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Kane over Tavares, Skinner over Nino

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Old
12-04-2010, 10:54 AM
  #1
petrocelli
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Kane over Tavares, Skinner over Nino

Sorry guys,

I'm in one of those "what if" moods and gonna tell it like I see it today....

I'll keep it short and sweet... Evander Kane is and will be a better player then Tavares. he is faster, stronger, not afraid to drop the gloves and all this is to go along with elite level skill... Plays an overall game with edge and scores (9-7-16 so far).. and opposed to Tavares falling down every shift, Kane does this...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xW9Sp-WndwA


and Jeff Skinner looks amazing.. Nino better be some player... Just look at what Skinner is doing.. here's a goal from last night...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lh8lVl8YS_0

I'd rather have Kane and Skinner over Tavares and Nino....

yeah, yeah.. I know its early, Nino is yet to play a game yet.. Tavares needs better talent around him....... I'm a jerk.... whatever..

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12-04-2010, 10:56 AM
  #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by petrocelli View Post
Sorry guys,

I'm in one of those "what if" moods and gonna tell it like I see it today....

I'll keep it short and sweet... Evander Kane is and will be a better player then Tavares. he is faster, stronger, not afraid to drop the gloves and all this is to go along with elite level skill... Plays an overall game with edge and scores (9-7-16 so far).. and opposed to Tavares falling down every shift, Kane does this...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xW9Sp-WndwA


and Jeff Skinner looks amazing.. Nino better be some player... Just look at what Skinner is doing.. here's a goal from last night...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lh8lVl8YS_0

I'd rather have Kane and Skinner over Tavares and Nino....

yeah, yeah.. I know its early, Nino is yet to play a game yet.. Tavares needs better talent around him....... I'm a jerk.... whatever..


I think you're hitting the panic button a bit too early

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Old
12-04-2010, 11:03 AM
  #3
Jester9881
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Premature over reacting for the win.

Also, forget about Skinner..... if anything, you can make a case that they should have drafted Cam Fowler. None of this matters though, because we won't be able to acurately grade those drafts for another 10 years.

Nino is still barely legal to drive a car for petes sake.

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Old
12-04-2010, 11:13 AM
  #4
Yashin for President
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The 2 players you just named are nice. Realize that they have nice players next to them to create space to score. Skinner has Staal and Kane has Toews, Sharp and a very mobile defense. I have been playing hockey my whole life. When you dont have space or PLAYERS to play with, it makes it much more difficult to score or create plays. Tavares is still putting up points with the garbage he plays with. the Nino Skinner comparison should be made 5 years from now.

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12-04-2010, 11:17 AM
  #5
Macch
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Originally Posted by Yashin for President View Post
The 2 players you just named are nice. Realize that they have nice players next to them to create space to score. Skinner has Staal and Kane has Toews, Sharp and a very mobile defense. I have been playing hockey my whole life. When you dont have space or PLAYERS to play with, it makes it much more difficult to score or create plays. Tavares is still putting up points with the garbage he plays with. the Nino Skinner comparison should be made 5 years from now.

He's talking about Evander on ATL

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Old
12-04-2010, 11:17 AM
  #6
CREW99AW
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Quote:
Originally Posted by petrocelli View Post
Sorry guys,

I'm in one of those "what if" moods and gonna tell it like I see it today....

I'll keep it short and sweet... Evander Kane is and will be a better player then Tavares. he is faster, stronger, not afraid to drop the gloves and all this is to go along with elite level skill... Plays an overall game with edge and scores (9-7-16 so far).. and opposed to Tavares falling down every shift, Kane does this...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xW9Sp-WndwA


and Jeff Skinner looks amazing.. Nino better be some player... Just look at what Skinner is doing.. here's a goal from last night...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lh8lVl8YS_0

I'd rather have Kane and Skinner over Tavares and Nino....

yeah, yeah.. I know its early, Nino is yet to play a game yet.. Tavares needs better talent around him....... I'm a jerk.... whatever..

I'm 100% serious when I ask if there is a point to this thread?

