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International Tournaments Discuss international tournaments such as the World Juniors, Olympic hockey, and Ice Hockey World Championships, as they take place; or discuss past tournaments.

Should players from professional leagues be allowed to play?

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Old
01-15-2011, 03:35 PM
  #1
MapleLeafsFan75
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Should players from professional leagues be allowed to play?

With the exception of the Russian goalie from the London Knights and one or two players on their team that played in Russian Junior leagues, 95% of the Russian players from their 2011 World Junior team played on professional teams in the KHL. Plus I am sure it's the same for players on Sweeden, Finland and Czech Repbulc. So should the rules be changed that to play in the World Juniors you must be playing on a Junior Hockey from their country team to play in the tournament? Now before anyone says Brayden Schenn started the season with the Los Angeles Kings and then was sent to their AHL team in Manchester, he was still sent down prior to playing his 9th game in the NHL meaning he would be staying with them and the 1st year would come off his entry level deal. So he was sent back to Brandon of the WHL before then making him ok to play for Canada. Plus wouldn't it seem more fair making each team of 100% of players from Junior teams that didn't play on professional teams no matter what league they came from?

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Old
01-15-2011, 03:38 PM
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Cardiac_Canes
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For years people complained that the tournament wasn't competitive enough. Now that it is becoming so, you want to deplete the talent available to the European competitors? Are you actually serious about this?

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01-15-2011, 03:43 PM
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Muuri
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Finnish SM-liiga teams would just send all of their under 20-years old players to junior team little before WJC team would be named.

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01-15-2011, 03:48 PM
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Qurpiz
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Yes I think Canada doesn't benefit from the system enough already.

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Old
01-15-2011, 03:52 PM
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wickedwitch
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If this isn't the sourest of grapes, I don't know what is.

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Old
01-15-2011, 03:53 PM
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Armia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MapleLeafsFan2010 View Post
95% of the Russian players from their 2011 World Junior team played on professional teams in the KHL.
Only Orlov, Kuznetsov and Tarasenko play in the KHL, all the rest plays in the MHL.
MHL is KHL's "rookie league".

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01-15-2011, 03:56 PM
  #7
Zine
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Why make it a lesser tournament because the NHL won't release its players?

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01-15-2011, 04:00 PM
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Armia View Post
Only Orlov, Kuznetsov and Tarasenko play in the KHL, all the rest plays in the MHL.
MHL is KHL's "rookie league".
Most of that team have played in the KHL, but only Orlov, Tarasenko, Kuznetsov, Panarin and Zaitsev are regulars.

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Old
01-15-2011, 04:10 PM
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Memphis The Pie
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muuri View Post
Finnish SM-liiga teams would just send all of their under 20-years old players to junior team little before WJC team would be named.
Why on earth would they do that? SM-liiga clubs don't exactly love to see their players to play in the WJC/national team games in the middle of the regular season. Granlund, Pulkkinen, Vatanen, Armia etc. are important players for their SM-liiga clubs and because of the WJC tournament these guys miss about five regular season games.

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01-15-2011, 04:11 PM
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leafsfuture
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This is a joke. The WJC is in the perfect possible situation. With all the best U-20 players from Europe, and with NHLers (who would dominate) not available, the tournament is in the situation where we have 4 legitimate contenders (Canada, Russia, Sweden, USA), and 3 teams who are capable of staying with these teams and causing an upset or two (Swiss, Finns, Czechs).

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01-15-2011, 04:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timanGi View Post
Why on earth would they do that? SM-liiga clubs don't exactly love to see their players to play in the WJC/national team games in the middle of the regular season. Granlund, Pulkkinen, Vatanen, Armia etc. are important players for their SM-liiga clubs and because of the WJC tournament these guys miss about five regular season games.
They(SM-liiga teams) are obliged to do release their players for WJC.

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Old
01-15-2011, 04:45 PM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MapleLeafsFan2010 View Post
With the exception of the Russian goalie from the London Knights and one or two players on their team that played in Russian Junior leagues, 95% of the Russian players from their 2011 World Junior team played on professional teams in the KHL. Plus I am sure it's the same for players on Sweeden, Finland and Czech Repbulc. So should the rules be changed that to play in the World Juniors you must be playing on a Junior Hockey from their country team to play in the tournament?
You do know that the system in Europe is entirely different from the one in North America, don't you?

