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Marco Sturm traded to the Kings

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Old
12-14-2010, 03:29 PM
  #151
Cook24
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Guys at LGK say he's skating with Emerson at TSC with DL watching. Said he looks good so far.

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Old
12-14-2010, 04:25 PM
  #152
PRMan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Herby View Post
Sturm at this point should be the type of pickup Modin was last season, a veteran capable of playing a sound two way game and chipping in some offense from a bottom 6 role. If Lombardi actually goes out and gets a real winger at the deadline then this is a great low risk trade.

The problem is they are going to expect him to play a top 6 role, which is ridiculous for a guy coming off major surgery who has one 50 point season in his career. This is no different than what Taylor used to do with Klatt, Rasmussen, Randy Robitaille, Heinze etc. They acquire guys like this and say "Oh we'll put them on a line with Palffy and call them a first liner"...... it's the same thing except the name Palffy has been replaced by Kopitar.

Dustin Brown, Marco Sturm, Justin Williams and Ryan Smyth is an incredibly weak group of Top 6 wingers, both in the current and for the long term.
Justin Williams is #34 in league scoring. That makes him a #2 forward.

Dustin Brown is #65 in league scoring. That makes him a #3 forward.

Jarret Stoll is #97 in league scoring. That makes him a #4 forward.

Ryan Smyth is #136 in league scoring. That makes him a #5 forward.

Note that Williams is 4th in his round, Brown is 5th and Stoll is 7th. Out of 30. Smyth is average at 16 of 30. That makes them a very good Top 6.

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Old
12-14-2010, 04:39 PM
  #153
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Originally Posted by Johnny Utah View Post
Exactly. Kings will have a dilemna when Parse returns.

Sturm-Kopitar-Brown
Smyth-Stoll-Williams
Poni-Handzus-Simmonds
Clifford-Lewis-Richardson

Kings will have Westgarth, Harrold, Drewiske and Parse. We all assume Moller and Zeiler will be sent down but we can't have 4 extra players. You can have 3 healthy scratches only.
Send Lewis down?

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Old
12-14-2010, 04:39 PM
  #154
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Our forwards are just fine. What we're missing from the equation is consistent offensive contributions from the blueline. We saw last night what happens when that gets going.

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Old
12-14-2010, 04:42 PM
  #155
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Originally Posted by PRMan View Post
Send Lewis down?
No, its got to be Moller. Lewis has been great. His defense and wheels are paying off for us. Once again, Moller just doesn't have a spot, but I think he'll be the first winger to be called back up when we have another rash of injuries.

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Old
12-14-2010, 04:43 PM
  #156
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I'd imagine Peter Harrold gets sent to Manchester and has to go through waivers or maybe Drewiske back to Manchester but Lewis doesn't deserve being sent to Manchester, unless he starts losing his groove and playing bad, I don't see how he's not a King for the rest of the year

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12-14-2010, 05:06 PM
  #157
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PRMan View Post
Justin Williams is #34 in league scoring. That makes him a #2 forward.

Dustin Brown is #65 in league scoring. That makes him a #3 forward.

Jarret Stoll is #97 in league scoring. That makes him a #4 forward.

Ryan Smyth is #136 in league scoring. That makes him a #5 forward.

Note that Williams is 4th in his round, Brown is 5th and Stoll is 7th. Out of 30. Smyth is average at 16 of 30. That makes them a very good Top 6.
First off, aren't your numbers a bit skewed with their hot starts, what have Smyth and Stoll done the last 12 games? And that is with both of them on the #1 PP unit.

Williams has been excellent this season, no doubt about that, but Carolina in 2006 might be the only cup winner in recent memory who didn't have two star forwards. Williams is not a championship caliber #2 forward.

Brown is what he is, I really like Brown have defended him for years but he is a 25 goal guy, give or take. He is very valuable at what he does, but ideally he should be the lunch pail player on a line with Kopitar and the elusive winger.

Stoll is ok as a stop gap until Schenn is ready and then either he or Handzus can slide into a 3rd line role they are better suited for. Stoll plays good two way hockey, but he is not a natural offensive player.

Smyth is absolutely horrible, if you want to argue he is a good top 6 player go right ahead. The guy is abysmal at even strength, I would go as far as calling him a liability with the turnovers and penalties. For a guy who has spent the entire season on the #1 PP his numbers aren't very good and the way he is playing he will be lucky to crack 40-45 points, sorry if that is not acceptable for a $6 million player.

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Old
12-14-2010, 05:22 PM
  #158
Sydor25
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Hammond:

The Kings’ trade with the Boston Bruins, for Marco Sturm, is now official, and Sturm is on his way to St. Louis to join his new teammates. Sturm is expected to arrive in St. Louis tonight and could be on the ice for tomorrow’s practice. That’s the plan at the moment.

