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International Tournaments Discuss international tournaments such as the World Juniors, Olympic hockey, and Ice Hockey World Championships, as they take place; or discuss past tournaments.

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Old
12-21-2010, 10:31 PM
  #26
Klaus
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However, I'm Canadian, and yet I do think that for THIS particular game, the reffing was really bad. Not Canadian refs being biased for the Canadian team or whatever, but just straight-up terrible refs. I mean, it's always hard for me to buy into referees calling games in favour of their country, cause seriously what do they have to gain? Why would they care whether or not their country wins some 19 year old kid's tournament? Wouldn't you rather just get your job done right... whatever though... even got a few posters here who believe in conspiracies, eh Nordic? Even when we win with non-Canadian refs or not on home ice we still can't catch a break from the whining.


Last edited by William H Bonney: 12-23-2010 at 08:15 AM. Reason: removed qp
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Old
12-22-2010, 05:45 AM
  #27
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The refs sucked in Canada - Sweden last day. You all saw it so stop pretending that they did a good job.

Ellis jumped into his own net and knocked it out when the swed basiclly had a open goal. Nothing happend.
Erixon was slashed so hard that his sticked broked and he had to leave the game. Nothing happend.

This two situation where the biggest. Then the sweds got like 5 crappenaltys that shouldnt have been anything. Like that highsticking in the 3 period.
Swedish number 10 got 2 (+10?) for shoulder to shoulder hit too.

But as someone else said, its tradition that canada gets advantage from refs in WJC.

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Old
12-22-2010, 06:15 AM
  #28
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The high-stick call from last night was legendary, watching the replay I didn't find a single player on the entire ice, on either team, that had his stick above the shoulders (even midget Ellis shoulders).

Perfect timing on the call, also.

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Old
12-22-2010, 06:33 AM
  #29
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Holy ****! Stop the damn whining people! It is what it is. Is the reffing bad? Sure, some games. But that happens in any tournament or league and instead of whining about it Sweden, and other teams, should learn to play with it. And Sweden, for one, really have to be more disciplined.

So, just cut the crap and let the teams adjust as they should. It's not the first tournament ever and it's the same deal every year.

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Old
12-22-2010, 06:45 AM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin929 View Post
The refs sucked in Canada - Sweden last day. You all saw it so stop pretending that they did a good job.

Ellis jumped into his own net and knocked it out when the swed basiclly had a open goal. Nothing happend.
Erixon was slashed so hard that his sticked broked and he had to leave the game. Nothing happend.

This two situation where the biggest. Then the sweds got like 5 crappenaltys that shouldnt have been anything. Like that highsticking in the 3 period.
Swedish number 10 got 2 (+10?) for shoulder to shoulder hit too.

But as someone else said, its tradition that canada gets advantage from refs in WJC.
Those were Canadian refs, don't think they were WJC ones.

Anyhow, the same thing happened during the recent Subway Super Series. The home country reffing was often terrible and it seemed to always benefit OHL/WHL/QMJHL. In fact, Russia likely lost game 4 because of a blatant no call.

I won't go as far as saying they're intentionally biased - just bad; however if the reffing doesn't get better and/or visiting teams don't start benefiting from poor calls...........

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Old
12-22-2010, 07:15 AM
  #31
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Come on are you really saying canada does not have skill enough to win so they need the refs.You know what is becoming a tradition is the amount of crying comming from sweden supporters.The dressing rooms are not good enough the food is sub par and the list goes on.With that said yes the refs were bad last night but don't act like thats the only way canada wins.

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Old
12-22-2010, 07:29 AM
  #32
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If this tournament was in Europe, and we played an exhibition game in sweden, the refs would be from the SEL, and they would suck just as bad.


Last edited by William H Bonney: 12-23-2010 at 08:20 AM. Reason: removed flaming
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Old
12-22-2010, 07:36 AM
  #33
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Originally Posted by Davebo View Post
If this tournament was in Europe, and we played an exhibition game in sweden, the refs would be from the SEL, and they would suck just as bad.
No. You're wrong. The Swedes have an excuse to why Canada always get favoured even by neutral refs.
Something along the lines that no one wants to **** off Hockey Canada, so Canada always gets away with murder.

I think Sweden should just pull out of this tournament because it's obvious that every time they lose it's the officials fault and when they win they have to beat Team X + the refs.


