada
Posts: 13,485
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust View Post
I don't think he was underrated. I don't think he was good enough to be considered in the upper echelon of defensemen during that era, but he was a very good #2-3 guy.

He reached his offensive peak in the early 90s (plus it helped that he played with one of the most productive players and lines of that era). After 92-93, his numbers took a huge dip and started to decrease significantly.

He wasn't a type of defenseman who could control the game like MacInnis, Coffey, Bourque, Stevens, Leetch, Lidstrom, Housley, etc. He was more along the lines of a players like Kevin Lowe, Steve Smith, Petr Svoboda, players who were well rounded and more than dependable.
You just about summed it up here.

As to the OP, why do think he under rated?

He played 15 seasons and never made the All Star game, he might be on the best team (12,6,2 position wise) to never have played in an all star game with 10 seasons or more or some weird metric like that but he was a decent support player and nothing more even at his peak.

Hardyvan123 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-18-2010, 09:31 PM
  #4
VanIslander
Hope for better 2015
 
VanIslander's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 19,384
vCash: 500
Bodger wasn't among the 720 picks in the main all-time draft here at hfBoards this year, but he was the 7th round 102nd pick in the following minor league draft (so 720+102= 822nd player of all time, based on building a team in a hypothetical league of pick up hockey). He was drafted amongst these all-time pretty goods:

Quote:
74. EagleBelfour - Les As de Québec - Rick Ley, D
75. BiLLY_ShOE1721 - Philadelphia Blazers - Mike Milbury, D
76. Stalberg & markrander87 - St. Mary's Huskies - Pekka Rautakallio, D
80. Hedberg & vancityluongo - Florida Hammerheads - Howard McNamara, D
81. Hedberg & vancityluongo - Florida Hammerheads - Dolly Swift, F/D
84. papershoes - Cornwall Royals - Dmitri Ukolov, D
87. EagleBelfour - Les As de Québec - Joe Watson, D
91. chaosrevolver - Belleville Bulls - Dmitri Yushkevich, D
92. jareklajkosz & TheDevilMadeMe - Brooklyn Americans - Dick Redmond, D
93. JFA87-66-99 - Pittsburgh Bankers - James Stewart, D
97. Velociraptor & Chigurh - Baltimore Skipjacks - Darius Kasparitis, D
102. chaosrevolver - Belleville Bulls - Doug Bodger, D
103. MadArcand & tony d - Carolina Hurricanes - Bruce Driver, D
105. DaveG - Charlotte Clippers - Steve Chiasson, D
107. BiLLY_ShOE1721 - Philadelphia Blazers - Dave Manson, D
110. raleh - Kokudo Bunnies - Allan Shields, D
111. seventieslord - Regina Capitals - Al Arbour, D
http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=785235

Should he have been drafted higher? Given the dearth of puck handling defensemen maybe so. But in terms of overall value? No, he isn't underrated.


Last edited by VanIslander: 11-18-2010 at 09:38 PM.
VanIslander is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-18-2010, 09:48 PM
  #5
Habsfan18
Registered User
 
Habsfan18's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 23,581
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardyvan123 View Post
You just about summed it up here.

As to the OP, why do think he under rated?

He played 15 seasons and never made the All Star game, he might be on the best team (12,6,2 position wise) to never have played in an all star game with 10 seasons or more or some weird metric like that but he was a decent support player and nothing more even at his peak.
I just wanted to get some general feelings about what you guys thought of Bodger, that's all.

In no way am I saying he was a top defender or anything of that sort, but he never really gets talked about at all and he did have a decent NHL career.

Maybe under appreciated would have been better?

Habsfan18 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-18-2010, 10:05 PM
  #6
Ziggy Stardust
Master Debater
 
Ziggy Stardust's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Parts Unknown
Posts: 33,287
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Habsfan18 View Post
I just wanted to get some general feelings about what you guys thought of Bodger, that's all.

In no way am I saying he was a top defender or anything of that sort, but he never really gets talked about at all and he did have a decent NHL career.

Maybe under appreciated would have been better?
I could see that since he isn't really talked about much. To liken Bodger to a modern day player, I think of Brad Stuart. A fairly solid contributor at both ends of the rink, but he never wowed or dazzled anyone with his abilities and will always have a role as an above average mid-pairing defenseman.

