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Old
02-03-2012, 11:49 AM
  #451
cassius
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Stop being a girly man.
+1

Life is all about taking action.... talking about stuff never leads to any results.

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02-03-2012, 12:06 PM
  #452
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Stop being a girly man.
[/reaches in Doritos bag]


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02-03-2012, 01:23 PM
  #453
Florentino Ariza
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I'm suspicious of reports which claim that soy protein will essentially turn you into a woman, especially when they talk about all the ways beef is great for you. Call me a conspiracy theorist, but it wouldn't surprise me to discover that the beef industry had a hand in something like that, given how powerful it is and how much beef Americans consume. After reading everything you do in the news about how companies use their influence to shape public opinion (IE, misrepresenting the facts in order to deceive people) it's not far-fetched.

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02-03-2012, 01:51 PM
  #454
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Originally Posted by Florentino Ariza View Post
I'm suspicious of reports which claim that soy protein will essentially turn you into a woman, especially when they talk about all the ways beef is great for you. Call me a conspiracy theorist, but it wouldn't surprise me to discover that the beef industry had a hand in something like that, given how powerful it is and how much beef Americans consume. After reading everything you do in the news about how companies use their influence to shape public opinion (IE, misrepresenting the facts in order to deceive people) it's not far-fetched.
Yep, greed is always a constant and both the beef industry and the soy industry have financial incentives to twist the facts, so I think it's just key to do your own research and form your own opinion.

The rise of soy can also be traced back to big $ marketing initiatives and it's kinda staggering how many foods you'll find soy in these days. It's becoming almost as prevalent as high-fructose corn syrup.

I stumbled on this book and it kinda changed my whole perception on soy: http://www.amazon.com/Whole-Soy-Stor.../dp/0967089751

My stance is that I'll still consume it in small quantity, but after doing my research I would never drink a soy protein shake daily or consume any large amount of soymilk on a regular basis. Whey seems a lot safer and it's not really that much more expensive.

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02-03-2012, 01:55 PM
  #455
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Getting man boobs from soy protein is like becoming impotent from drinking Mountain Dew.


I don't know this for fact, but I have heard that not all proteins are created equal, and that animal protein is much more complex than soy, and in turn better for you. I've always sort of personally operated under that premise, but I honestly think they are essentially the same, and eating one or the other will have no ill effects.

Soy has to be eaten by vegetarians or they would have no protein, aside from nuts, in their diet.

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02-03-2012, 02:08 PM
  #456
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Originally Posted by JTG View Post
Getting man boobs from soy protein is like becoming impotent from drinking Mountain Dew.


I don't know this for fact, but I have heard that not all proteins are created equal, and that animal protein is much more complex than soy, and in turn better for you. I've always sort of personally operated under that premise, but I honestly think they are essentially the same, and eating one or the other will have no ill effects.

Soy has to be eaten by vegetarians or they would have no protein, aside from nuts, in their diet.
This is generally true. The guy getting man boobs from soy drank 3 quarts of soy milk a day. I can't imagine what kind of issues you'd have if you drank that much cow's milk a day. Maybe you'd grow utters

What it boils down to is moderation. Soy is certainly a larger part of a vegetarians protein levels than meat eaters. There are other forms such as other beans, legumes, whole grains, and if you are just a vegetarian and not vegan than eggs (which are one of the best proteins), milk (which is what whey is derived from) and cheese.

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02-03-2012, 02:12 PM
  #457
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Originally Posted by cassius View Post
Yep, greed is always a constant and both the beef industry and the soy industry have financial incentives to twist the facts, so I think it's just key to do your own research and form your own opinion.

The rise of soy can also be traced back to big $ marketing initiatives and it's kinda staggering how many foods you'll find soy in these days. It's becoming almost as prevalent as high-fructose corn syrup.

I stumbled on this book and it kinda changed my whole perception on soy: http://www.amazon.com/Whole-Soy-Stor.../dp/0967089751

My stance is that I'll still consume it in small quantity, but after doing my research I would never drink a soy protein shake daily or consume any large amount of soymilk on a regular basis. Whey seems a lot safer and it's not really that much more expensive.
I agree with the $ marketing initiatives for the increase in soy. It is a very versatile ingredient and when manufacturers can take one ingredient and tweak it to fit all of their products, they will do it to make more money.

