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Jarome Iginla- Top 10 goal scorer all time?

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Old
12-19-2010, 11:25 PM
  #1
Walkingthroughforest
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Jarome Iginla- Top 10 goal scorer all time?

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So what would happen if we switched those guys around, what if Jarome had played when and where Dino had ? If Iggy had played 1049 games with teams that scored 3.977 goals per game and he had continued to score 15.8% of the teams goals ? Jarome would be looking at today a career goal total of 659, and perhaps another 140 goals in the next 2.67 years. Cicarelli on the other hand, if he scored 12.4% of his team’s goals on a team that averaged 2.727 for 1232 games would have ended his career at 416
Article here
Interesting article pro-rating Iginla onto different dynasty teams of the last 50 years. Agree? Disagree?

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12-19-2010, 11:32 PM
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At the end of the day where do I rank Jarome Iginla as a goal scorer ? Certainly in the top 10 of all time. His goals per game is nearly equivalent to Gordie Howe’s, despite playing in a leaner era and without the benefit of Hall of Fame team mates. I could argue everyone in the top 20 had a situational advantage on Jarome. Either a higher scoring era, or much better teams or, often both. I would have him ahead of Shanahan who is 11th, but would rank him behind Bossy and maybe Bure. I would put Jarome ahead of Robatille, Messier and Esposito who all had great totals and long careers but also the benefit of playing with slouches like Gretzky, Orr and the like. I’m torn on Richard, he obviously had a great team around him, but he was far ahead of his peers. So final ranking 1. Brett Hull 2 Mario Lemiuex 3 Mike Bossy 4 Wayne Gretzky 5 Gordie Howe 6 Pavel Bure 7 Jarome 8 Rocket
He obviously has no idea how to rank players who played pre-expansion. No Bobby Hull or Charlie Conacher on the list at all? Iginla ahead of Rocket Richard?

Comparing Gordie Howe's goals per game with Iginlas, like that is meaningful at all?

Then the "oh Iginla is better than Esposito, who led the league in goals 6 seasons in a row and set all kinds of records on the way, because Esposito played with Orr" is pretty strange.

Overall, the article heavily relies on the "goals per game" stat, which is problematic because it doesn't offer a fair comparison across eras and because it punishes players who played full careers.

When people come out with "all time" lists like this, the first thing I think is "is the list really an all'time" list, and then I see that only Gordie Howe and Maurice Richard are included as token representatives from before 1980. And it fails the "all time" criteria.


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12-19-2010, 11:41 PM
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Kind of hard to just translate numbers though because a big part of why Iginla was so great was more than just his natural talent it was that he was such a fitness freak. I think you transport him back in time he doesn't have that same understanding of how to take care of his body and train than it's kind of difficult to say. To be honest I've never really thought of where he ranks but just for fun.

Ovechkin
Bure
Hull
Hull
Gretzky
Lemieux
Selanne
Sakic
Jagr
Bossy
Richard

Do you put him over? He's pretty close imo though.

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12-19-2010, 11:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Tavaresmagicalplay View Post
Kind of hard to just translate numbers though because a big part of why Iginla was so great was more than just his natural talent it was that he was such a fitness freak. I think you transport him back in time he doesn't have that same understanding of how to take care of his body and train than it's kind of difficult to say. To be honest I've never really thought of where he ranks but just for fun.

Ovechkin
Bure
Hull
Hull
Gretzky
Lemieux
Selanne
Sakic
Jagr
Bossy
Richard

Do you put him over? He's pretty close imo though.
I'd say Iginla's close to Selanne and Bobby Hull territory.
The year he put up 52 goals in 01-02 was as comparable to putting up 60+ goals today.
Granted, I'm no homer regardless of the affiliation.

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12-19-2010, 11:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Cole435 View Post
I'd say Iginla's close to Selanne and Bobby Hull territory.
The year he put up 52 goals in 01-02 was as comparable to putting up 60+ goals today.
Granted, I'm no homer regardless of the affiliation.
Bobby Hull led the NHL in goals 7 times (1st all-time). He broke 50 goals 3 times before expansion, and nobody else in the league had more than 35 goals in any of those seasons (he broke it one more time post-expansion). This is what I mean when I say you can't compare the raw numbers of guys who played pre-expansion with post-expansion. If you give pre-expansion hockey a fair shake, neither Iginla nor Selanne could hold Bobby Hull's proverbial jock.

