HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > The History of Hockey
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

The History of Hockey Relive great moments in hockey history and discuss how the game has changed over time.

HOHHOF : Early Era round-up!

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
11-29-2010, 09:55 PM
  #26
Dreakmur
Registered User
 
Dreakmur's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Orillia, Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,074
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nighthawks View Post
How about two great snipers of the day:

Joe Malone
Frank McGee
We'll have to see how he stacks up when we get more into it, but McGee seems like a guy who might not make in with the tougher standards.

Dreakmur is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-29-2010, 09:58 PM
  #27
TheDevilMadeMe
Registered User
 
TheDevilMadeMe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Brooklyn
Country: United States
Posts: 45,406
vCash: 500
Great work copying over a lot of the relevant ATD bios, VI.

But I do hope that the finalized player profiles don't contain things like an uncritical use of the silly "adjusted size" metric. Edit: I can be useful in comparing guys across eras in the ATD, but doesn't belong in a serious HOF profile.

Quote:
Originally Posted by VanIslander View Post

Adjusted Size:
6’6” 245 lbs


Last edited by TheDevilMadeMe: 11-29-2010 at 10:13 PM.
TheDevilMadeMe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-29-2010, 10:02 PM
  #28
jumptheshark
McDavid Headquarters
 
jumptheshark's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Lord of HFBOARDS
Country: United Nations
Posts: 69,242
vCash: 50
frank patrick went in as a builder in 66--back then the hall had some odd rules(if I am not mistaken) and if he had the rep to go in as a builder they would not look at his playing career

__________________
**Avatar approved by the powers that be***
jumptheshark is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-29-2010, 10:08 PM
  #29
seventieslord
Moderator
 
seventieslord's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Regina, SK
Country: Canada
Posts: 28,381
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by jumptheshark View Post
frank patrick went in as a builder in 66--back then the hall had some odd rules(if I am not mistaken) and if he had the rep to go in as a builder they would not look at his playing career
I'm not sure about that.

How on earth would Art Ross and Lester Patrick get in as players?

seventieslord is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-29-2010, 10:29 PM
  #30
MXD
Registered User
 
MXD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Hôlle
Posts: 28,493
vCash: 500
In regards to George Hay

I think he's at his place, in the Early Era voting round. But a point could be made that he should be up for voting later...What do you think?

MXD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-29-2010, 10:33 PM
  #31
seventieslord
Moderator
 
seventieslord's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Regina, SK
Country: Canada
Posts: 28,381
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MXD View Post
I think he's at his place, in the Early Era voting round. But a point could be made that he should be up for voting later...What do you think?
I'd keep him here. Imagine he never plays in the NHL, does he make the hall? Maybe. Imagine he never plays in the west, does he make the hall? Not a chance.

seventieslord is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-29-2010, 11:08 PM
  #32
MXD
Registered User
 
MXD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Hôlle
Posts: 28,493
vCash: 500
Bernie Morris

For M. Bernie Morris



- 5'7", 145 lbs
- Stanley Cup (1917)
- Stanley Cup Finalist (1920, 1924)
- PCHA First All-Star Team (1916, 1917, 1918, 1919, 1922)
- PCHA Second All-Star Team (1921, 1923)
- Top-10 in PCHA Goals 7 times (1st, 2nd, 2nd, 2nd, 4th, 5th, 9th)
- Top-10 in PCHA Assists 6 times (1st, 2nd, 2nd, 2nd, 3rd, 6th)
- Top-10 in PCHA Points 7 times (1st, 2nd, 2nd, 2nd, 4th, 6th, 7th)
- 6th in goals, 10th in assists, 7th in points in his one WCHL season (1924)
- Stanley Cup scoring leader (1917)
- 2nd in playoff scoring behind Howie Morenz (1924)
- SPHL Scoring Leader (1912)
- 175 Goals, 85 Assists, 260 Points in 217 Top-level games
- 19 goals, 10 assists, 29 Points in 22 Top-level playoff games

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Trail Of The Stanley Cup, Vol. 1
With the addition of Morris, the Mets had a team that was always a contender. Morris was a very versatile player and was used at both RW and Centre. He was a great favourite with the Seattle fans for eight years and they were sorry to see him traded to Calgary, where he had one more good year. He figured on four championship teams, played in three cup series and was on one Stanley Cup winner.

In his first two years at Seattle he centred a line of Jack Walker and ***** ****** with Frank Foyston at rover, alternating with Foyston at Rover. He was the scoring leader in his first year and in the 1917 cup series, when the Mets defeated Candiens three games to one, Bernie scored 14 goals in four games, the best effort since the days of Frank McGee.

The next year he centred ****** and Gord Roberts while in 1919 he played RW on a line with Foyston and ****** and the Mets won another championship... He was chosen for the PCHA All-Star Teams of 1918 and 1919... He had three more good years with Seattle centering Foyston and *** *****. Two of those years they were in the playoffs but lost to Vancouver.

He was traded to Calgary in 1924, where playing on a line with ***** ****** and Rusty Crawford he was a big factor in the Tigers winning the championship of the WCHL.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Total Hockey
A goal-scoring star who helped bring the first Stanley Cup to the USA. He is sixth all-time in goals and fifth all-time in points in the PCHA.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord Stanley's Cup
The goal-scoring star of the year.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Players: The Ultimate A-Z Guide Of Every Player Who Has Ever Played In the NHL
It was not because of his NHL career that Morris was a legend by the time he retired. He was one of the great players of the PCHA, winning a Stanley Cup with Seattle and establishing himself as one of the great scorers of the game. In the 1917 Finals, he scored 14 goals in the series against Montreal with the great Georges Vezina in the nets. He is not in the HHOF, but some consider his exploits comparable to other PCHA stars such as Cyclone Taylor, Tommy Dunderdale, Mickey MacKay, and Frank Foyston, who are in the Hall. Perhaps his exclusion is because of the 1919-20 season, which he spent in prison after some trouble with U.S. Authorities.
We don't know much about how Morris played, other than he was an offensive whiz. But I did find one passage describing him from his short time with Boston:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Globe and Mail, 1/12/1925
Bernie Morris, aggressive little center player...
Bernie Morris' Main claim to fame is being the star of the 1917 Stanley Cup Finals:

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Trail Of the Stanley Cup, Vol. 1

(game 1, 3-1 Habs) Bernie Morris was the best for Seattle, scoring three of their goals and keeping Vezina hopping with many other attempts.

(game 2, 6-1 Seattle) Bernie Morris and Frank Foyston were the stars.

(game 3, 4-1 Seattle) Bernie Morris was again the star for Seattle.

(game 4, 9-1 Seattle) Bernie Morris was sensational and easily the outstanding star. He scored six goals in this match, raising his total to 14 for the series, the best record since Frank McGee.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Backcheck: A Hockey Retrospective
Morris seemed to be the principal fly in the Montreal ointment, the Seattle forward snagging six scores alone.
In all, Seattle outscored Montreal 23-11. Morris scored 14 goals,over half Seattle's total, and more than Montreal scored.

Morris' reputation as a draft dodger is not a reputation that was fairly earned:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Seattlehockey.net
The 1918-19 season was the fourth consecutive in which Morris led the Mets in scoring, and confidence in Seattle was high going into the two games, total goals playoff with Vancouver for the right to play for the Stanley Cup. A few hours before the start of the first game Bernie was informed that he was being sought by the authorities on charges of draft evasion. He immediately turned himself in, figuring that it was just a misunderstanding that would be cleared up quickly. He was wrong, and the subsequent investigation and court proceedings not only kept him out of the playoffs and 1919 Stanley Cup finals, but also resulted in his detention at Camp Lewis (now Fort Lewis) for almost a year, preventing him from taking the ice for the 1919-20 season. His name was finally cleared in the spring of 1920, just in time to make the trip east with the Mets for the 1920 Stanley Cup finals against Ottawa. Morris wasn't in game shape, only earning two assists in five games as the Mets lost the series three games to two.
The two assists in 5 games help to skew his playoff numbers downward, but The Trail indicates he was a spare in three of those games, and spares rarely set foot on the ice. Morris had 27 points in his other 17 playoff games.

There should be little doubt that Morris was the offensive catalyst behind the Seattle attack, and perhaps he was a better player than Frank Foyston. Take a look at Seattle's top-4 scorers in every season that Morris was in Seattle: (He missed 1920 thanks to his detention which apparently took a toll on him throughout the 1921 season as well) It is also important to note that Foyston and Morris were born less than one year apart so this is apples-to-apples.


http://hfboards.com/showpost.php?p=2...&postcount=527


Last edited by MXD: 11-29-2010 at 11:15 PM.
MXD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-29-2010, 11:12 PM
  #33
TheDevilMadeMe
Registered User
 
TheDevilMadeMe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Brooklyn
Country: United States
Posts: 45,406
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by seventieslord View Post
VI: Thanks for doing the work posting some of the old bios by LF, EB and myself.

A better Lester Patrick bio from ATD12 that doesn't convolute his offensive credentials beyond recognition is located here: http://hfboards.com/showpost.php?p=2...&postcount=852

plus it has a lot more quotes. Hopefully you can all look past the fact that it doesn't mention he was once 7th in the WCHL in playoff PIMs by a defenseman (with two!!)
Good point. I feel that bios are much better if the useful information isn't buried in meaningless statistical smoke (like the example you mentioned). Yet another thing to make sure our HOF profiles do not include (at some point, we might want to make a decision on whether to standardize them or not).

TheDevilMadeMe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-29-2010, 11:31 PM
  #34
MXD
Registered User
 
MXD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Hôlle
Posts: 28,493
vCash: 500
Gordon "Duke" Keats

Monsieur Gordon Blanchard Keats [/B]



Nickname: Duke, Iron Duke
Height: 5'11''
Weight: 195 lbs
Position: Center
Shoots: Right
Date of Birth: March 01, 1895
Place of Birth: Montreal, Canada
Date of Death: January 16, 1972 (Age: 76)

Stanley Cup Finalist (1923)
First All-Star Team Centre (1922, 1923, 1924, 1925) *WCHL*
First All-Star Team Centre (1926) *WHL*
Art Ross Trophy (1922) *WCHL*
Hart Memorial Trophy (1922*) *WCHL*
Maurice Richard Trophy (1922) *WCHL*
Team Captain (1921-1926)
Inducted into the Edmonton Sports Hall of Fame (1964)
Inducted into the Hockey Hall of Fame (1958)

National Hockey Association [1915-17]
Top-10 Scoring (4th)
Top-10 Goalscoring (5th)
Top-10 Assist (4th)
Top-10 Penalty Minutes (3rd, 10th)
Western Canada Hockey League [1921-25]
Western Hockey League [1925-26]

Top-10 Scoring (1st, 2nd, 3rd, 3rd, 6th)
Top-10 Goalscoring (1st, 2nd, 4th, 4th, 5th)
Top-10 Assist (1st, 2nd, 4th, 6th, 8th)
Top-10 Penalty Minutes (1st, 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 8th)
Top-10 Playoff Scoring (1st, 2nd, 8th)
Top-10 Playoff Goalscoring (1st)
Top-10 Playoff Assist (1st, 1st, 3rd)
Top-10 Playoff Penalty Minutes (1st, 2nd, 2nd)
National Hockey League [1926-29]
Top-10 Scoring (9th, 10th)
Top-10 Goalscoring (10th)
Top-10 Assist (7th, 8th)

- Gordon was given the nickname "Duke" after a warship
- At the age of 17, he was making $75 a month playing hockey (about 1650$ today)
- Lost two years of prime hockey due to World War I
- In the 1916-17 season, Keats played two games with the Toronto Blueshirts as the goaltender, posting a 0-1 record with a goal against average of 8.82
- He scored eight goals against Saskatoon on January 23, 1922
- In the 1923 WCHL finals, he scored the game winning goals in overtime
- A story is told that Duke once skated the length of the ice backwards and scored a goal on the opposition
- In the 1926-27 season, he was named head coach of the Detroit Cougars for 11 games
- The first goal Keats ever scored in a Detroit uniform was an overtime winner in a 1-0 victory over the New York Americans
- He registered the first hat-trick of the franchise history in a 7-1 win over Pittsburgh on March 10, 1927
- In 1926-27, he led all Detroit's player with three game-winning goals
- Keats played the right wing with the Chicago Blackhawks
- Elected into the World Wide Hockey Hall of Fame in 1948


















- ''You would have thought he had a nail in the end of his stick, the way he could carry that puck around. He was that good.'' - Lloyd McIntyre, a teammate of Keats

- ''To just a kid, it looked like a million.'' - Duke Keats, about the money he was making at a young age

- ''Duke is the possessor of more hockey grey matter than any man who ever played the game'' - Frank Patrick

- ''Gordon Keats was the best player of all time'' - Lloyd McIntyre

- ''Keats was the brainiest pivot that ever strapped on a skate because he could organize plays and make passes every time he starts.'' - Lester Patrick