Last year, I gave up anything with corn in it for lent. It was insanely difficult but really educational. It really changed the way I ate. I think attempting that with soy would be interesting as well. However, as a vegetarian, that would be difficult. I suppose I could just give up soy by products and continue to eat tofu and soy milk from time to time.

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02-03-2012, 06:31 PM
  #458
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Originally Posted by cassius View Post
Yep, greed is always a constant and both the beef industry and the soy industry have financial incentives to twist the facts, so I think it's just key to do your own research and form your own opinion.

The rise of soy can also be traced back to big $ marketing initiatives and it's kinda staggering how many foods you'll find soy in these days. It's becoming almost as prevalent as high-fructose corn syrup.

I stumbled on this book and it kinda changed my whole perception on soy: http://www.amazon.com/Whole-Soy-Stor.../dp/0967089751

My stance is that I'll still consume it in small quantity, but after doing my research I would never drink a soy protein shake daily or consume any large amount of soymilk on a regular basis. Whey seems a lot safer and it's not really that much more expensive.
Yep, and that's why, as someone else said, moderation is the key. I'm not going to live on soy protein and I'm also not going to eat four steaks a week. In fact, I live on 0 steaks a week. I stopped eating beef about 2 years ago. And I guess I almost never consume soy now, either.

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02-03-2012, 08:05 PM
  #459
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Just did an hour of hockey, havn't played in 10 years. Pooped....

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02-06-2012, 03:01 AM
  #460
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Originally Posted by HandshakeLine View Post
Anyone have any good suggestions for getting into Olympic-style lifting? I'd like to take advantage of the explosiveness it affords for the upcoming tournament season, but I'm also a bit wary of stepping into something like that without supervision.

Olympic style lifting is becoming a rarity nowadays. You would be hard pressed to find a health club that even offers this sort of equipment. First step is to find a gym that has the equipment. From their you can find someone to help guide you on the lifts.

you want your progression to start from the top down.
So if you want to work on cleans, dont just jump into full cleans, or power cleans.
Instead work on hang high pulls, hang cleans, etc.

Olympic lifting is all about the transition of weight from different parts of the body to complete a lift. It really builds up the neural pathways of strength and you can see huge gains this way.

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02-06-2012, 03:34 AM
  #461
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Originally Posted by JTG View Post
Getting man boobs from soy protein is like becoming impotent from drinking Mountain Dew.


I don't know this for fact, but I have heard that not all proteins are created equal, and that animal protein is much more complex than soy, and in turn better for you. I've always sort of personally operated under that premise, but I honestly think they are essentially the same, and eating one or the other will have no ill effects.

Soy has to be eaten by vegetarians or they would have no protein, aside from nuts, in their diet.
So all protein is metabolically the same. However proteins can affect hormonal levels,and the con studies have shown that Soy produces more estrogen (female sex horomone) in people. Steak and other red meats have shown to produce more testosterone in people. However too much of either is not good for you.

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02-06-2012, 04:38 AM
  #462
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Originally Posted by JTG View Post
Soy has to be eaten by vegetarians or they would have no protein, aside from nuts, in their diet.
As Shady hinted at, this is actually a common misconception. Quinoa and other grains, many beans and legumes, and seitan (which provides more protein and fewer calories than beef) and other meat-substitutes are all high in protein. Even some vegetables like potatoes and spinach are surprisingly high in protein.

Being vegetarian/vegan takes a little more thought than auto-piloting through the aisles, but protein really isn't a concern for anyone considering a meatless diet. You can get a healthy amount of protein on accident (like I do) and can definitely get enough to build and maintain muscle mass when you plan your diet accordingly (like 6'4, 250 lb. Georges Laraque probably still does).