As for Iginla's 01-02, it was certainly impressive. But you have to remember that Calgary was basically out of a playoff spot with a month left in the season, so they spent the last month just feeding Iginla to help pad his stats, since they had nothing else to play for. That's where the author's premise that Iginla was hurt by being the only offensive talent on his team goes astray (though I think there is some merit to that in other seasons).

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12-20-2010, 12:00 AM
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Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
Bobby Hull led the NHL in goals 7 times (1st all-time). He broke 50 goals 3 times before expansion, and nobody else in the league had more than 35 goals in any of those seasons (he broke it one more time post-expansion). This is what I mean when I say you can't compare the raw numbers of guys who played pre-expansion with post-expansion. If you give pre-expansion hockey a fair shake, neither Iginla nor Selanne could hold Bobby Hull's proverbial jock.

As for Iginla's 01-02, it was certainly impressive. But you have to remember that Calgary was basically was out of a playoff spot with a month left in the season, so they spent the last month just feeding Iginla to help pad his stats, since they had nothing else to play for. That's where the author's premise that Iginla was hurt by being the only offensive talent on his team goes astray (though I think there is some merit to that in other seasons).
I'm not going to knock Bobby here, but how many HOF players has Iginla played with in his career?
The only two potentials I can think of both stopped pucks.
If Jarome had anything resembling an 80-90 point centre, let alone Stan Mikita, he would have led the league in goals more than twice. From all my research on Bobby, Jarome is a pretty good comparable.

And that 01-02 season actually had Jarome slowing down his pace, as for the first half of the season he was on pace to break Lanny's record of 66, and that was when the Flames were well in the playoff race.

For being a Flames fan for a painstakingly long time, I can tell you that Iginla has been starved for offensive support outside of the two years from 2007-2009.
He deserves a lot more recognition then what he gets.

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12-20-2010, 12:09 AM
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Originally Posted by Cole435 View Post
I'm not going to knock Bobby here, but how many HOF players has Iginla played with in his career?
The only two potentials I can think of both stopped pucks.
If Jarome had anything resembling an 80-90 point centre, let alone Stan Mikita, he would have led the league in goals more than twice. From all my research on Bobby, Jarome is a pretty good comparable.

And that 01-02 season actually had Jarome slowing down his pace, as for the first half of the season he was on pace to break Lanny's record of 66, and that was when the Flames were well in the playoff race.

For being a Flames fan for a painstakingly long time, I can tell you that Iginla has been starved for offensive support outside of the two years from 2007-2009.
He deserves a lot more recognition then what he gets.
Mikita and Hull played on separate lines, only getting time together on PPs. They helped each other, but not nearly as much as you implied. Bobby Hull can be argued as the best goal scorer in the history of the NHL. You'll have a hard time backing Iginla in that debate... is he even a better goal scorer than Mikita?

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12-20-2010, 12:18 AM
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Not even close. Yes, Iginla is awesome but he has only scored 50 goals twice. A lot of 30 goal seasons and some 40 goal seasons.

Gretzky
Lemieux
Brett
Bobby
Bossy
Richard
Howe
Ovechkin
Bure
Esposito

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12-20-2010, 12:35 AM
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Originally Posted by RabbinsDuck View Post
Mikita and Hull played on separate lines, only getting time together on PPs. They helped each other, but nearly as much as you implied. Bobby Hull can be argued as the best goal scorer in the history of the NHL. You'll have a hard time backing Iginla in that debate.
I don't think anyone would say Hull was the best goal scorer in the history of hockey, Gretzky, Lemieux, and own son are three you can't debate with, through raw numbers and analysis on this board.
I've never seen Hull play, so I can't critically asse.s him, but Iginla is criminally underrated by the hockey community in general. He has had virtually no one to play with for almost his entire career, and is on pace to have 10 30+goal seasons.
If he had anything resembling a #1 centre for the duration of his career, he would probably have at least two Hart trophies (02,08), two Art Ross's(02,08), three maybe four Richard's (02,04,08(07 if he stayed healthy)) and two Pearson's (02,08).

