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Armchair GMs: What to do with the season now?

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Old
12-26-2010, 10:34 AM
  #51
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1. Trade Connolly. Agree about prospects. There has to be an up-and-coming team that has a prospect just about NHL ready. Teams that have been drafting high for almost a decade. Teams to look at: LA, Phoenix, St Louis, Toronto, Islanders, Florida. Just get him off the team.

2. Trade all the old guys....Rivet, Grier, Neids.

3. Try to change the core of the team. Obviously, Roy can't be traded. Stafford, Pomminville, Gausted, Vanek, Kaleta, Butler, Gerbe...all tradeable.

4. I would try to build for the future, not unless this new owner is a Mark Cuban type. I would like to get Staal out of Pittsburgh. I really don't care what they want, I'd pay for him. Roy, Staal and Adam works for me over the next 5 years.

5. I can't see us competitive over the next year or two unless new owner is Cuban-like...trade Miller. I still see the Fluery/Staal for Miller++++ as a great deal for both teams.

Bottom line...Roy has really been the only bright spot this year and with him gone, this team needs to be re-identified right now. Take Regiers shackles off now and let him start the rebuild. NYR want Connolly, make it happen.

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Old
12-26-2010, 10:53 AM
  #52
Jame
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slip View Post
The problem is that to do a proper rebuild, getting a guy like Rask is only the first step. Realistically, we need to suck for the next 2 years after to acquire at least one top 3 pick (preferably two).

That is the blueprint if the Sabres wish to put themselves in cup contention 4 years down the road. Myers will be hitting his prime (24) around that time, and so will guys like Kassian, Ennis, Adam, McNabb, Foligno, Brennan, and Pysyk.

Unfortunately, the longer Miller sticks around, the more likely it is Buffalo spends the next 2-3 years missing the playoffs while drafting in the 10-14 range, perpetuating the cycle of mediocrity for the next half dozen years.

Like you said, time to take a step back, if not two.

Trade Miller.
IF.... IF.... this new owner comes along, I think a new rebuild could be much faster. A new owner, who brings in a NEW front office, and a NEW coaching staff... with a top 5-8 pick, and the depth of assets acquired at the deadline from our UFA to be players... the potential to get a high end young center, to also get rid of the deadweight and maybe be a player in the offseason trade market (im looking at what Atlanta and Florida did).

A one year rebuild is not out of the question.

Am I ok with a planned 2-3 year rebuild... YES... but I see ways it can be done in a 1 year turnaround.

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12-26-2010, 10:59 AM
  #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SabresFanNorthPortFL View Post
1. Trade Connolly. Agree about prospects. There has to be an up-and-coming team that has a prospect just about NHL ready. Teams that have been drafting high for almost a decade. Teams to look at: LA, Phoenix, St Louis, Toronto, Islanders, Florida. Just get him off the team.

2. Trade all the old guys....Rivet, Grier, Neids.

3. Try to change the core of the team. Obviously, Roy can't be traded. Stafford, Pomminville, Gausted, Vanek, Kaleta, Butler, Gerbe...all tradeable.

4. I would try to build for the future, not unless this new owner is a Mark Cuban type. I would like to get Staal out of Pittsburgh. I really don't care what they want, I'd pay for him. Roy, Staal and Adam works for me over the next 5 years.

5. I can't see us competitive over the next year or two unless new owner is Cuban-like...trade Miller. I still see the Fluery/Staal for Miller++++ as a great deal for both teams.

Bottom line...Roy has really been the only bright spot this year and with him gone, this team needs to be re-identified right now. Take Regiers shackles off now and let him start the rebuild. NYR want Connolly, make it happen.
I love the idea of getting Staal. I love to day dream about those type of scenarios....BUT... going into the trade/deadline, Buffalo fans need to accept that those types of deals will NEVER happen. It's time to start looking at REAL possible hockey deals. That include collecting picks and mid range prospects at the deadline, and then targeting cap strapped teams in the offseason. The best possible deals are going to be from teams near the cap with key RFAs to sign... we need to find the Ladd and Byfuglien type deals... or the team with the big name "change of scenery" situation like Horton.