Junior and pro teams aren't divided into seperate entities, they are part of the same franchise. Teams develop their own talent, at least most teams do. If a junior player proves to be good enough to play for the men's team, he will get a shot. A player doesn't need to be drafted, nor is there an age protection for juniors like the major junior leagues have.

Apart from that, even the small "salary" players get in the major junior leagues should be more than a regular junior player gets in Europe. While some already have a pro-contract and make more money, most juniors don't. Which kind of makes major junior players more of a pro than European juniors, so do you want to exclude all those players as well?

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Old
01-15-2011, 04:54 PM
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So you want Canada vs USA tournament?

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Old
01-15-2011, 05:00 PM
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The real question is, are there any players in the European leagues that weren't released by their teams to compete in the tournament? Obviously it's well documented how many players Canada could have had that are playing in the NHL, but it's not well known how many players were in a similar situation overseas.

Anybody know?

Either way I think that the tournament is just fine the way it is. If Canada doesn't win gold a every so often because our best under-20 players are needed in the NHL, then that's just the way it is.

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01-15-2011, 05:09 PM
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jekoh
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Why make the tournament even more meaningless than it already is?

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Old
01-15-2011, 05:13 PM
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Wow, this is a stupid idea. Someone is still pissed about losing to Russia get over it.

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01-15-2011, 05:25 PM
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This must be a joke..Like 99% of all Swedish WJC calibre players have been promoted from their junior teams to the men's team, and stay within the same organization. It's like the Canadian junior players taking the next step by getting into the CHL, just that they stay in junior hockey instead. That's how clubs work in Europe, you raise your own players from the grassroots and put them in when they are ready to contribute. Don't think these players make some big money either..

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Old
01-15-2011, 05:32 PM
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pox
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the CHL is borderline pro anyways...

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01-15-2011, 05:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MapleLeafsFan2010 View Post
With the exception of the Russian goalie from the London Knights and one or two players on their team that played in Russian Junior leagues, 95% of the Russian players from their 2011 World Junior team played on professional teams in the KHL. Plus I am sure it's the same for players on Sweeden, Finland and Czech Repbulc. So should the rules be changed that to play in the World Juniors you must be playing on a Junior Hockey from their country team to play in the tournament? Now before anyone says Brayden Schenn started the season with the Los Angeles Kings and then was sent to their AHL team in Manchester, he was still sent down prior to playing his 9th game in the NHL meaning he would be staying with them and the 1st year would come off his entry level deal. So he was sent back to Brandon of the WHL before then making him ok to play for Canada. Plus wouldn't it seem more fair making each team of 100% of players from Junior teams that didn't play on professional teams no matter what league they came from?

A case can be made that Canadian Jr players do get paid in some form to play junior hockey in Canada--via scholarships and a few other things. There is a reason why once a player plays junior hockey--he is considered a professional player NCAA

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Old
01-15-2011, 06:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jumptheshark View Post
A case can be made that Canadian Jr players do get paid in some form to play junior hockey in Canada--via scholarships and a few other things. There is a reason why once a player plays junior hockey--he is considered a professional player NCAA
allowance, equipment, 1 year in a canadian university per year they play, room and board...


and then there are the ridiculous contracts that some import players get. Luxury car lease. posh apartment. very large allowance.

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Old
01-15-2011, 06:39 PM
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KRM
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Seems like someone is ********, especially considering that it would be ok to use NHL players as long as they haven't played more then 9 games.

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Old
01-15-2011, 06:57 PM
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Unfortunately hockey isn't as big in europe as in NA so no we cant make as big junior leagues yet....

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Old
01-15-2011, 06:59 PM
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OP, if it ain't broke don't fix it. This would only severly the tournament and we might as well have a best of 7 Canada against US.

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Old
01-15-2011, 06:59 PM
  #24
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Terrible idea, and it couldn't be more obvious that you're trying to mess with the rules to give Canada a massive advantage.

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Old
01-15-2011, 07:35 PM
  #25
fly4apuckguy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leafsfuture View Post
This is a joke. The WJC is in the perfect possible situation. With all the best U-20 players from Europe, and with NHLers (who would dominate) not available, the tournament is in the situation where we have 4 legitimate contenders (Canada, Russia, Sweden, USA), and 3 teams who are capable of staying with these teams and causing an upset or two (Swiss, Finns, Czechs).
Agreed. The tournament is not a true best-on-best, but it is a very good situation for all of the top nations as is. Sometimes fair is not equal.

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