- ''He made thirty perfect passes to his wingmates one night'' - Frank Patrick

http://news.google.com/newspapers?id...5263%2C1318081

Sites:
http://www.legendsofhockey.net/Legen...=P195812#photo
http://www.sihrhockey.org/member_pla...id=1749&mode=0
http://redwings.nhl.com/club/page.ht..._wol-dukekeats
[url]http://www.oilersheritage.com/history/early_teams_edmonton_eskimos.html[/ur][/QUOTE]


Last edited by MXD: 11-30-2010 at 02:01 PM.
MXD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-30-2010, 12:11 AM
  #35
EagleBelfour
Registered User
 
EagleBelfour's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Country: Canada
Posts: 7,416
vCash: 500
Players that could get a single vote and havn't been mention yet:

Russell Bowie
Punch Broadbent
Lloyd Cook
Bert Corbeau
Rusty Crawford
Jack Darragh
Pete Green
Riley Hern
Harry Hyland
Percy LeSueur
Frank McGee
Harry Mummery
Tom Paton
Blair Russell
Ernie Russell
Alf Smith
Tommy Smith
Jack Walker
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
What I could find on my files on some of them:
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Monsieur Ernest Russell

Stanley Cup Champion (1906, 1907, 1908, 1910)
ECAHA's 1st All-Star Team (1907)
ECAHA's 2nd All-Star Team (1908)
Art Ross Trophy (1907)
Hart Trophy (1907*)
Maurice Richard Trophy (1907)
Inducted into the Hockey Hall of Fame (1965)

ECAHA Stats
Top-10 Scoring (1st, 2nd, 5th)
Top-10 Goalscoring (1st, 2nd, 5th)
Top-10 Penalty Minutes (3rd, 6th)
*Missing the 1907-08 Season*
NHA Stats
Top-10 Scoring (2nd, 3rd, 8th)
Top-10 Goalscoring (2nd, 3rd, 8th)
Top-10 Penalty Minutes (1st, 6th, 6th)
*1.81 goals a game in the regular season*

Playoffs Stats (ECAHA/NHA)
Top-10 Scoring (1st, 1st, 5th, 5th)
Top-10 Goalscoring (1st, 1st, 5th, 5th)
Top-10 Penalty Minutes (1st, 6th, 6th, 7th)
*3.00 Goals a game in the playoffs*
*Assist were not registered during Russell's Career.


- In his career, he played rover, center and right winger
- Led the ECAHA with 5 winning goals in 1906-07
- Scored the most goals in a single season in 1910's with 42 in 1906-07


Quote:
Originally Posted by HHOF
He was captain of the Sterling Athletics juniors in 1903 when they won the junior championship of Canada. That same year, he was also captain of the Montreal Amateur Athletic Association football team that won a Canadian junior title.

He was a fast skater and an accomplished stickhandler, and although he weighed only about 140 pounds he averaged nearly two goals per game over his career.

He is perhaps best remembered for scoring a hat-trick in each of five consecutive games and for amassing the incredible total of 43 goals in only nine games during the 1907 season. He was one of Montreal's best known and most respected athletes in his day, and lived in the city his entire life.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultimate Hockey
Ernie Russell played on all four Stanley Cup-winning Montreal Wanderers clubs and consistently figured among the leading scorers in the ECAHA and later in the NHA. Although Russell could pass, stick-handle, and skate, his scoring instinct was quickly shown to be his bread and butter.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Monsieur Harold Macarius Hyland



Nickname: Harry
Height: 5'6''
Weight: 156 lbs
Position: Right Wing
Shoots: Right
Date of Birth: January 02, 1889
Place of Birth: Montreal, Canada
Date of Death: August 08, 1969 (Age: 80)

Stanley Cup Champion (1910)
First All-Star Team (1912) *PCHA*
Inducted into the Hockey Hall of Fame (1962)

Eastern Canada Hockey League [1908-09]
Top-10 Scoring (6th)
Top-10 Goalscoring (6th)
Top-10 Penalty Minutes (10th)
*Assist were not recorded*
National Hockey Association [1909-11;1912-17]
Top-10 Scoring (3rd, 3rd, 4th, 5th)
Top-10 Goalscoring (3rd, 3rd, 4th, 5th)
Top-10 Assist (4th, 9th)
Top-10 Playoff Scoring (6th)
Top-10 Playoff Goalscoring (6th)
Top-10 Playoff Penalty Minutes (1st, 7th)
Pacific Coast Hockey Association [1911-12]
Top-10 Scoring (2nd)
Top-10 Goalscoring (2nd)
Top-10 Penalty Minutes (7th)
*Assist were not recorded*
National Hockey League [1917-18]
Top-10 Goalscoring (8th)
Top-10 Penalty Minutes (5th)

- Hyland was also a Lacrosse star, where he won a championship in 1910 and 1912
- Hyland scored a hat trick in the 1910 Stanley Cup championship game against the Ottawa Senators
- He won the league championship with the New Westminster Royals in the only year he played in the PCHA; he registered 4 goals in the championship game against the Vancouver Millionaire
- In the only All-Star he played in the PCHA, Hyland registered 6 goals
- On January 25th 1913, Hyland registered 8 goals against the Quebec Bulldogs
- In the 1917 season, he missed several games as a salary holdout
- Harry Hyland was a Montreal Wanderers for 9 years, until the team was dissolved in January 1918 when a fire destroyed the Westmount Arena
- Hyland played the opening night of the National Hockey League on December 19th 1917. He was the star of the game and registered 5 goals in a 10-9 victory over the Toronto Arenas
- Hyland announced his retirement from hockey on December 6, 1918
- After his playing career, Hyland coached multiple teams, including the McGill University hockey squad the Columbus entry in Senior Group of the Quebec Amateur Hockey Association
- Hyland his 4th All-Time in scoring in the National Hockey Association
- In his career, Hyland registered 17 three-goal games, 5 four-goal games, 4 five-goal games and 1 eight-goal games
- The book ''The trail of The Stanley Cup'' considered Harry Hyland one of the 11 best forward from 1893 to 1926, a list including Frank Nighbor, Joe Malone, Frank Foyston, Didier Pitre, Harry Broadbent, Jack Darragh and Gordon Roberts.


Quote:
Originally Posted by HHOF
A fast skater with a powerful shot, he scored two goals in his professional debut against Quebec.

Hyland joined the Montreal Wanderers for 1909-10 and was a major part of the Wanderers Stanley Cup championship.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trail of the Stanley Cup, vol.1
Hyland was a fast and tricky stickhandler.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Classic Auctions
Montreal-born Harry Hyland was once described as one of the greatest right wingers of his day while teaming with Montreal Wanderer linemate Gordon Roberts to form one of the best scoring combinations in the game.

Harry Hyland was a scoring star who helped the Montreal Wanderers to the Stanley Cup in 1910. Together with linemates Odie Cleghorn and Gordon Roberts, the trio was a formidable force.
Quote:
Goalscoring performances of the best National Hockey Association players from 1911 to 1915

1. Harry Hyland - 106 goals in 72 games played - 1.47 goals/game
2. Joe Malone - 104 goals in 67 games played - 1.55 goals/game
3. Didier Pitre - 95 goals in 70 games played - 1.35 goals/game
4. Edouard Lalonde - 78 goals in 54 games played - 1.44 goals/game

Sites:
http://www.legendsofhockey.net/Legen...=P196211#photo
http://www.classicauctions.net/Defau...d=52&lotid=574
http://www.classicauctions.net/Defau...d=52&lotid=283
http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=398815&cmpid=rss
http://www.sportsecyclopedia.com/nhl...wanderers.html
http://www.sihrhockey.org/member_pla...id=1578&mode=0
http://www.gvshof.ca/news.asp?ID_ArticleIndex=43
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Defenseman/Winger Lloyd Cook

Before going into Lloyd Cook career details: Cook played mostly as a winger with the Vancouver Millionaire in his first two years in the PCHA (1915-16 and 1916-17). In the 1917-18 season, he played as a defenseman, replacing Frank Patrick who was at his last mile as a hockey player. From the 1918-19 season until his retirement in 1925, Cook played as a full-time defenseman.

Stanley Cup Champion (1915)
Stanley Cup Finalist (1918, 1921, 1922)
Norris Trophy (1918*, 1921*, 1923*) *PCHA*
ASHL First All-Star Team (1914)
PCHA First All-Star Team (1920, 1921, 1923)
PCHA Second All-Star Team (1916, 1918, 1919)
Played as defenseman

PCHA Stats
Top-10 Scoring (3rd, 8th, 8th, 8th, 10th)
Top-10 Goalscoring (4th, 6th, 8th, 9th)
Top-10 Assist (3rd, 6th, 6th, 7th, 8th, 10th)
Top-10 Penalty Minutes (4th, 7th, 9th, 10th)
Played as defenseman

Top-5 Scoring among defenseman (1st, 1st, 1st, 1st, 2nd, 5th)
Top-5 Goalscoring among defenseman (1st, 1st, 1st, 1st, 1st, 5th)
Top-5 Assist among defenseman (1st, 1st, 1st, 3rd, 3rd, 3rd, 4th)
Top-5 Penalty Minutes among defenseman (1st, 2nd, 2nd, 4th, 4th)
(Statistics as a full-time defenseman: from 1918 to 1925)

- In the 1910's, Llyod Cook was 6'0 feets, 185 pounds
- He was nickanamed ''The Farmer''
- Cook is 5th All-Time (1st among defenseman) in game played in the PCHA with 223
- Cook is 8th All-Time (1st among defenseman) in goal scored in the PCHA with 106
- Cook is 8th All-Time (1st among defenseman) in points in the PCHA with 163
- Lloyd Cook is one of the most durable player of his ERA. He only missed 6 games in 10 season.
- Cook was the captain of the Vancouver Millionaire at some time in his career, although for now I couldn't confirm what was in captaincy length.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trail of The Stanley Cup, vol.1
Lloyd Cook started with Vancouver in 1915 where he was trained as a defence man by the old masters Si Griffis and Frank Patrick. He did very well indeed and when Griffis broke his leg at the close of the season, Cook took his place in the Cup finals when the Millionaires defeated Ottawa.

When the Victoria franchise was transferred to Spokane in 1917, Frank Patrick shuffled some of the players to try and strengthen the Canaries. Cook was sent to Spokane where he played rover but the team received poor support.

Lloyd Cook was an excellent stickhandler and scored more goals in the coast league than any other defence player.
Quote:
Lloyd Cook competition in the PCHA:

Jack Adams (1920-1922)
Frank Boucher (1923-1924)
Tommy Dunderdale (1915-1923)
Frank Foyston (1916-1924)
Frank Fredrickson (1921-1924)
Si Griffis (1915-1919)
Moose Johnson (1915-1922)
Mickey Mackay (1915-1919;1921-1924)
Bernie Morris (1915-1923)
Frank Nighbor (1915)
Frank Patrick (1915-1918; 1923)
Lester Patrick (1915-1922)
Cyclone Taylor (1915-1921; 1923)
Jack Walker (1916-1924)
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Tom Paton



Trophy Case:

Stanley Cup (1893)
Championship (AHAC) Winner (1888, 1889, 1890, 1891, 1892, 1893)
Hart Memorial Trophy (1889*)
Vézina Trophy (1888*, 1889*, 1890*, 1891*, 1893*)

Wins League Leader (1888, 1889, 1890, 1891)
Goal Against Average League Leader (1888, 1889, 1890, 1891)

- According to Ultimate Hockey, the best glove hand of the 1800's
- According o Ultimate Hockey, the finest goaltender of the 1800's

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultimate Hockey
Tom Paton was one of the founding members of the MAAA, an organization born when the montreal Lacrosse and Snowshoe club merged. Paton, or ''Tommy'' as fans knew him, put in 12 seasons on the Montreal Lacrosse Club and was apparently one of the ''trickiest'' player in the Dominion. He was a stellar goalkeeper, putting together solid efforts from 1887 through 1894 season. The short time he did spent playing for the MAAA was well spent indeed. He was, simply put, a gem.
In the 1889 final match, the Triple-A bashed the Montreal Victorias 6-1, thanks in large part to Paton's work between the pipes. According to records, he single-handedly kept the MAAA in the game long enough to ensure victory.
Paton was one of the finest goalies of the pre-NHL era.

Peak Years 1888-92
In a Word WINNER


Best regular season of the 1800's

The 1888 schedule culminated in an exciting one-game playoff between the MAAA and Montreal Victorias. The former took the title, winning 2-1 on the strenght of some fine goaltending by Tom Paton.


