HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Pacific Division > Edmonton Oilers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Official Proposal Thread #3/Rumor thread (Both Oiler and Non-Oiler)

View Poll Results: Would you do this swap in the offseason?
Yes 3 100.00%
No 0 0%
Voters: 3. You may not vote on this poll

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
01-22-2011, 06:49 PM
  #26
vb
Registered User
 
vb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Miami, FL
Country: United States
Posts: 3,259
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by 8BostonRocker24 View Post
He was one of the most dominating college players I have seen the past 10 years. He bounced between lines 1-3 his two years at University of Denver. He was a PPG player is first year in large part because he had really good finishers on his line. The 2008 team was really good, winning the WCHA with a 26-13-1 record. In 2009 they were a #1 seed in The NCAA with a 23–11–5 record and at large berth.

He's done well at the AHL level and has developed better then most Bruin fans thought. He was the 2nd to last cut in Bruin Camp this year just missing out to Jordan Caron. (Both are back at The AHL level now).

When he was drafted he needed to add weight, and he is finally up to 213 which might be good enough for The NHL. He's 6-5, great play maker and has great scoring touch. The knocks on him are:
1. Not physical for his size
2. Coasts and relies too much on talent


I've seen him live at the college and AHL level and he has a ton of talent, does he reach it? Not sure. Right now, if I had to project him, I would say he looks to be a 22-33-55 type 2nd line center / wing. His potential is 30-50-80 though, and as of right now I only give him a 20% chance of reaching it. I just don't see the drive and fire, but he has a TON of talent.
Appreciate you taking the time to share this.

As a Bruin fan I bet you've seen a high conversion of prospects to full blown NHLers (certainly more than Edmonton) so I think your opinion means a lot. Samsonov, Thorton, Bergeron, Wesley, Caron, Seguin are just the names that pop out without doing any research.

vb is offline  
Old
01-22-2011, 06:50 PM
  #27
8BostonRocker24
Registered User
 
8BostonRocker24's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Los Gatos via Boston
Country: China
Posts: 9,214
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fourier View Post
Fair enough.

I am not going to try and convince you of what Biston needs since you would clearly know that more than I would. But I do find it somewhat surprising that if you are really lookig for a 40 goal scoring winger (Semin being pretty much the only name I can see fitting this bill) that you would prefer Hemsky to Penner. When it coems to goal scoring Penner is a better option. Hemsky is first and foremost a playmaker.

I've also watched Ryder through most of his career. His stats may be similar to Penner, but Penner is a significant upgrade. He simply does way more things than Ryder. Horton would certainly be a much better comparable.

And for the record, I would be shocked if the Oilers would trade either Panner or Hemsky for Colbourne so I don't think this deal happens either.
I want Hemsky for one and only one reason. To pair him with Patrice Bergeron. People outside of Boston forget how great this guy is. In 2003-04 (his rookie year), he was one of Boston's best players as an 18 year old. He didn't show up a ton on the stat sheet, but showed flashes. He was apart of Boston's best line that playoffs (Him, Nylander and Samsonov), 4 points and a +5.

In 2005-06 he was the show in Boston after Thornton was traded, and until Thomas was called up from The AHL. The Sturm - Patrice - Boyes line was great and the only decent line in Boston that year. Patrice potted 31 goals and carried Sturm and Boyes. Hemsky (IMO) can bring back Patrice the goal scorer. Patrice is the only goal scoring center Boston has right now. Savard, Krejci and Hemsky are cut from the same cloth. Playmaking, 20ish goal scorers and Hemsky can play wing (duh) something Savard and Krejci can't do.

Down the road, I would love to see what Hemsky and Seguin could do together. As-of-right-now Seguin is playing wing and showing flashes of greatness. Down the road, he should be a goal scoring center and (IMO) someone like Hemsky would be great for him.

8BostonRocker24 is offline  
Old
01-22-2011, 06:51 PM
  #28
HemskyToHall*
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: London
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,908
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by PenzOil View Post
Would we (Edm fans) do :

Gilbert + 2011 1st for Seguin

OR

Marincin for Colborne
I'd do the first one and hell no to the 2nd one.

