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Old
01-17-2011, 07:35 PM
  #76
umbyforpresident
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I will never claim to be a smarter mind haha. I just think that Huse plays a similar game to Daniel Alfredsson, who also spent time on a line with Spezza.

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01-17-2011, 07:55 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by umbyforpresident View Post
I will never claim to be a smarter mind haha. I just think that Huse plays a similar game to Daniel Alfredsson, who also spent time on a line with Spezza.
We will get along great then!! Actually, we have some very knowledgable fans here. I have learned a lot!

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Old
01-17-2011, 08:23 PM
  #78
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I am pretty certain that HC Arniel would openly admit that in order to play the system he is trying to implement, the center position has to be strong or the defense will be exposed.

With that being said, I don't recall anyone saying Spezza is the _Best_ center in the game, but after looking at the available options, he seems to be the Best of the available options which would ~potentially~ be available in terms that the CBJ could deal with.

I would go so far as to say that even if the CBJ top line was :

Nash-Spezza-Calvert OR Nash-Spezza- ($Random_CBJ_Player)

it would be the best line in the history of the team. Heck we could bring back Vyborny and replace Calvert's spot with him and still be the best line the CBJ ever had. <Serious but not wanting to bring back Vyborny or saying Calvert is the ultimate answer- just making a point...>

You could replace Calvert on that line with someone else currently on the active roster and maybe debate some improvement - That's fine Calvert is a finisher. Either way to deny that Spezza is an upgrade at center on this team is a fallacy.

I understand being excited by Filatov but at this point he may as well be a younger Svitov. He contributes 0 to the CBJ now. In the future perhaps - ok, fine. I would not advocate trading him at this point anyways as a matter of principle because his value is so freaking low right now.

There are enough pieces to make a deal happen to acquire Spezza and still holding onto Filatov if we want to see if he will be ready to play in the next couple of years.

Huselius makes too many turnovers and too many shots miss the net for his contract level in my opinion and if moving that contract is a part of getting Spezza I say do it. Even if that is part of a trade to another team to free up cap space - do it. It is unfortunate because I like Huselius but I think he has let me down a few times too many at this point.

Get Spezza without giving up too much and add something (even by subtraction) to the Defense and we're instantly better.

I would put the following players on the block in the following order:

Commodore
Strahlman
Clark
Moreau
Murray
Huselius
Hejda
Brassard
Filatov
2011 Draft Picks
-- In the right deal, also--
Mason


Flame if you must, flamers.


Last edited by GreaterGood: 01-17-2011 at 11:57 PM. Reason: in respoinse to Edit of DSL Post
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Old
01-17-2011, 08:29 PM
  #79
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Spezza is not oft-injured.

Spezza would be a huge upgrade on this roster and would make the team better both "now" (his current injury notwithstanding) and in the future.

I agree with Capn about the "magic bullet move." It's the same concept as saying we're not one player away so we shouldn't make a trade for one player.

I really like Jake and would have a hard time moving him in a deal for Spezza, but Brassard + Filatov + 1st I would do in a heartbeat. That said, if it required Voracek, I'd see what else could be added to get Foligno. (Not both Jake and Nikki.)

EDIT:
GG's bit about Calvert on the top line though is problematic.
"We've got to stop counting on unproven kids for production and go get Spezza!"
And I likey the Matt Calvert.

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Old
01-17-2011, 08:35 PM
  #80
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I don't care who they trade, and I don't care who is on the team, all I want them to do is win. Period.

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Old
01-17-2011, 08:37 PM
  #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Double-Shift Lassť View Post
Spezza is not oft-injured.

Spezza would be a huge upgrade on this roster and would make the team better both "now" (his current injury notwithstanding) and in the future.

I agree with Capn about the "magic bullet move." It's the same concept as saying we're not one player away so we shouldn't make a trade for one player.