That might sound like me being a homer, but he was that damn good and no one recognizes it. The second and third highest point total by a Flames outside of Jarome's 96,94,98,89 was 82 and 81 and by Mike Cammalleri (08-09) Alex Taungay (06-07). Both coincidently set their career highs in points beside Iginla, and Tanguay's year was one that saw Iginla miss 12 games while still scoring 94 points.

There have been no other players Iginla has played with that have scored more then 80 points. Though he did turn career 50 point players Kristian Huselius, Daymond Langkow and Craig Conroy into 70 point players.

This isn't some scrub.
If he was on a team during the 2000's like Colorado, Detroit, Dallas, Ottawa or San Jose, playing with the top players they had, he'd already be a first ballot HOF right now with or without a cup

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12-20-2010, 12:37 AM
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Originally Posted by RabbinsDuck View Post
Mikita and Hull played on separate lines, only getting time together on PPs. They helped each other, but not nearly as much as you implied. Bobby Hull can be argued as the best goal scorer in the history of the NHL. You'll have a hard time backing Iginla in that debate... is he even a better goal scorer than Mikita?
At first I thought "of course Iginla was a better goal scorer than Mikita," but then I looked at the numbers.

Mikita finished 2nd, 2nd, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th in goals.
Iginla finished 1st, 1st, and 3rd in goals. Those are his only 3 top 10 finishes. Very inconsistent player.

Without an in-depth analysis, I think their competition for these spots was close. The league talent as a whole was deeper when Iginla played, but top end forward talent was at quite a lull in the early 2000s.

By this measure, Iginla has the best 2 seasons, but Mikita was the more consistent goal scorer.

Neither man played with an elite playmaker, so I'm not sure the teammate argument holds much merit. Of course, Mikita's team was deeper - it was just a 6 team league! But every other player in the league played in that same 6 team league, and have the same advantages and disadvantages as Mikita in the rankings.

Neither is close to Bobby Hull, obviously.

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12-20-2010, 12:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Cole435 View Post
I'd say Iginla's close to Selanne and Bobby Hull territory.
The year he put up 52 goals in 01-02 was as comparable to putting up 60+ goals today.
Granted, I'm no homer regardless of the affiliation.
Bobby Hull? Nowhere near. Led the NHL in goals numerous time, at least 5... and if he hadn't gone to the WHA he realistically could have been the top goal scorer of all time. Iginla doesn't compare IMO.

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12-20-2010, 12:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Cole435 View Post
I don't think anyone would say Hull was the best goal scorer in the history of hockey,

Gretzky, Lemieux, and own son are three you can't debate with, through raw numbers and analysis on this board.
Statistically and judged against his peers, Bobby Hull probably is the best goal scorer of all-time. Definitely better than his son.

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I've never seen Hull play, so I can't critically asse.s him, but Iginla is criminally underrated by the hockey community in general. He has had virtually no one to play with for almost his entire career, and is on pace to have 10 30+goal seasons.
If he had anything resembling a #1 centre for the duration of his career, he would probably have at least two Hart trophies (02,08), two Art Ross's(02,08), three maybe four Richard's (02,04,08(07 if he stayed healthy)) and two Pearson's (02,08).
First off, I agree that Iginla is pretty underrated in many circles and I personally consider him a lock for the HHOF. Or at least he should be.

But he really wasn't that close to an Art Ross or Richard in 2008.

Ovechin had 112 points to 98 for Iginla. 65 goals (the most goals in over a decade) to 50 for Iginla.

Iginla's center Langhow had 65 ponts and Ovechkin's center Backstrom had 69 points. Hardly a huge difference in help. Iginla also got to play with a fantastic playmaking LWs, Tanguay and Huselius, both better and higher scoring that any wing Ovechkin played with that season.

Considering Ovechkin dragged the Capitals on his back in the second half of the season into the playoffs for the first time since the lockout, I don't see Iginla having any case for the Hart whatsoever that year.

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That might sound like me being a homer, but he was that damn good and no one recognizes it. The second and third highest point total by a Flames outside of Jarome's 96,94,98,89 was 82 and 81 and by Mike Cammalleri (08-09) Alex Taungay (06-07). Both coincidently set their career highs in points beside Iginla, and Tanguay's year was one that saw Iginla miss 12 games while still scoring 94 points.