Earliest known hockey awards, given to Tom Paton in 1885


Multiples medals won by Tom Paton in the early 1880's in snowshoeing


Medals given to Tom Paton for his championship victory in 1888


First ever Stanley Cup Ring (1893) won by Tom Paton

EagleBelfour is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-30-2010, 01:09 AM
  #36
seventieslord
Moderator
 
seventieslord's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Regina, SK
Country: Canada
Posts: 28,381
vCash: 500
some more on Ernie Russell:

Ernie Russell, C/Rover



- 5'6, 160 lbs
- Member of the HHOF
- Stanley Cup (1906, 1907, 1908, 1910)
- ECAHA 1st All-Star Team (1907)
- ECAHA 2nd All-Star Team (1908)
- 4th in CAHL Scoring (1905)
- 5th, 1st, 5th in ECAHA Scoring (1906, 1907, 1908)
- 2nd, 8th, 2nd in NHA Scoring (1910, 1911, 1912)
- Stanley Cup Scoring:
- 1906: 1st on Wanderers, 5th overall
- 1907: 1st on Wanderers, 1st overall
- 1908: 1st on Wanderers, 1st overall
- 1910: 1st on Wanderers, 6th overall (Wanderers played 1 game, Ottawa played 4)
- NHA PIM Leader (1912)
- 184 Goals, 368 PIM in 101 Top-Level Games (assists not recorded most of his career)
- 31 Goals, 51 PIM in 11 Stanley Cup Games

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultimate Hockey
Ernie Russell played on all four Stanley Cup-winning Montreal Wanderer clubs and consistently figured among the leading scorers in the ECHA and later the NHA.

Although Russell could pass, stickhandle, and skate, his scoring instinct was his bread and butter. his genius around the net spurred the Redbands to cup wins in 1906, 1907, 1908, and 1910. Many have said that the only reason the Wanderers failed to win in 1909 as well was that Russell had been expelled by club brass, who'd been displeased that he played hockey for the Wanderers, but other sports for the MAAA. Upon his return in 1910, he and Newsy Lalonde engaged in a furious battle for the league scoring title, the likes of which had never been seen. Lalonde won 38-31 on the strength of a nine-goal performance in the last game of the season.

Russell operated at a frighteningly machine-like clip. For the first 50 years of the 20th century, there were only a handful of men as deadly around the enemy net as he was.

In a word: POACHER.
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Trail Of the Stanley Cup, Vol. 1
Ernie Russell was a small man who probably did not weigh over 140 pounds (SIHR has him at 160)... his size was no problem on the ice. There are many of his ardent fans who compare him with the great Russell Bowie and certainly they had several attributes in common. Ernie was a fast skater and accomplished stickhandler, equally at home playing rover or centre (I found games where he was a LW too!) He was the only player of the era who seriously threatened Bowie as a goal scorer. Russell had the advantage of playing on much stronger teams than Bowie and in consequence was on four Stanley Cup Winners.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Players: The Ultimate A-Z Guide Of Everyone Who Has Ever Played in the NHL
Playing center or rover, Russell was a permier scorer in the early years of the 20th century... he was speedy and shifty...
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Renfrew Millionaires
An accomplished skater & stickhandler
Russell was the star of game 1 of the 1906 Finals when the Wanderers surprised the cocky Ottawas with a 9-1 pasting:

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Patricks: Hockey's Royal Family
the defending champions were 2:1 betting favourites, but the Wanderers obviously weren't listening to the neighbourhood bookies. Their fans went wild as Ernie Russell got four goals, Pud Glass got three and Moose Johnson shared a pair with Patrick in the hometown 9-1 victory.
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Trail Of the Stanley Cup, Vol. 1
Ernie Russell figured prominently in the scoring.
Russell was huge against Ottawa in clinching the ECAHA Championship to retain the cup:

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Trail Of the Stanley Cup, Vol. 1
Ottawa's hopes for a championship rested on defeating the Wanderers in their return match at the capital on March 2nd... there seemed little doubt as to the outcome after play got started. The smooth skating Patrick and Johnson were all over the Senators. Russell played a magnificent game, scoring five goals...
He was the only Wanderer who could score when Tommy Phillips' Thistles came to whisk away the cup. He scored both of their goals in a 4-2 defeat and then two goals in game 2, an 8-6 defeat:

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Trail Of the Stanley Cup, Vol. 1
Patrick, Russell, and Johnson were the best for the Wanderers.
However, when it was time to take the cup back, Ernie delivered the goods and the team won this time, taking game one 7-2 on the strength of Russell's four goals, before losing game two 6-5 but still winning the series:

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Trail Of the Stanley Cup, Vol. 1
The super sniper Ernie Russell scored four.
Russell was again the star in the 1908 cup defense against the Ottawa Vics, scoring 10 of the team's 22 goals over 2 games.:

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Trail Of the Stanley Cup, Vol. 1
Art Ross and Ernie Russell starred for the Redbands.
Russell also spoiled the Renfrew Millionaires' anticipated debut in 1910:

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Patricks: Hockey's Royal Family
They were bombed 7-2 as the Wandrers' big scoring machine, Ernie Russell, ripped four shots in, three of them in the game's opening minutes.
That Scappy Little Bugger...

I think Russell was a scrappy player with a good 4th line mentality. Thanks to there being very little detail about his play to validate this, I present to you a list of drafted forwards born within 4 years of Ernie Russell (1879-1887) - Ernie put up more PIMs per game than any of them. (Note that only Lalonde, Bowie, and Tommy Smith were top-5 in goals in their league more often among this generation! - Smith's totals include three times in slightly lesser leagues: OPHL and IHL.)

Name DOB GP G PIM G/GP PIM/GP GP w/PIM* Top-5s
Name DOB GP G PIM G/GP PIM/GP GP w/PIM* Top-5s in Goals
Ernie Russell 1883 112 215 419 1.92 3.74 6
Bruce Stuart 1881 104 111 280 1.07 3.33 84 3
Harry Smith 1883 65 150 211 2.31 3.25 4
Newsy Lalonde 1887 254 329 769 1.30 3.03 11
Tommy Phillips 1883 45 71 100 1.58 2.56 39 1
Marty Walsh 1884 75 167 181 2.23 2.41 4
Pud Glass 1884 103 109 221 1.06 2.15 0
Tom Dunderdale 1887 289 226 527 0.78 1.82 5
Didier Pitre 1883 239 267 433 1.12 1.81 6
Tommy Smith 1886 175 274 288 1.57 1.65 7
Cyclone Taylor 1885 228 246 355 1.08 1.56 4
Russell Bowie 1880 82 249 43 3.04 1.39 31 10
Frank McGee 1882 41 135 56 3.29 1.37 4
Blair Russell 1881 69 109 68 1.58 1.36 50 5
Herb Jordan 1884 61 146 19 2.39 0.31 4

* Some players had seasons where PIMs were not recorded; to avoid skewing results, their PIMs are divided only by the number of games they played in seasons where PIMs were recorded. This only counts top-level hockey: NHA, PCHA, St-Cup, ECAHA, ECHA, OPHL, CAHL, FAHL, IHL.

* It may be said that Ernie Russell's "generation" is truly the players born from 1879-1884, with Russell right on the tail end of that generation, but that would be too subjective and I decided to use an objective 9-year range with his birth year right in the middle to define his generation.

Russell's Stanley Cup Scoring Dominance

According to The Trail Of the Stanley Cup, here are the playoff and cup final goals leaders through 1926:

NameGPG
Frank McGee2263
Frank Foyston4737
Alf Smith2236
Ernie Russell1131
Newsy Lalonde2927
Tom Phillips1627
Harry Westwick2426
Marty Walsh825
Ernie Johnson2123
Joe Malone1523
Pud Glass1623
Harry Smith721

But, not all cup games are created equal. Some players played in easy Stanley Cup matches, including Russell. Let's look at the leaders as apples-to-apples, three different ways. First, here are these leaders with "easy" matches removed:

NameGPG
Frank Foyston4737
Newsy Lalonde2927
Frank McGee1426
Tom Phillips1423
Ernie Russell818
Ernie Johnson1618
Alf Smith1414
Harry Smith513
Pud Glass1113
Harry Westwick1611
Joe Malone129
Marty Walsh37

Russell is one of only three on this list who averaged over 2 GPG in the "legitimate" matches, the others being Harry Smith and Marty Walsh, who combined for 8 "legitimate" matches.

Now let's look at only the Wanderer forwards during the years in which they played cup games (1906-1910) since the core of the team stayed mostly the same:


NameGPG
Ernie Russell1131
Pud Glass1623
Ernie Johnson1619
Lester Patrick811
***** *********75

But of course, some of those were the easy, lopsided games. Let's look at these Wanderers forwards based on just the "legitimate" matches:

NameGPG
Ernie Russell818
Pud Glass1113
Ernie Johnson1113
Lester Patrick67
***** *********54

So not only did Russell carry the offensive load for this dynasty, but he also relied very little on lopsided matches to boost his totals.

seventieslord is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-30-2010, 01:12 AM
  #37
seventieslord
Moderator
 
seventieslord's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Regina, SK
Country: Canada
Posts: 28,381
vCash: 500
Here's a guy who should get some support:

Eddie Oatman, F/D/Rover (mostly RW)



- 5'8", 155 lbs
- Stanley Cup (1912)
- Stanley Cup Finalist (1916, 1922, 1924)
- Top-10 in Goals in his league (OPHL, NHA, PCHA) 10 times (3rd, 4th, 5th, 5th, 6th, 6th, 7th, 7th, 8th, 10th)
- Top-10 in Assists in his league 13 times (1st, 1st, 3rd, 3rd, 3rd, 4th, 4th, 5th, 6th, 6th, 8th, 9th, 9th)
- Top-10 in Points in his league 12 times (3rd, 3rd, 4th, 4th, 6th, 6th, 7th, 7th, 7th, 7th, 8th, 10th)
- Top-10 in PIM in his league 11 times (2nd, 3rd, 3rd, 3rd, 5th, 5th, 5th, 7th, 8th, 10th, 10th)
- On pace for 3rd in Goals, 1st in Assists, 3rd in points in 1917 NHA before 228th Battallion's season was cut short (finished 8th, 3rd, 7th, included above)
- 1st or 2nd on his team in scoring in 10 of 11 seasons from 1910-1920 (5X 1st, 5X 2nd)
- PCHA 1st All-Star Team (1914, 1915, 1916)
- PCHA 1st/2nd All Star Team 7 other seasons (1913, 1918, 1919, 1920, 1921, 1922, 1923)
- OPHL 1st All-Star Team (1910)
- According to The Trail, 12th in pre-merger goals, behind Lalonde, Malone, Denneny, Pitre, Smith, Bowie, Nighbor, Cleghorn, Dunderdale, Foyston, and Roberts.
- Very consistent player. Along with Mickey MacKay, Oatman is the only player to play 5+ PCHA seasons and have 15+ points in each of them.
- 203 Goals, 106 Assists, 309 Points in 320 top-level games
- 6 goals, 2 assists, 8 Points in 21 top-level playoff games
- Career continued for 6 more seasons in American pro leagues AHA & CAHL, then played until 1939 in Saskatchewan and Duluth, retiring at age 50.
- Was captain of six pro teams

Quote:
Originally Posted by SIHR
Professional hockey may be the most physically challenging of all sports.The strenuous leg exertion - the grueling player contact - the playing arena coldness - the ice hardness, all takes their toll on the player. The professional career is fewer than a dozen years. Bobby Hull's 20-year career is exceptional. To play 32 years in the demanding sport should be impossible, yet that is the extraordinary accomplishment of Eddie Oatman.

While there is relatively little known about his personal life, the Internet did reveal information about his hockey career. Though Eddie never played in the National Hockey League, he was among the elite goal scorers of his era. During his 32 years playing professional ice hockey, Eddie was picked 10 straight seasons as an all-star with the Pacific Coast Hockey Association. He was a star with the Quebec Bulldogs when it won the 1912 Stanley Cup. Eddie played with clubs that won five league championships, and he was a successful coach and captain of five different hockey teams.

...He signed with New Westminster Royals. In the 1914-15 season, he was named to the PCHA all-star team. The Royals became the Portland Rosebuds and Eddie became the team captain. The following year, he also was its coach and was an all-star again when the club won the league championship. However, the Montreal Canadians won their first Stanley Cup title beating Portland three games to two in a best-of-five playoff. With Portland's near victory over Montreal, expectations grew for their chances in the 1916-1917 season, but these hopes ended when Eddie enlisted in the Canadian armed forces as part of the 228th Battalion.

When the 228th Battalion secured a franchise in the NHA for the 1916-17 season, Oatman joined the roster. But when the 228th was sent to Europe for military action in the First World War, Oatman was discharged "for special circumstances." The following season Eddie went back to Portland, again as its coach and captain. When the Rosebuds suspended operations, Eddie joined the Victoria Aristocrats as their captain and remained with the team for the next five years. As result of another player's injury, he saw action with the Vancouver Millionaires when they lost the Stanley Cup to the Toronto St. Pats in 1922.

Eddie was traded to the Calgary Tigers in 1923-24. He helped the team win the Western Canada Hockey League title, but were denied a Stanley Cup championship when they again lost to the Montreal Canadiens. From 1924 to 1926, he was the Tigers' coach and captain, leading them to back-to-back championships in 1924 and 1925. Unfortunately, pro hockey collapsed in the West after the 1925-26 season, but he continued to play minor-league hockey. Eddie was the team captain of the Minneapolis, Minnesota, club in the American League in 1927. Then, for the next three years, he played for the Boston Tigers in the Canadian-American League (1928-1930), and as their captain led them to the league championship in the 1929. In 1931, he played as captain for the Buffalo Majors in the American League. He later served as a player-coach in Yorkton, Prince Albert and Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, until his hockey-playing career ended when he was 50.