I really like Jake and would have a hard time moving him in a deal for Spezza, but Brassard + Filatov + 1st I would do in a heartbeat. That said, if it required Voracek, I'd see what else could be added to get Foligno. (Not both Jake and Nikki.)

EDIT:
GG's bit about Calvert on the top line though is problematic.
"We've got to stop counting on unproven kids for production and go get Spezza!"
And I likey the Matt Calvert.
Si Senor

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Old
01-17-2011, 09:01 PM
  #82
JF Omalycat
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So it's settled? We're all in agreement that Spezza would, in fact, be an upgrade?

Are we really having this argument?

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Old
01-17-2011, 09:13 PM
  #83
CapnCornelius
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Originally Posted by JF Omalycat View Post
So it's settled? We're all in agreement that Spezza would, in fact, be an upgrade?

Are we really having this argument?
Only for about 3 seasons. It should carry on until Spezza's contract is up and he gets a new deal somewhere. Fortunately for us, unlike Marleau or Thornton, that day is YEARS and YEARS away.

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Old
01-17-2011, 11:22 PM
  #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GreaterGood View Post

You could replace Calvert on that line with someone else currently on the active roster and maybe debate some improvement - That's fine Calvert is a finisher.

I would put the following players on the block in the following order:

Commodore
Strahlman
Clark
Moreau
Murray
Huselius
Hejda
Brassard
Filatov
2011 Draft Picks
-- In the right deal, also--
Mason
.
It might be a tad early to state Calvert as proven finisher

My additions:
Pahlsson
Dorsett
Put them between Huselius and Hejda.

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Old
01-17-2011, 11:53 PM
  #85
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It's abbreviated CBJ.

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Old
01-17-2011, 11:56 PM
  #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Citrigno View Post
It's abbreviated CBJ.
Only thing worse is seeing Johansen spelled 100 different ways, most of them wrong. He's not Swedish, so it's definitely not "Johansson".

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Old
01-17-2011, 11:58 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by umbyforpresident View Post
Coug I actually like Huselius on the line with Spezza. But that being said, not opposed to moving him. He has a heavier contract but it is short time.
I actually like the idea of moving Juice and I'm not a Juice hater. The guy puts up good consistent numbers from season to season it seems. My issue with him is that he tends to kill the chemistry and whatever line he's on because he doesn't seem to work well with any of our centers. Remember the playoff run when Vermette had GREAT chemistry with RJ almost instantly? Vermette also meshed well with Nash. Brassard appears to play better with Voracek and Nash, but perhaps that's due to Nash's talent more than any type of chemistry.

Huselius is a good talent, but he seems to do it all alone and tends to not get the rest of his line involved. If he could do the latter he'd be a much better player for us.

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Old
01-18-2011, 12:57 AM
  #88
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Originally Posted by Viqsi View Post
Theoretically, Nash could cover for Spezza's gaffes and still play effectively.

That said, the needs are greater on the blueline, and I'd rather those get addressed, rather than chasing after lightning in a bottle from six years ago for a team in a less talented league.

Nash "needs a center". Crosby "needs a winger". How long did Nash stay on Crosby's line in the Olympics, again?
I have missed about 10 Ottawa Senators games in the last year and a half. Spezza defence is very solid, this year he played the PK and in all situations and had a great faceoff%. I know it sounds like I am talking up Spezza so much then why trade him. The reason is he needs a top winger to play with him, simple as that, if Ottawa could get a top line winger to play with Spezza then I would never trade him. IMO it is simple get a top line winger to play with your superstar or trade him, I don't see very many wingers availiable.

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01-18-2011, 10:44 AM
  #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wilfred View Post
I have missed about 10 Ottawa Senators games in the last year and a half. Spezza defence is very solid, this year he played the PK and in all situations and had a great faceoff%. I know it sounds like I am talking up Spezza so much then why trade him. The reason is he needs a top winger to play with him, simple as that, if Ottawa could get a top line winger to play with Spezza then I would never trade him. IMO it is simple get a top line winger to play with your superstar or trade him, I don't see very many wingers availiable.
Strange, I could have sworn that there was this top-line winger, name of Daniel Alfredsson, who plays for Ottawa...