There has been no other player that Iginla has played with that has scored more then 80 points. Though he did turn career 50 point players Kristian Huselius, Daymond Langkow and Craig Conroy into 70 point players.
He was very good and he did have little offensive scoring help, but Iginla is far from the only player to put up lots of points with little help.

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This isn't some scrub I'm comparing to Bobby Hull.
If he was on a team during the 2000's like Colorado, Detroit, Dallas, Ottawa or San Jose, he'd already be a first ballot HOF right now with or without a cup
Bobby Hull is one of the top 10 players of all time. This isn't your run of the mill star player you are comparing to Iginla.

I think a lot of people here think Iginla already should be a first ballot HHOFer. The negative though is the inconsistency that has plagued Jerome - he really only had 3 elite seasons. He might be hurt in reality, however, because I don't think the HHOF committee ever realized that it's harder to score now than in the 1980s.

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12-20-2010, 01:06 AM
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Jarome Iginla is perhaps Top-20, but there's no way he's one of the 10 best goalscorer of All-Time, unless you put HUGE value into peaks season, and even then.

Stan Mikita was a better goalscorer than Jarome Iginla. Mikita just happens to be an even better playmaker. That's why he's one of the 10 best forwards to ever play the game. I think alot of people forget guys like Stan Mikita, because they were so good and well rounded that their goalscoring doesn't pop out like Jarome Iginla who's more ''unidimensional''.

In no order:

Wayne Gretzky
Mario Lemieux
Gordie Howe
Bobby Hull
Maurice Richard
Sergei Makarov
Nels Stewart
Alexander Ovechkin
Jean Beliveau
Frank Mahovlich
Marcel Dionne
Bill Cook
Roy Conacher
Newsy Lalonde
Charlie Conacher
Valeri Kharlamov
Jaromir Jagr
Howie Morenz
Russell Bowie
Phil Esposito
Pavel Bure
Brett Hull
Guy Lafleur
Bobby Orr
Teemu Selanne
Joe Sakic
Mike Bossy
Bernard Geoffrion
Cy Denneny
Babe Dye
Joe Malone
------------------
Bryan Hextall Sr.
Cyclone Taylor
Steve Yzerman
Busher Jackson
Dickie Moore
Gordie Drillon

Ok, I might be pushing the envelop on the second, 6 players list, but even there's no denying you could make a case for them. Now tell me, there's 31 players on that 1st list. Which 21 are you cutting to put him on the Top-10? On further look, Iginla doesn't even cut my top-20 list. Top-30? Probably.

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12-20-2010, 01:15 AM
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Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
Statistically and judged against his peers, Bobby Hull probably is the best goal scorer of all-time. Definitely better than his son.



First off, I agree that Iginla is pretty underrated in many circles and I personally consider him a lock for the HHOF. Or at least he should be.

But he really wasn't that close to an Art Ross or Richard in 2008.

Ovechin had 112 points to 98 for Iginla. 65 goals (the most goals in over a decade) to 50 for Iginla.

Iginla's center Langhow had 65 ponts and Ovechkin's center Backstrom had 69 points. Hardly a huge difference in help. Iginla also got to play with a fantastic playmaking LWs, Tanguay and Huselius, both better and higher scoring that any wing Ovechkin played with that season.

Considering Ovechkin dragged the Capitals on his back in the second half of the season into the playoffs for the first time since the lockout, I don't see Iginla having any case for the Hart whatsoever that year.



He was very good and he did have little offensive scoring help, but Iginla is far from the only player to put up lots of points with little help.



Bobby Hull is one of the top 10 players of all time. This isn't your run of the mill star player you are comparing to Iginla.

I think a lot of people here think Iginla already should be a first ballot HHOFer. The negative though is the inconsistency that has plagued Jerome - he really only had 3 elite seasons. He might be hurt in reality, however, because I don't think the HHOF committee ever realized that it's harder to score now than in the 1980s.
The Flames and Capitals finished with identical point numbers in 2008, and Iginla willed that team to the playoffs. While Backstrom only did have 69 points, he was a young player who got progressively better as the season went on and I'm almost certain went well above PPG during the final 30 games of the season turning Ovechkin into a 65 goal player.
Iginla carried his team to the playoffs on his back while on the other hand having to deal with a sulking Alex Tanguay, who he never played with thanks to Keenan, a Kristian Huselius who scored 40 of his points in a span of 10 games, a steady Daymond Langkow and an entourage of third and fourth line players, plus a Kiprusoff that was made swiss cheese. If he had Backstrom playing with him, he would have scored 60 that year and won the Hart.