HemskyToHall* is offline  
Old
01-22-2011, 07:51 PM
  #29
8BostonRocker24
Registered User
 
8BostonRocker24's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Los Gatos via Boston
Country: China
Posts: 9,214
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by vb View Post
Appreciate you taking the time to share this.

As a Bruin fan I bet you've seen a high conversion of prospects to full blown NHLers (certainly more than Edmonton) so I think your opinion means a lot. Samsonov, Thorton, Bergeron, Wesley, Caron, Seguin are just the names that pop out without doing any research.
1. Samsonov: One of the best rookie years I have ever seen. He was slotted right in to the GAS line. Billy Guerin - Jason Allison - Samsonov.

2. Thornton: One of the worst rookie years I have ever seen. If HF Boards was around in 1997 I would of hated to see the reaction.

3. Bergeron: The first (2003) great 2nd round pick Boston has made the past 10 years. Outstanding rookie year that reviles Samsonov's.

4. Krejci: The next great 2nd round pick (2004). He was apart of Boston's Special K's (we didn't like the "KKK" term, so we went with Special K's). Krejci is the only one of the Special K's to make an NHL impact (the other two were Karsums & Kalus). We had some interesting debates back in the day...
http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=97572

5. Lucic: The 3rd great 2nd round pick (2006). He's rounded out nicely.

6. Brad Marchand: Another 2006er. He was drafted in the 3rd round and has really surprised Boston fans even though he's put up great numbers in The AHL.

7. Joe Colborne: 2008 1st round. Most again hated the pick because he was considered a project. He's ahead of schedule but there are still a ton of questions on what he is. People that see him live this year in The AHL say he looks better, I can't say I have not seen him since Boston's rookie camp.

8. Max Sauve: 4th great 2nd round pick. He should be in Boston next year and has passed Colborne in some people's minds.


9. Caron: He, IMO (and most of The Bruin's Board) is Boston's #2 prospect. He has passed Colborne. He is NHL ready today and played very good while in Boston. He's already a good PKer and uses his size very well. In the rookie games this offseason he looked like a man playing with boys. He just pushed everyone out the way and went where he wanted to go.

10. Seguin: This guy is TBD in my book. He has shown flashes of pure greatness. But he needs to work on his two-way game and can not just rely on his blinding speed. If/when he learns where to position himself in the offensive zone, he will start getting on the stat sheet.


2005 was bad: Matt Lashoff & Petr Kalus (although Vladimir Sobotka is looking like a player in St Louis, a lot of us were sad to see him go).

2007 was bad: Zach Hamill is a bust and a lot on the Boston Board questioned the pick when it was made. A lot wanted a defenseman. He was drafted because of his outstanding numbers in Jrs his draft year and he was considered a good two-way player. He is finally looking decent at the AHL level this year and might be a 3rd liner some day. Tommy Cross was also picked this year and might be decent #5/6 some day.

2005 and 2007 were great years for California Cabs though.

8BostonRocker24 is offline  
Old
01-22-2011, 08:07 PM
  #30
Mr Forever
The Oilers :(
 
Mr Forever's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: COLLEGE
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,599
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by dnicks17 View Post
20 year old rookie AHLer playing 2nd/3rd line minutes at 0.5 ppg.

What a bust.
No kidding

you can't classify a guy as a bust until they've reached Hugh Jessiman status.

Mr Forever is offline  
Old
01-22-2011, 08:39 PM
  #31
8BostonRocker24
Registered User
 
8BostonRocker24's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Los Gatos via Boston
Country: China
Posts: 9,214
vCash: 500
To Edmonton:
Paul Gaustad

To Buffalo:
Andrew Cogliano

8BostonRocker24 is offline  
Old
01-22-2011, 09:07 PM
  #32
proppski
Registered User
 
proppski's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Khon Kaen
Country: Thailand
Posts: 599
vCash: 500
this is a realistic one

Omark for carl gunnarsson + 2 round pick

proppski is offline  
Old
01-22-2011, 09:11 PM
  #33
Petro Points
Registered User
 
Petro Points's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 14,343
vCash: 885
Quote:
Originally Posted by proppski View Post
this is a realistic one

Omark for carl gunnarsson + 2 round pick
Leafs actually have a 2nd round pick this draft?