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Old
12-14-2010, 05:26 PM
  #159
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sydor25 View Post
Hammond:

The Kings’ trade with the Boston Bruins, for Marco Sturm, is now official, and Sturm is on his way to St. Louis to join his new teammates. Sturm is expected to arrive in St. Louis tonight and could be on the ice for tomorrow’s practice. That’s the plan at the moment.
This is good news.

As far as Harrold goes, I really don't see the Kings sending him down. He still has a bit of value in his utility, moreso than some of the other players riding the pine right now. I could see Zeiler going back down.

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12-14-2010, 05:39 PM
  #160
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chruceg View Post

1) He asked you a simple question. "What would you do right now to fill the hole?" You dodged it by saying you would never be here in the first place. If you're going to do that you need to list viable alternatives that could fill the hole.
I would have traded for Fleischman and if that fell through I would have traded for Sturm because something had to be done, Dwight King was the first line LW. I still think my original comment was valid, how after five years was this hole so big?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chruceg View Post
2) Wingers, although nice, are not the lynch pin for any Stanley Cup winning team. Stanley Cups are won with depth down the middle and on defense. Out of the top 50 paid players in the league the only wingers who has won a Stanley Cup were Eric Staal, Patrick Kane, and Patrik Elias. Staal and Kane did it on their entry level contracts while Elias was still a RFA not making much. Spending money on wingers in a salary cap situation is folly.
Again, never did I say wingers were the lynch pin, but has a team with wingers this bad ever won a championship.

As for your salary cap comment, I agree that cap management in today's NHL is huge, but please explain to me the Ryan Smyth trade. Dean trades Cammalleri over money, then doesn't sign Gaborik over term but he goes out and picks up washed up Ryan Smyth for a $6.1 mill cap hit over three years? Do you realize how awful that contract looks right now, and we have all this season and another full season to enjoy it.

Please explain that one, and thanks for the top 50 cap hits link, nothing like getting a good afternoon laugh seeing #94 makes more than both Sedin twins and Nicklas Lidstrom, that sure seems like excellent cap management.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Chruceg View Post

3) I know you like to make the "Dean should draft more scoring wingers" argument. What really irks me about this argument is that this is EXACTLY how the Kings drafted before Dean got here. Let's take a look at the wingers that the Kings drafted from 2000-2005 in rounds one through three: Frolov (00), Karlsson (01), Bednar (01), Juntunen (01), Anshakov (02), Kanko (02), Brown (03), Tambellini (03), Pushkarev (03), Tukonen (04), and Roussin (05). Eleven players drafted over five years and only two have had any impact at the NHL level. In case you're missing my point: The fact that the Kings drafted more wingers than anything else over rounds 1-3 from 2000-2005 is WHY the Kings were terrible.
Career ending injuries to Allison and Deadmarsh had absolutely nothing to do with that, obviously.

Taylor made some awful picks, no question about it. But he also never had the luxury of drafting in the Top 5, like Lombardi has had three times.

And you also might want to realize that the Kings core consists of players Taylor drafted or was acquired inn trades with players Taylor drafted or traded for.

Dean Lombardi has had his nice picks like Doughty and Simmonds, but lets be honest there have been some bad picks to (Hickey, Teubert, Lewis) so if you want to trash DT you better bash DL too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chruceg View Post
4) Lombardi came into the Kings with virtually no back end, no depth of any kind at any position, and an old, aging team. He puts together a young competitive team, filling out the most important parts of the team first ... the team makes the playoffs last year and is poised to do so again this year despite being one of the top five youngest teams in the league ... and your gripe is that the least important part of a team would have been something you thought was important to address?
Anze Kopitar was 19
Jonathan Quick was 20
Dustin Brown was 21
Mike Cammalleri was 24
Alexander Frolov was 24
Tim Gleason was 23
Sean Avery was 26
Lubomir Visnovsky was 30

So Dean traded Gleason and Belanger for Jack Johnson, which was an excellent trade.

Traded Visnovsky for Greene and Stoll, has worked out for the Kings more than Edmonton, especially with DD and JJ here. But Visnovsky is still one of the best offensive d-man in the NHL.

Traded Cammalleri over money for what has essentially been a wasted draft pick

Let Frolov walk for nothing

Oh well, we will just have to agree to disagree. I still think after five seasons, seven first round picks, three top 5 picks the Kings should be further along and more loaded in the system.

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Old
12-14-2010, 05:51 PM
  #161
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Originally Posted by Herby View Post
how after five years was this hole so big?
Every team has a hole/holes somewhere, esp. with the cap. Yes, sometimes even within in their top line. Or if they have a solid top line, something's missing from the 2nd, or need a grinder, or need a big body, or need a scoring D, a stand-on-his-head like Quick GK or something. It's hard to fill every role properly with a cap.

Besides, the only reason so many people are so damn fixated on the left wing is because of Kovygate. It's obvious because they conveniently ignore all the other roles that were properly filled in recent years.

IN fact, when Kovygate was happening, many of them wanted to put all eggs in the one leftwing basket. It's not the end of the world that we don't have a Class A LW. We can make it up with everything else.