Pittsburgh has no reason to trade Staal. We are not signing Richards. We need to get realistic about a rebuild.

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12-26-2010, 11:01 AM
  #54
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I think the Pominville to Ottawa deal on the trade board is an interesting "change the core" type of move.

Various versions end up looking like Pominville for Foligno and 2nd

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12-26-2010, 11:09 AM
  #55
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In a perfect world Lalime would be waived, but I honestly cannot see Darcy or Miller letting that happen (remember Miller is the reason why he got resigned).

I'm not as well versed as some people here on how the salary and contract stuff works with call ups and stuff, but would it be feasible to call up Enroth on a "as we need him" basis? Limiting Lalime's starts but giving Enroth the low pressure NHL starts that his development could probably use.

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12-26-2010, 11:24 AM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
I love the idea of getting Staal. I love to day dream about those type of scenarios....BUT... going into the trade/deadline, Buffalo fans need to accept that those types of deals will NEVER happen. It's time to start looking at REAL possible hockey deals. That include collecting picks and mid range prospects at the deadline, and then targeting cap strapped teams in the offseason. The best possible deals are going to be from teams near the cap with key RFAs to sign... we need to find the Ladd and Byfuglien type deals... or the team with the big name "change of scenery" situation like Horton.

Pittsburgh has no reason to trade Staal. We are not signing Richards. We need to get realistic about a rebuild.
I actually liked his post but agree wholeheartedly with what you are saying - which worries me a little.

Gotta say that I didn't really like your proposals in the post above.

Something along the lines of Fleury and Stall for Miller and Stafford + works in fantasy land but not in reality.

I also agree that the Ottawa deals were tempting, both the Foligno / Kovalev + 2nd or something based around Fisher for Pominville.

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12-26-2010, 11:28 AM
  #57
Jame
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trade options in the offseason:
- Dustin Jeffrey RFA - Pitt has nearly 8 mil in cap space, but a dozen roster spots to fill
- Andreas Nodl RFA - Philly has 1.7 million in cap space going into next year
- Benn Ferreiro RFA - San Jose has higher priorities

UFA options
- Ville Leino UFA - Philly has 1.7 million in cap next year, and only 9 forwards signed. 2.5 per?
- Christian Erhoff - putting him and Myers together would make for the the best #1 pairing this side of Chicago. Would be the most impactful, and expensive UFA signing in recent history (around 4.5 mil a year)
- Kevin Bieksa - A Right Handed #4 defensemen could be a need if Montador is not brought back. Could probably be signed for fair money around 3.0
- Jonathan Ericsson - Big big defensemen who has been groomed by countrymen Lidstrom... take a shot at him
- Anton Babchuk - another big shot Right hander...

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12-26-2010, 11:37 AM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
trade options in the offseason:
- Dustin Jeffrey RFA - Pitt has nearly 8 mil in cap space, but a dozen roster spots to fill
- Andreas Nodl RFA - Philly has 1.7 million in cap space going into next year
- Benn Ferreiro RFA - San Jose has higher priorities

UFA options
- Ville Leino UFA - Philly has 1.7 million in cap next year, and only 9 forwards signed. 2.5 per?
- Christian Erhoff - putting him and Myers together would make for the the best #1 pairing this side of Chicago. Would be the most impactful, and expensive UFA signing in recent history (around 4.5 mil a year)
- Kevin Bieksa - A Right Handed #4 defensemen could be a need if Montador is not brought back. Could probably be signed for fair money around 3.0
- Jonathan Ericsson - Big big defensemen who has been groomed by countrymen Lidstrom... take a shot at him
- Anton Babchuk - another big shot Right hander...
This team does not need D help as much as scoring and forwards with size. Last years draft and moving forward the sabres should have and need to pick up scoring punch for up front.

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Old
12-26-2010, 11:45 AM
  #59
Rowley Birkin
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Originally Posted by French Connection View Post
This team does not need D help as much as scoring and forwards with size. Last years draft and moving forward the sabres should have and need to pick up scoring punch for up front.
True but there is not a lot of FA options at forward.