Eddie died 24 years later in 1973 at age 74. Although hockey was his life, Eddie was a barber by trade and found time to marry and have one son. There is a triangular stone for him at the Springford Cemetery, Oxford County, Ontario, where he is buried next to his brother Russ. He was also the subject of a Ripley's "Believe It Or Not" article for playing 32 years in professional hockey and is featured on at least two trading cards.

Following his death, Ed's family tried unsuccessfully to have him inducted into the Hockey Hall of Fame.
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Trail Of the Stanley Cup, Vol. 1
...He played a few games on defense with Ernie Johnson and then took over his regular RW spot with ******** and *******. The next year playing rover and RW with the Royals, he made the PCHA All-Star team, in spite of being out two weeks with a broken toe. The team was moved to Portland where he repeated on the All-Star team when the Rosebuds won the championship but failed to win the cup... When the 228th Battallion secured an NHA franchise, Oatman was in the lineup and although their best player, earned some unfavourable publicity when the battallion went overseas... he returned to Portland where he played Rover... had four years with Victoria playing rover and RW, and also did a spell on defense with Clem Loughlin... He outlasted his old teammates Joe Malone and **** ********. He was a first class player, numbered amongst the elite who scored over 200 goals.
Was Eddie Oatman a star?

Those who were there, frequently said he was.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toronto Star, February 16, 1910
Waterloo without Oatman is like a ship without a rudder.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anonymous poem dedicated to 1912 Quebec Bulldogs
...Eddie Oatman is a dandy, Eddie's heady and he's handy,
He is sure the real candy, as he more than once has shown...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toronto Star, October 25, 1912
Oatman is considered by many to be one of the best men in the N. H. A.
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Trail Of the Stanley Cup, Vol. 1
Eddie Oatman, star rover of the New Westminster Royals...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toronto World, March 4, 1913
The Stanley Cup championship team had been riddled by the Western raid, losing three of its finest players, Prodgers, Oatman, and ********.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Montreal Daily Mail, November 16, 1913
Eddie Oatman, the clever forward who figured so prominently on the Portland club's lineupin the World Series agains the Canadiens last season...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultimate Hockey
Two top PCHA stars Eddie Oatman and Art Duncan had signed up... it started to look as if Oatman's real role with the 228th was as a ringer for the hockey club.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toronto Star, November 6, 1916
In Eddie Oatman, late of Portland, now with the 228th, and Gordon Keats, who will again be with Torontos, the local N.H.A. clubs have two of the best centre players in the game.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toronto World, November 22, 1916
According to Frank Patrick, the National Hockey Association, in signing Eddie Oatman and Art Duncan, has secured two of best players in hockey today... "Of Oatman, I have nothing but admiration. He is a wonderful player, and the fact that during his four years service on the coast he was selected as an all-star each season shows clearly that he is one of the stars of hockey."
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toronto World, November 30, 1916
Eddie Oatman, the Tillsonburg player, who has been performing on the Pacific Coast for a number of seasons, but who is now a member of the 228th Battallion, made his initial appearance and featured the practice with his work. To say that he will be one of the sensations of the NHA is no exaggeration. He is a natural hockey player, is very speedy, and has the weight to carry through the opposing defense.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toronto Star, December 9, 1916
Eddie Oatman, Who will play on the forward line for the 228th Battalion N. H. A. team this winter. He is one of the best forwards in the game.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Globe and Mail, November 4th, 1918
Eddie Oatman, former NHA star...
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Trail Of The Stanley Cup, Vol. 1
He was a first class player
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Immortals: Commemorating the Formative Years of Canadian Professional Hockey
Lester Patrick, his coach for five years in Victoria said Oatman was one of the greatest players of his time. Frank Selke referred to Oatman as a gentleman and a fine team player.
How did Oatman play?

For the past few drafts we really haven't had much evidence in regards to Oatman's play and that was a big question mark on him as a pick. Thanks to some old newspaper research by overpass and myself of actual in-game descriptions, we finally have many clues. Oatman was a well-balanced offensive player who was probably a better playmaker than goalscorer. He was chippy and gritty, a very hard worker, responsible defensively, and he could skate and shoot.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toronto Star, January 17, 1911
Oatman did a lot of fighting, and was finally chopped down by McNamara, the Renfrew captain. Both were chased to the ice box for the balance of the match, about ten minutes of playing time remaining.
Here's Oatman taking on a guy 3 inches taller and 35 pounds heavier:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Montreal Gazette, February 27, 1911
A fist fight marked the closing minutes of the game... Ross and Oatman were the principals... There had been considerable rough play preceding the trouble, and Oatman, who is no drawing-room player himself, was a mark for some hammering. Smaill bored in on Quebec, but was checked by Oatman, who got the puck, but Smaill didn't let him pass, and gave him the knee. Following this, Oatman was thrown agains the rail by Ross. This so enraged the Quebec player that he struck the Wanderer point with his stick. Ross tried to retaliate but was prevented. Both players were then disqualified... With Oatman in the lead, the unruly pair skated to the penalty box, and as Oatman started to mount the rail, Ross, angered at the crack he received, pulled off his glove and struck Oatman a hard blow over the eye with his bared fist... Oatman was eager to continue the fray, but peacemakers kept the two belligerents separated.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daily Telegraph, January 23, 1912
Eddie Oatman the Worker - Eddie Oatman is without a doubt the hardest worker in the league, and is effective. When Ottawas came down here a few weeks ago, he had **** played to a standstill and he did the same thing with Sprague Cleghorn last week, and last night he kept Payan guessing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toronto Star, December 11, 1912
Fred Taylor, the sensation of the N. H. A. for many years, stood out head and shoulders above every other player on the ice. Other players who showed exceptional class were: Eddie Oatman, late of Quebec, *****, of Winnipeg, and Si Griffis, the former Kenora player.
Look at the review of the 1913 NHA/PCHA All-Star Game. Seems Oatman was the only noteworthy western player on a team that featured Taylor and The Patricks:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Globe and Mail, March 27, 1913
Nighbor and Ross played a brilliant game for the Easterners, while Oatman was the only Westerner who played a good game.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toronto Star, February 8, 1913
In the last period Griffis and Oatman came together and both were sent off for ten minutes for fighting.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ottawa Citizen, December 13, 1913
Westminster's showing has been the surprise to date... The defense of Oatman and Johnson is one of the best ever seen at the coast.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toronto Star, December 17, 1915
As a sequel to the fistic battle which was staged between Cully Wilson, who had the reputation of being the “bad man” of hockey in the East last season, and Eddie Oatman in Seattle Tuesday night, a warning went out from the office of President Frank Patrick yesterday that a repetition of such a scene would bring down a suspension, with the possibility of a more drastic penalty... Wilson, of the Seattle club, and Oatman, of Portland, collided shortly after the opening of the final period, both being sent off for fifteen minutes each and fined. Several stitches were necessary to repare Wilson’s anatomy and Oatman’s head.
Quote:
Originally Posted by NY Times, March 26, 1916
Lalonde of the Montreal team and Johnson and Oatman of Portland were threatened with arrest for striking eachother with sticks and fists.
Quote:
Originally Posted by NY Times, April 5, 1916
Moose Johnson, with Oatman as his chief assistant, made many daring and spectacular raids on the Canadien cage.

Half a minute later Oatman stole up while the whole Canadien team was gathered up in a convention around the cage and jabbed the puck through with the point of his stick.
Some interesting quotes from an article following a game between the 228th Battallion and a team of NHA all-stars:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toronto World, December 18, 1916
At the end of the game, when you would have expected to see the overworked regulars show signs of tiring, it looked as though they could have left Oatman, ******, and a goalie on the ice and still played rings around the all-stars... The Blueshirts were called the all-stars, probably because Lalonde, Pitre, and ***** journeyed upon from the east to don skates... Oatman and ****** were the pick of the soldiers. The way those boys went down made the fans gasp. Each scored three goals. Oatman gets back with his man faster than ******* does, and that's saying a lot... Oatman went through the whole team to score 228th's fifth... ***** went down for a shot on ********, then Oatman took it all the way back and scored.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toronto Star, January 4, 1917
Randall and Oatman tried to compete for the “Bad Man” championship held for so many years by Joe Hall. They only succeeded in getting in wrong with everybody. The public likes good, hard, square body-checking, but not slashing and chopping, and cross-checking with the stick.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toronto Star, January 8, 1917
Oatman and G. McNamara each accounted for two, while Arbour and Prodgers bulged the twine on passes from Oatman…Scoring six goals for his team, “Goldie” Prodgers was the star of the evening. He was closely followed by Eddie Oatman
Quote:
Originally Posted by Montreal Daily Mail, January 11, 1917
For the Soldiers, Eddie Oatman stood out among the remainder of the team, except ********. Oatman's stickhandling was first rate, but he received little to no support from his wings.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toronto Star, Feb 8, 1917
Noble and ******* outlasted their checks and were going great guns at the finish. For the soldiers, Oatman played a horse of a game. He did a prodigious amount of work and was always dangerous.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toronto Star, January 23, 1919
With but 51 seconds separating the two clubs from an overtime contest, Eddie Oatman, the leader of the visitors, snagged a pass from Dunderdale and banged the rubber past Goaler C. Holmes for the point that won the fastest battle of the year.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toronto Star, March 18, 1922
Eddie Oatman and Ernie Parkes did the relief work, and both were good. Oatman has speed and a shot.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toronto Star, March 24, 1922
The Cameron-Oatman argument was certainly a dandy while it lasted. Oatman smothered a Cameron rush rather rudely, and the Irish defenser objected by clouting Oatman one in the ribs. Oatman raced at him, knocked him down, and then patted him on the head with his stick, raising a hickey about the size of a powder puff. The coast boy was inclined to (parcel?) more of Cammy’s sparse hair when Noble horned in with a cross-check behind Oatman’s ear that laid him flat on the ice. Referee Smeaton, who is a husky chap, tossed Noble to one side and waved the original battlers to the bench for a 10-minute term and fined them $15 each.

Duncan and Randall were already in the skookum house for mussing each other about a bit, so that left it four a side. With the ice cleared the coast people had lots of room to manoeuvre in, and they kept Roach as busy as a one-armed paperhanger in flytime, but they did not get one by until 18 minutes had passed and sides were normal again. Oatman got that one. The Irish were thoroughly beaten at this point and just filled in the time... Adams and Skinner and Oatman were the firebrands of the forward line, and the all played swell hockey...
And a few quotes from when Oatman was a 41-year old man playing in Buffalo. He was still a prominent player, and the leader of the team.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chicago Daily Tribune, December 26, 1930
The Buffaloes made it 3-0 when St. John rammed one home after taking a pass from Oatman.

...a few seconds later, Oatman sought to use his blade on Timmins...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chicago Daily Tribune, January 12, 1931
Oatman broke away from a melee mid-rink and skated into the Green defense, where Mulligan and Headley bodychecked him. Clayton came racing back, bumping Eddie out of a falling posture to a skating position, and Eddie went through to pick it up in front of Timmins. It was a simple matter to score as timmins lurched out to smother the shot.

Two minutes later again oatman came down and went to the side, passing back to Heyd on the other side. Heyd made a short pass to St. John, and he likewise fired it in.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Montreal Gazette, November 18, 1931
Coach Eddie Oatman, a star in the old Pacific Coast League days and still able to hold his own as a defenseman
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pittsburgh Press, February 4, 1935
Eddie Oatman ought to be qualifying one of these days as a veteran hockey player. He's in his 26th season as a professional puckster. But he can still handle that disc in the St. Paul central league.
Oatman's Legacy

Oatman was already touted as the longest-playing pro player ever, but this Chicago newspaper wasn't aware he was still playing in Saskatchewan. At this point, he still had three years to go:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chicago Daily Tribune, December 19, 1936
The longest hockey career on record is attributed to Eddie Oatman, who started as an amteur in (1907) and finished with St. Paul in 1935.
Oatman's not in the Hall. Is he just a guy who played with a bunch of hall of famers?

Far from it. Oatman was considered a star in his own right, and he had remarkably little support from other HHOF forwards, so he is in fact the complete opposite of "a guy who played with a bunch of hall of famers". See the below chart indicating how often all of the HHOF PCHA forwards and rovers (and Bernie Morris, because we all know he is as good as those guys) played on the same team as eachother: (need to play 10 games to be considered a "season played")

I did not include Jack Walker. Despite being in the HHOF, he was not an offensive catalyst and he would only skew the results of the other HHOF players in this chart. Ditto Jimmy Gardner who played one PCHA season with Oatman at the end of his career, in which he had 7 points. Tommy Dunderdale's 1923 season is also excluded as he was at the end, scoring 2 goals in 27 games as a sub. All other "eligible seasons" counted saw the player score at least 9 points, 70 of the 78 with 15+ so these are all good seasons by good players we are talking about. Harry Hyland is excluded simply because he had no effect on the other players - he played one PCHA season with no HHOF help.