Last edited by William H Bonney: 12-23-2010 at 08:20 AM. Reason: edited qp
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Old
12-22-2010, 08:01 AM
  #34
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Originally Posted by 2525 View Post
No. You're wrong. The Swedes have an excuse to why Canada always get favoured even by neutral refs.
Something along the lines that no one wants to **** off Hockey Canada, so Canada always gets away with murder.

I think Sweden should just pull out of this tournament because it's obvious that every time they lose it's the officials fault and when they win they have to beat Team X + the refs.
This is true. But only against Canada. Any other team wins then they're simply "a better team". Ridiculous!

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Old
12-22-2010, 08:15 AM
  #35
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Sweden needs to have some discipline and then maybe they will have a chance.


Last edited by William H Bonney: 12-23-2010 at 08:18 AM. Reason: removed troll comment
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Old
12-22-2010, 08:20 AM
  #36
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Its funny how most of the Canadian people thought the ref sucked and gave Canada advantage in the forumthread about the game. But here everyone thinks there is nothing wrong with the refs.
I guess the people who has written here never saw the game.

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Old
12-22-2010, 08:33 AM
  #37
KerPatrick
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Yes the reffing was terrible, but holy crap it was only an exhibition game! You guys are complaining like it was an elimination game or something. Relax a little

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Old
12-22-2010, 08:47 AM
  #38
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Just becuse it wasnt in the tournament doesnt mean its okay. And thats the feeling i get from the canadian people here. That its okay for ref to do this. ITS NOT. Same thing happend last year in the championchip and it will most likely happen again.

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Old
12-22-2010, 08:51 AM
  #39
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Let me see:

In international hockey a lot of people say the refs suck.
In the NHL a lot of people say the refs suck.
In international basketball a lot of people say the refs suck.
In the NBA a lot of people say the refs suck.
In international soccer a lot of people say the refs suck.
In all european club competitions in soccer a lot of people say the refs suck.
In all other team sports I've ever watched a lot of people said the refs sucked.

I'm beginning to see a pattern there.

There will always be bs-calls in any game, because just like the players the refs make mistakes. Especially in a fast paced game such as hockey.
I've stopped complaining about refs in any sport a while back, because it just isn't worth it. I know it's hard when you are really passionate about your team but I rather get worked up about the players mistakes than the refs.

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Old
12-22-2010, 09:05 AM
  #40
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The reffing last night was not great, but the Swedes definitley earned a lot of their penalties. But did anyone else notice that on every call -- offside, faceoff, penalty -- there was a Swede complaining to the ref? Right from the start of the game.

Swedes would win more tournaments if they could ever shake their overwhelming sense of victimhood. They certainly have the hockey talent.

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Old
12-22-2010, 09:09 AM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nordic View Post
Of course you do, you're Canadian and obviously you don't see it.
I guess if Canada hadn't won gold since 1981 in this tournament, we would start seeing things/ making up excuses in advance as well . For the record, I really enjoy reading most of the Swedish posters insight, as they are very knowledgeable...but the same few always pop up every WJHC and just continuously moan and whine. As if it will make a difference to ***** on these hockey boards. All it ends up doing is pissing off a bunch of posters who end up slinging crap at each other for a few hours.

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Old
12-22-2010, 09:13 AM
  #42
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Originally Posted by FrankMTL View Post
I guess if Canada hadn't won gold since 1981 in this tournament, we would start seeing things/ making up excuses in advance as well.
Not to that degree some sweden fans make up excuess.

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Old
12-22-2010, 09:48 AM
  #43
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Originally Posted by time View Post
The reffing last night was not great, but the Swedes definitley earned a lot of their penalties. But did anyone else notice that on every call -- offside, faceoff, penalty -- there was a Swede complaining to the ref? Right from the start of the game.

Swedes would win more tournaments if they could ever shake their overwhelming sense of victimhood. They certainly have the hockey talent.
True.
Frustrating though when you get 2+10 for clean hits.
Also, you'll see posters here go nuts when you have Canadians diving all over the place and get the calls, while Canadian fans keep bringing up how embarrased all Swedes should be for having their players dive all the time and so on.

Nevertheless, everybody enters these tournaments and know exactly what to expect. Whining about the calls when you are playing in Canada against Canada is a great example of wasting time and energy on things that can only turn the refs against you even more.

