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Old
01-17-2011, 11:46 AM
  #26
TheDoctor10
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Oh good, this again...

No. It's already been explained a thousand times why this won't work. Just no.

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Old
01-17-2011, 12:25 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by PenguinsFan2008 View Post
No. Iginla is aging, declining in production, and still has two years left on his current contract.

Even the thought of having him on a roster for the playoffs is enticing, it wouldn't make sense long-term.
I am so sick of this 'Iginla is declining' crap...

in 2007/08 - he put up a career high in points
in 2008/09 - he dropped a whole 9 points while redefining his role on the team (meaning he played set up to Cammalleri)
in 2009/10 - he dropped significantly, coincidentally when the Flames went from playing a run and gun offense to a smothering Sutter defense
in 2010/11 - he started slow but not has 16g/32pts in the last 30 games (on pace to slightly improve on last years numbers)

keep in mind the other years Iginla played under a Sutter as coach Iginla was in the 35g/70pt range... its not a coincidence

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01-17-2011, 01:22 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by Lunatik View Post
I am so sick of this 'Iginla is declining' crap... in 2007/08 - he put up a career high in points
in 2008/09 - he dropped a whole 9 points while redefining his role on the team (meaning he played set up to Cammalleri)
in 2009/10 - he dropped significantly, coincidentally when the Flames went from playing a run and gun offense to a smothering Sutter defense
in 2010/11 - he started slow but not has 16g/32pts in the last 30 games (on pace to slightly improve on last years numbers)

keep in mind the other years Iginla played under a Sutter as coach Iginla was in the 35g/70pt range... its not a coincidence
So true, slow start and hes "washed up"

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Old
01-17-2011, 01:24 PM
  #29
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Oy vay

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Old
01-17-2011, 01:33 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lunatik View Post
I am so sick of this 'Iginla is declining' crap...

in 2007/08 - he put up a career high in points
in 2008/09 - he dropped a whole 9 points while redefining his role on the team (meaning he played set up to Cammalleri)
in 2009/10 - he dropped significantly, coincidentally when the Flames went from playing a run and gun offense to a smothering Sutter defense
in 2010/11 - he started slow but not has 16g/32pts in the last 30 games (on pace to slightly improve on last years numbers)

keep in mind the other years Iginla played under a Sutter as coach Iginla was in the 35g/70pt range... its not a coincidence
Hey I am a Pens fan and I agree with you. I think he is still a fantastic hockey player and brings so much to the table. Though I say no to the original proposal, I don't understand the Iginla bashing. I'd love to have him on my team. But, with that said, I am not trading a guy who still has potential like Malkin for an "older" guy, when Geno still has many more years ahead of him. I'd rather the return be someone in their mid 20's. But Iginla is just fine and is one of the top talents in the NHL. If someone didn't want him on their team they are stupid. But in a salary cap world, it makes it harder to acquire him. Especially for a team like Pittsburgh. However, I'd love for the Pens to get Tanguay. I made a proposal involving CGY/PIT about a week ago and it seemed somewhat solid. I think Tanguay could work really well in Pittsburgh. He'd be a better option for the Pens to target.

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Old
01-17-2011, 01:56 PM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Axl2VinceNeil View Post
Hey I am a Pens fan and I agree with you. I think he is still a fantastic hockey player and brings so much to the table. Though I say no to the original proposal, I don't understand the Iginla bashing. I'd love to have him on my team. But, with that said, I am not trading a guy who still has potential like Malkin for an "older" guy, when Geno still has many more years ahead of him. I'd rather the return be someone in their mid 20's. But Iginla is just fine and is one of the top talents in the NHL. If someone didn't want him on their team they are stupid. But in a salary cap world, it makes it harder to acquire him. Especially for a team like Pittsburgh. However, I'd love for the Pens to get Tanguay. I made a proposal involving CGY/PIT about a week ago and it seemed somewhat solid. I think Tanguay could work really well in Pittsburgh. He'd be a better option for the Pens to target.
I agree the OP is garbage lol... his edit would have made more sense before the Penguins signed Martin and Michalek this summer... now it doesn't...

and I agree Iginla on the Pens would be a great fit on the ice, I can't see it working under the cap

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Old
01-17-2011, 02:04 PM
  #32
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I could see this trade being consummated if Darryl Sutter were suddenly hired as the GM of the Pen's. Failing that occurring, no GM in the NHL would agree to such an offer. Iginla’s best days are in his rear view mirror, Malkin’s are still on approach. Of course the good folks at Calgarypuck seem to believe it’s very doable.

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Old
01-17-2011, 02:17 PM
  #33
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I can only think of 2 maybe 3 players in the NHL that Malkin would be straight traded for...

Iggy, though a good player, is NOT one of them.