Name Elig. Seasons TD EO FFo MM BM CT BS FFr JA GR FB FN DP NL TP DI Total Help from HHOFers Per Season Incl. Oatman
Gord Roberts 3 0 0 1 1 1 2 2 0 1 N/A 0 0 0 0 0 0 8 2.7 2.7
Barney Stanley 4 0 0 0 4 0 4 N/A 0 0 2 0 0 0 0 0 0 10 2.5 2.5
Frank Nighbor 2 0 0 0 1 0 2 0 0 0 0 0 N/A 1 0 0 0 4 2.0 2.0
Didier Pitre 1 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 1 N/A 0 0 0 2 2.0 2.0
Cyclone Taylor 8 0 0 0 5 0 N/A 4 0 1 2 0 2 1 0 0 0 15 1.9 1.9
Mickey MacKay 9 0 0 0 N/A 0 5 4 0 2 1 2 1 0 0 0 0 15 1.7 1.7
Jack Adams 3 0 0 0 2 0 1 0 0 N/A 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 4 1.3 1.3
Bernie Morris 8 1 0 7 0 N/A 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 9 1.1 1.1
Frank Boucher 2 0 0 0 2 0 0 0 0 0 0 N/A 0 0 0 0 0 2 1.0 1.0
Neswy Lalonde 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 N/A 1 0 1 1.0 1.0
Tommy Phillips 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 N/A 0 1 1.0 1.0
Dick Irvin 1 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 N/A 1 1.0 1.0
Eddie Oatman 10 6 N/A 0 0 0 0 0 3 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 9 0.9 0.9
Frank Foyston 9 0 0 N/A 0 7 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 8 0.9 0.9
Frank Fredrickson 4 2 3 0 0 0 0 0 N/A 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 2 0.5 1.3
Tommy Dunderdale 11 N/A 6 0 0 1 0 0 2 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 4 0.4 0.9

The list is sorted by number of HHOF forward teammates per season (that column does not include seasons with Oatman as a teammate; the next column does). Dunderdale had the least help among these players, with "only" Oatman to get him the puck most years. Frank Fredrickson had the second least, with just two seasons of Dunderdale, plus Oatman. If you include Oatman as someone who "helped" Dunderdale and Fredrickson (and you should), then Oatman, with 0.9 top players up front per season, had the least offensive help throughout his PCHA career, along with Dunderdale and Foyston.

How much did Dunderdale help Oatman?

Tommy Dunderdale and Eddie Oatman played together for six seasons. Dunderdale and Oatman were born just two years apart so they were at fairly the same points developmentally in the years that they played together. Here are their combined stats from those six seasons:

NameGPGAPts
Dunderdale 1268137118
Oatman 1195956115

Dunderdale was scoring 30% more goals per game than Oatman, but Oatman was also getting 60% more assists per game than Dunderdale. Oatman actually had a slightly higher points-per-game average.

Furthermore, aside from 1912, when there were no assists recorded, the PCHA gave out assists at the rate of 0.47 per goal. This put playmakers like Oatman at a disadvantage as far as point production went - one's point production would be heavily driven by their goalscoring, not their playmaking. Oatman was a much better playmaker than goalscorer, and Dunderdale the opposite. This is what the stats of two players like this might have looked like in modern times, with closer to 1.5 assists given out per goal:

NameGPGAPts
Dunderdale 12681111192
Oatman 11959168227

Then, would you be so sure of who the better player was?

Oatman's place in PCHA History

Oatman played on some mediocre teams, but it's been shown that he was still known as a star individually and he did not leech off of his HHOF linemate. He was a tough little player with good skills and known as a leader, team player and hard worker. Offensively, how did his PCHA numbers shake out when all was said and done?

Name GP G A Pts PIM GPG APG PPG Best 5 G Best-5 A Best-5 Pts
Cyclone Taylor 130 159 104 263 65 1.22 0.80 2.02 1, 1, 1, 2, 2 1, 1, 1, 1, 1 1, 1, 1, 1, 1
Tommy Dunderdale 241 194 60 254 494 0.80 0.25 1.05 1, 1, 1, 3, 6 3, 4, 5, 6, 6 1, 1, 3, 3, 5
Smokey Harris 252 156 90 246 416 0.62 0.36 0.98 2, 3, 5, 6, 7 1, 1, 2, 2, 4 1, 2, 3, 4, 7
Mickey MacKay 192 159 82 241 193 0.83 0.43 1.26 1, 1, 2, 5, 6 1, 2, 2, 2, 4 2, 2, 2, 3, 5
Bernie Morris 167 155 76 231 137 0.93 0.46 1.38 1, 2, 2, 2, 4 1, 2, 2, 2, 3 1, 2, 2, 2, 4
Frank Foyston 202 174 53 227 133 0.86 0.26 1.12 1, 1, 2, 3, 4 5, 5, 7, 8, 11 2, 3, 3, 4, 4
Eddie Oatman 195 129 81 210 278 0.66 0.42 1.08 3, 3, 4, 5, 6 1, 3, 4, 4, 5 3, 3, 4, 4, 6
Jack Walker 186 82 58 140 31 0.44 0.31 0.75 4, 7, 9, 9, 11 3, 4, 4, 4, 6 4, 8, 9, 9, 10
Frank Fredrickson 105 93 46 139 83 0.89 0.44 1.32 1, 3, 4, 4, DNP 1, 2, 2, 3, DNP 1, 2, 2, 3, DNP

This list is sorted by career points. Note that Oatman falls just short of Frank Foyston in this category, but 50% ahead of the next-highest, Jack Walker, a hall of famer.

Playmaking was Oatman's specialty. Check out the assists per game column. Note that Oatman is well behind Cyclone Taylor, along with everyone else, but right there with Bernie Morris, the 2nd-best offensive player in PCHA history, Mickey MacKay, a bonafide superstar, and Frank Fredrickson, another HHOFer who played probably his four best seasons in the PCHA and none of his declining years. Oatman is also the only one whose stats include some games played as a defenseman, which assumedly hindered his production somewhat.

Don't forget Oatman starred for 4 seasons in the east, too

Don't make the mistake of labelling Oatman as mediocre because he's 7th all-time in PCHA points. When you factor in his seasons played in the east, his career totals don't look much different from two bonafide HHOFers and top-200 picks, Mickey MacKay and Frank Foyston.

Their career paths are pretty similar. They all started in the east, (Foyston had 3 NHA seasons, MacKay none, Oatman 2 plus one in the OPHL) then went to the PCHA for the league's duration (Oatman was with the 228th for one of those years) then went to the WCHL/WHL when the PCHA was done with. MacKay and Foyston then played in the NHL. All three of them played their last top-level pro game between the ages of 35y10mo and 37y2mo. All had a period of decline that hurt their career average as they aged. Here are their career totals, counting all top-level pro games played: (OPHL, NHA, PCHA, WCHL, WHL, NHL)

Name GP G A Pts GPG APG PPG
Oatman 344 206 102 308 0.60 0.31* 0.895*
Mackay 394 242 111 353 0.61 0.28 0.896
Foyston 361 240 81 321 0.66 0.22 0.889

* Oatman's APG average is based on 330 GP, not 344, as he played 14 games in the OPHL where assists were not recorded. His PPG average does include those games though.

Oatman's only a hair below MacKay (2%) in career goal output per-game, and about 10% above in assists per game. Foyston scored goals about 10% better than either of them, but MacKay and Oatman had 27% and 41% more assists per game than him. The points per game stat is favourable to goal scorers when talking about oldtimers; in modern times with assists more abundant, Oatman just may have led the group in points per game.

It's time Oatman got the respect he deserves. We'll take him as a 4th liner over anyone. The criticisms of the past are debunked - he was not a nondescript player, he was known as a star. Contemporaries spoke highly of him. We now know how he played. He was maybe not quite a hall of famer, but his career numbers stack up pretty well with some hall of famers. And he didn't play with hall of famers, rather, he played against them much more often.

seventieslord is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-30-2010, 01:14 AM
  #38
seventieslord
Moderator
 
seventieslord's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Regina, SK
Country: Canada
Posts: 28,381
vCash: 500
Another early scoring star:

Marty Walsh, C



A scoring star with dazzling skill but also a ton of grit, defensive ability, and infectious work ethic. A superb fourth liner that I hope you'll take the time to learn about.

- 5'7", 155 Lbs.
- Member of the HHOF
- Stanley Cup (1909, 1911)
- Stanley Cup Finalist (1906)
- Two Time Pro Scoring Champion (1909-ECHA, 1911-NHA)
- Runner-up In Scoring Race to Russell Bowie (1908-ECAHA)
- Two Time CIHU Scoring Champion against other HHOFers (1904, 1906)
- Stanley Cup Scoring Leader with 13 of his team's 20 goals (1911)
- 2nd In Stanley Cup Scoring (1910)
- 149 Goals, 19 Assists, 168 Points, 190 PIMs in 69 Top-Level Games
- 25 Goals, 18 PIMs in 8 Stanley Cup Games

Quote:
Originally Posted by loh.net
Marty Walsh was one of the few players on the roster of the great Ottawa Senators teams of 1909 to 1911 who was not born in that city. He was born in Kingston, and played his early hockey with Queen's University where the team won the Intercollegiate Union title in 1906 and mounted an unsuccessful challenge against the Ottawa Silver Seven for the Stanley Cup. He turned pro with the Canadian Soo of the IHL in 1906-07 but broke his leg during the year and appeared in only seven games of the 24-game schedule before joining the Senators the following year. In his first year with Ottawa, he led the league with 27 goals in nine games, including a seven-goal outburst against Montreal on March 7, 1908.

He added to his records the following season by scoring 42 goals in just 12 games as the Senators went on to capture the Stanley Cup as champions of the ECHA with a 10-2-0 record. Walsh scored six goals in a 12-3 opening game victory against Galt in the Cup challenge of January 5 and 7, 1910 as Ottawa went on to a two-game, total-goals victory by a margin of 15-4. The Senators made another successful Cup defense later in the same month, this time against Edmonton, but lost the sacred bowl to the Montreal Wanderers because Montreal won the 1909-10 NHA title.

The Senators were back as Cup holders the following season after having won the NHA crown and assuming the title from the Wanderers. Ottawa defended its title against a challenge from Port Arthur in March 1911 by a two-game score of 21-8. In the second game of the series, played on March 16, 1911 in Ottawa, Walsh scored an amazing ten goals in the Senators 14-4 victory.

Marty Walsh was inducted into the Hockey Hall of Fame in 1962.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Pelletier
Marty Walsh was one of the most remarkable goal scorers of his day. In a playoff game against Port Arthur in 1911, he scored 10 times, placing him at the top of the list for single game totals. A newspaper reported the next day "this is a decidedly great performance for Walsh not only tallied at will, but he did a great deal of checking as well and was on top of the rubber from beginning to end." In five seasons with Ottawa he scored an unbelievable 137 goals in 62 games!

Walsh first came to prominence while playing for Queen's University in 1906, when they challenged the Ottawa Silver Seven for the Stanley Cup. Even though Queen's was defeated, Walsh's superb play against Ottawa superstar Frank McGee did not go unnoticed. The Silver Seven immediately made Walsh an offer when McGee retired in 1906. Accepting a contract in the International Hockey League instead, Walsh headed south of the border in 1907.