...and yes, I know he's having a down year right now, but that doesn't explain your eagerness to trade Spezza from last year and the year before.

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01-18-2011, 11:24 AM
  #90
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Strange, I could have sworn that there was this top-line winger, name of Daniel Alfredsson, who plays for Ottawa...
Awesome winger. 2007 and before. He's still good, but he's not longer elite. Don't get me wrong, I would like him on this team, but I don't think I would use him in the implied context anymore.

Not sure I believe wilfred's statements, but I wouldn't use what you did as a counter.

Do I think Spezza's productivity would go up in Columbus? Yes. Do I think he's a decent defensive center? Yes. Would he give us a center to match up against the better teams in the West? Yes. Is Spezza flawed in a few ways? Yes. Do I think he would score 100 points in Columbus? No. Get back up to 90? Maybe. Most important. Would we be a better team? Yes, most likely. Would that be our last move? No. We have big needs on defense.


Last edited by blahblah: 01-18-2011 at 11:29 AM.
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Old
01-18-2011, 11:38 AM
  #91
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I know everyone wants that profound #1 center to play with Nash but we have no one good except Clitsome, the AHL callup, that I like on our defense. ISNT THAT SAYING SOMETHING? We might have gotten the best center in last years draft in Johansen. I really rather keep our assets such as Brassard, Jake, and Filatov. But if we do trade them for anything, it should be for a defenseman.

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01-18-2011, 11:46 AM
  #92
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Originally Posted by Gagnefan924 View Post
I know everyone wants that profound #1 center to play with Nash but we have no one good except Clitsome, the AHL callup, that I like on our defense. ISNT THAT SAYING SOMETHING?
Yes. It says that I can never trust your evaluation of any defensemen ever again. Clitsome as the only decent defenseman? Seriously? Granted, he gets shots on net better than most of our guys, but we've been down this path before. How are Aaron Rome and Clay Wilson doing, again?

That said, I do concur that we need improvement on the blueline first.

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01-18-2011, 11:52 AM
  #93
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Awesome winger. 2007 and before. He's still good, but he's not longer elite. Don't get me wrong, I would like him on this team, but I don't think I would use him in the implied context anymore.

Not sure I believe wilfred's statements, but I wouldn't use what you did as a counter.

Do I think Spezza's productivity would go up in Columbus? Yes. Do I think he's a decent defensive center? Yes. Would he give us a center to match up against the better teams in the West? Yes. Is Spezza flawed in a few ways? Yes. Do I think he would score 100 points in Columbus? No. Get back up to 90? Maybe. Most important. Would we be a better team? Yes, most likely. Would that be our last move? No. We have big needs on defense.
That Alfie contract made me cringe. But, it is typical Bryan Murray. He loves him some aging veterans beyond their prime.

The smarter/harder move would have been to let Alfie go and build around Spezza, but it seemed like Murray just couldn't commit to that for whatever reason. Talk about needing a GM change. Sometimes everyone just needs a change of scenery, and I think that's true of Murray in Ottawa. Maybe Burke will be fired in Toronto by then and can clean up another one of his messes and take them to a championship. I keed, I keed.

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Originally Posted by Viqsi View Post
Yes. It says that I can never trust your evaluation of any defensemen ever again. Clitsome as the only decent defenseman? Seriously? Granted, he gets shots on net better than most of our guys, but we've been down this path before. How are Aaron Rome and Clay Wilson doing, again?

That said, I do concur that we need improvement on the blueline first.
I'd like to think that we can walk and chew gum at the same time. No reason we can't address both. As to which comes first, it depends on which is available first.

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Old
01-18-2011, 11:59 AM
  #94
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I'm sure this has been covered already, but I'm pretty sure you can't trade a player currently on IR.