I'd rather have player X instead of player Y!!!!!!!!!

I don't know,maybe their are other posters who will fill better about whining, about who the team doesn't have.

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Old
12-04-2010, 11:22 AM
  #7
Richie Daggers Crime
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The Isles could have drafted Duchene or Hedman as well.

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12-04-2010, 11:44 AM
  #8
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tavares>kane

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Old
12-04-2010, 11:46 AM
  #9
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Yashin makes a good point. Look at the talent surrounding Kane in Atlanta and Skinner in Caolina. Tavares has two career minor leaguers on his wing. Niederreiter was playing with Doug Weight (enough said). Sometimes the numbers dont say it all. I do love Evander Kane's speed and rough edge, BUT, Tavares is being asked to carry a terrible franchise on his shoulders, and all he did was help turn a career minor leaguer into a 30 goal scorer, and lead his team in points. I don't know if Kane could have done that. Tavares faced team's top checking forwards from game one of his career, I think people neglect to realize that. Kane and Duchene were allowed to roam free because they weren't their teams best offensive players. That gave them space, room to roam, gain confidence, etc.

Skinner vs Niederreiter, too early to tell. Skinner was the highest goal scoring winger available in last years draft, and 6 teams passed on him, so there must be some be some negatives in his game. I'm not surprised he's scoring, he looks to be a fine sniper. I'm a HUGE Niederreiter fan, I like his all around game, his size, and I feel he'll be a good scorer for us. I was impressed with his short stint with the Isles.

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12-04-2010, 11:50 AM
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scott99 View Post
Yashin makes a good point. Look at the talent surrounding Kane in Atlanta and Skinner in Caolina. Tavares has two career minor leaguers on his wing. Niederreiter was playing with Doug Weight (enough said). Sometimes the numbers dont say it all. I do love Evander Kane's speed and rough edge, BUT, Tavares is being asked to carry a terrible franchise on his shoulders, and all he did was help turn a career minor leaguer into a 30 goal scorer, and lead his team in points. I don't know if Kane could have done that. Tavares faced team's top checking forwards from game one of his career, I think people neglect to realize that. Kane and Duchene were allowed to roam free because they weren't their teams best offensive players. That gave them space, room to roam, gain confidence, etc.

Skinner vs Niederreiter, too early to tell. Skinner was the highest goal scoring winger available in last years draft, and 6 teams passed on him, so there must be some be some negatives in his game. I'm not surprised he's scoring, he looks to be a fine sniper. I'm a HUGE Niederreiter fan, I like his all around game, his size, and I feel he'll be a good scorer for us. I was impressed with his short stint with the Isles.
yeah im pretty sure Tavares will perk up significantly once OK comes back....lets give him until then before we dump him, ok?

and as for NINO....still want Forbort, but the logic from garth was we needed size and strength along with scoring ability up front....and nino fit the bill....what skinner has done is great, but he's playing with good players....and lacks the size we desperately needed up front. plus nino was the youngest player in the draft so to me, he has more room to grow mentally and physically...and that makes me excited.

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Old
12-04-2010, 12:39 PM
  #11
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Nah, Kane and Skinner play on actual NHL teams.

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12-04-2010, 12:44 PM
  #12
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Originally Posted by NYI Win View Post
Nah, Kane and Skinner play on actual NHL teams.
The irony in this (okay mainly from an outsider's point of view) is that at the beginning of the season, some Isles fans were downright irate that many pre-season polls by hockey sites or hockey magazines suggested the Isles would finish below Atlanta and Carolina.

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12-04-2010, 12:48 PM
  #13
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Originally Posted by Sidney the Kidney View Post
The irony in this (okay mainly from an outsider's point of view) is that at the beginning of the season, some Isles fans were downright irate that many pre-season polls by hockey sites or hockey magazines suggested the Isles would finish below Atlanta and Carolina.
There are still many kool aid drinkers out there.

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12-04-2010, 12:49 PM
  #14
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well we have him for another 4 and a half years. deal with it.