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Old
02-06-2012, 05:47 AM
  #463
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Originally Posted by Jtown View Post
So all protein is metabolically the same. However proteins can affect hormonal levels,and the con studies have shown that Soy produces more estrogen (female sex horomone) in people. Steak and other red meats have shown to produce more testosterone in people. However too much of either is not good for you.
I'm not sure if they are metabolically the same. I have always been told that all proteins are not created equal. That meat protein is better for you. Like I said...I don't know this for sure, it's just the assumption I have always operated under.

It would make sense due to what you said. If steak produces more testosterone, that's better for men who are trying to get muscle mass.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff Goldblum View Post
As Shady hinted at, this is actually a common misconception. Quinoa and other grains, many beans and legumes, and seitan (which provides more protein and fewer calories than beef) and other meat-substitutes are all high in protein. Even some vegetables like potatoes and spinach are surprisingly high in protein.

Being vegetarian/vegan takes a little more thought than auto-piloting through the aisles, but protein really isn't a concern for anyone considering a meatless diet. You can get a healthy amount of protein on accident (like I do) and can definitely get enough to build and maintain muscle mass when you plan your diet accordingly (like 6'4, 250 lb. Georges Laraque probably still does).
Yeah, I definitely misspoke there. I knew that.

Hell, even in the past when I was eating a good bit of red meat when I was trying to build muscle mass, I would eat other high protein foods that you mentioned.

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02-06-2012, 06:02 AM
  #464
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Originally Posted by JTG View Post
I'm not sure if they are metabolically the same. I have always been told that all proteins are not created equal. That meat protein is better for you. Like I said...I don't know this for sure, it's just the assumption I have always operated under.

It would make sense due to what you said. If steak produces more testosterone, that's better for men who are trying to get muscle mass.



Yeah, I definitely misspoke there. I knew that.

Hell, even in the past when I was eating a good bit of red meat when I was trying to build muscle mass, I would eat other high protein foods that you mentioned.

By metabolic I mean Theromgenically. Obviously you want to eat complete proteins with the essential AA component. Too much testosterone is related to arterial disease, so its a give and take. That is why you want a varied amount of proteins and fats in your diet to get benefits from every group.

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02-06-2012, 11:52 AM
  #465
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Olympic style lifting is becoming a rarity nowadays. You would be hard pressed to find a health club that even offers this sort of equipment. First step is to find a gym that has the equipment. From their you can find someone to help guide you on the lifts.

you want your progression to start from the top down.
So if you want to work on cleans, dont just jump into full cleans, or power cleans.
Instead work on hang high pulls, hang cleans, etc.

Olympic lifting is all about the transition of weight from different parts of the body to complete a lift. It really builds up the neural pathways of strength and you can see huge gains this way.
its always nice to find a gym that has the powerlifting racks. As for the lifting i agree with what jtown said..a clean should be a smooth, linear motion and it takes practice to perform. theres great tutorials on youtube for all sorts of powerlifts. just be careful of your back and remember that the power comes from the legs because when your slinging that much weight around any small mistake is multiplied.

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02-06-2012, 12:03 PM
  #466
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Originally Posted by 66-29-33 View Post
Just in case someone new to working out is following this thread.

Bad form=bad!

Here is an example of terrible form.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NNTGv...dUo-iBSDEPAUC3

See how they are both swinging their bodies? that does not work your arms at all, infact it would work your hips way more then your arms. Unless you want super slow results, when lifting weights DON'T SWING YOUR BODY!

Good form= GREAT!

Stand up straight, feet about shoulder width apart, lock your elbows at your hip, move the upper part of your arms (from just ahead of elbow) up and down, but elbow must be locked, that's the key part of this. Follow the experts like scooby who gives this info away for free. In fact for a beginner the best place to go would be his website. (i've already got someone hooked there)

http://scoobysworkshop.com/

It's hilarious listening to him talk with those muscles, but he knows his ****.


Also to remember this 1 thing, don't do isolation work. Do a full body workout, because the whole point of working out is for yourself. If you just do a certain area like chest/arms you're just doing it for the chicks and you're other areas that should have been worked on will remain weak.
Glad I got you hooked on Scooby :p
He might be a bit despotic in his nutrition, but he's still spot on. And if you want to learn good form, learn it from him.