Iginla is the only player in the last 40 years to win the Art Ross while having no team mate over 80 points besides Jagr in 99 and Ovechkin in 08.
It's silly to believe that if he had a #1 centre he wouldn't have won multiple scoring titles.

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12-20-2010, 01:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Cole435 View Post
I don't think anyone would say Hull was the best goal scorer in the history of hockey, Gretzky, Lemieux, and own son are three you can't debate with, through raw numbers and analysis on this board.
Any search for "greatest goal scorer of all-time" will find Bobby Hull at or near the top. Surely you realize goals were harder to come by in 2000 versus the 80s and early 90s, but the 50s and 60s were even lower scoring - it's best to just compare by peers.

Brett Hull led the league in goals 3 times and was top 5 1 other time.
Wayne Gretzky led the league 5 times and 4 other times finished in the top 5.
Bobby Hull led the league 7 times and was 5 other times in the top 5.
He also went on to be a top goal scorer in the WHA for 5 more years after that.

For comparison's sake, Iginla led the league twice, and was top 5 one other time.
So unless you think Pre-1980 players "just suck", it's fair to consider Hull a top goal scorer of all-time.

Quote:
I've never seen Hull play, so I can't critically asse.s him, but Iginla is criminally underrated by the hockey community in general. He has had virtually no one to play with for almost his entire career, and is on pace to have 10 30+goal seasons.
If he had anything resembling a #1 centre for the duration of his career, he would probably have at least two Hart trophies (02,08), two Art Ross's(02,08), three maybe four Richard's (02,04,08(07 if he stayed healthy)) and two Pearson's (02,08).

That might sound like me being a homer, but he was that damn good and no one recognizes it. The second and third highest point total by a Flames outside of Jarome's 96,94,98,89 was 82 and 81 and by Mike Cammalleri (08-09) Alex Taungay (06-07). Both coincidently set their career highs in points beside Iginla, and Tanguay's year was one that saw Iginla miss 12 games while still scoring 94 points.

There have been no other players Iginla has played with that have scored more then 80 points. Though he did turn career 50 point players Kristian Huselius, Daymond Langkow and Craig Conroy into 70 point players.

This isn't some scrub.
If he was on a team during the 2000's like Colorado, Detroit, Dallas, Ottawa or San Jose, playing with the top players they had, he'd already be a first ballot HOF right now with or without a cup
Iginla is definitely not a scrub. He'll get into the HHoF, but that doesn't mean he is one of the greatest goal scorers of all-time. I'm not sure if he would be in the top 20, honestly.

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12-20-2010, 01:18 AM
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Originally Posted by EagleBelfour View Post
Jarome Iginla is perhaps Top-20, but there's no way he's one of the 10 best goalscorer of All-Time, unless you put HUGE value into peaks season, and even then.

Stan Mikita was a better goalscorer than Jarome Iginla. Mikita just happens to be an even better playmaker. That's why he's one of the 10 best forwards to ever play the game. I think alot of people forget guys like Stan Mikita, because they were so good and well rounded that their goalscoring doesn't pop out like Jarome Iginla who's more ''unidimensional''.

In no order:

Wayne Gretzky
Mario Lemieux
Gordie Howe
Bobby Hull
Maurice Richard
Sergei Makarov
Nels Stewart
Alexander Ovechkin
Jean Beliveau
Frank Mahovlich
Marcel Dionne
Bill Cook
Roy Conacher
Newsy Lalonde
Charlie Conacher
Valeri Kharlamov
Jaromir Jagr
Howie Morenz
Russell Bowie
Phil Esposito
Pavel Bure
Brett Hull
Guy Lafleur
Bobby Orr
Teemu Selanne
Joe Sakic
Mike Bossy
Bernard Geoffrion
Cy Denneny
Babe Dye
Joe Malone
------------------
Bryan Hextall Sr.
Cyclone Taylor
Steve Yzerman
Busher Jackson
Dickie Moore
Gordie Drillon

Ok, I might be pushing the envelop on the second, 6 players list, but even there's no denying you could make a case for them. Now tell me, there's 31 players on that 1st list. Which 21 are you cutting to put him on the Top-10? On further look, Iginla doesn't even cut my top-20 list. Top-30? Probably.
I'm not arguing that he's a top 10 goal scorer, I'm just stating the article.
But for the record, I'd put him just below Sakic and move Selanne below him.