...Walsh captured the scoring title during his first two seasons and was instrumental in Ottawa's Stanley Cup wins in 1909 and 1911. He was elected to the Hockey Hall of fame in 1962.
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Trail Of the Stanley Cup, Vol. 1
When the Ottawa Silver Seven turned back the challenge of Queens University in decisive fashion in 1906, Frank McGee found the opposing centre Marty Walsh a worthy opponent. Consequently after McGee's retirement the Senators tried to get the college star... Walsh was the star center for Ottawa, and lanked by *******, **** and Darragh the Senators won the Stanley Cup twice... Marty was a very nimble and tricky skater with the knack for always being in a position for a shot, as his great scoring record shows.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Almanac 1994-95
An explosive goal scorer who could singlehandedly turn a game into a rout
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fischler's Hockey Encyclopedia
A multitalented centerman who impressed even the great Frank McGee...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Honoured Members
He may not have had a long career, but it was spectacular nonetheless. Walsh was a centreman, a forward who scored almost at will.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord Stanley's Cup
A superb skater...
Walsh's debut in big-time hockey was against the powerful Silver Seven:

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Trail Of the Stanley Cup Vol. 1, 1906 Finals
One player stood out for Queens, however, and that was Marty Walsh.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Montreal Gazette, 1906-02-28 (regarding failed Cup Challenge by Queens University)
Marty Walsh at rover for the Queens seven was not surpassed in brilliancy by any member of the Ottawas. The little fellow did good work for his team, but it counted for very little, owing to the fact that [B]he received poor assistance...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ottawa Citizen, Nov 30, 1907
Marty Walsh, crack hockey player from Kingston, may play with Ottawa this season... Marty appeared in Ottawa two years ago, playing on the forward line of the Queens hockey club when it challenged for the Stanley Cup. He was easily the star of the Queens aggregation... Walsh soon proved his mettle in the International league, but had a bone in his ankle broken.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ottawa Citizen, December 7, 1907
Several Ottawa players, who figured in the international league last year, and who played against Walsh, state that, before he was injured, the little Kingston player was the "whole tip" on the Soo team. Walsh, while small of stature, is very fast, an excellent stickhandler,and has plenty of sand - something that he is apt to find handy in the Eastern Canada league.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ottawa Citizen, December 17, 1907
Walsh has the earmarks of a winner and will probably make good all right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Montreal Gazette, January 20, 1908
Marty Walsh was the bad boy of the lot; the Ottawa centre was out of the game five times tor a total of 21 minutes.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ottawa Citizen, January 27, 1908
Marty Walsh tallied four times through pretty work close in on the nets.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toronto Star, January 4, 1909
Walsh was the best man on the team, and worked ceaselessly for the good of his team.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toronto Star, January 11, 1909
Marty Walsh the Only One With Any Class - Ottawa Defence the Main Strength... The forward division played punk hockey as a whole - all but Walsh, who was right on the job all evening, scoring five goals.
A good example of Walsh's ability to seize victory from the jaws of defeat:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Montreal Gazette, January 18, 1909
just when things looked blackest, the brace that saved the day and which incidentally prevented a big slump in hockey interest in Ottawa came, two clever goals by Marty Walsh within as many minutes. From that on, Ottawas were masters of the situation...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ottawa Citizen, December 1, 1909
The proposition to play Patrick at rover, Bruce Stuart at center and switch Marty Walsh to one of the wings was also made, but the Kingston boy shook his head. Walsh is too valuable a man in mid-ice and will be kept there.
Walsh was one player that the O'Briens ultimately couldn't get to come to Renfrew, but not for a lack of trying. Ottawa had to pony up for him to stay:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ottawa Citizen, December 8, 1909
yesterday Renfrew started on a final effort to round out their team...They sent one man to Kingston to intercept Walsh... on arrival in Ottawa both Walsh and **** saw officers of the Ottawas... both have been offered positions in the city. They are to receive big increases in salary from the Ottawas, and have been assured the best of treatment.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ottawa Free Trader, January 7, 1910
Marty Walsh, who is conceded to be one of the best forwards in the Dominion, has received an offer of $2500 for ten weeks' play, a bonus of $200 if he plays the complete season and a guarantee of a position at $1200 per annum, good the year round.
A good example of a strong team letting up on a weak team that they're dominating:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ottawa Citizen, January 6, 1910
To Marty Walsh again go the scoring honours. Marty started his terrible shooting early in the fracas and continued to go right to the finish, getting seven goals in all. Marty got four goals in succession, thus establishing a record... He was a puzzle that neither Lehman nor ****** could solve. He is going faster than ever... Had they wished to rub it in, they could have probably made their total twenty. In the latter part of the second half, Walsh, Stuart, ***** and ******* actually threw away beautiful openings.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ottawa Citizen, January 10, 1010
There was seldom a time that one or more of the visiting seven was not occupying a spot on the penalty bench. Marty Walsh was the worst offender, being ruled off five times. Walsh gave an otherwise brilliant exposition of stickhandling, as, barring his strenuous tactics, he was the finest individual performer on the ice, and scored four goals.
Marty Walsh the workaholic:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ottawa Citizen, January 24, 1910
There has been in evidence an element of misfortune which again asserted itself on Saturday when Marty Walsh, champion goalgetter of the east took ill. Marty was feeling sick all week... His physician believes Marty has been over-working himself.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ottawa Citizen, January 26, 1910
Les Canadiens gave Ottawas a hard run last Saturday but the Ottawas were not by any means up to form on that occasion, and with Marty Walsh in condition and back at center, they will be a vastly improved aggregation tonight.
In some articles, the distances of the goals were recorded. Not sure if meters or feet are used, but Marty Walsh managed to score from 15 "units" away, when 8 of the game's 12 goals were within 4 units:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ottawa Citizen, February 10, 1910
Marty Walsh scored two in the first five minutes of play after neat combination attacks with Stuart and *******, settling Haileybury's fate... Walsh following this up with another goal in 15 minutes, this being the longest of the entire match.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ottawa Citizen, November 30, 1910
The Walsh-******-**** combination is as good as any that the Ottawas have had since the Silver Seven went out of business.
Marty's undrafted teammates knew who their meal ticket was:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ottawa Citizen, December 15, 1910
The most interesting announcement was that Marty Walsh had chosen to hold down his old position at center.... The question of releasing Marty was never seriously entertained... The officers seemed particularly pleased over his re-signing... Marty's return was likewise hailed with delight by ****, ******* and *****.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ottawa Citizen, December 16, 1910
Walsh and **** figured in some magnificent combination plays.... Both are showing rare form for so early in the season... Walsh is just as aggressive and scrappy as ever. He bagged a handful of goals and missed as many more, being from beginning to end right in the thick of the fray.
A great quote showing that Walsh was consistently outsmarting Lalonde defensively and breaking up rushes:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ottawa Citizen, March 10, 1911
slippery Marty also getting the fifth after 15 minutes of play... Marty Walsh sustained his long reputation at center, carrying the puck oftener (sic) than any man of the fourteen, breaking up attack after attack with surprising consistency and netting three of the Ottawa goals. By his work last night Marty wins out in the race for NHA scoring honours... Walsh was repeatedly applauded for his clever work... Every time Lalonde grabbed the puck Pete Green would shout, "Get him Marty... get his body, he won't pass it" and Green's tip proved the correct one for Lalonde invariably retained the rubber until the Ottawa forward robbed him of it when Newsy would slap his stick on the ice in disgust.
A couple quotes that show Walsh saved his very best for the biggest games - the cup matches:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toronto Star, March 14, 1911 (Ottawa-Galt Cup Game)
It was all Ottawa in the opening period. Walsh scoring the first in fourteen minutes on a shot whose rebound he received. Marty also registered the next after Ridpath had nursed it from end to end...In the third period Walsh made it 5 to 2 on Darragh's pass...Mallen was smothered by Walsh...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toronto Star, March 17, 1911 (Ottawa-Port Arthur Cup Game)
Walsh found the going so easy in mid-ice that his team-mates fed him for six goals, the Kingstonian getting four more on individual play. The champion goal-getter of the N.H.A. on one occasion went from end to end and slapped it in while lying on the ice. It was his night on, and Walsh played probably the greatest game of his career. Neither **** nor ******* extended himself.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ottawa Citizen, February 20, 1911
No one distinguished himself in the first except Walsh, who gave Joe Hall many an anxious moment... ******* flipped it out and Walsh hoisted it in, giving Ottawa a lead that was never overtaken.... the third and last period was a repetition of the many preceding "last periods" of this season's games. Have you seen the Ottawa line tearing up the ice four abreast?... Have you seen them coming back with equal speed and purloining the rubber before their opponents secured an opening?... Have you seen Walsh cutting a zigzag course from goal to goal, shooting and passing with tantalizing effectiveness?... Well that's what happened on Saturday.
Interesting how Walsh was said to not be brilliant by the Toronto newspaper, yet, he had just completed one of the most dominant scoring seasons of all-time. He sure sounded brilliant in the Ottawa papers, and if he wasn't brilliant, he must have scored all those goals with his dogged work ethic:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toronto Star, March 21, 1911
Marty Walsh, centre, is the champion scorer of the National Hockey Association. Walsh is a graduate of Queen’s University, and was as an amateur one of the greatest outside wings in the Inter-Collegiate Football Union. He is 28 years old, and has been playing with the Ottawas for four seasons. Walsh, while not brilliant, is perhaps the hardest and most effective worker on the Ottawa team. He weighs 164."
Fun With Numbers From The Hockey Compendium:

Walsh's 1909 and 1911 scoring titles were among the most dominant offensive seasons in pro hockey history. A few numerical measures from hockey's stats bible demonstrate this:

Quality of Victory, Points, 1909-2001 - PPG leader's margin of victory over 2nd place

Name League Year % Lead in PPG
Keats WCHL 1922 60%
Gretzky NHL 1984 57%
Lemieux NHL 1993 51%
Gretzky NHL 1986 51%
Gretzky NHL 1983 48%
Gretzky NHL 1982 44%
Gretzky NHL 1985 41%
Gretzky NHL 1987 36%
Dunderdale PCHA 1913 35%
Taylor PCHA 1918 34%
Morenz NHL 1928 34%
Howe NHL 1953 34%
Lalonde NHA 1910 34%
Walsh ECHA 1909 31%
Dye NHL 1923 30%
Hull NHL 1966 30%
T.Smith NHA 1915 29%
Lemieux NHL 1996 27%
Cowley NHL 1939 26%
Taylor PCHA 1913 26%

Individual Scoring Domiance, 1909-1930 - Player's GPG divided by league GPG

Name League Year ISD
Lalonde NHA 1910 0.54
Dye NHL 1925 0.53
T.Smith NHA 1915 0.52
Taylor PCHA 1918 0.52
T.Smith NHA 1913 0.51
Malone NHA 1913 0.50
Joliat NHL 1925 0.49
T.Smith NHA 1914 0.46
Walsh ECHA 1909 0.46
Keats WCHL 1922 0.45
WalshNHA19110.44

Ideal Goals - A formula that uses the same logic as most adjusted stats, (schedule length, goals per game averages, roster size) except these ones go back to 1909

Name League Season Ideal Goals
Esposito NHL 1971 78
Br.Hull NHL 1991 76
Gretzky NHL 1984 75
Lemieux NHL 1993 75
Lemieux NHL 1989 73
Cook NHL 1927 73
Lemieux NHL 1996 72
T.Smith NHA 1913 71
Lalonde NHA 1910 71
Malone NHA 1913 71
Morenz NHL 1928 70
T.Smith NHA 1915 70
Gretzky NHL 1982 69
Conacher NHL 1934 69
Bure NHL 2000 68
Conacher NHL 1932 68
Hull NHL 1992 68
Conacher NHL 1935 68
Dye NHL 1925 67
Conacher NHL 1931 67
Taylor PCHA 1918 66
Bo.Hull NHL 1967 66
Neely NHL 1994 66
Weiland NHL 1930 65
Howe NHL 1953 65
Bo.Hull NHL 1969 65
Esposito NHL 1972 65
Mogilny NHL 1993 65
Walsh NHA 1911 64
Bo.Hull NHA 1966 64
Esposito NHA 1974 64
Walsh ECHA 1909 63
Selanne NHL 1998 63
MacKay PCHA 1915 63
Kurri NHL 1985 63
Stewart NHL 1926 63
Bailey NHL 1929 63
Cook WHL 1926 63
Irvin NHL 1926 63
Cook NHL 1932 62

(note - two WHA seasons were on this list; they were removed as I don't believe it qualified as top-level hockey)

Grittiness Backed Up By PIMs

Here is a list of drafted forwards born within 4 years of Marty Walsh, and two undrafted ones (1880-1888) - Walsh appears to have been one of the scrappier star forwards of his time. (Note that only Bowie, Lalonde, Taylor and Tommy Smith were top-5 in goals in their league more often among this generation! - Smith's total of 5 includes twice in the OPHL, a slightly lesser league.


Name DOB GP G PIM G/GP PIM/GP GP w/PIM* Top-2s in Goals
Ernie Russell 1883 112 215 419 1.92 3.74 3
Bruce Stuart 1881 104 111 280 1.07 3.33 84 0
***** ***** 1883 65 150 211 2.31 3.25 2
Newsy Lalonde 1887 254 329 769 1.3 3.03 7
Marty Walsh 1884 77 174 208 2.26 2.70 3
Tommy Phillips 1883 45 71 100 1.58 2.56 39 0
Pud Glass 1884 103 109 221 1.06 2.15 0
Tom Dunderdale 1887 289 226 527 0.78 1.82 3
Didier Pitre 1883 239 267 433 1.12 1.81 3
Tommy Smith 1886 175 274 288 1.57 1.65 5
Cyclone Taylor 1885 228 246 355 1.08 1.56 5
Russell Bowie 1880 82 249 43 3.04 1.39 31 9
Frank McGee 1882 41 135 56 3.29 1.37 2
Blair Russell 1881 69 109 68 1.58 1.36 50 1
**** ****** 1884 61 146 19 2.39 0.31 2

* Some players had seasons where PIMs were not recorded; to avoid skewing results, their PIMs are divided only by the number of games they played in seasons where PIMs were recorded. This only counts top-level hockey: NHA, PCHA, St-Cup, ECAHA, ECHA, OPHL, CAHL, FAHL, IHL, CHA.

seventieslord is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-30-2010, 05:38 AM
  #39
Nighthawks
Registered User
 
Nighthawks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: CT
Country: United States
Posts: 157
vCash: 500
Two more guys worth discussing:

Gord "Doc" Roberts
Wilfred "Smokey" Harris

Nighthawks is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-30-2010, 07:31 AM
  #40
MXD
Registered User
 
MXD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Hôlle
Posts: 28,493
vCash: 500
We all agree that King Clancy and Nels Stewart doesn't belong in this round (I think...).