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02-07-2012, 01:35 PM
  #467
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I got him on my YouTube subscriptions and sometimes watch his videos, but I don't follow him just the advice from him and the p90x guys. Btw since I forced myself to follow the nutrition in the week I did I lost 5 pounds!! I'm now 209 instead of 214. I'm gonna be doing plyometrics real soon but gonna downgrade to p90 as I'm getting into hockey and biking so need less intense for now, then build my way up. Sorry if this is a sloppy post, I'm on my iPhone 4S. I think I rushed into p90x, supposed to start at beginning, not jump into the top end right away...less intense this way. I still can't do a pull up after 5 months lol, unless it"s a beam then I can do 3 but 0 with pull up bar but I got muscle on my arms now.


Last edited by 66-29-33: 02-07-2012 at 01:42 PM.
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02-07-2012, 02:16 PM
  #468
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I've lost a ton of weight since I started forcing myself to throw up

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02-07-2012, 02:19 PM
  #469
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I've lost a ton of weight since I started forcing myself to throw up
Now that is dedication.

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02-07-2012, 04:17 PM
  #470
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I've lost a ton of weight since I started forcing myself to throw up
Matilda: I became...
Hansel: What?
Matilda: Bulimic.
Derek Zoolander: You can read minds?

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02-07-2012, 05:15 PM
  #471
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I've lost a ton of weight since I started forcing myself to throw up
I bet you're so cut.

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02-08-2012, 10:29 AM
  #472
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Anyone have any pool workouts for a beginning swimmer?

I'm an okay swimmer, just not comfortable with all the strokes.

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02-08-2012, 12:38 PM
  #473
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check out letangs offseason regime


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02-08-2012, 12:38 PM
  #474
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Originally Posted by Jeff Goldblum View Post
As Shady hinted at, this is actually a common misconception. Quinoa and other grains, many beans and legumes, and seitan (which provides more protein and fewer calories than beef) and other meat-substitutes are all high in protein. Even some vegetables like potatoes and spinach are surprisingly high in protein.
10% protein is not high in protein. You can get enough protein to maintain some muscle mass, but it is not ideal for most people.

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its always nice to find a gym that has the powerlifting racks. As for the lifting i agree with what jtown said..a clean should be a smooth, linear motion and it takes practice to perform. theres great tutorials on youtube for all sorts of powerlifts. just be careful of your back and remember that the power comes from the legs because when your slinging that much weight around any small mistake is multiplied.
Huh? This is the exact opposite of what a clean should be. A clean is an explosive movement. Controlled deadlift, then rapid acceleration once you hit about mid-thigh until you hit full extension, then back under the bar. It looks controlled when executed properly, but it is in no way 'smooth' or 'linear'. And the last comment makes little sense.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 66-29-33 View Post
I'm gonna be doing plyometrics real soon but gonna downgrade to p90 as I'm getting into hockey and biking so need less intense for now, then build my way up.
What I've taken from your previous posts, plyometrics would be of little use considering your goals. They should only be used by advanced trainees (ie. 1.5xBW below parallel back squat) and are pretty difficult to recover from (talking about depth jumps and the like. Beginner plyos, like simple bounding will have little benefit). Plyos are the last thing that should be added to a program. No until after almost everything else has been implemented and beginner gains exhausted.

Start doing the major lifts (Squat, DL, C&J, Snatch, Press, Bench Press and their derivative lifts, ie. front squat, power clean/snatch, behind-the-neck push press, snatch balance, RDL, etc.) and get adequately strong first.

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02-08-2012, 12:58 PM
  #475
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Huh? This is the exact opposite of what a clean should be. A clean is an explosive movement. Controlled deadlift, then rapid acceleration once you hit about mid-thigh until you hit full extension, then back under the bar. It looks controlled when executed properly, but it is in no way 'smooth' or 'linear'. And the last comment makes little sense.
how is it not smooth? theres no breaks in motion when doing a clean, and ya its pretty linear since the bar should move in a straight line from the ground, also when doing large weight power comes from legs, hence the jump.

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