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Old
01-17-2011, 03:48 PM
  #34
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Thats a ballsy thing to say in a thread including Iginla.

argueably the worst linemates of any player for his entire career
Yeah, I agree for the most part. I still think his linemates over the past 2 years have been better than guys like Talbot, but no doubt Iginla hasn't had much help either.

I don't think anybody lacks respect for Iginla and his game, even at this point in his career. It's just the big age difference that makes Malkin more valuable. You can build around Geno for another 10 years and only build around Iginla for a couple more years before he settles in as a role player for a while and then retires.

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Old
01-17-2011, 06:22 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iggy-4-50 View Post
For the Flames to get Malkin it would take Iginla, Giordano, a 1st and maybe even a top prospect to boot. Plus the flame would have to take a high priced scrub to even out the cap hits.

Not going to happen and thankfully so, Malkin isn't the answer if it takes that much to get him. his play the last 2 seasons indicates he's no longer interested in being a star.
The Flames don't have the pieces to get Malkin.

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Old
01-17-2011, 07:34 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by Ragamuffin Gunner View Post
The Flames don't have the pieces to get Malkin.
I truely agree.

Where would the Penguins honestly even put Regehr?? Their current pairing have been working well.

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Old
01-17-2011, 07:49 PM
  #37
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Funny how Flames fans fail to mention Iginla is owed $7 mil each of the next 2 years, or that he's a pathetic -9.

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Old
01-17-2011, 08:03 PM
  #38
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Iginla, Stajan, Bourque, 2011 1st.

Pens still refuse?

Stajan could easily play on their 2nd line while keeping Staal on the 3rd line. Bourque would be a very solid addition to the Pens roster for many many years.

Dupuis-Crosby-Iginla
Kunitz-Stajan-Bourque
Kennedy-Staal-Talbot

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Old
01-17-2011, 08:05 PM
  #39
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I do not think the value of the OP is off as all the Pens fans are making out to be. What tips the scales in this proposal is the difference of age between these 2 players. The Pens and Flames could both get better packages for trading these 2 players in different deals. So the proposal is not a great one for that reason. But I agree the Flames would need to add more, but no way is the difference Gio and a 1st.

With that said, (and I don't care if I get heat for saying this) but Malkin is one of the most over rated players on HF. Don't get me wrong, he is an excpetional talent, but I do not think that he is even one of the best top 10 players in the NHL anymore. He is not a guy I would build a franchise around, I would rather build my team around a Mike Richards or Toews over Malkin any day. Malkin has exceptional skill, but I do not see much else to his game that everyone else on here is just so high on. I just think Pens fans over hype the guy way too much. He sure has not shown that he is on the same level of a Lemieux or Jagr.

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Old
01-17-2011, 08:10 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MVW View Post
I do not think the value of the OP is off as all the Pens fans are making out to be. What tips the scales in this proposal is the difference of age between these 2 players. The Pens and Flames could both get better packages for trading these 2 players in different deals. So the proposal is not a great one for that reason. But I agree the Flames would need to add more, but no way is the difference Gio and a 1st.

With that said, (and I don't care if I get heat for saying this) but Malkin is one of the most over rated players on HF. Don't get me wrong, he is an excpetional talent, but I do not think that he is even one of the best top 10 players in the NHL anymore. He is not a guy I would build a franchise around, I would rather build my team around a Mike Richards or Toews over Malkin any day. Malkin has exceptional skill, but I do not see much else to his game that everyone else on here is just so high on. I just think Pens fans over hype the guy way too much. He sure has not shown that he is on the same level of a Lemieux or Jagr.
A cup ring and an Art Ross is all hype? Malkin is most definitely a franchise player and a top 10 player. Even with crap wingers he would still be a 80pt centre at the absolute worst. Like its been said many times, just wait til he leaves PIttsburgh and gets first line centre mins with top line wingers, he will tear it up. WHen hes on his game, few defenseman can shut him down.

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Old
01-17-2011, 08:37 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by Puckgenius View Post
A cup ring and an Art Ross is all hype? Malkin is most definitely a franchise player and a top 10 player. Even with crap wingers he would still be a 80pt centre at the absolute worst. Like its been said many times, just wait til he leaves PIttsburgh and gets first line centre mins with top line wingers, he will tear it up. WHen hes on his game, few defenseman can shut him down.
Matt Duchene, Ryan Kesler, Mike Riberio and Jeff Carter are all second line centres and have more points than Malkin this year. Jeff Skinner is a rookie and has more points than him, Logan Couture (a rookie) is a second line centre and has 5 less points than Malkin. To me, a top 10 player in the world should have more points than the players I mentioned being that their position and icetime are comparable and considering that over half of a season has already been played. Granted Malkin does not have the best wingers in hockey, but if he was as good as advertised he should be producing more. And to say how he is not getting top line minutes is laughable, Malkin gets plenty of minutes and PP time. Look, I am not saying that Maklin is a bad player by any stretch, because there are not many players that have his talent and skill set, but I just do not think that he is quite as good as lots of people make him out to be. I

ts my opinion of him as a hockey player, and I could care less what anyone else thinks about it. He has had 2 very good seasons, and beyond that he has had some great stretches of hockey followed by other stretches of some fairly inconsistent play.