More realistic proposal: Omark for carl gunnarsson OR 2 round pick

Petro Points is offline  
Old
01-22-2011, 09:18 PM
  #34
proppski
Registered User
 
proppski's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Khon Kaen
Country: Thailand
Posts: 599
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by PenzOil View Post
Leafs actually have a 2nd round pick this draft?

More realistic proposal: Omark for carl gunnarsson OR 2 round pick
Im not an oiler-fan so maybee i overrated omarks value i go for omark for gunnarsson
because oilers need D and are full of wings!

proppski is offline  
Old
01-23-2011, 01:29 AM
  #35
dnicks17
Moderator
.
 
dnicks17's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 15,793
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by vb View Post
True, but I said he only looks like a bust/career AHLer so far. He still has a couple years on his ELC to turn it around.

At this point in time I wouldn't deal a roster player for him; not one that Boston would want anyway.
I was only commenting on the "bust" status, not the trade.

dnicks17 is offline  
Old
01-23-2011, 11:11 AM
  #36
rockinghockey
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,422
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by PenzOil View Post
Would we (Edm fans) do :

Gilbert + 2011 1st for Seguin

OR

Marincin for Colborne
I would do the first one but if we have the 1st over all I say we keep it and take Larrson

rockinghockey is offline  
Old
01-23-2011, 11:48 AM
  #37
Harrison
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,828
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by PenzOil View Post
Would we (Edm fans) do :

Gilbert + 2011 1st for Seguin

OR

Marincin for Colborne
Trying to figure out why we would give up Gilbert and a first for Sequin. Why not just keep our first and draft a center? Why give Gilbert away?

Certainly wouldn't do any of these deals.

Harrison is offline  
Old
01-23-2011, 12:00 PM
  #38
Petro Points
Registered User
 
Petro Points's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 14,343
vCash: 885
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harrison View Post
Trying to figure out why we would give up Gilbert and a first for Sequin. Why not just keep our first and draft a center? Why give Gilbert away?

Certainly wouldn't do any of these deals.
Because we heavily scouted Seguin last season and were willing to give up a lot for him. I doubt there is anyone as good as Seguin this draft. We give up Gilbert because BOS needs a PMD and would be stupid to trade us Seguin for an unknown draft pick.

Petro Points is offline  
Old
01-23-2011, 12:07 PM
  #39
Fourier
Registered User
 
Fourier's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Waterloo Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,712
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by PenzOil View Post
Leafs actually have a 2nd round pick this draft?

More realistic proposal: Omark for carl gunnarsson OR 2 round pick
Would you really take a second round pick for Omark at this stage.

At this point the Oilers have no real idea what Omark is capable of. But he has a legit shot at being a full on NHL player and even a top six winger. This is true of less than 1 in 5 second rounders. In fact, by the end of this year he will have played in as many NHL games as at least 50% of the players drafted in the second round from 2000 and 2001. More than half of the 2nd round picks in 2002 have yet to play in the NHL, with the top 5 in the second round of 2002 having a combined 69 games of NHL experience.

To me you trade Omark for a second if you are convinced he has no role going forward. In esence you are looking to salvage something for an asset you do not want.

Fourier is offline  
Old
01-23-2011, 12:10 PM
  #40
Harrison
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,828
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by PenzOil View Post
Because we heavily scouted Seguin last season and were willing to give up a lot for him. I doubt there is anyone as good as Seguin this draft. We give up Gilbert because BOS needs a PMD and would be stupid to trade us Seguin for an unknown draft pick.
Ok, sounds reasonable I guess. Just that we are weak on the backend and Gilbert has been one of our brighter lights back there.