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12-20-2010, 01:21 AM
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[QUOTE=RabbinsDuck;29677137][QUOTE=Cole435;29676864]I don't think anyone would say Hull was the best goal scorer in the history of hockey, Gretzky, Lemieux, and own son are three you can't debate with, through raw numbers and analysis on this board.
Quote:
Any search for "greatest goal scorer of all-time" will find Bobby Hull at or near the top. Surely you realize goals were harder to come by in 2000 versus the 80s and early 90s, but the 50s and 60s were even lower scoring - it's best to just compare by peers.

Brett Hull led the league in goals 3 times and was top 5 1 other time.
Wayne Gretzky led the league 5 times and 4 other times finished in the top 5.
Bobby Hull led the league 7 times and was 5 other times in the top 5.
He also went on to be a top goal scorer in the WHA for 5 more years after that.

For comparison's sake, Iginla led the league twice, and was top 5 one other time.
So unless you think Pre-1980 players "just suck", it's fair to consider Hull a top goal scorer of all-time.



Iginla is definitely not a scrub. He'll probably get into the HHoF, but that doesn't mean he is one of the greatest goal scorers of all-time. I'm not sure if he would be in the top 20, honestly.
I never said Hull wasn't a top goal scorer, I have great respect of Bobby as a player and he's easily top 5. But from the research I've done, and not just looking at season finishes I'd still state that Lemieux, Brett and Gretzky were the better goal scorers.

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12-20-2010, 01:26 AM
  #18
RabbinsDuck
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[QUOTE=Cole435;29677157][QUOTE=RabbinsDuck;29677137]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cole435 View Post
I don't think anyone would say Hull was the best goal scorer in the history of hockey, Gretzky, Lemieux, and own son are three you can't debate with, through raw numbers and analysis on this board.
I never said Hull wasn't a top goal scorer, I have great respect of Bobby as a player and he's easily top 5. But from the research I've done, and not just looking at season finishes I'd still state that Lemieux, Brett and Gretzky were the better goal scorers.
Why? Just raw totals?

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12-20-2010, 01:26 AM
  #19
FrozenJagrt
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Originally Posted by EagleBelfour View Post
Jarome Iginla is perhaps Top-20, but there's no way he's one of the 10 best goalscorer of All-Time, unless you put HUGE value into peaks season, and even then.

Stan Mikita was a better goalscorer than Jarome Iginla. Mikita just happens to be an even better playmaker. That's why he's one of the 10 best forwards to ever play the game. I think alot of people forget guys like Stan Mikita, because they were so good and well rounded that their goalscoring doesn't pop out like Jarome Iginla who's more ''unidimensional''.

In no order:

Wayne Gretzky
Mario Lemieux
Gordie Howe
Bobby Hull
Maurice Richard
Sergei Makarov
Nels Stewart
Alexander Ovechkin
Jean Beliveau
Frank Mahovlich
Marcel Dionne
Bill Cook
Roy Conacher
Newsy Lalonde
Charlie Conacher
Valeri Kharlamov
Jaromir Jagr
Howie Morenz
Russell Bowie
Phil Esposito
Pavel Bure
Brett Hull
Guy Lafleur
Bobby Orr
Teemu Selanne
Joe Sakic
Mike Bossy
Bernard Geoffrion
Cy Denneny
Babe Dye
Joe Malone
------------------
Bryan Hextall Sr.
Cyclone Taylor
Steve Yzerman
Busher Jackson
Dickie Moore
Gordie Drillon

Ok, I might be pushing the envelop on the second, 6 players list, but even there's no denying you could make a case for them. Now tell me, there's 31 players on that 1st list. Which 21 are you cutting to put him on the Top-10? On further look, Iginla doesn't even cut my top-20 list. Top-30? Probably.
Just nitpicking, but does Kharlamov really belong on this list? Not disputing his talent at all, I was just more under the assumption that this was about NHL players.