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Old
01-17-2011, 08:44 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by MVW View Post
Matt Duchene, Ryan Kesler, Mike Riberio and Jeff Carter are all second line centres and have more points than Malkin this year. Jeff Skinner is a rookie and has more points than him, Logan Couture (a rookie) is a second line centre and has 5 less points than Malkin. To me, a top 10 player in the world should have more points than the players I mentioned being that their position and icetime are comparable and considering that over half of a season has already been played. Granted Malkin does not have the best wingers in hockey, but if he was as good as advertised he should be producing more. And to say how he is not getting top line minutes is laughable, Malkin gets plenty of minutes and PP time. Look, I am not saying that Maklin is a bad player by any stretch, because there are not many players that have his talent and skill set, but I just do not think that he is quite as good as lots of people make him out to be. I

ts my opinion of him as a hockey player, and I could care less what anyone else thinks about it. He has had 2 very good seasons, and beyond that he has had some great stretches of hockey followed by other stretches of some fairly inconsistent play.
Kunitz has as many goals as Ovechkin. Straight up trade?

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Old
01-17-2011, 08:51 PM
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MVW View Post
Matt Duchene, Ryan Kesler, Mike Riberio and Jeff Carter are all second line centres and have more points than Malkin this year. Jeff Skinner is a rookie and has more points than him, Logan Couture (a rookie) is a second line centre and has 5 less points than Malkin. To me, a top 10 player in the world should have more points than the players I mentioned being that their position and icetime are comparable and considering that over half of a season has already been played. Granted Malkin does not have the best wingers in hockey, but if he was as good as advertised he should be producing more. And to say how he is not getting top line minutes is laughable, Malkin gets plenty of minutes and PP time. Look, I am not saying that Maklin is a bad player by any stretch, because there are not many players that have his talent and skill set, but I just do not think that he is quite as good as lots of people make him out to be. I

ts my opinion of him as a hockey player, and I could care less what anyone else thinks about it. He has had 2 very good seasons, and beyond that he has had some great stretches of hockey followed by other stretches of some fairly inconsistent play.
Do you think any GM that held the rights to one of the guys mentioned above would take more than 8 seconds to say yes if offered Malkin straight up for their guy?

Even after his bad start he's still only a hot streak away from being a top 10 scorer in the part of the season that doesn't matter. He'll be in the hunt for the Conn Smythe when most of the guys you mentioned are hunting for lost golf balls.

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Old
01-17-2011, 08:54 PM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MVW View Post
Matt Duchene, Ryan Kesler, Mike Riberio and Jeff Carter are all second line centres and have more points than Malkin this year. Jeff Skinner is a rookie and has more points than him, Logan Couture (a rookie) is a second line centre and has 5 less points than Malkin. To me, a top 10 player in the world should have more points than the players I mentioned being that their position and icetime are comparable and considering that over half of a season has already been played. Granted Malkin does not have the best wingers in hockey, but if he was as good as advertised he should be producing more. And to say how he is not getting top line minutes is laughable, Malkin gets plenty of minutes and PP time. Look, I am not saying that Maklin is a bad player by any stretch, because there are not many players that have his talent and skill set, but I just do not think that he is quite as good as lots of people make him out to be. I

ts my opinion of him as a hockey player, and I could care less what anyone else thinks about it. He has had 2 very good seasons, and beyond that he has had some great stretches of hockey followed by other stretches of some fairly inconsistent play.
All of the guys you listed have far better wingers than Malkin has. You'd be crazy not to think their point totals wouldn't take a big hit playing with 4th liners like Asham and Talbot.

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Old
01-17-2011, 09:54 PM
  #45
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Listen, I did not say once that Malkin was not a top talent. I definitely think his skill set is in the top 10 in the NHL. I just do not think that he can be put in the same sentence as Crosby, OV or now Stamkos. I think those players are a cut above Malkin. And with all the great young talent currently in the league, it is debateable if Malkin is one of top 10 best players in the world. He definitely has the ability to be there, but IMO his play over the last 2 seasons has dropped his ranking. Great players are great no matter who they play with. There are other wingers that have far greater wingers than Crosby, yet he still finds a way to be the best and make others around him better. Malkin over the last 2 seasons has not been nearly on this level. Again he is a great player, but I feel he is slightly over rated.