Ehrhoff would be a great signing IMO.

Sekera-Myers
Leopold-Ehrhoff
Weber-Morisson

Thats a pretty strong defence.

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Old
12-26-2010, 11:46 AM
  #60
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Originally Posted by RaoulDo0k View Post
In a perfect world Lalime would be waived, but I honestly cannot see Darcy or Miller letting that happen (remember Miller is the reason why he got resigned).

I'm not as well versed as some people here on how the salary and contract stuff works with call ups and stuff, but would it be feasible to call up Enroth on a "as we need him" basis? Limiting Lalime's starts but giving Enroth the low pressure NHL starts that his development could probably use.
We can recall Enroth as long as we do not have 23 players on our active roster.
For example, we should have 22 next game if Morrisonn and Roy are on IR (I believe Morrisonn already is) and we could also gain another spot if Connolly is placed on IR.

The problem is that of course, Lalime is on a one-way contract, so we will be paying him $600k to play in the AHL (yes, he has a $650k hit, but $50k are performance bonuses).
That means that instead of paying $600k for the backup position, the organization would be paying $600k + the prorated amount of Enroth's $685k contract.
I doubt they go for waiving Lalime just because they would be doubling their expenses.

Another issue is that we only have two pro goalies in the system, both of which are in Portland.
If we recall one, we don't have an ECHL affiliate to recall from (whether it is another prospect, like other organizations do, or just someone who can be a solid backup), so Portland would have to go find another on their own.
I'm sure we've already pissed them off enough with our lack of depth (the goaltending issues last year when they had to sign Todd Ford, this year when we are recalling the only legit center they have).

That being said, I'm sure Enroth will be getting some more starts soon enough.
If one of the extra defensemen gets shipped out and we don't get a body back, we'd have one less scratch every game.
With Roy out, we'll most likely have 12 forwards every game, 7-8 defensemen not factoring in a trade and depending on when Morrisonn gets off of IR, and two goalies.
That adds up to 21-22, so even if Morrisonn isn't on IR, we have a spot for Enroth or an extra skater.

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12-26-2010, 11:47 AM
  #61
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Sell, Sell, Sell...with Pegula's impending purchase, let's clean house.

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Old
12-26-2010, 12:01 PM
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
trade options in the offseason:
- Dustin Jeffrey RFA - Pitt has nearly 8 mil in cap space, but a dozen roster spots to fill
- Andreas Nodl RFA - Philly has 1.7 million in cap space going into next year
- Benn Ferreiro RFA - San Jose has higher priorities

UFA options
- Ville Leino UFA - Philly has 1.7 million in cap next year, and only 9 forwards signed. 2.5 per?
- Christian Erhoff - putting him and Myers together would make for the the best #1 pairing this side of Chicago. Would be the most impactful, and expensive UFA signing in recent history (around 4.5 mil a year)
- Kevin Bieksa - A Right Handed #4 defensemen could be a need if Montador is not brought back. Could probably be signed for fair money around 3.0
- Jonathan Ericsson - Big big defensemen who has been groomed by countrymen Lidstrom... take a shot at him
- Anton Babchuk - another big shot Right hander...
Just to address the Flyers players: Philly does not want to lose Nodl or Leino, I can guarantee that.
If need be, I'm sure they are willing to dump any number of their useless players with large hits (Carcillo, Leighton, Shelley, Walker) to enable them to retain these players.
They bring in original six profits, so they have no problem burying contracts.

They literally cannot sign more players because of something called tagging, which has to do with the amount of money committed to non-expiring one-way contracts, and I believe they also have an issue with the number of contracts they have signed.

Philly will part with any of the contracts I named rather than give up Nodl or Leino.

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12-26-2010, 12:25 PM
  #63
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I think Ville Leino would be really good sign. If I remember correct according some Finnish newspaper he turned down flyers first offer and they speculated that offer between 2-3 mill per year would be needed to him to sign. BUT if flyers somehow cant manage to sign Leino would Sabres really be his first option? Afraid not.