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Old
12-14-2010, 06:07 PM
  #162
Johnny Utah
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Kings are ok for now because Richardson is hurt.

I imagine Moller goes down, and Sturm moves to the 1st line and Williams move back to the 2nd.

Lewis will be with Clifford and Zeiler/Westgarth...the dilemna is when Richardson comes back (Zeiler will have to go back down) and when Parse comes back....Who will go Harrold, Drewiske, Parse or Westgarth?

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Old
12-14-2010, 06:21 PM
  #163
BigBrown
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Healthy lineup:

Sturm-Kopitar-Brown
Smyth-Stoll-Williams
Poni-Handzus-Simmonds
Clifford-Richardson-Lewis

Maybe? Am I forgetting someone? Looks pretty damn solid assuming Sturm can hold his own.

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Old
12-14-2010, 06:30 PM
  #164
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Originally Posted by PRMan View Post
Justin Williams is #34 in league scoring. That makes him a #2 forward.

Dustin Brown is #65 in league scoring. That makes him a #3 forward.

Jarret Stoll is #97 in league scoring. That makes him a #4 forward.

Ryan Smyth is #136 in league scoring. That makes him a #5 forward.

Note that Williams is 4th in his round, Brown is 5th and Stoll is 7th. Out of 30. Smyth is average at 16 of 30. That makes them a very good Top 6.
True and if you filter out D-men it bumps Brown up to 56th in all forwards, so that puts him into #2 range. Brown scores, he hits, he even plays defense every few games and he is considered a leader by people who deal with him on a daily/weekly basis.

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Old
12-14-2010, 06:36 PM
  #165
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PRMan View Post
Justin Williams is #34 in league scoring. That makes him a #2 forward.

Dustin Brown is #65 in league scoring. That makes him a #3 forward.

Jarret Stoll is #97 in league scoring. That makes him a #4 forward.

Ryan Smyth is #136 in league scoring. That makes him a #5 forward.
It's doesn't work that way. Each team doesn't have 1 forward per line. You should count 1-90 as the first line


Last edited by Flour Child: 12-14-2010 at 06:45 PM.
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Old
12-14-2010, 06:38 PM
  #166
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Seriously guys? Parse is what 2 months away from a return. A lot can happen by the time he returns.

Moller will most likely be the first sent down as soon as Sturm is ready because there won't be any top 6 role available.

Zeiler gets sent down as soon as Richie is ready.

Here is the line-up I'm HOPING for once Sturm and Richie are ready:

Sturm-Kopitar-Williams
Smyth-Stoll-Brown
Poni-Handzus-Simmonds
Clifford-Richardson-Lewis
Westgarth
Harrold

Doughty-Scuderi
Johnson-Mitchell
Martinez-Greene
Drewiske (But would still consider Harrold the #7)

Quick
Bernier

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Old
12-14-2010, 06:40 PM
  #167
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Alright! cant wait!

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12-14-2010, 06:51 PM
  #168
DocWest
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I can't wait to see Sturm on the ice. He seems like a great guy and will hopefully be a solid fit for the team. Welcome to LA, Marco!

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Old
12-14-2010, 07:05 PM
  #169
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Herby View Post
First off, aren't your numbers a bit skewed with their hot starts, what have Smyth and Stoll done the last 12 games? And that is with both of them on the #1 PP unit.

Williams has been excellent this season, no doubt about that, but Carolina in 2006 might be the only cup winner in recent memory who didn't have two star forwards. Williams is not a championship caliber #2 forward.

Brown is what he is, I really like Brown have defended him for years but he is a 25 goal guy, give or take. He is very valuable at what he does, but ideally he should be the lunch pail player on a line with Kopitar and the elusive winger.

Stoll is ok as a stop gap until Schenn is ready and then either he or Handzus can slide into a 3rd line role they are better suited for. Stoll plays good two way hockey, but he is not a natural offensive player.

Smyth is absolutely horrible, if you want to argue he is a good top 6 player go right ahead. The guy is abysmal at even strength, I would go as far as calling him a liability with the turnovers and penalties. For a guy who has spent the entire season on the #1 PP his numbers aren't very good and the way he is playing he will be lucky to crack 40-45 points, sorry if that is not acceptable for a $6 million player.
Williams stepped up to the #1 line and the 2nd line hasnt been the same since. Smyth's numbers aren't far off that little guy in Montreal making 6 mill...

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Old
12-14-2010, 07:47 PM
  #170
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DocWest View Post
I can't wait to see Sturm on the ice. He seems like a great guy and will hopefully be a solid fit for the team. Welcome to LA, Marco!
He is a great guy. He may need a few games to get the rust off as he hasn't played for awhile. I was kind of hoping he would be playing in Boston for the Bruins but the cap space problem got the better of us.

I will be checking in on him to see how he does. Sometimes when players leave or are traded I don't really follow their career. There are a few who I like enough to try and watch when I can...Like Marco.

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