Harrison is offline  
Old
01-23-2011, 12:11 PM
  #41
OilerTyler
Fire Lowe
 
OilerTyler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Edmonton
Country: Canada
Posts: 10,678
vCash: 50
The Oilers should try to re-acquire Stoll. He isn't dating any LA celebrities any more, is he?

He can kill penalties, win faceoffs and play the point on the powerplay. Then all we need to do is sign Glencross and we have a great energy line with Glencross/Stoll/Jones.

OilerTyler is offline  
Old
01-23-2011, 12:14 PM
  #42
Fourier
Registered User
 
Fourier's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Waterloo Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,712
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by 8BostonRocker24 View Post
I want Hemsky for one and only one reason. To pair him with Patrice Bergeron. People outside of Boston forget how great this guy is. In 2003-04 (his rookie year), he was one of Boston's best players as an 18 year old. He didn't show up a ton on the stat sheet, but showed flashes. He was apart of Boston's best line that playoffs (Him, Nylander and Samsonov), 4 points and a +5.

In 2005-06 he was the show in Boston after Thornton was traded, and until Thomas was called up from The AHL. The Sturm - Patrice - Boyes line was great and the only decent line in Boston that year. Patrice potted 31 goals and carried Sturm and Boyes. Hemsky (IMO) can bring back Patrice the goal scorer. Patrice is the only goal scoring center Boston has right now. Savard, Krejci and Hemsky are cut from the same cloth. Playmaking, 20ish goal scorers and Hemsky can play wing (duh) something Savard and Krejci can't do.

Down the road, I would love to see what Hemsky and Seguin could do together. As-of-right-now Seguin is playing wing and showing flashes of greatness. Down the road, he should be a goal scoring center and (IMO) someone like Hemsky would be great for him.


I'm a big fan of Bergeron btw.

The big problem you have with Hemsky though is that he tends to hold onto the puck for ever.

I know that you are follow the Oilers. Why do you think that the Oilers would deal Hemsky, a proven 1st line RW for a prosepct like Colbourne? Do you think it is at all realistic or is this more in the class of something you would love to see but do not believe would happen.

Fourier is offline  
Old
01-23-2011, 12:34 PM
  #43
8BostonRocker24
Registered User
 
8BostonRocker24's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Los Gatos via Boston
Country: China
Posts: 9,214
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fourier View Post
I'm a big fan of Bergeron btw.

The big problem you have with Hemsky though is that he tends to hold onto the puck for ever.

I know that you are follow the Oilers. Why do you think that the Oilers would deal Hemsky, a proven 1st line RW for a prosepct like Colbourne? Do you think it is at all realistic or is this more in the class of something you would love to see but do not believe would happen.
I'm not sure how realistic it is... I also have no idea how other organizations see the value of Colborne. If Edmonton sees Colborne in the same light that The Boston organization sees him, it makes sense. Colborne was drafted in 2008 and was considered a long term project, taking 3 years to make a dent professionally and 5 years to even make Boston. He needed to add a lot of weight, learn to play better positional hockey. Again, I got to see him a fair amount in college and he was so good, but in college hockey you can get away with just being more talented, a better skater, being faster, or making 2 or 3 great plays in a game and score 2 points. That's what Joe did, that doesn't fly at the pro level, even at the AHL. You need to play good positional hockey.

Honestly, I have no idea how Edmonton sees Hemsky either. Is he part of the core moving forward? Do they resign him this offseason? Do they deal him in the next 12 months for the best return? Do they think recent injuries are just a fluke or a sign of what's to come? Is Hemsky their "franchise forward"...

As an Edmonton fan I would like to see Hemsky resigned this offseason to a 3 year $15.0 million contract. Not sure if he would take such a short term deal. You can't have kids up and down the line-up. You need some late-20, 30 year olds.
If The Edmonton organization decides it's time to move on (due to injures) I would want a big center prospect. Scheen or Colborne would work for me.

So to answer your question, I have no idea if it makes sense. IMO Edmonton should resign him and Penner this offseason to short as possible deals. Nothing more then 5 years.