However -- what of Herb Gardiner?

MXD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-30-2010, 08:46 AM
  #41
MXD
Registered User
 
MXD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Hôlle
Posts: 28,493
vCash: 500
Georges Boucher

Rough and tumble D-Men for the Senators, and a very key part of their early '20ies dynasty.

NHL

Goals : 22-23 (8th), 23-24 (7th)
Assists : 17-17 (6th), 20-21 (8th), 21-22 (4th), 22-23 (7th), 23-24 (1st)
Points : 21-22 (9th), 22-23 (7th), 23-24 (2nd)
Goals - D :17-18 (4th), 18-19 (4th); 19-20 (4th), 20-21 (3rd), 21-22 (3rd), 22-23 (1st), 23-24 (1st), 24-25 (1st), 25-26 (6th), 26-27 (8th)
Assists - D : 17-18 (3T) 18-19 (5th); 19-20 (2nd), 20-21 (3rd), 21-22 (3rd), 22-23 (1st), 23-24 (1st), 24-25 (5th), 25-26 (6th), 27-28 (8t)
Points - D : 17-18 (3rd) 18-19 (4th); 19-20 (5th), 20-21 (3rd), 21-22 (3rd), 22-23 (1st), 23-24 (1st), 24-25 (3rd), 25-26 (3rd)

Also had 4 Top-5 for PIMs, including one 1st and a 2nd.

Total Hockey's Norris : 1922, 1923, 1924, 1926.

Total hockey awards :

MXD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-30-2010, 10:15 AM
  #42
JFA87-66-99
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: USA
Country: United States
Posts: 2,581
vCash: 500
Great work guys. All the early stars bio's in one thread.

JFA87-66-99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-30-2010, 11:54 AM
  #43
seventieslord
Moderator
 
seventieslord's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Regina, SK
Country: Canada
Posts: 28,381
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MXD View Post
We all agree that King Clancy and Nels Stewart doesn't belong in this round (I think...).

However -- what of Herb Gardiner?
That's a tough one. best season was in 1927, but the rest of his good seasons were just before that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MXD View Post
Rough and tumble D-Men for the Senators, and a very key part of their early '20ies dynasty.

NHL

Goals : 22-23 (8th), 23-24 (7th)
Assists : 17-17 (6th), 20-21 (8th), 21-22 (4th), 22-23 (7th), 23-24 (1st)
Points : 21-22 (9th), 22-23 (7th), 23-24 (2nd)
Goals - D :17-18 (4th), 18-19 (4th); 19-20 (4th), 20-21 (3rd), 21-22 (3rd), 22-23 (1st), 23-24 (1st), 24-25 (1st), 25-26 (6th), 26-27 (8th)
Assists - D : 17-18 (3T) 18-19 (5th); 19-20 (2nd), 20-21 (3rd), 21-22 (3rd), 22-23 (1st), 23-24 (1st), 24-25 (5th), 25-26 (6th), 27-28 (8t)
Points - D : 17-18 (3rd) 18-19 (4th); 19-20 (5th), 20-21 (3rd), 21-22 (3rd), 22-23 (1st), 23-24 (1st), 24-25 (3rd), 25-26 (3rd)

Also had 4 Top-5 for PIMs, including one 1st and a 2nd.

Total Hockey's Norris : 1922, 1923, 1924, 1926.

Total hockey awards :
Two of his retro norrises were really poorly decided. Cleghorn was a hart-runner-up two of those seasons.

seventieslord is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-30-2010, 12:25 PM
  #44
TheDevilMadeMe
Registered User
 
TheDevilMadeMe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Brooklyn
Country: United States
Posts: 45,406
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by seventieslord View Post
That's a tough one. best season was in 1927, but the rest of his good seasons were just before that.
I think the EEC should work on Herb Gardiner. Sure, his best year was in the consolidated NHL. But he's not getting into the Hall based on just that one season. Definitely more research into his Western League success is needed for a complete case to be made for him, and such research is the main reason this committee exists.

TheDevilMadeMe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-30-2010, 12:25 PM
  #45
TheDevilMadeMe
Registered User
 
TheDevilMadeMe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Brooklyn
Country: United States
Posts: 45,406
vCash: 500
Also, I think that everyone who actually did get into the HHOF in real life should be profiled here, even briefly, even if he is unlikely to get into our version.

TheDevilMadeMe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-30-2010, 12:56 PM
  #46
TheDevilMadeMe
Registered User
 
TheDevilMadeMe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Brooklyn
Country: United States
Posts: 45,406
vCash: 500
Clint Benedict

Clint Benedict by Hockey Outsider

Quote:
TDMM edit: Here are Bendict's NHA stats, via overpass:

-Benedict led the league in GAA and Wins in 1915. 1st in GP.
-Benedict led the league in GAA and was 2nd in wins (Georges Vezina) in 1916. 1st in GP
-Benedict led the league in GAA and led the league in wins in 1917. 2nd in GP.

*Numbers from Wikipedia, which give the Trail of the Stanley Cup as the original source.
I'll start by summarizing his accomplishments in chart form:

Year Games Wins Shutouts GAA Other
1918 1st 2nd 1st
1919 1st 1st 1st 1st
1920 1st 1st 1st 1st Won Stanley Cup
1921 1st 1st 1st 1st Won Stanley Cup
1922 1st 1st 1st 1st
1923 1st 1st 1st 1st Won Stanley Cup
1924 1st 1st 2nd
1925 1st
1926 1st 2nd
1927 2nd 1st
1928 1st 2nd
1929
1390

In his thirteen year career, Clint Benedict led the NHL in the following categories: games played 9 times; shutouts 7 times; GAA 6 times; and wins 6 times. This level of statistical dominance is on par with that of Hasek, Durnan and Dryden. Benedict's record would be even better if you included his NHA seasons (the only reason I haven't done that myself is I don't have access to the data).

Admittedly I don't like using wins, shutouts or GAA (all strongly influenced by a goalie's team) when more accurate data is available. However, there's evidence that Benedict was not just a product of his team.

How do we know that Benedict wasn't a product of his team? Let's consider the 1925 season. Benedict was shipped away from Ottawa (who had won three Cups in the past five years). Ottawa fell from 1st in the league and 2nd in goals against, to 4th in the league in both points and goals against (in a six-team league with two expansion teams). Benedict was sent to the Montreal Maroons, one of the two expansion teams. Benedict's Maroons actually finished 3rd in the league in goals against; not only did they beat the Bruins and the established St. Patricks (Leafs), but they actually surrendered fewer goal's than Benedict's old team, the Senators! The Sens still had a great blueline featuring Clancy, Boucher and Hitchman, not to mention defensive forward Nighbor. Unless you think that playing behind a defense corp of Dunc Munro, Gerry Munro, Geroge Carroll and Frank Cain was the key to Benedict's success, it seems clear that Benedict was the key to the Sens' success.

In short: once Benedict was taken off a dynasty team (that retained the rest of their core players), the team's goals-against and win percentage suffered dramatically. Benedict led an expansion team with a weak blueline to a better defensive record (ie fewer goals against) than his former team.

Benedict was the best playoff performer of his era. In addition to win three Stanley Cups in the NHL, his GAA dropped by 0.46 in the playoffs, falling to under two goals per game. During the span of his career, Benedict was responsible for 30% of all shutouts in the playoffs!

Although there is a tendency to say that Benedict played long ago when goaltending was much different, it's worth emphasizing that Benedict was one of the most innovative and creative goalies of his era. Benedict is generally regarded as the first goalie to routinely fall to the ice to make a save - in fact, the NHL was forced to change the rules that required goalies to always remain standing, to accommodate Benedict's new style. Benedict was also the first goalie in NHL history to wear a mask, beating Plante by 30-something years.

Unfortunately there were few awards in Benedict's era. All-star teams were not introduced until 1931, the year after his retirement. The Hart trophy wasn't introduced until 1924 (towards the end of Benedict's peak) but he still finished 3rd in 1925 (behind Burch and Morenz).

In summary, Clint Benedict was the best goalie in the NHL's first decade. His statistical dominance is on par with Hasek, he was an elite playoff performer, and, as indicated by the 1924 trade, he was the key to his team's success.


Last edited by TheDevilMadeMe: 11-30-2010 at 04:19 PM.
TheDevilMadeMe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-30-2010, 01:19 PM
  #47
MXD
Registered User
 
MXD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Hôlle
Posts: 28,493
vCash: 500
Harry Hyland

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Monsieur Harold Macarius Hyland



Nickname: Harry
Height: 5'6''
Weight: 156 lbs
Position: Right Wing
Shoots: Right
Date of Birth: January 02, 1889
Place of Birth: Montreal, Canada
Date of Death: August 08, 1969 (Age: 80)

Stanley Cup Champion (1910)
First All-Star Team (1912) *PCHA*
Inducted into the Hockey Hall of Fame (1962)

Eastern Canada Hockey League [1908-09]
Top-10 Scoring (6th)
Top-10 Goalscoring (6th)
Top-10 Penalty Minutes (10th)
*Assist were not recorded*
National Hockey Association [1909-11;1912-17]
Top-10 Scoring (3rd, 3rd, 4th, 5th)
Top-10 Goalscoring (3rd, 3rd, 4th, 5th)
Top-10 Assist (4th, 9th)
Top-10 Playoff Scoring (6th)
Top-10 Playoff Goalscoring (6th)
Top-10 Playoff Penalty Minutes (1st, 7th)
Pacific Coast Hockey Association [1911-12]
Top-10 Scoring (2nd)
Top-10 Goalscoring (2nd)
Top-10 Penalty Minutes (7th)
*Assist were not recorded*
National Hockey League [1917-18]
Top-10 Goalscoring (8th)
Top-10 Penalty Minutes (5th)

- Hyland was also a Lacrosse star, where he won a championship in 1910 and 1912
- Hyland scored a hat trick in the 1910 Stanley Cup championship game against the Ottawa Senators
- He won the league championship with the New Westminster Royals in the only year he played in the PCHA; he registered 4 goals in the championship game against the Vancouver Millionaire
- In the only All-Star he played in the PCHA, Hyland registered 6 goals
- On January 25th 1913, Hyland registered 8 goals against the Quebec Bulldogs
- In the 1917 season, he missed several games as a salary holdout
- Harry Hyland was a Montreal Wanderers for 9 years, until the team was dissolved in January 1918 when a fire destroyed the Westmount Arena
- Hyland played the opening night of the National Hockey League on December 19th 1917. He was the star of the game and registered 5 goals in a 10-9 victory over the Toronto Arenas
- Hyland announced his retirement from hockey on December 6, 1918
- After his playing career, Hyland coached multiple teams, including the McGill University hockey squad the Columbus entry in Senior Group of the Quebec Amateur Hockey Association
- Hyland his 4th All-Time in scoring in the National Hockey Association
- In his career, Hyland registered 17 three-goal games, 5 four-goal games, 4 five-goal games and 1 eight-goal games
- The book ''The trail of The Stanley Cup'' considered Harry Hyland one of the 11 best forward from 1893 to 1926, a list including Frank Nighbor, Joe Malone, Frank Foyston, Didier Pitre, Harry Broadbent, Jack Darragh and Gordon Roberts.











Sites:
http://www.legendsofhockey.net/Legen...=P196211#photo
http://www.classicauctions.net/Defau...d=52&lotid=574
http://www.classicauctions.net/Defau...d=52&lotid=283
http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=398815&cmpid=rss
http://www.sportsecyclopedia.com/nhl...wanderers.html
http://www.sihrhockey.org/member_pla...id=1578&mode=0
http://www.gvshof.ca/news.asp?ID_ArticleIndex=43

MXD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-30-2010, 01:21 PM
  #48
MXD
Registered User
 
MXD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Hôlle
Posts: 28,493
vCash: 500
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Defenseman/Winger Lloyd Cook

Before going into Lloyd Cook career details: Cook played mostly as a winger with the Vancouver Millionaire in his first two years in the PCHA (1915-16 and 1916-17). In the 1917-18 season, he played as a defenseman, replacing Frank Patrick who was at his last mile as a hockey player. From the 1918-19 season until his retirement in 1925, Cook played as a full-time defenseman.