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12-04-2010, 12:54 PM
  #15
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Wanting Skinner over Nino is somewhat understandable. Skinner is a very skilled goal scorer and point producer. However, Nino is MUCH more physical and has an enormous size advantage. He has a better chance of lasting a longer time as an NHLer than Skinner, mainly because he cannot bust. If he's not a big time goal scorer, then he can still be a physical 3rd line forward who can chip in here and there. Skinner, due to his size, was much more of a question mark (not much, but still).

Wanting Kane over Tavares is just dumb. If we drafted Kane at the 09 draft, this fan base would have self destructed. And who would be our first line center? Bailey? He's not good enough to be a first line center for years.

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12-04-2010, 01:03 PM
  #16
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well we have him for another 4 and a half years. deal with it.
5 and a half.But I agree with ya.

Deal with it.He's going nowhere anytime soon

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Old
12-04-2010, 01:19 PM
  #17
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And the stupid threads just keep popping up...

Kane wasn't even in the conversation for the top pick so just get over it. If you want to complain about Duchene, OK, sure I would prefer him to Tavares also.

Everyone will say how they just want the Isles to take the consensus pick and stop going off the board. Well this is one of the times they did that. Not to mention a ton of people on this board said they would be done with the organization if they took Duchene, and you think they should have taken Kane?

It looks like people didn't learn from last year, when JT had a slump and everyone was calling him a bust and saying they would take SCHREMP over him. He is TWENTY YEARS OLD, most players that age aren't going to be that consistent. Especially when they have PA Parenteau on their RW, and I also feel he is being played out of position.

These guys are all on ELC's, maybe we should give them some time?

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Old
12-04-2010, 01:28 PM
  #18
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Originally Posted by Doug Height View Post
And the stupid threads just keep popping up...

Kane wasn't even in the conversation for the top pick so just get over it. If you want to complain about Duchene, OK, sure I would prefer him to Tavares also.

Everyone will say how they just want the Isles to take the consensus pick and stop going off the board. Well this is one of the times they did that. Not to mention a ton of people on this board said they would be done with the organization if they took Duchene, and you think they should have taken Kane?

It looks like people didn't learn from last year, when JT had a slump and everyone was calling him a bust and saying they would take SCHREMP over him. He is TWENTY YEARS OLD, most players that age aren't going to be that consistent. Especially when they have PA Parenteau on their RW, and I also feel he is being played out of position.

These guys are all on ELC's, maybe we should give them some time?
I think the only concern I'd have about Tavares is he's not really separating himself from his crappy linemates. He's tied with Moulson at 14 points, and as crappy as Parenteau is, Tavares is only 1 point ahead of him. So while there's no doubt he doesn't have much to play with, at the same time I'd expect him to show that separation in talent on the score sheet.

For example, while I realize it's not quite a fair comparison between Tavares and the Pens' dynamic duo of Crosby and Malkin, they're a perfect example of that separation I'm referring to that occurs when you have one superior player playing with two inferior linemates. I think we can all agree that the wingers beside Crosby and Malkin aren't anything special. So you see the separation. Crosby has 44 points, his linemates have 14 and 12, respectively. Malkin has 22 points, his linemates have 11 and 8, respectively. There's clear separation between them and their inferior linemates.

Contrast, Tavares has 14 points, Moulson has 14 points, and Parenteau has 13 points. There is zero separation, and thus, it suggests that while his linemates aren't exactly studs, he's not doing much himself to prove he's better than them at the moment.

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12-04-2010, 01:50 PM
  #19
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Originally Posted by CREW99AW View Post
5 and a half.But I agree with ya.

Deal with it.He's going nowhere anytime soon
CREW, how do you figure 5 1/2? I am not sure about the CBA, but I thought he could be RFA 1 year, then RFA with arbitration rights another then UFA after that.So 2 years RFA, 1 year UFA year, and the last 1 1/2 years of his ELC = 3 1/2.
Please educate me on this.

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Old
12-04-2010, 01:57 PM
  #20
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Nino does a LOT of little things that help you win (especially come playoff time). You'll see in the coming yrs what Im talking about. Skinner is a scorer but doesnt do much else.