As far as how nobody here understands why Canada gets the benefit of the doubt here, it's pretty simple. Lots of people/media watching the games. Do good, and you get another game. Do poorly, and you're done, and if Canada ever loses a hockey game anywhere, let alone in Canada, no Mapleleaf here is going to tell me that the refs aren't chastised by an entire nation. Lots of pressure on those guys. I don't for a second think the refs sit before the game and determine they are going to stick it to the other team, but they are still human, and in the heat of the battle, Canada will always get the benefit of the doubt. It's not strange. They are nervous and eager to do the best they can too. It's only human.

Canada is unique in that sense, because of its size and massive hoceky market (Tourneys in Europe are not as affected due ot the smaller markets and internal rivalries... Many times Fins will cheer for Canada when they play Sweden for example). The only country that can match it is Russia, but I still don't think most European countries gives a rat's about Russia because of history.

Having said all that, it's not the Canadian players' or the fans' fault. They just play and/or cheer like anyone else does. To deny that a team wanting to beat a Canadian team, especially in Canada, has to be not only better but quite a bit better is just as naive as subscribing to a conspiracy theory IMO.

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Old
12-22-2010, 10:04 AM
  #44
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Having said all that, it's not the Canadian players' or the fans' fault. They just play and/or cheer like anyone else does. To deny that a team wanting to beat a Canadian team, especially in Canada, has to be not only better but quite a bit better is just as naive as subscribing to a conspiracy theory IMO.
Okay, call me naive, but I have been watching international tournaments for almost forty years. Rarely, very rarely, does the reffing actually make a difference. Objectively speaking, of course -- it's hard to see things clearly when you think your team is getting screwed.

For years Canadians complained about European reffing, and even now we prep our national teams to adapt to the differences in hockey culture. But how a Czech or Swiss or Russian ref would favour Canada over another country is beyond me.

Canada dominates at this tournament because we have a very deep pool of talent. Sweden handed our ***** to us in the '02 Olympics because they were far better coached and the U.S. has become a hockey power because their development system has been very well-built over the last thirty years. The refs have had nothing to do with any of that, and they won't have anything to do with the results in this tournament.

But, obsessing over perceived slights and biases can throw you off your game, and the Swedish coach better get his players better focused. Spouting off to the press about the qualities of other teams, complaining to the officials on every call, is a recipe for failure. That Swedish team looked really good last night. They could win this thing, but they might just beat themselves before the real game starts.

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Old
12-22-2010, 10:33 AM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ribban View Post
True.
Frustrating though when you get 2+10 for clean hits.
Also, you'll see posters here go nuts when you have Canadians diving all over the place and get the calls, while Canadian fans keep bringing up how embarrased all Swedes should be for having their players dive all the time and so on.

Nevertheless, everybody enters these tournaments and know exactly what to expect. Whining about the calls when you are playing in Canada against Canada is a great example of wasting time and energy on things that can only turn the refs against you even more.

As far as how nobody here understands why Canada gets the benefit of the doubt here, it's pretty simple. Lots of people/media watching the games. Do good, and you get another game. Do poorly, and you're done, and if Canada ever loses a hockey game anywhere, let alone in Canada, no Mapleleaf here is going to tell me that the refs aren't chastised by an entire nation. Lots of pressure on those guys. I don't for a second think the refs sit before the game and determine they are going to stick it to the other team, but they are still human, and in the heat of the battle, Canada will always get the benefit of the doubt. It's not strange. They are nervous and eager to do the best they can too. It's only human.

Canada is unique in that sense, because of its size and massive hoceky market (Tourneys in Europe are not as affected due ot the smaller markets and internal rivalries... Many times Fins will cheer for Canada when they play Sweden for example). The only country that can match it is Russia, but I still don't think most European countries gives a rat's about Russia because of history.

Having said all that, it's not the Canadian players' or the fans' fault. They just play and/or cheer like anyone else does. To deny that a team wanting to beat a Canadian team, especially in Canada, has to be not only better but quite a bit better is just as naive as subscribing to a conspiracy theory IMO.
Hits from behind and hits to the head are both not considered clean under IHF rules. Keep whining though...

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Old
12-22-2010, 12:01 PM
  #46
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Okay, call me naive, but I have been watching international tournaments for almost forty years. Rarely, very rarely, does the reffing actually make a difference. Objectively speaking, of course -- it's hard to see things clearly when you think your team is getting screwed.

For years Canadians complained about European reffing, and even now we prep our national teams to adapt to the differences in hockey culture. But how a Czech or Swiss or Russian ref would favour Canada over another country is beyond me.