Stanley Cup Champion (1915)
Stanley Cup Finalist (1918, 1921, 1922)
Norris Trophy (1918*, 1921*, 1923*) *PCHA*
ASHL First All-Star Team (1914)
PCHA First All-Star Team (1920, 1921, 1923)
PCHA Second All-Star Team (1916, 1918, 1919)
Played as defenseman

PCHA Stats
Top-10 Scoring (3rd, 8th, 8th, 8th, 10th)
Top-10 Goalscoring (4th, 6th, 8th, 9th)
Top-10 Assist (3rd, 6th, 6th, 7th, 8th, 10th)
Top-10 Penalty Minutes (4th, 7th, 9th, 10th)
Played as defenseman

Top-5 Scoring among defenseman (1st, 1st, 1st, 1st, 2nd, 5th)
Top-5 Goalscoring among defenseman (1st, 1st, 1st, 1st, 1st, 5th)
Top-5 Assist among defenseman (1st, 1st, 1st, 3rd, 3rd, 3rd, 4th)
Top-5 Penalty Minutes among defenseman (1st, 2nd, 2nd, 4th, 4th)
(Statistics as a full-time defenseman: from 1918 to 1925)

- In the 1910's, Llyod Cook was 6'0 feets, 185 pounds
- He was nickanamed ''The Farmer''
- Cook is 5th All-Time (1st among defenseman) in game played in the PCHA with 223
- Cook is 8th All-Time (1st among defenseman) in goal scored in the PCHA with 106
- Cook is 8th All-Time (1st among defenseman) in points in the PCHA with 163
- Lloyd Cook is one of the most durable player of his ERA. He only missed 6 games in 10 season.
- Cook was the captain of the Vancouver Millionaire at some time in his career, although for now I couldn't confirm what was in captaincy length.

MXD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-30-2010, 01:23 PM
  #49
MXD
Registered User
 
MXD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Hôlle
Posts: 28,493
vCash: 500
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Tom Paton



Trophy Case:

Stanley Cup (1893)
Championship (AHAC) Winner (1888, 1889, 1890, 1891, 1892, 1893)
Hart Memorial Trophy (1889*)
Vézina Trophy (1888*, 1889*, 1890*, 1891*, 1893*)

Wins League Leader (1888, 1889, 1890, 1891)
Goal Against Average League Leader (1888, 1889, 1890, 1891)

- According to Ultimate Hockey, the best glove hand of the 1800's
- According o Ultimate Hockey, the finest goaltender of the 1800's





Earliest known hockey awards, given to Tom Paton in 1885


Multiples medals won by Tom Paton in the early 1880's in snowshoeing


Medals given to Tom Paton for his championship victory in 1888


First ever Stanley Cup Ring (1893) won by Tom Paton[/QUOTE]

MXD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-30-2010, 03:59 PM
  #50
Leafs Forever
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,795
vCash: 500
George Boucher

I think George Boucher was a forward in 17-18 if memory serves.

Here is my big bio for him:

Quote:
A member of one of hockey's best-known families, George "Buck" Boucher was a stellar defenseman during a professional career that spanned two decades. Although he wasn't blessed with lightning speed, his proficient stickhandling and competitive zeal assured his status among the NHL's best.- Legends of Hockey
Quote:
In the nation's capital he was partnered with King Clancy to form one of the toughest, most effective duos in the league. In fact, Boucher helped nurture the young Clancy from his first days with Ottawa and contributed significantly to the Senators' four Stanley Cup triumphs in 1920, 1921, 1923, and 1927.-Legends of Hockey
Quote:
Ultimate Hockey

Although the Ottawa Senators would boast such talents as Eddie Gerard, King Clancy, Sprague Cleghorn and Lionel Hitchman, the man they called Buck was the linchpin. Although he wasn't a particularly fast skater. His puck control was other-worldly. According to reports, opposing players could hear the curious tap-tap of his stick on the ice as he navigated his way through oppsing teams. In all, he figured in four Stanley Cups in Ottawa and during his prime was considered one of the leagues elite talents. It's often said that King Clancy was the first of the modern rushers, but Buck Boucher, a stick handling wizard, started the proverbial puck rolling.
Accounts of his play:

Quote:
"George Boucher played cleverly both defensively and offensively. He was given a rough ride and near the end was put down for the count but carried on to the finish in gallant fashion." -Ottawa Citizen, nov 30, 1927
Quote:
"Boucher is playing the best hockey of his career and if there is any man on the Ottawa team at present time deserving of the most valuable player award it is the game George Bocher. "Buck" has scored many goals for Ottawa this winter, goals which have come at opportune times and only for the fact George Hainstworth was playing the game of his life last night. Boucher would have whipped in at least one goal. He absorbed plenty of punishment in Canadiens goalwards thrusts but he took it all with a grin- at the same time evening up for any sly cracks that came his way.- Ottawa Citizen, Dec 27, 1927
Quote:
Six minutes of the second period had elapsed when Boucher, who was playing a brilliant offensive game, swept from end to end and scored the opening goal. In 1.15 he again rushed, passing to Denneny inside the defense, who made it sure."- Globe and Mail, December 20, 1923
Quote:
Two minutes from the start of the final session Boucher sent the crowd wild with a goal, in which he carried the puck from end to end and eluded practically every man on the Toronto Team, flipping the disc into the empty net after tricking Lockhart...and Denneny finished the scoring when he accepted Boucher's pass to score in nine minutes more."- Globe and Mail, December 20, 1923
Protecting his teammates:
Quote:

"Hooley Smith rode high into Hitchman, it is true, but big Hitch made a bad move when he clubbed Hooley across the ribs. Then in sailed George Boucher and the fat was in the fire."- April 14, 1927
Quote:
"Hitchman dropped Boucher. A minute later they came together again and a fight started. Hitchman closer on Refeere Bell and was ready to clean up rink. Police jumped to the ice and soon tied the big Bostonian up, while Ottawa players kept Boucher stil."- April 14, 1927, The Montreal Gazette
Quote:
"As the pivot, he was feeding his wings, but both Oliver and Galbraith piled up on a solid Ottawa defense. Oliver was almost through alone, but George Boucher poked the puck from him just as the Bruin right winger broke."- The Montreal Gazette, 12 Apr, 1927
Quote:
"Ottawa were in a hole when George Boucher spilled Herberts as the latter tried to hurdle the Ottawa defense."- The Montreal Gazette, Apr 12, 1927
Quote:
"While the Senators finished up with the score 3 to 1 in their favour, the play was much closer than that and only through stellar defensive work on the part of the Boucher-Clancey-Connel tandem aided by the stury young Alex Smith and the devastaing poke-checks of Frank Nighbor and Hooley Smith were the Bruins held at bay to the finish."- April 9, 1927, Ottawa Citizen
Boucher Pking:
Quote:

"Clancy was shased for holding Joliat and again the flaming-shirted Montrealers rushed the play into Ottawa territory only to be beaten back by the defensive skill of Alex Smith, George Boucher, Frank Nighbor and Alex Connel.- Ottawa Citizen, Dec 27, 1927
Quote:
The defensive and offensive brilliancy of George Boucher, Frank Clancy, Alex Smith and Frank Nighbor and the gallant forward line movements of Punch Broadbent, Len Grosvenorand Cy Denneny..- Ottawa Citizen, Dec 27, 1927
Quote:
"Gagne and Gadreatul were in past the defence, but Boucher saved the day by taking Gaudreault out of the play at the big moment."- Ottawa citizen, Dec 27, 1927
Quote:
"Boucher whizzed Gardiner's cap off with a hard body check."- Ottawa Citizen Dec 27, 1927
Quote:
"Leduc came barging through and Boucher flatenned him."- Ottawa Citizen, Dec 27, 1927
Quote:
"Boucher blazed down the center and passed to Broadbent."- Ottawa Citizen, Dec 27, 1927
Quote:
"Grosvenor got the gate (penalty). With the odd man the Canucks drobe hard and Boucher did some great work on the defense till Leng to black.:- Ottawa Citizen, Dec 27, 1927
Quote:
"About halfway through the final period the "feuds" ended when Halderson and Boucher hooked up in a short rough and tumble, and other players on each side took part in the battle."- Ottawa Citizen, Nov 23, 1925
Quote:
Next to Nighbor and Smith, "King" Clancy, Boucher, and Kilrea were most prominent for the Senators. The defenseman contributed brilliant puck-carrying and sturdy defending, while Kilrea was a "skating fool" all night"- Ottawa Citizen, Dec 10, 1926
Quote:
'There was no sign of undue roughness, although the Americans set out to resort to heavy body-checking. At this style they gained no appearable advantage, for Boucher, Clancy, Hooley Smith, and Denneny body checked right back."- Ottawa Citizen, Feb 1, 1926
Quote:
"On different occasions, he out-guessed Simpson and Shorty Green when they were inside the Ottawa defence. Such occasions were bound to come, but on the whole, Alex was given rather wonderful protection by Boucher and Clancy."- Ottawa Citizen, Feb 1, 1926
Quote:
"Boucher foiled what looked like a certain goal when he chopped Green's stick as he was about to shoot."-Ottawa Citizen, Feb 1, 1926
Quote:
"Boucher and Clancy played their usual strong game on the defense, holding out such clever goal-getter as the Cook brothers and stopping the rushes of ponderous defencemen, Abel and Johnson, and they were also conspicuous with telling rushes on the New York net. The speed of Clancy and the stick-handling of Boucher were roundly applaued time after time."- Ottawa Citizen, Feb 16, 1927
Quote:
"March was given a big hand when he carried the puck past Frank Nighbor, the famous center ice player, the little fellow pushing the rubber between Nighbor's legs to again obtain possesion, but the defence of Boucher and Clancy was more than the Regina boy could overcome."- Ottawa Citizen, Dec 7, 1928
Quote:
"Boucher went through on a lone rush and came very close to scoring with a deceptive back-hand shot."-Ottawa Citizen, Dec 7, 1928
Quote:
"Ed Gorman teamed up well with him on the rear guard and had several jousts with his old team-mate,George Boucher, much to the delight of the gallery. Gorman and Boucher broke even in their bumping duel although Ed pulled down three penalties to Boucher's nil.- Ottawa Citizen, Dec 7, 1927
Quote:
"standing out in tonight's game for Ottawa were Hec Kilrea, George Boucher and King Clancy. Kilrea was like a streak, while the defence pair upset Boston's attack all night."- Ottawa Citizen, April 5, 1927
Quote:
Boucher, Clancy and Alex Smith carried the defense burden for the locals in an admirable manner. - Ottawa Citizien, Feb 20, 1928
Quote:
Harry Oliver and Sailor Herberts played well on the forward line, but they were unable to break through the stone-wall defense of Clancy and Boucher.- Ottawa Citizen, March 18, 1927
Quote:
"Buck Boucher, making his first local appearance in several games, put up a masterful performance on the Senatorial defense, routing Oliver or Fredrickson whenever they succeded in outwitting the first line of defense.- Ottawa Citizen, March 18, 1927
The Toronto St.Pats are proud to select an amazing all-around defensemen. He is perhaps the best defenseman offensively of the 1920's, a tremendous defenseman defensively, and fairly tough as well. He is...



GEORGE BOUCHER!

Awards and Achievements
4 x Retro Norris Trophy Winner (1922, 1923, 1924, 1926)
4 x Stanley Cup Champion (1920, 1921, 1923, 1927)
Awarded "Best Offensive Defenseman of the 1920s" by Ultimate Hockey
4th in Hart Voting (1924) (may have more- looking into it)

Scoring
Points Amongst defensemen (credit to seventies, some finishes I did) (top-5 finishes only): 5th(1919)*** 5th(1920), 3rd(1921), 3rd(1922), 1st(1923), 1st(1924), 2nd(1925)(behind Clancy), 4th(1926),

*Achieved with particularly low numbers due to low scoring year and low ice-time for Boucher.

**-May have been a forward in 1919. It is rather unclear as he was a subsitute all year and there are no references to what position he played.

-League size (in early Boucher's career) and split-league must be considered with Boucher, but his finishes are still impressive and his peak definitely gives him a case for best offensive defenseman of his day, as will be shown.

Following finishes aren't as important and are helped by his era, but I think they are still impressive- top-5 finishes in major offensive categories, league wise:

Assists- 1st(1924), 4th(1922)

Points-2nd(1924)

Playoff Points Amongst defensemen- 1st(2nd overall)(1921)

Won't give the rest because the numbers are too low and it's one series per year, however:

-He put up 6 goals and 7 points in 16 stanley cup challenge games, quite impressive for a defenseman.

-From 1919-1924 NHL Playoffs, Boucher is 1st amongst defensemen in points and tied for 5th overall in points. He is 2nd amongst defensemen in PPG in this time frame.

-From 1920-1926 (George Boucher's peak) George Boucher is 1st in points amongst defensemen in points and 6th overall in points. He has 123% (23% higher numer of points) over the 2nd place defenseman (Sprague Cleghorn), and 141% over the 3rd place defenseman (Harry Cameron).

-Expanding it, from 1920-1928 (George Boucher's time in Ottawa where we know he was a defenseman), George Boucher is 1st in points amongst defenseman and 7th overall in points (3 points behind 5th place Aurele Joliat). He has 130% of 2nd place (Sprague Cleghorn) and 165% of 3rd (T-King Clancy, Harry Cameron). He comes 3rd in defenseman PPG in this timeframe, behind Gerard, who played 90 games in the period (and perhaps some at forward), and Cameron who played 93, wheras George Boucher played 260- almost 3x as much as either.

Leafs Forever is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:55 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2016, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2016 All Rights Reserved.