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01-18-2011, 12:32 PM
  #95
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I'm sure this has been covered already, but I'm pretty sure you can't trade a player currently on IR.
Pascal Leclaire.

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Old
01-18-2011, 12:44 PM
  #96
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I know everyone wants that profound #1 center to play with Nash but we have no one good except Clitsome, the AHL callup, that I like on our defense. ISNT THAT SAYING SOMETHING? We might have gotten the best center in last years draft in Johansen. I really rather keep our assets such as Brassard, Jake, and Filatov. But if we do trade them for anything, it should be for a defenseman.
Howson would like you... Rolling the dice with our only potential top line center in the org, who is probably years away. I suppose Brass still has a chance, but it seems fairly slim at this point.

I concede that there we are stronger up the middle on then on defense.

I leave you with this.

There are two buildings burning. 70 people in one, 30 in the other. In the building with 30, you have a 70% chance to save them all. 30% chance in the building to save 70. There is a 5% chance to save everyone. Failure results in complete loss. Which do you choose?

1. The building with 70 people?
2. 30?
3. Try and save everyone?
4. Freeze in fear because you can't make a decision?

I'm #2 for the most part. A guy like Burke is probably #1 (high risk, high reward). Not sure if Howson is #3 or #4.

My point? If you a #2 person, you generally make slow, steady progress. You take opportunities as they arise. If Spezza is available and you can figure out how to afford it without destroying your team. You do it. You don't look back and don't have regret is something better comes along and you can't do it because of your previous choice. If your #1 you might wait or even take the move even with cap issues or giving up too much. #3, your always waiting for the perfect situation to come along. But when it does, it's usually a knock out. There is a fine line between #3 and #4.

Me, I take the first major upgrade that comes along, if it's center or d, that doesn't destroy my assets or budget situation. If Spezza is available and doesn't destroy my team or budget situation, I do it. An upgrade on D may never come. At least with as much potential upside as Spezza.


Last edited by blahblah: 01-18-2011 at 12:56 PM.
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Old
01-18-2011, 01:13 PM
  #97
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Howson would like you... Rolling the dice with our only potential top line center in the org, who is probably years away. I suppose Brass still has a chance, but it seems fairly slim at this point.

I concede that there we are stronger up the middle on then on defense.

I leave you with this.

There are two buildings burning. 70 people in one, 30 in the other. In the building with 30, you have a 70% chance to save them all. 30% chance in the building to save 70. There is a 5% chance to save everyone. Failure results in complete loss. Which do you choose?

1. The building with 70 people?
2. 30?
3. Try and save everyone?
4. Freeze in fear because you can't make a decision?

I'm #2 for the most part. A guy like Burke is probably #1 (high risk, high reward). Not sure if Howson is #3 or #4.

My point? If you a #2 person, you generally make slow, steady progress. You take opportunities as they arise. If Spezza is available and you can figure out how to afford it without destroying your team. You do it. You don't look back and don't have regret is something better comes along and you can't do it because of your previous choice. If your #1 you might wait or even take the move even with cap issues or giving up too much. #3, your always waiting for the perfect situation to come along. But when it does, it's usually a knock out. There is a fine line between #3 and #4.

Me, I take the first major upgrade that comes along, if it's center or d, that doesn't destroy my assets or budget situation. If Spezza is available and doesn't destroy my team or budget situation, I do it. An upgrade on D may never come. At least with as much potential upside as Spezza.
While I might like to hear Dr. Fire's take on your analogy...

This post. Exactly. Well said.

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Old
01-18-2011, 02:35 PM
  #98
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I take a moment to call for reinforcements so together we can pull people out of both buildings.

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01-18-2011, 02:53 PM
  #99
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I call the fire department because GOOD GOD WHY HASN'T SOMEBODY DONE THAT YET!?

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01-18-2011, 03:47 PM
  #100
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I call the fire department because GOOD GOD WHY HASN'T SOMEBODY DONE THAT YET!?
You would be the fire department. Gosh.

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