Ziggy Stardust is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
11-18-2010, 10:57 PM
  #7
seventieslord
Moderator
 
seventieslord's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Regina, SK
Country: Canada
Posts: 25,411
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by VanIslander View Post
Bodger wasn't among the 720 picks in the main all-time draft here at hfBoards this year, but he was the 7th round 102nd pick in the following minor league draft (so 720+102= 822nd player of all time, based on building a team in a hypothetical league of pick up hockey). He was drafted amongst these all-time pretty goods:


http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=785235

Should he have been drafted higher? Given the dearth of puck handling defensemen maybe so. But in terms of overall value? No, he isn't underrated.
ATD evidence should be used in the HOH section more often.

seventieslord is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
11-18-2010, 11:48 PM
  #8
VanIslander
Hope for better 2015
 
VanIslander's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 19,384
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust View Post
To liken Bodger to a modern day player, I think of Brad Stuart. A fairly solid contributor at both ends of the rink, but he never wowed or dazzled anyone with his abilities and will always have a role as an above average mid-pairing defenseman.
1121st pick in the all-time drafts, on the second day of the third tier AAA draft, amongst these all-time decent rearguards:

Quote:
Mark Streit, D, London
Jim McKenny, D, Philadelphia
Jack Ruttan, D, Regina
Brad Stuart, D, Colorado
Chris Phillips, D, Queen's
Curt Giles, D, Philadelphia
Lubomir Visnovsky, D, Kosice
Anton Volchenkov, D, Queen's
Tom Kurvers, D, Johnstown
Jim Dorey, D, Abbotsford
Alexei Zhitnik, D, London
Nikolai Makarov, D, Toledo
http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=826163

And Stuart wasn't a popular pick. He started on a top pairing but ended up on a second pairing.

So,.. if your analogy holds: is Brad Stuart underrated or Doug Bodger overrated?

VanIslander is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-18-2010, 11:57 PM
  #9
seventieslord
Moderator
 
seventieslord's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Regina, SK
Country: Canada
Posts: 25,411
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by VanIslander View Post
1121st pick in the all-time drafts, on the second day of the third tier AAA draft, amongst these all-time decent rearguards:


http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=826163

And Stuart wasn't a popular pick. He started on a top pairing but ended up on a second pairing.

So,.. if your analogy holds: is Brad Stuart underrated or Doug Bodger overrated?
I'm not sure the analogy holds. Bodger was a more important player than Stuart.

He averaged about 23.3 minutes over 1000+ games. Stuart's averaged 21.9 in a shorter career.

seventieslord is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2010, 12:12 AM
  #10
Ziggy Stardust
Master Debater
 
Ziggy Stardust's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Parts Unknown
Posts: 33,287
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by seventieslord View Post
I'm not sure the analogy holds. Bodger was a more important player than Stuart.

He averaged about 23.3 minutes over 1000+ games. Stuart's averaged 21.9 in a shorter career.
While you may look at the minutes as a comparison, I look at the roles played to indicate the players' importance, and seeing what Brad Stuart brought to the Wings after they acquired him and his play in the playoffs (paired with Kronwall), they formed a very good middle pairing behind Lidstrom and Rafalski.

I liken it to them both being highly regarded rearguards taken high in the first round (Stuart going 3rd, Bodger 9th), but they settled into the league as defensive dmen in the later stages of their careers and were not recognized as the puck-rushing or flashy types.

I'm drawing an analogy of the player and his abilities, not their stats.

Ziggy Stardust is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2010, 12:24 AM
  #11
seventieslord
Moderator
 
seventieslord's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Regina, SK
Country: Canada
Posts: 25,411
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust View Post
While you may look at the minutes as a comparison, I look at the roles played to indicate the players' importance, and seeing what Brad Stuart brought to the Wings after they acquired him and his play in the playoffs (paired with Kronwall), they formed a very good middle pairing behind Lidstrom and Rafalski.

I liken it to them both being highly regarded rearguards taken high in the first round (Stuart going 3rd, Bodger 9th), but they settled into the league as defensive dmen in the later stages of their careers and were not recognized as the puck-rushing or flashy types.

I'm drawing an analogy of the player and his abilities, not their stats.
You may call minutes just a stat, but it's a direct reflection of how much they were valued by their teams in their careers. Coaches want to win, and they play their best players as much as possible.

seventieslord is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2010, 09:24 AM
  #12
tony d
ATD 2015
 
tony d's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Behind A Tree
Country: Canada
Posts: 38,483
vCash: 500
Bodger was another 1 of those guys that I've always liked. He wasn't someone that you'd use as the focal point of your defense but he was still a solid player during his career.

tony d is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2010, 01:56 PM
  #13
Analyzer
#WeAreBoston
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Renfrew, ON.
Country: Canada
Posts: 44,018
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by VanIslander View Post
Bodger wasn't among the 720 picks in the main all-time draft here at hfBoards this year, but he was the 7th round 102nd pick in the following minor league draft (so 720+102= 822nd player of all time, based on building a team in a hypothetical league of pick up hockey). He was drafted amongst these all-time pretty goods:


http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=785235

Should he have been drafted higher? Given the dearth of puck handling defensemen maybe so. But in terms of overall value? No, he isn't underrated.
Given the players drafted a head of him just in the small part you quoted, I think he is underrated.

Analyzer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2010, 01:59 PM
  #14
seventieslord
Moderator
 
seventieslord's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Regina, SK
Country: Canada
Posts: 25,411
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Analyzer View Post
Given the players drafted a head of him just in the small part you quoted, I think he is underrated.
I wouldn't select him ahead of Ley, McNamara, Redmond, yushkevich or Watson for sure.

seventieslord is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2010, 02:16 PM
  #15
BraveCanadian
Registered User
 
BraveCanadian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,878
vCash: 500
Didn't Bodger have a pretty good pop gun from the point too?