8BostonRocker24 is offline  
Old
01-23-2011, 12:44 PM
  #44
Petro Points
Registered User
 
Petro Points's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 14,343
vCash: 885
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fourier View Post
Would you really take a second round pick for Omark at this stage.

At this point the Oilers have no real idea what Omark is capable of. But he has a legit shot at being a full on NHL player and even a top six winger. This is true of less than 1 in 5 second rounders. In fact, by the end of this year he will have played in as many NHL games as at least 50% of the players drafted in the second round from 2000 and 2001. More than half of the 2nd round picks in 2002 have yet to play in the NHL, with the top 5 in the second round of 2002 having a combined 69 games of NHL experience.

To me you trade Omark for a second if you are convinced he has no role going forward. In esence you are looking to salvage something for an asset you do not want.
Omark for a ~35th overall pick would be a good deal if he is not part of the big picture. Unless Hall moves to C for good there is no room for Omark on our top6 and I prefer guys like Reddox and Jones on the 3rd line.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Harrison View Post
Ok, sounds reasonable I guess. Just that we are weak on the backend and Gilbert has been one of our brighter lights back there.
Gilbert has been good in patches but we need a more dependable RD in our top4. His contract isnt very team friendly either.

Petro Points is offline  
Old
01-23-2011, 01:08 PM
  #45
Joey Moss
Registered User
 
Joey Moss's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 22,296
vCash: 226
Quote:
Originally Posted by HemskyToHall View Post
1st Overall Pick for Seguin?

Bruins get to draft the long awaited blue chip defenseman prospect in Larsson and get rid of a struggling NHLer.
I think i'd rather have Larsson then Seguin TBH.

As much as I love Seguin and the fact he wanted to come here I think Larsson is a franchise defenseman which we don't have.

Joey Moss is offline  
Old
01-23-2011, 01:37 PM
  #46
ItsTheBGB
WJC Pool Champ!
 
ItsTheBGB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Edmonton, AB
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,235
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by PenzOil View Post
Would we (Edm fans) do :

Gilbert + 2011 1st for Seguin

OR

Marincin for Colborne
Leave Gilbert out of it, thats it.

And no to the 2nd deal too.

ItsTheBGB is offline  
Old
01-23-2011, 01:45 PM
  #47
HemskyToHall*
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: London
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,908
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by OilGagner89 View Post
I think i'd rather have Larsson then Seguin TBH.

As much as I love Seguin and the fact he wanted to come here I think Larsson is a franchise defenseman which we don't have.
Seguin is a much better prospect then Larsson. He has the tools to become something this franchise has been missing for decades now, a #1 center.

HemskyToHall* is offline  
Old
01-23-2011, 02:00 PM
  #48
ItsTheBGB
WJC Pool Champ!
 
ItsTheBGB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Edmonton, AB
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,235
vCash: 500
Trading our first...

There has been a lot of talk lately regarding our first round pick. Do we trade it for proven talent? Could we trade it for Shea Weber, seeing as he's an upcoming RFA and sign him to a long term contract?

This draft is looking more and more like a weak top end talent draft and we're likely not getting a Hall outta this. I don't want to see us turn into the Islanders or Florida, how they continuously have top picks, but the players don't turn out. We should try and push for a playoff spot next season.

Would ST consider it?

ItsTheBGB is offline  
Old
01-23-2011, 02:03 PM
  #49
Tad Mikowsky
Retired
 
Tad Mikowsky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Edmonton
Country: Canada
Posts: 10,643
vCash: 500
Please no.

I mean yeah, it would be great to have a proven player. But somehow, I'd have a feeling we'd need to pay more.

I don't want us to turn into the Islanders of the earlier 2000s. Like when they traded for Yashin for Chara, 2nd overall pick, and Bill Muckalt.

Tad Mikowsky is offline  
Old
01-23-2011, 02:04 PM
  #50
HemskyToHall*
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: London
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,908
vCash: 500
1st overall pick for Seguin pl0x.

HemskyToHall* is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:23 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.