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12-26-2010, 12:31 PM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
trade options in the offseason:
- Dustin Jeffrey RFA - Pitt has nearly 8 mil in cap space, but a dozen roster spots to fill
- Andreas Nodl RFA - Philly has 1.7 million in cap space going into next year
- Benn Ferreiro RFA - San Jose has higher priorities

UFA options
- Ville Leino UFA - Philly has 1.7 million in cap next year, and only 9 forwards signed. 2.5 per?
- Christian Erhoff - putting him and Myers together would make for the the best #1 pairing this side of Chicago. Would be the most impactful, and expensive UFA signing in recent history (around 4.5 mil a year)
- Kevin Bieksa - A Right Handed #4 defensemen could be a need if Montador is not brought back. Could probably be signed for fair money around 3.0
- Jonathan Ericsson - Big big defensemen who has been groomed by countrymen Lidstrom... take a shot at him
- Anton Babchuk - another big shot Right hander...
Obviously its common sense that I agree, but with added payroll and a new front office, i really hope Ehrhoff is our #1 priority this off-season.

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Old
12-26-2010, 12:39 PM
  #65
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Babchuk's got personality issues too. Wouldn't mesh well at all with Ruff, but we're probably assuming he's gone under this scenario.

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12-26-2010, 12:49 PM
  #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jfb392 View Post
Just to address the Flyers players: Philly does not want to lose Nodl or Leino, I can guarantee that.
If need be, I'm sure they are willing to dump any number of their useless players with large hits (Carcillo, Leighton, Shelley, Walker) to enable them to retain these players.
They bring in original six profits, so they have no problem burying contracts.

They literally cannot sign more players because of something called tagging, which has to do with the amount of money committed to non-expiring one-way contracts, and I believe they also have an issue with the number of contracts they have signed.

Philly will part with any of the contracts I named rather than give up Nodl or Leino.
What's the highest offer you can make to a RFA and NOT give up a 1st? I love Leino... maybe we can make a RFA offer that Philly can't match. If we can get a 2nd for Montador... and then give up our 2nd for Leino... that could be an option

edit: uh... he's an UFA.... NEVERMIND


Last edited by Jame: 12-26-2010 at 12:49 PM. Reason: i'm dumb
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Old
12-26-2010, 01:32 PM
  #67
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Babchuk's got personality issues too. Wouldn't mesh well at all with Ruff, but we're probably assuming he's gone under this scenario.
He's basically a Soviet Dion Phaneuf.
He has personality issues, can't play defense very well, and can't even hit the net with his slapshot.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
What's the highest offer you can make to a RFA and NOT give up a 1st? I love Leino... maybe we can make a RFA offer that Philly can't match. If we can get a 2nd for Montador... and then give up our 2nd for Leino... that could be an option

edit: uh... he's an UFA.... NEVERMIND
Yeah, I love Leino too.
Even if he is a UFA after this season, I think Philadelphia will manage to create some cap space between the draft and free agency that will enable them to retain him.
Nodl, however, will be an RFA still.
The compensation changes every year, but it will probably be ~$3m before you have to give up at 1st rounder next year.

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12-26-2010, 01:38 PM
  #68
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also, for the LOVE OF EVERYTHING THAT IS HOLY, DO NOT RE-SIGN CONNOLLY.

DO NOT.

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12-26-2010, 08:01 PM
  #69
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IF.... IF.... this new owner comes along, I think a new rebuild could be much faster. A new owner, who brings in a NEW front office, and a NEW coaching staff... with a top 5-8 pick, and the depth of assets acquired at the deadline from our UFA to be players... the potential to get a high end young center, to also get rid of the deadweight and maybe be a player in the offseason trade market (im looking at what Atlanta and Florida did).

A one year rebuild is not out of the question.

Am I ok with a planned 2-3 year rebuild... YES... but I see ways it can be done in a 1 year turnaround.
That's a lot of if's to turn the Sabres from pretenders to contenders, and while Atlanta and Florida have shown promise so far, still way to soon to say if those franchises have really turned a corner.