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12-20-2010, 01:31 AM
  #20
Walkingthroughforest
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[QUOTE=RabbinsDuck;29677186][QUOTE=Cole435;29677157]
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Originally Posted by RabbinsDuck View Post

Why? Just raw totals?
Not that, from what I've seen and read Bobby was the much better player, but Brett was a more natural goal scorer.
And I'm not sure how to get about the Gretzky-Lemieux debate, but either of them could have scored over a hundred goals a season if they wanted to.

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12-20-2010, 01:45 AM
  #21
RabbinsDuck
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Originally Posted by Cole435 View Post

Not that, from what I've seen and read Bobby was the much better player, but Brett was a more natural goal scorer.
Ah, the "natural goal scorer" ie. The player who sucked at everything else but scoring goals. Yes, I suppose Brett was more "natural" than his dad, despite his father being much "better" at it.
Quote:
And I'm not sure how to get about the Gretzky-Lemieux debate, but either of them could have scored over a hundred goals a season if they wanted to.
Thank God for the rest of the league that those two never really tried!

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12-20-2010, 01:48 AM
  #22
Mantha Poodoo
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No. I have no real desire to expand on that either. He certainly was and is a good goalscorer, though.

However, I do think a very good case can be made for him as a top 10 power forward all time, or at very least a top 10 power winger.

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12-20-2010, 03:32 AM
  #23
NYI Win
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Ehm, no.

Bossy
Gretzky
Lemieux
Hull
Hull
Richard
Howe
Esposito
Conacher
Bure
Ovechkin
.
.
.

... all better goal scorers than him.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cole435 View Post
I'd say Iginla's close to Selanne and Bobby Hull territory.
The year he put up 52 goals in 01-02 was as comparable to putting up 60+ goals today.
Granted, I'm no homer regardless of the affiliation.
Close to Hull? You realize Hull is one of the all time greatest and arguably the best pure goal scorer in the history of the game.

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12-20-2010, 04:01 AM
  #24
Sky04
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Originally Posted by Cole435 View Post
The Flames and Capitals finished with identical point numbers in 2008, and Iginla willed that team to the playoffs. While Backstrom only did have 69 points, he was a young player who got progressively better as the season went on and I'm almost certain went well above PPG during the final 30 games of the season turning Ovechkin into a 65 goal player.
Iginla carried his team to the playoffs on his back while on the other hand having to deal with a sulking Alex Tanguay, who he never played with thanks to Keenan, a Kristian Huselius who scored 40 of his points in a span of 10 games, a steady Daymond Langkow and an entourage of third and fourth line players, plus a Kiprusoff that was made swiss cheese. If he had Backstrom playing with him, he would have scored 60 that year and won the Hart.

Iginla is the only player in the last 40 years to win the Art Ross while having no team mate over 80 points besides Jagr in 99 and Ovechkin in 08.
It's silly to believe that if he had a #1 centre he wouldn't have won multiple scoring titles.
How's it silly? It may improve his stats but it certainly wouldn't increase it to the length you suggest.

What years do you think he would've won it in then?
02-03? Nope
03-04? Nope
05-06? big nope
06-07? Nope
07-08? Maybe
08-09? Nope
09-10? Nope


You're underrating Ovechkin that season, Backstrom wasn't close to as good as he is now, and he didn't go "well over ppg" in his last 30 games, he had 27 points. Even if Iginla had a rookie Backstrom I highly doubt he would've gotten 60 goals that year.

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Old
12-20-2010, 04:08 AM
  #25
EagleBelfour
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Originally Posted by Ace14 View Post
Just nitpicking, but does Kharlamov really belong on this list? Not disputing his talent at all, I was just more under the assumption that this was about NHL players.
The title say: Jarome Iginla- Top 10 goal scorer all time? All-Time include, well, everyone. If you only take the NHL, I guess you can scratch out guys like Makarov, Kharlamov and Bowie, but at the end he dosn't even sniff the Top-20.

And I would love to hear an argument as to how Brett Hull is a better goalscorer than Bobby. I honestly don't think a good argument can be done. In my book, Bobby Hull is either one or two. I'd probably have Gretzky ahead of him, but that's pretty much it.

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