Canada dominates at this tournament because we have a very deep pool of talent. Sweden handed our ***** to us in the '02 Olympics because they were far better coached and the U.S. has become a hockey power because their development system has been very well-built over the last thirty years. The refs have had nothing to do with any of that, and they won't have anything to do with the results in this tournament.

But, obsessing over perceived slights and biases can throw you off your game, and the Swedish coach better get his players better focused. Spouting off to the press about the qualities of other teams, complaining to the officials on every call, is a recipe for failure. That Swedish team looked really good last night. They could win this thing, but they might just beat themselves before the real game starts.
Absolutely.

... and your last paragraph sums it up perfectly. It's preceived that it will be another edition of the Canada Cup before every NA tournament, so naturally people look for THE call, and at the first sight, it goes south. So, you're absolutely right about "obsesssing" and how players and coaches should conduct themselves. I agree. Instead of getting all sour about whatever number of PKs they got on last night, for example, they would have been better off shaking them off and focused on the next sequence. The inability to do so is what cost them dearly in Prague and Ottawa a few years ago, and I was pissed then. I was furious with them for not having learned a thing last year, and this year... guess what... I'm done. If they win, I'll be happy, of course, but I frankly just expect more of the same.

Having said all that, a few Canadians have already mentioned it in here, sure there were some bad calls last night, or like someone else said, the better teams tend to get the call, like it or not.... who the better team is at this point is pretty much subjective, and in Canada, Team Canada will always be considered the better team. On that same note, many refs from other nations also consider Canada being the better team in any given contest (doesn't matter where the ref is from or if TC really is the better team - it's about perception), even outside Canada, hence they get calls other teams don't get. This is not whining. It's not bad, good, fair, or unfair. It's just humans in action. It's sports (Just look at all the b.s. going on in the WC in soccer this year).

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Old
12-22-2010, 12:07 PM
  #47
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Hits from behind and hits to the head are both not considered clean under IHF rules. Keep whining though...
There was no hit to the head. It was a good, clean shoulder to shoulder hit.
It was an awful call where the Swede got penalized for being strong, and the Canadian kid rewarded for putting on bobble head doll performance. He should have gotten 2 minutes for diving, and that's it.

Was it the reason for Sweden's loss? Don't be ridiculous. Nobody says that. Does it bring up old memories and a feeling of "Here we go again..."? You bet.

The fact that you even wrote what you wrote tells me that you obviously learned all you think you know about hockey from Pierre and Don. *Yawn*

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Old
12-22-2010, 12:50 PM
  #48
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Since it's quite clear that Nordic (aka Bilros) will never accept the fact that Canada can actually win without the refs, I'll just play along from now on.

Yeah, we get the help from the refs. We're lucky to have them on our side, and give us PPs. I'm very happy that the refs favour us, and screw Sweden all the time.

What are you going to do about it?

(BTW, when Canada won against Sweden in 2009 Gold Medal game, Sweden had more PPs than Canada, but Nordic still complained about officiating.... so there you go)

EDIT: AND THE COMPLAINING FROM SWEDISH PLAYERS WAS EMBARASSING. From the 1st penalty, the coach and players started complaining. I didn't see one time where the player went straight to the box. Yeah, I admit the officiating was lop-sided in Canada's favour, but arguing ain't gonna help you.

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Old
12-22-2010, 12:54 PM
  #49
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Quote:
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Sweden once again royally screwed by (Canadian) refs against Canada.

Only an exhibition game, but none the less, it keeps happening.
Really? Why? Because your team was lazy and took stupid penalties because they couldn't handle the style that our team plays?

I've got nothing but respect for Swedish hockey and their players, and most of the posters here, but when you complain about something like the refereeing in that game, you know nothing. Some of it was questionable, but that can go both ways. You're looking for an excuse because you can't handle that your team lost to a Canadian team who isn't even the favorite.

Earlier in the thread someone said don't post if you don't have an argument, so here we go..

The Canadians, this year, play Canadian style hockey. We're big, we hit, we tire the opposition out. That's going to make us take some penalties, but it's also going to make the other teams take penalties. When a team like Sweden, who is smaller than in some other years, get pushed around, they're going to react with high-sticks, trips and hooks. It's natural. My favorite team, the Montreal Canadiens, do it all the time. It's frustrating, but in no way is it the referees fault.

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Old
12-22-2010, 12:56 PM
  #50
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Some Swedes crying about refereeing before the tournament has even begun? Check.

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