I guess I'm less optimistic than you are of the potential for success of such a short turn around. So much would need to go right over the next 6 months to appreciably turn Buffalo from a fringe playoff team -- and it's barely on the fringe of that fringe -- to a legitimate Cup finalist. Although signing Richards and Ehrhoff would go a long way toward proving me wrong, I guess. Anything short of that is likely a futile exercise in deck-chair rearrangement.

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12-27-2010, 10:05 AM
  #70
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Originally Posted by Jame View Post
I love the idea of getting Staal. I love to day dream about those type of scenarios....BUT... going into the trade/deadline, Buffalo fans need to accept that those types of deals will NEVER happen. It's time to start looking at REAL possible hockey deals. That include collecting picks and mid range prospects at the deadline, and then targeting cap strapped teams in the offseason. The best possible deals are going to be from teams near the cap with key RFAs to sign... we need to find the Ladd and Byfuglien type deals... or the team with the big name "change of scenery" situation like Horton.

Pittsburgh has no reason to trade Staal. We are not signing Richards. We need to get realistic about a rebuild.
You mention the trade dealine...I think that is the wrong time to go after Staal. We need to go after him during the summer, after Pittsburgh goes through the playoffs. One of two things will happen, they will win the cup or they won't. As you said in another post "they have 8mil in cap space but a dozen spots to fill." If they win, their guys will want a pay day. They have $26.4mil tied up in Crosby, Malkin, Staal & Fluery per year. If they don't win and Fleury stinks, it would be an interesting proposal dangling Miller to Pitts.

I agree that Pittsburgh doesn't have to trade Staal but I do think there will come a day when they will have to deal one of Staal or Malkin. IMO, Staal brings intangibles that the Sabres need and I would overpay to get them. We already have an offensive center in Roy, now get a top shutdown, 60 point, big-bodied center to compliment our Roy. OVERPAY.

Miller, Ennis & 1st for Staal & Fleury.

Pros for Pittburgh:
1. The 1st will be a top 10 pick.
2. Miller is better than Fleury.
3. They will save almost $2 mil in cap savings.
4. Ennis is on an ELC and could be the winger the Pitts fans all crave.
5. Will be a very, very scary team with 2 of top 5 centers in league and Miller in net. Ennis will become a legend.

Cons:
Give up Staal.

Pros for Buffalo:
1. Get 5 years younger in net. Still solid goalie.
2. Get a young, big, solid, 2-way center. Really solidifies Buffalo at center. Roy, Staal, Adam, Gausted will still be signed.
3. Saving money, even though we took on almost $2mil, Connolly will be gone, saving us over $2mil.
4. IMO, Staal is the captain type player. He'd become the face of the franchise. He is also a winner, something this team needs.

Cons:
1. Give up top 10 pick.
2. Give up Miller.
3. Give up Ennis.

I do not believe that this proposal is a pipe dream during this summer.

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12-27-2010, 10:12 AM
  #71
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If you guys feel like crying, I just got Ryan Kesler on my Sabres team in a sim league. I also got Derek Stepan and Chris Kreider recently.

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Miller, Ennis & 1st for Staal & Fleury.
Trades like this just don't happen in real life any more, especially with a conservative GM like Darcy.

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12-27-2010, 11:33 AM
  #72
Jame
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Originally Posted by SabresFanNorthPortFL View Post
You mention the trade dealine...I think that is the wrong time to go after Staal. We need to go after him during the summer, after Pittsburgh goes through the playoffs. One of two things will happen, they will win the cup or they won't. As you said in another post "they have 8mil in cap space but a dozen spots to fill." If they win, their guys will want a pay day. They have $26.4mil tied up in Crosby, Malkin, Staal & Fluery per year. If they don't win and Fleury stinks, it would be an interesting proposal dangling Miller to Pitts.

I agree that Pittsburgh doesn't have to trade Staal but I do think there will come a day when they will have to deal one of Staal or Malkin. IMO, Staal brings intangibles that the Sabres need and I would overpay to get them. We already have an offensive center in Roy, now get a top shutdown, 60 point, big-bodied center to compliment our Roy. OVERPAY.

Miller, Ennis & 1st for Staal & Fleury.