I like Kane but Tavares is an elite scorer that just needs a better supporting cast.

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12-04-2010, 06:59 PM
  #21
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Originally Posted by Doug Height View Post
And the stupid threads just keep popping up...

Kane wasn't even in the conversation for the top pick so just get over it. If you want to complain about Duchene, OK, sure I would prefer him to Tavares also.
If you look at my preview of the draft from way back when, on here, I clearly stated that I thought Evander Kane would be the best player from the draft when all was said and done. I also predicted Ryan Ellis would be a steal around 15-30, and he ended up going 11th overall.

However, anyone who thinks Snow should've taken Duchene or Hedman or Kane over Tavares is living strictly in Fantasy-land. Go beam Mickey Mantle at Fantasy Camp just because Mickey was crowding the plate, like Kramer did in Seinfeld.

Also, I have not watched the Isles regularly this season, but every time I do, I see Tavares put two or three golden set-up opportunities for somebody to finish right in front of the net. The problem is that PA Parenteau and whoever else has not been able to finish. Tavares is legitimately carrying two AHL players on the first line, especially now that Bailey was demoted to the AHL. Tavares officially has no NHL caliber skill players on his wings.

Whoever measures Tavares solely in goals is clueless. The guy is an AMAZING set-up man. He just needs goal scorers OR people that can create space for him to score goals. It is also very clear to me that Tavares is very good up close and does most of his damage in front of the net. I did not expect this, but its intriguing. He could be a John LeClair type.

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Old
12-04-2010, 08:50 PM
  #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sidney the Kidney View Post
I think the only concern I'd have about Tavares is he's not really separating himself from his crappy linemates. He's tied with Moulson at 14 points, and as crappy as Parenteau is, Tavares is only 1 point ahead of him. So while there's no doubt he doesn't have much to play with, at the same time I'd expect him to show that separation in talent on the score sheet.

For example, while I realize it's not quite a fair comparison between Tavares and the Pens' dynamic duo of Crosby and Malkin, they're a perfect example of that separation I'm referring to that occurs when you have one superior player playing with two inferior linemates. I think we can all agree that the wingers beside Crosby and Malkin aren't anything special. So you see the separation. Crosby has 44 points, his linemates have 14 and 12, respectively. Malkin has 22 points, his linemates have 11 and 8, respectively. There's clear separation between them and their inferior linemates.

Contrast, Tavares has 14 points, Moulson has 14 points, and Parenteau has 13 points. There is zero separation, and thus, it suggests that while his linemates aren't exactly studs, he's not doing much himself to prove he's better than them at the moment.
Don't forget, Tavares missed some games too. So his 14 points come in less games. I read something Stamkos said about Tavares, he said something along the lines of "he can score 50 goals in the NHL, no problem" I think Stamkos knows more about Tavares than we do. I think he will probably hit 40-50 goals next season. Anyone expecting him to pull a Stamkos type of jump in his second year, without Okposo and Streit to help, was just fooling themselves. Heck, Tavares is still on pace for 30 goals, that's a nice jump considering his lack of help.

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Old
12-04-2010, 09:58 PM
  #23
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The true, young talent on this team can't be judged until we add some non-AHL players to our roster.

With that, let's see where we stand in 5 years when our new owner opens his wallet.

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Old
12-04-2010, 10:01 PM
  #24
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Some of you are so frustrated by the history of this club that you don't realize how good Tavares is. He's not going to explode with the crap he's got to play with this year, but he's on another planet in terms of talent than Kane is. If you can't see that, then whatever.

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12-04-2010, 10:05 PM
  #25
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The Isles could have drafted Duchene or Hedman as well.
at that point in time..with the #1 pick....every GM would have taken JT...no question about it...sorry not a snow supporter but he made the right pick

JUST LIKE IF AND WHEN WE GET THE #1 PICK THIS YEAR ..WE MOST CERTAINELY HAVE TO TAKE LARSSON even though I want offense (RNH)


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