BraveCanadian is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2010, 02:59 PM
  #16
seventieslord
Moderator
 
seventieslord's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Regina, SK
Country: Canada
Posts: 25,411
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BraveCanadian View Post
Didn't Bodger have a pretty good pop gun from the point too?
He sure did.

seventieslord is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2010, 03:08 PM
  #17
BraveCanadian
Registered User
 
BraveCanadian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,878
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by seventieslord View Post
He sure did.
He always sort of reminded me of the Sabres version of Dave Ellett.

BraveCanadian is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2010, 03:19 PM
  #18
seventieslord
Moderator
 
seventieslord's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Regina, SK
Country: Canada
Posts: 25,411
vCash: 500
both were what I would call offensive specialists, but neither was devoid of defense either. Bodger was more defensive, Ellet more offensive. Both managed to remain very useful after their offense dried up.

seventieslord is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2010, 03:25 PM
  #19
VanIslander
Hope for better 2015
 
VanIslander's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 19,384
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BraveCanadian View Post
He always sort of reminded me of the Sabres version of Dave Ellett.
Ellett went 224th in the minor league draft, so 944th overall in this year's all-time drafts, amongst:

Quote:
209. Miroslav Dvorak, D
217. Alexei Gusarov, D
220. Walter Smaill, F/D
223. Niklas Kronwall, D
224. Dave Ellett, D
227. Marty Burke, D
228. Shea Weber, D
230. Warren Godfrey, D
http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=785235

So, since Ellett went over a hundred picks later, by the comparison, Bodger isn't undervalued unless Ellett is much more so.

VanIslander is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2010, 06:16 PM
  #20
DickSmehlik
Registered User
 
DickSmehlik's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: DC
Country: United States
Posts: 1,753
vCash: 500
I always said Doug never did anything great he just was one of those guys that did everything good.

He was above average offensively, could play good defense and was underrated physically. Not too many guys like him anymore.

DickSmehlik is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2010, 10:31 PM
  #21
Hardyvan123
tweet@HardyintheWack
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Vancouver
Country: Canada
Posts: 13,485
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by VanIslander View Post
Bodger wasn't among the 720 picks in the main all-time draft here at hfBoards this year, but he was the 7th round 102nd pick in the following minor league draft (so 720+102= 822nd player of all time, based on building a team in a hypothetical league of pick up hockey). He was drafted amongst these all-time pretty goods:


http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=785235

Should he have been drafted higher? Given the dearth of puck handling defensemen maybe so. But in terms of overall value? No, he isn't underrated.
Mike Milbury went higher?

Really?

Did people forget that he had to spend a couple of seasons in the minors because his skating was so bad?

He was a tough player but did play in the watered down 70's

Hardyvan123 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2010, 10:58 PM
  #22
Hardyvan123
tweet@HardyintheWack
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Vancouver
Country: Canada
Posts: 13,485
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by seventieslord View Post
I wouldn't select him ahead of Ley, McNamara, Redmond, yushkevich or Watson for sure.
I'm more on the side of Analyzer here Bodger had a pretty solid 15 year career in the NHL.

Some of these guys are not clearly ahead of him.

Ley might be, not sure on the other guys you listed though.

Hardyvan123 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2010, 11:15 PM
  #23
VanIslander
Hope for better 2015
 
VanIslander's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 19,384
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardyvan123 View Post
Mike Milbury went higher? Really?

Did people forget that he had to spend a couple of seasons in the minors because his skating was so bad?

He was a tough player but did play in the watered down 70's
I didn't like the pick. He's a 6/7 slot guy. But there's no arguin' if you need a guy to climb over the bench and into the stands to hit angry fans with the heel of a shoe, he's your man!

VanIslander is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2010, 11:49 PM
  #24
Hardyvan123
tweet@HardyintheWack
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Vancouver
Country: Canada
Posts: 13,485
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by VanIslander View Post
I didn't like the pick. He's a 6/7 slot guy. But there's no arguin' if you need a guy to climb over the bench and into the stands to hit angry fans with the heel of a shoe, he's your man!
he is still entertaining on TV as well. I miss him and Espo as GM's though they always made things very interesting, not better for their teams, just interesting for the rest of us.

Hardyvan123 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-20-2010, 01:40 AM
  #25
seventieslord
Moderator
 
seventieslord's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Regina, SK
Country: Canada
Posts: 25,411
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardyvan123 View Post
I'm more on the side of Analyzer here Bodger had a pretty solid 15 year career in the NHL.

Some of these guys are not clearly ahead of him.

Ley might be, not sure on the other guys you listed though.
Hey, VI gave a big list, and those were the only five I can say I am sure about. There are a few I'd definitely take Bodger over, and then many who are iffy, more depending on what role I am filling.

seventieslord is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:11 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2015 All Rights Reserved.