Pros for Pittburgh:
1. The 1st will be a top 10 pick.
2. Miller is better than Fleury.
3. They will save almost $2 mil in cap savings.
4. Ennis is on an ELC and could be the winger the Pitts fans all crave.
5. Will be a very, very scary team with 2 of top 5 centers in league and Miller in net. Ennis will become a legend.

Cons:
Give up Staal.

Pros for Buffalo:
1. Get 5 years younger in net. Still solid goalie.
2. Get a young, big, solid, 2-way center. Really solidifies Buffalo at center. Roy, Staal, Adam, Gausted will still be signed.
3. Saving money, even though we took on almost $2mil, Connolly will be gone, saving us over $2mil.
4. IMO, Staal is the captain type player. He'd become the face of the franchise. He is also a winner, something this team needs.

Cons:
1. Give up top 10 pick.
2. Give up Miller.
3. Give up Ennis.

I do not believe that this proposal is a pipe dream during this summer.
I play the role of delusional all too often... but atleast I acknowledge it.

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12-27-2010, 11:56 AM
  #73
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Originally Posted by SabresFanNorthPortFL View Post
You mention the trade dealine...I think that is the wrong time to go after Staal. We need to go after him during the summer, after Pittsburgh goes through the playoffs. One of two things will happen, they will win the cup or they won't. As you said in another post "they have 8mil in cap space but a dozen spots to fill." If they win, their guys will want a pay day. They have $26.4mil tied up in Crosby, Malkin, Staal & Fluery per year. If they don't win and Fleury stinks, it would be an interesting proposal dangling Miller to Pitts.

I agree that Pittsburgh doesn't have to trade Staal but I do think there will come a day when they will have to deal one of Staal or Malkin. IMO, Staal brings intangibles that the Sabres need and I would overpay to get them. We already have an offensive center in Roy, now get a top shutdown, 60 point, big-bodied center to compliment our Roy. OVERPAY.

Miller, Ennis & 1st for Staal & Fleury.

Pros for Pittburgh:
1. The 1st will be a top 10 pick.
2. Miller is better than Fleury.
3. They will save almost $2 mil in cap savings.
4. Ennis is on an ELC and could be the winger the Pitts fans all crave.
5. Will be a very, very scary team with 2 of top 5 centers in league and Miller in net. Ennis will become a legend.

Cons:
Give up Staal.

Pros for Buffalo:
1. Get 5 years younger in net. Still solid goalie.
2. Get a young, big, solid, 2-way center. Really solidifies Buffalo at center. Roy, Staal, Adam, Gausted will still be signed.
3. Saving money, even though we took on almost $2mil, Connolly will be gone, saving us over $2mil.
4. IMO, Staal is the captain type player. He'd become the face of the franchise. He is also a winner, something this team needs.

Cons:
1. Give up top 10 pick.
2. Give up Miller.
3. Give up Ennis.

I do not believe that this proposal is a pipe dream during this summer.


The Pens get the better goalie, the better offensive player plus we throw in a 1st rounder. We get a very good two way center who in no way upgrades our offense (which is a major problem right now) and we add salary (thats some pretty convoluted logic btw to assert we save money). Not a move I would want to make.

Btw Staal has never had 60pts.


Last edited by joshjull: 12-27-2010 at 12:13 PM.
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12-27-2010, 11:59 AM
  #74
ImpressedDAHagent
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Originally Posted by Ron Barr View Post
If you guys feel like crying, I just got Ryan Kesler on my Sabres team in a sim league. I also got Derek Stepan and Chris Kreider recently.


Trades like this just don't happen in real life any more, especially with a conservative GM like Darcy.
i'd rather have ennis and miller..

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12-27-2010, 12:47 PM
  #75
Jame
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this offseason is going to be awesome for "armchair GMs"...

IF the Sabres are sold to Pegula (which I have at 80/20 right now)... Then their is DEFINITELY going to be BIG change. Regier would be 95% gone, Ruff would have maybe a 50/50 chance of being around.

You can almost guarantee that none of the UFAs would be back (maybe Monty, hopefully McCormick)...

They'd have a BIG chunk of cap space, and a NEW direction from a NEW owner...

The offseason cannot come fast enough...

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