In regards to the OP, the value is not as far off as many suggest. The Flames would need to add more but only because of the age difference and not the fact Malkin is heads and shoulders better than Iginla. I think Iginla and a 1st round pick is fair value, not that the Pens would ever agree to the trade.

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Old
01-17-2011, 11:14 PM
  #46
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Actually the OP isn't too far off in his original proposal. I DEFINITELY believe that Iginla would help the Pens more so than Malkin for the next 2 years but that's not nearly enough to entice the Pens to trade a young franchise type center at this point.

I think to balance things that there would have to be a swap of 1st rbd picks this season. Cal is most likely looking at a lottery pick this year and the MAY find an elite player with that pick but it's not a guarrentee. I think that Malkin will most likely prove to be a better player and franchise guy than whomever they may get with their pick this season. It's a high price to pay but that would be the cost to get someone like Malkin. They would still have a 1st rnd pick this year but it figures to be a late rnd pick seeing how the Pens are a serious cup contender again this year.

From the Pens POV, it would be tough to trade away Malkin but I actually like this move for them. Iginla, even with getting up there in age, is still an exceptional player. Getting a lottery pick this year should still land them a very good player who would most likely be able to play on their team as soon as next season and at just an entry level contract price. The combination of Iginla + 2011 1st rnd pick price wise shoulodn't be more than Malkin and production wise for the next 2 years should be better than Malkin. I think it makes them a stronger team for the next 2-3 years. Also, Staal will FINALY get to show everyone that he's far more than just a shut-down center. Trust me, he's more than capable to running that 2nd line. Letestu has done a damned good job as the 3rd line center in Staals absence so I'd just keep him there.

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Old
01-17-2011, 11:30 PM
  #47
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Originally Posted by phlocky View Post
Actually the OP isn't too far off in his original proposal. I DEFINITELY believe that Iginla would help the Pens more so than Malkin for the next 2 years but that's not nearly enough to entice the Pens to trade a young franchise type center at this point.

I think to balance things that there would have to be a swap of 1st rbd picks this season. Cal is most likely looking at a lottery pick this year and the MAY find an elite player with that pick but it's not a guarrentee. I think that Malkin will most likely prove to be a better player and franchise guy than whomever they may get with their pick this season. It's a high price to pay but that would be the cost to get someone like Malkin. They would still have a 1st rnd pick this year but it figures to be a late rnd pick seeing how the Pens are a serious cup contender again this year.

From the Pens POV, it would be tough to trade away Malkin but I actually like this move for them. Iginla, even with getting up there in age, is still an exceptional player. Getting a lottery pick this year should still land them a very good player who would most likely be able to play on their team as soon as next season and at just an entry level contract price. The combination of Iginla + 2011 1st rnd pick price wise shoulodn't be more than Malkin and production wise for the next 2 years should be better than Malkin. I think it makes them a stronger team for the next 2-3 years. Also, Staal will FINALY get to show everyone that he's far more than just a shut-down center. Trust me, he's more than capable to running that 2nd line. Letestu has done a damned good job as the 3rd line center in Staals absence so I'd just keep him there.
Easy to say from a Flyers perspective. Any game where Crosby/Iginla don't provide 2+ goals I don't want to be relying on Cooke/Staal/Kennedy to get it done. Everyone is giddy on Staal lately because he had two really nice games lately but those games are an anomaly. Even if they weren't, all the better because I'd rather trade Staal and get some bona fide help for Malkin, who is and always will be the better player to have.

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Old
01-17-2011, 11:31 PM
  #48
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Pens would be liked u serious dawgg?

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01-17-2011, 11:40 PM
  #49
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Easy to say from a Flyers perspective. Any game where Crosby/Iginla don't provide 2+ goals I don't want to be relying on Cooke/Staal/Kennedy to get it done. Everyone is giddy on Staal lately because he had two really nice games lately but those games are an anomaly. Even if they weren't, all the better because I'd rather trade Staal and get some bona fide help for Malkin, who is and always will be the better player to have.

Actually, 2 of my kids (21 and 17) are Pens fans and we watch just as many Pens games here as we do Flyers games (we get both CSN Philly and FSN Pitts). I know an aweful lot about the Pens and probably know them as well as most of their fans and better than a lot. 2 years ago when some Pens fans were looking to include Gogo in trades for a cup run I told them that they needed to keep him because he was their future PP QB to replace Gonchar. I understand if you don't want to do it but I do believe that it would make them better right now and I don't think it would make them significantly worse in the future.

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Old
01-17-2011, 11:44 PM
  #50
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Interesting how it's always fans of our rivals who think it'd be a really nifty idea for us to trade our 24 year old superstar for a player who's a decade older and significantly less productive over the last few seasons.

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